Who Are the "TWO WITNESSES" of Revelation 11

[reba]

it does not say the witness are 2 guys..as i said post # 11 i have not developed a view. still reading and trying to figure it out. guess i was not clear,,,, i have studied scripture read commentaries, sites , for years and have not yet come to a conclusion in my head/heart

thanks for posting the passage

 

[petester]

Ya know I was thinking the same thing but I didn't want to say anything because im very ignorant to scripture. Maybe its 2 chicks or 1 chick 1 dude.Now its just my opinion but if it is one of each sex that would be balancing as I believe they are prolly Holy auditors for God observing how we conduct ourselves.Maybe they will be more objective to their own sex as the passage I believe says God will choose 2 humans for the task so he may take into account our nature.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

Continued from: Who Are the "TWO WITNESSES" of Revelation 11:

Ascend Up To Heaven?
But what about the claim that "no man" has ascended up to "heaven"? First of all, notice that when Jesus Christ made that statement, He was clearly referring to the heaven of God's throne (John 3:13). Also, He spoke in the past tense. This statement, therefore, would not necessarily preclude two men in the future, from ascending up to "heaven."
However, we don't need to assume that the heaven of God's throne is referred to at all. When John tells us the two witnesses, when their dead bodies are revived, ascend up to heaven, he did not specify WHICH heaven! The truth is, the
Bible itself speaks of at least three different "heavens." There is the heaven of God's throne (Rev.4:1-3); then there is the heaven where the planets and stars and galaxies circulate (Gen.1:1); and finally, there is the heaven which is the atmosphere of the earth -- the heaven where the birds fly (Gen.1:20).
Which heaven did the two witnesses ascend up to?
Actually, in history, the Bible does record one man, other than Christ Himself, who, like the two witnesses, "ascended to heaven" when his ministry was finished. He was, like them, a prophet of God -- a mighty prophet -- the prophet Elijah! We read the account in II Kings:
"And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that,
behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and
parted them asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into
HEAVEN" (II Kgs.2:11).

Elijah was taken to "heaven"! But what "heaven" did he go to? Many have assumed that Elijah never died, and that he was taken to the heaven of God's throne. Some also assume that Enoch never died, because we read in the book of Genesis: "And Enoch walked with God; and he was not; for God took him" (Gen.5:24). Does this mean God took him to heaven?
But that would contradict the plain words of the Messiah Himself. So what did happen to Enoch and Elijah?
Did Enoch and Elijah Go to Heaven?
Actually, this mystery is cleared up for us in the book of Hebrews, in the New Testament. The truth is, as the apostle Paul wrote, all the saints of God died. He enumerated specifically Abel, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, and Sarah, and said: "These ALL died in faith, not having received the promises" (Heb.11:13).

Enoch was among these mentioned (verse 5). What did Paul mean, then, when he said that Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him"? (v.5). Men have assumed this meant he went to heaven and never died. But Enoch was human flesh, and all flesh dies (Eccl.3:18-20). "All go to one place; ALL are of the dust, and ALL turn to dust again" (v.19). The Greek word for "translated" here is metatithemi (#3346 in Strong's Concordance) and means, "to transfer, i.e., transport," by impl., "to exchange, carry over, change, remove, translate, turn."
In other words, Enoch was "removed" or "carried over" by God from one place to another, for his own protection. Since he was a prophet of God, and the world hated him for preaching the truth and warning them of their sins, they sought to kill him, as they have done to all God's prophets from the beginning of time. But God saw to it that he was protected -- God removed him from danger, and from their presence, to a "safe place." When his ministry was fulfilled, God "took him" -- that is, He had his angels remove him from danger and carried him to a "place of safety" on this earth. Thus he did not ascend to heaven at all!

What about Elijah? Elijah, who was taken in the sky by a chariot and fiery horses (II Kings 2:11), was not taken to the heaven of God's throne, but also was merely transferred to another location on the earth. This occurred in 896 B.C., according to Ussher's chronology. In 893 B.C., about three years later, Jehoshaphat, king of Judah, appoints his son Jehoram as king, at the age of 32 years; he reigned for eight years (II Kings 8:16-18). He was a wicked king and walked in the ways of the kings of Israel (v.18). He married the daughter of Ahab (II Chron.21:6). During his reign, he received a letter from Elijah the prophet who reproached him for his apostasy and warned that he would die of a great disease of the bowels (II Chron.21:12-15).
"And after all this the LORD smote him in his bowels with an incurable disease. And it came to pass, that in process of time, after the end of two years, his bowels fell out by reason of his sickness; so he died of sore diseases" (vs.18-19). Jehoram's death occurred in 885, and his disease lasted about two years, so Elijah's letter must have been written and sent about 887 B.C. This would have been about nine years after his supposed "ascension" into heaven via the fiery chariot and horses! Thus Elijah was not taken to the heaven of God's throne, thus contradicting the words of Christ, but was taken through the atmospheric heaven surrounding the earth, and taken to a remote location to live out his life. During this time he wrote the letter mentioned above.
Again, we know that Elijah died from the New Testament witness. In Hebrews 11 we read of him, one of God's prophets who raised a woman's son to life again (Heb.11:32-35). Paul says of all these men, "And these ALL, having obtained a good report through faith,
5
RECEIVED NOT THE PROMISE: God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect" -- that is, receive the promises, eternal life and salvation (Heb.11:39-40). Thus they are still waiting in their graves for the resurrection, even as king David is (Acts 2:29).
There is no indication whatsoever that Enoch and Elijah will literally be resurrected and be brought back to earth to be the two witnesses. Rather, God Himself will raise up two men, "in the power and spirit of Elijah," men who are filled with the Spirit of God, the anti-types of Joshua and Zerubbabel (Zech.4-5). One of these men will be the one prophesied to come "in the spirit and power of Elijah," as John the Baptist did before Christ's second coming (Mal.4:4; Luke 1:13-17).
Thus the fact that the two witnesses will "ascend to heaven" when their ministry is completed in no way "proves" that they are "two angels" of God, or two spirit beings!
"Standing in His Presence"
Does the mere fact that the two witnesses stand in God's presence prove that these must be two angelic beings, who stand before God's throne in heaven?
This, too, is not the case at all. True Christians stand in God's presence every day of their lives, as they serve God. Jesus Christ declared, "For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them" (Matt.18:20). Moses also was on the earth, and yet stood in the "presence" of God (Exo.33:15). Jonah attempted to flee from God's presence, but found he could not do it (Jonah 1:3). Job, the patriarch, experienced God's presence, and it troubled him, and made him afraid (Job 23:15).
David himself prayed to God, "Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me" (Psalm 51:11). He also declared, in prayer, "Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?" (Psalm 139:7).

 

[WalterandDebbie]

What about Elijah? Elijah, who was taken in the sky by a chariot and fiery horses (II Kings 2:11), was not taken to the heaven of God's throne, but also was merely transferred to another location on the earth. This occurred in 896 B.C., according to Ussher's chronology. In 893 B.C., about three years later, Jehoshaphat, king of Judah, appoints his son Jehoram as king, at the age of 32 years; he reigned for eight years (II Kings 8:16-18). He was a wicked king and walked in the ways of the kings of Israel (v.18). He married the daughter of Ahab (II Chron.21:6). During his reign, he received a letter from Elijah the prophet who reproached him for his apostasy and warned that he would die of a great disease of the bowels (II Chron.21:12-15).

"And after all this the LORD smote him in his bowels with an incurable disease. And it came to pass, that in process of time, after the end of two years, his bowels fell out by reason of his sickness; so he died of sore diseases" (vs.18-19). Jehoram's death occurred in 885, and his disease lasted about two years, so Elijah's letter must have been written and sent about 887 B.C. This would have been about nine years after his supposed "ascension" into heaven via the fiery chariot and horses! Thus Elijah was not taken to the heaven of God's throne, thus contradicting the words of Christ, but was taken through the atmospheric heaven surrounding the earth, and taken to a remote location to live out his life. During this time he wrote the letter mentioned above.
Again, we know that Elijah died from the New Testament witness. In Hebrews 11 we read of him, one of God's prophets who raised a woman's son to life again (Heb.11:32-35). Paul says of all these men, "And these ALL, having obtained a good report through faith,
5
RECEIVED NOT THE PROMISE: God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect" -- that is, receive the promises, eternal life and salvation (Heb.11:39-40). Thus they are still waiting in their graves for the resurrection, even as king David is (Acts 2:29).
There is no indication whatsoever that Enoch and Elijah will literally be resurrected and be brought back to earth to be the two witnesses. Rather, God Himself will raise up two men, "in the power and spirit of Elijah," men who are filled with the Spirit of God, the anti-types of Joshua and Zerubbabel (Zech.4-5). One of these men will be the one prophesied to come "in the spirit and power of Elijah," as John the Baptist did before Christ's second coming (Mal.4:4; Luke 1:13-17).
Thus the fact that the two witnesses will "ascend to heaven" when their ministry is completed in no way "proves" that they are "two angels" of God, or two spirit beings!
"Standing in His Presence"
Does the mere fact that the two witnesses stand in God's presence prove that these must be two angelic beings, who stand before God's throne in heaven?

This, too, is not the case at all. True Christians stand in God's presence every day of their lives, as they serve God. Jesus Christ declared, "For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them" (Matt.18:20). Moses also was on the earth, and yet stood in the "presence" of God (Exo.33:15). Jonah attempted to flee from God's presence, but found he could not do it (Jonah 1:3). Job, the patriarch, experienced God's presence, and it troubled him, and made him afraid (Job 23:15).
David himself prayed to God, "Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me" (Psalm 51:11). He also declared, in prayer, "Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?" (Psalm 139:7).

To stand in God's presence, we don't need to be "in heaven"!
"The Two Olive Trees"
But the individual who claims these are two cherubims from God's throne also points out that the cherubim were fashioned out of "olive wood," and compares that fact to the fact that the two witnesses are called "two olive trees." Does this prove they are angelic beings?
Not at all! Notice!
In the book of Zechariah, we read another prophecy about a solid gold lampstand with seven lights on it, seven channels to the lights, and "two olive trees by it, one on the right of the bowl and the other on its left" (Zech.4:3). Who were these two "olive trees"? This description introduces a prophecy about God's servant Zerubbabel, a human being, saying:
"This is the word of the LORD to Zerubbabel: Not by might nor by 6 power, but by my Spirit, says the LORD Almighty. What are you, O
mighty mountain? Before Zerubbabel you will become level ground. Then
he will bring out the capstone to shouts of 'God bless it! God bless it!'
"Then the word of the LORD came to me: 'The hands of Zerubbabel
have laid the foundation of this temple; his hands will also complete it.
Then you will know that the LORD Almighty has sent me to you. Who
despise the day of small things? Men will rejoice when they see the plumb
line in the hand of Zerubbabel'" (Zech.4:6-10).
Zerubbabel was one of these two "olive trees" of the prophecy of Zechariah! He was used mightily of God, against powerful opposition, to REBUILD the Temple of God during his time!
Interestingly, in chapter 3 of Zechariah, we read about another servant of God, the high priest Joshua, with Satan the devil standing at his right hand to resist him and accuse him. Zechariah declares:

The LORD said to Satan, 'The LORD rebuke you, Satan! The LORD,
who has chosen Jerusalem, rebuke you! Is not this man a burning stick snatched
from the fire?' Now Joshua was dressed in filthy clothes as he stood before the
angel. The angel said to those who were standing before him, 'Take off his
filthy clothes.' Then he said to Joshua, 'See, I have taken away your sin, and
I will put rich garments on you.' Then I said, 'Put a clean turban on his head.'
So they put a clean turban on his head and clothed him, while the angel of the
LORD stood by.
"The angel of the LORD gave this charge to Joshua: 'This is what the LORD
Almighty says: 'If you will walk in my ways and keep my commandments,
ten you will govern my house and have charge of my courts, and I will give
you a place among these standing here. Listen, O high priest Joshua and your
associates seated before you, who are MEN SYMBOLIC OF TIMES TO COME:
I am going to bring my servant, the Branch. See, the stone I have set in front of
Joshua There are seven eyes on that one stone, and I will engrave an inscription
on it, says the LORD Almighty, and I will remove the sin of this land in a single
day'" (Zech.3:2-9).

Joshua the high priest was a spiritual leader of Israel during the time of Zerubbabel. He was guilty of sin -- and had to repent of his sins, before God could use him. He bitterly and totally repented, and God kept His promise and gave him a great responsibility, a great service to do -- to restore the true worship of God! He was the other "olive tree." And he, too, was a human being!
Thus the prophecy of Zechariah involved the rebuilding of the Temple of God during thedays of Zerubbabel, governor of Judea, when Joshua was the high priest. These two men were used by God to lead in the REBUILDING of God's physical Temple and restoring the true worship of God! The Temple itself had been destroyed by king Nebuchadnezzar and the Babylonians in 586 B.C. Although the Jews were allowed to return to Jerusalem in 537 B.C., during the reign of Cyrus, king of Persia, after being in captivity for 70 years, since 607 B.C., when Nebuchadnezzar first invaded the land, Temple reconstruction did not really get under way until 520 B.C., and was not finished until 515 B.C.
7
Joshua and Zerubbabel
Now notice what Zechariah says about them:
"Then I asked the angel, 'What are these TWO OLIVE TREES on the right
hand and the left on the lampstand?' Again I asked him, 'What are these two
olive branches beside the two gold pipes that pour out golden oil?' He replied.

 

[Malachi]

it does not say the witness are 2 guys...

Since they are called "these two prophets" in Rev 11:10, that should be sufficient proof that they are two men who "shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and three score days" (Rev 11:3). How do we manage to miss the obvious?

 

[WalterandDebbie]

To stand in God's presence, we don't need to be "in heaven"!
"The Two Olive Trees"
But the individual who claims these are two cherubims from God's throne also points out that the cherubim were fashioned out of "olive wood," and compares that fact to the fact that the two witnesses are called "two olive trees." Does this prove they are angelic beings?
Not at all! Notice!
In the book of Zechariah, we read another prophecy about a solid gold lampstand with seven lights on it, seven channels to the lights, and "two olive trees by it, one on the right of the bowl and the other on its left" (Zech.4:3). Who were these two "olive trees"? This description introduces a prophecy about God's servant Zerubbabel, a human being, saying:
"This is the word of the LORD to Zerubbabel: Not by might nor by 6 power, but by my Spirit, says the LORD Almighty. What are you, O mighty mountain? Before Zerubbabel you will become level ground.

Then he will bring out the capstone to shouts of 'God bless it! God bless it!'
"Then the word of the LORD came to me: 'The hands of Zerubbabel
have laid the foundation of this temple; his hands will also complete it.
Then you will know that the LORD Almighty has sent me to you. Who
despise the day of small things? Men will rejoice when they see the plumb
line in the hand of Zerubbabel'" (Zech.4:6-10).
Zerubbabel was one of these two "olive trees" of the prophecy of Zechariah! He was used mightily of God, against powerful opposition, to REBUILD the Temple of God during his time!
Interestingly, in chapter 3 of Zechariah, we read about another servant of God, the high priest Joshua, with Satan the devil standing at his right hand to resist him and accuse him. Zechariah declares:

"The LORD said to Satan, 'The LORD rebuke you, Satan! The LORD,
who has chosen Jerusalem, rebuke you! Is not this man a burning stick snatched
from the fire?' Now Joshua was dressed in filthy clothes as he stood before the
angel. The angel said to those who were standing before him, 'Take off his
filthy clothes.' Then he said to Joshua, 'See, I have taken away your sin, and
I will put rich garments on you.' Then I said, 'Put a clean turban on his head.'
So they put a clean turban on his head and clothed him, while the angel of the
LORD stood by.
"The angel of the LORD gave this charge to Joshua: 'This is what the LORD
Almighty says: 'If you will walk in my ways and keep my commandments,
ten you will govern my house and have charge of my courts, and I will give
you a place among these standing here. Listen, O high priest Joshua and your
associates seated before you, who are MEN SYMBOLIC OF TIMES TO COME:

I am going to bring my servant, the Branch. See, the stone I have set in front of
Joshua There are seven eyes on that one stone, and I will engrave an inscription
on it, says the LORD Almighty, and I will remove the sin of this land in a single
day'" (Zech.3:2-9).
Joshua the high priest was a spiritual leader of Israel during the time of Zerubbabel. He was guilty of sin -- and had to repent of his sins, before God could use him. He bitterly and totally repented, and God kept His promise and gave him a great responsibility, a great service to do -- to restore the true worship of God! He was the other "olive tree." And he, too, was a human being!

Thus the prophecy of Zechariah involved the rebuilding of the Temple of God during thedays of Zerubbabel, governor of Judea, when Joshua was the high priest. These two men were used by God to lead in the REBUILDING of God's physical Temple and restoring the true worship of God! The Temple itself had been destroyed by king Nebuchadnezzar and the Babylonians in 586 B.C. Although the Jews were allowed to return to Jerusalem in 537 B.C., during the reign of Cyrus, king of Persia, after being in captivity for 70 years, since 607 B.C., when Nebuchadnezzar first invaded the land, Temple reconstruction did not really get under way until 520 B.C., and was not finished until 515 B.C.
7 Joshua and Zerubbabel
Now notice what Zechariah says about them:
"Then I asked the angel, 'What are these TWO OLIVE TREES on the right
hand and the left on the lampstand?' Again I asked him, 'What are these two
olive branches beside the two gold pipes that pour out golden oil?' He replied,

'Do you not know what these are?' 'No, my lord,' I said. So he said, 'These
are the TWO WHO ARE ANOINTED TO SERVE THE LORD of all the
earth" (Zech.4:11-14).

As we can see, therefore, Joshua the high priest and Zerubbabel, who were used of God to rebuild His Temple, after the Babylonian captivity, were TYPES of the two END-TIME servants of God mentioned in Revelation 11, who ALSO are called the "two olive trees"! Olive oil, of course is a type of God's Holy Spirit. Therefore, these two men are "sons of oil," or men who will be mightily endowed by the Spirit of God to perform their unique End-Time ministry! In the Hebrew, the word for "anointed ones" here is ben ["son of"] yitshar ["oil," "anointing," as producing light], thus these are the "sons of oil" or "sons of light." They are filled with God's Holy Spirit, and proclaim the true light of the gospel -- the truth of God!
Notice! Cherubims are never called "olive trees" in Scripture, nor are they compared to olive trees. The fact that they were composes of olive wood, in the Temple, is an illustration of the fact that they are filled with God's Spirit, which olive oil is a type of. But they are not called olive "trees."
However, men who are filled with God's Spirit ARE compared to "olive trees" in Scripture! Notice! David declares, "But I am like a GREEN OLIVE TREE in the house of God: I trust in the mercy of God forever and ever" (Psalm 52:8).

God also says of the righteous, that their "children are like olive plants round about thy table" (Psal.128:3). Israel, God's people, are also compared to an olive plant. God says through Jeremiah the prophet, "The LORD called thy name, a green olive tree, fair, and of goodly fruit" (Jer.11:16). And speaking of Israel after Christ returns, Hosea the prophet declares, "His branches shall spread and his beauty shall be as the olive tree, and his smell as Lebanon" (Hos.14:6).
Who could these two men be? Why are they called "sons of oil"?
Men Like Moses and Aaron

This means that like Elijah and Elisha, they will be given a DOUBLE-PORTION of the Spirit of God, which will manifest itself in the mighty miracles and wonders which God will give them POWER to perform, according to His will and direction -- just as Moses and Aaron were led of God to prophesy and pour out mighty plagues upon ancient Egypt to compel Pharaoh to let the children of Israel to go, so these two End-Time servants of God will prophesy plagues on the End-Time "New World Order" led by modern "Babylon the Great," the prophesied Kingdom of the Beast (Rev.13 and 17-18).
8

In spiritual power they will be like Moses and Aaron, and Elijah and Elisha. One will be the leader, and the other will be working with him as his right hand man -- even as Moses had precedence over Aaron, and Elijah had precedence over Elisha, but they were all used mightily by Almighty YAHVEH, the Lord of heaven and earth!
Moses and Aaron brought a plague of turning waters into blood upon the Egyptians (Exodus 7:14-24). Even so, the two witnesses will turn the waters into blood in the kingdom of the Beast (Rev.11:6). This plague is described in Rev.16:
The second angel poured out his bowl on the sea, and it turned into blood
like that of a dead man, and every living thing in the sea died. The third
angel poured out his bowl on the rivers and springs of water, and they
became blood. Then I heard the angel in charge of the waters say: 'You
are just in these judgments, you who are and who were, the Holy One,
because you have so judged; for they have shed the blood of your saints and
prophets, and you have given them blood to drink as they deserve'" (Rev.
16:3-6).

God used Moses and Aaron to smite Egypt with nine plagues -- including turning water to blood, frogs, gnats, a plague on livestock, boils, hail, locusts, darkness, and the death of all the Egyptian firstborn, which Jewish tradition tells us may have involved a seismic earthquake, in which only all the firstborn miraculously died (see Exodus 7-12). The End-Time plagues which will be poured out on the kingdom of the Beast are listed in Revelation 16. These are the major earth-wrenching plagues which the two witnesses of God will announce and prophesy! They include seven horrendous plagues -- ugly and painful sores upon men (Rev.16:2), waters turned to blood (verses 3-6), scorching, intense heat from the sun (verses 8-9), incredible darkness (vs.10-11), drought and diversion of the Euphrates river (vs.12-16), preparing the world for Armageddon -- and a horrendous hail storm and earthquake (vs.17-21), unlike anything the world has ever seen before or experienced!
Notice how similar these plagues are to the ones God inspired Moses and Aaron to proclaim!
Men Like Elijah and Elisha

The fact that the two witnesses will be inspired of God to declare a great drought is directly connected with the power that God also gave to Elijah, who did the same thing! The apostle James wrote:
"Elijah was a man just like us. He prayed earnestly that it would not rain,
and it did not rain on the land for three and a half years. Again he prayed,
and the heavens gave rain, and the earth produced its crops" (James 5:17-18).
The fact that fire will destroy all those who attempt to harm the two witnesses is directly reminiscent of Elijah and Elisha. We read that during the ministry of Elijah, when he sent a message to the king of Judah telling him that he was going to die.

 

[Eugene]

Will Old Testament elect be handing out judgment against the church? Instead I see God’s own of the New Testament used in His dealing with mankind in those seven years of tribulation. E.g. The Twenty-four Elders & Four Beasts or Living Ones are those of Rev 5:9 singing that Jesus had redeemed them to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation. This does not fit the description of the elect of Israel.

Rev 6:1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.
Rev 6:3 And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see.
Rev 6:5 And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see.
Rev 6:7 And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

'Do you not know what these are?' 'No, my lord,' I said. So he said, 'These
are the TWO WHO ARE ANOINTED TO SERVE THE LORD of all the
earth" (Zech.4:11-14).

As we can see, therefore, Joshua the high priest and Zerubbabel, who were used of God to rebuild His Temple, after the Babylonian captivity, were TYPES of the two END-TIME servants of God mentioned in Revelation 11, who ALSO are called the "two olive trees"! Olive oil, of course is a type of God's Holy Spirit. Therefore, these two men are "sons of oil," or men who will be mightily endowed by the Spirit of God to perform their unique End-Time ministry! In the Hebrew, the word for "anointed ones" here is ben ["son of"] yitshar ["oil," "anointing," as producing light], thus these are the "sons of oil" or "sons of light." They are filled with God's Holy Spirit, and proclaim the true light of the gospel -- the truth of God!
Notice! Cherubims are never called "olive trees" in Scripture, nor are they compared to olive trees. The fact that they were composes of olive wood, in the Temple, is an illustration of the fact that they are filled with God's Spirit, which olive oil is a type of. But they are not called olive "trees."
However, men who are filled with God's Spirit ARE compared to "olive trees" in Scripture! Notice! David declares, "But I am like a GREEN OLIVE TREE in the house of God: I trust in the mercy of God forever and ever" (Psalm 52:8).

God also says of the righteous, that their "children are like olive plants round about thy table" (Psal.128:3). Israel, God's people, are also compared to an olive plant. God says through Jeremiah the prophet, "The LORD called thy name, a green olive tree, fair, and of goodly fruit" (Jer.11:16). And speaking of Israel after Christ returns, Hosea the prophet declares, "His branches shall spread and his beauty shall be as the olive tree, and his smell as Lebanon" (Hos.14:6).
Who could these two men be? Why are they called "sons of oil"?
Men Like Moses and Aaron

This means that like Elijah and Elisha, they will be given a DOUBLE-PORTION of the Spirit of God, which will manifest itself in the mighty miracles and wonders which God will give them POWER to perform, according to His will and direction -- just as Moses and Aaron were led of God to prophesy and pour out mighty plagues upon ancient Egypt to compel Pharaoh to let the children of Israel to go, so these two End-Time servants of God will prophesy plagues on the End-Time "New World Order" led by modern "Babylon the Great," the prophesied Kingdom of the Beast (Rev.13 and 17-18).
8

In spiritual power they will be like Moses and Aaron, and Elijah and Elisha. One will be the leader, and the other will be working with him as his right hand man -- even as Moses had precedence over Aaron, and Elijah had precedence over Elisha, but they were all used mightily by Almighty YAHVEH, the Lord of heaven and earth!
Moses and Aaron brought a plague of turning waters into blood upon the Egyptians (Exodus 7:14-24). Even so, the two witnesses will turn the waters into blood in the kingdom of the Beast (Rev.11:6). This plague is described in Rev.16:
The second angel poured out his bowl on the sea, and it turned into blood
like that of a dead man, and every living thing in the sea died. The third
angel poured out his bowl on the rivers and springs of water, and they
became blood. Then I heard the angel in charge of the waters say: 'You
are just in these judgments, you who are and who were, the Holy One,
because you have so judged; for they have shed the blood of your saints and
prophets, and you have given them blood to drink as they deserve'" (Rev.
16:3-6).

God used Moses and Aaron to smite Egypt with nine plagues -- including turning water to blood, frogs, gnats, a plague on livestock, boils, hail, locusts, darkness, and the death of all the Egyptian firstborn, which Jewish tradition tells us may have involved a seismic earthquake, in which only all the firstborn miraculously died (see Exodus 7-12). The End-Time plagues which will be poured out on the kingdom of the Beast are listed in Revelation 16. These are the major earth-wrenching plagues which the two witnesses of God will announce and prophesy! They include seven horrendous plagues -- ugly and painful sores upon men (Rev.16:2), waters turned to blood (verses 3-6), scorching, intense heat from the sun (verses 8-9), incredible darkness (vs.10-11), drought and diversion of the Euphrates river (vs.12-16), preparing the world for Armageddon -- and a horrendous hail storm and earthquake (vs.17-21), unlike anything the world has ever seen before or experienced!
Notice how similar these plagues are to the ones God inspired Moses and Aaron to proclaim!
Men Like Elijah and Elisha

The fact that the two witnesses will be inspired of God to declare a great drought is directly connected with the power that God also gave to Elijah, who did the same thing! The apostle James wrote:
"Elijah was a man just like us. He prayed earnestly that it would not rain,
and it did not rain on the land for three and a half years. Again he prayed,
and the heavens gave rain, and the earth produced its crops" (James 5:17-18).
The fact that fire will destroy all those who attempt to harm the two witnesses is directly reminiscent of Elijah and Elisha. We read that during the ministry of Elijah, when he sent a message to the king of Judah telling him that he was going to die.

Men Like Elijah and Elisha
The fact that the two witnesses will be inspired of God to declare a great drought is directly connected with the power that God also gave to Elijah, who did the same thing! The apostle James wrote:
"Elijah was a man just like us. He prayed earnestly that it would not rain,
and it did not rain on the land for three and a half years. Again he prayed,
and the heavens gave rain, and the earth produced its crops" (James 5:17-18).
The fact that fire will destroy all those who attempt to harm the two witnesses is directly reminiscent of Elijah and Elisha. We read that during the ministry of Elijah, when he sent a message to the king of Judah telling him that he was going to die, because he had consulted.

 

[Fusion77]

The 2 witnesses are alive and aware of their identity. They are 2 individuals...2 prophets as per Revelation 11:10 There are messages to 1 of them in the bible. Could be messages to both of them.

 

[for_his_glory]

Sorry this is a little lengthy, but didn't know a better way of breaking it down.

Zechariah 4:1-6; 4:11-14 explains that these two witnesses are the word of God in all power and might and the Holy Spirit which is the oil that is poured out on those who God anoints with His Holy Spirit. There are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, His spoken word and the Holy Spirit that are one and three that bear witness in earth as being the Holy Spirit, the word and the blood of Jesus and these three agree in one, 1 John 5:7, 8. Only God can give power to act on His word as the Holy Spirit and Jesus bare witness to Gods power and authority especially through signs and wonders.

Enoch, Moses and Elijah were not taken up to the third Heaven as some teach that when they were seen (not Enoch) of Peter, James and John in Matthew 17:1-9 it was only a transfiguration like a vision that they saw Jesus transfigured as was Moses and Elijah. There is no one in the third heaven except God, Jesus and the angels, John 3:13. 1Thessalonians 4:13-18 says we who have died are only asleep unto the coming of the Lord in the clouds and those who are asleep before us who are still alive will be taken up first and we who are alive will meet them in the clouds.

Gen 5:24 And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.
(Does not say where God took him)

Heb 11:5 by faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

Deu 34:5 So Moses the servant of the LORD died there in the land of Moab, according to the word of the LORD.
Deu 34:6 and he buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, over against Beth-peor: but no man knoweth of his sepulcher unto this day.

2Ki 2:11 And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. (Heaven here means atmosphere)

Elijah, having ascended into the air by a whirlwind was carried away out of sight beyond the horizon. Several years after he was taken away King Jehoram received a letter from him. How long after? There are some difficulties in figuring the exact chronology as it varies from 2 to 10 years or more. A note in Josephus (a Jewish historian of the first century A.D.) says 4 years, while the JEWISH ENCYCLOPEDIA figures it at 7 years.

Regardless of the exact number of years there came writing to Jehoram from Elijah the prophet, saying..." (2Chron 21:12). Now the wickedness of Jehoram, for which he was being rebuked in the letter, took place after Elijah was taken away, yet the letter speaks of these things as past events, and the punishment to come upon him as yet future. So the idea of some, that Elijah wrote the letter before he was removed by the whirlwind, is proved wrong.

Elijah was taken up by the whirlwind into the first heaven and transported to another location on Earth. God did not see fit in His purpose to reveal his whereabouts. What some people do not know is that there are three heavens. The first heaven is the Atmosphere, the air surrounding the earth. Birds fly "in the heaven" - certainly not to God's throne. We read in Genesis l:2 of "foul that may fly above the Earth in the open firmament of heaven." Jacob, when blessing Isaac, said: "God give you of the dew of heaven," and Moses was joyful that the "heavens shall drop down dew" (Gen.27:28; Deut.33:28). The dew comes from the first heaven - the atmosphere. The second heaven is the expanse of this awesome universe - where the stars, moon and planets are. The Psalmists often wrote about the "Heavens, the work of your fingers, the moon, and the stars, which you have ordained" (Ps.8:3; Gen.1:15-17). The third heaven is where the throne of God exists, where the heavenly temple is found and the heavenly Jerusalem. It is the heaven where Paul and John were caught up to in vision (2 Cor.12: l-4; Rev.4: l-2).

 

[Fusion77]

The 2 witnesses are alive and aware of their identity. They are 2 individuals...2 prophets as per Revelation 11:10 There are messages to 1 of them in the bible. Could be messages to both of them.

The key, of course, is in Zechariah 4. Only, it took more to unlock the true meaning. It really starts in Zechariah 3:8 it states that Joshua and the friends that sit before him are a SIGN or a SYMBOL. Joshua symbolizes the Branch (Christ). Of course, there are also friends before Joshua that are a symbol as well. 3 verse after Zechariah 3:8 with the same encounter, with the same angel and the same prophet is roused from a sleep like state. He awakens to a vision of several objects. Zechariah 4:2-3 those objects represent Gods Message to Zerubbabel Zechariah 4:6. Those objects = "Not by might, not by power but by my Spirit saith the Lord of hosts" directed to Zerubbabel. It's not the Zerubbabel any one would think. He is merely Symbolic of the witness. It's Gods message to one of the witnesses saying not your power but by My Spirit that you'll do these things. This is the one whom God calls Zerubbabel a type, just like Zechariah 3:8 says. There is NOTHING in Zechariah 4 that has ANYTHING to do with the second temple era, or the Zerubbabel of that age. It's all about the 2 witnesses specifically Gods message to one of them. I'll show this later.

 

[Fusion77]

The key, of course, is in Zechariah 4. Only, it took more to unlock the true meaning. It really starts in Zechariah 3:8 it states that Joshua and the friends that sit before him are a SIGN or a SYMBOL. Joshua symbolizes the Branch (Christ). Of course, there are also friends before Joshua that are a symbol as well. 3 verse after Zechariah 3:8 with the same encounter, with the same angel and the same prophet is roused from a sleep like state. He awakens to a vision of several objects. Zechariah 4:2-3 those objects represent Gods Message to Zerubbabel Zechariah 4:6. Those objects = "Not by might, not by power but by my Spirit saith the Lord of hosts" directed to Zerubbabel. It's not the Zerubbabel any one would think. He is merely Symbolic of the witness. It's Gods message to one of the witnesses saying not your power but by My Spirit that you'll do these things. This is the one whom God calls Zerubbabel a type, just like Zechariah 3:8 says. There is NOTHING in Zechariah 4 that has ANYTHING to do with the second temple era, or the Zerubbabel of that age. It's all about the 2 witnesses specifically Gods message to one of them. I'll show this later.

Of course what's thrown folks off track in Zechariah 4 is Zechariah 4:7-10. Most folks attribute this to the second temple. It is NOT speaking of the second temple or any physical building. First of all, Zerubbabel did NOT lay the foundation of the second temple. Ezra 3:10 Ezra 5:16 the bible is REALLY CLEAR about this. So once we recognize that fact, we can also realize Zechariah 4:7-10 is NOT speaking of physical work. In Zechariah 4:9 the word for foundation in Hebrew is derived from a feminine NOUN! Yesudah H3248, you can look this up on bible hub. You CANT get an ACTION out of a NOUN! The use of Yesudah has one other occurrence Psalms 87:1 do you think this speaks of physical building? Neither does Zechariah 4:7-10. These were 2 spiritual demonic attacks endured by this individual. Wherein, he resisted/denied the powers of darkness spiritual. Zechariah 4:10 it is something only the Eyes (Spirit) of the Lord sees. It can't be seen in the physical. Revelation 5:6 the Eyes are the Spirits Revelation 4:5 the 7 lamps 7 eyes = 7 Spirits.

Of course the Golden oil represents the anointing and refining power of the Holy Spirit. The olive trees and lampstands represent the 2 witnesses. Revelation 11:3-4 Zechariah 4:11 a question is asked no response Zechariah 4:12 a question is asked and a response is given Zechariah 4:14 Revelation 11:4. The olive branches represent individual gentile believers overflowing with the anointing of the Holy Spirit. Did we forget the objects represent Gods message to Zerubbabel? Or did we forget about Zechariah 4:6 already? One lampstand in the vision one message to 1 witness. The olive trees are for indentification purposes.

People have the misconception that these witnesses are something special on their own. WRONG! Like a lampstand they are USELESS without the Lamps (Holy Spirit) and oil (anointing power of Holy Spirit and Christ). Merely 2 vessels.

Zechariah 4 is ALL about The word of the Lord to Zerubbabel. He is a type of the witness. Actually this is his God given name. There is NOTHING in Zechariah 4 that pertains to the Zerubbabel of the second temple era. nope, not even Zechariah 4:7-10.

 

[Fusion77]

Of course what's thrown folks off track in Zechariah 4 is Zechariah 4:7-10. Most folks attribute this to the second temple. It is NOT speaking of the second temple or any physical building. First of all, Zerubbabel did NOT lay the foundation of the second temple. Ezra 3:10 Ezra 5:16 the bible is REALLY CLEAR about this. So once we recognize that fact, we can also realize Zechariah 4:7-10 is NOT speaking of physical work. In Zechariah 4:9 the word for foundation in Hebrew is derived from a feminine NOUN! Yesudah H3248, you can look this up on bible hub. You CANT get an ACTION out of a NOUN! The use of Yesudah has one other occurrence Psalms 87:1 do you think this speaks of physical building? Neither does Zechariah 4:7-10. These were 2 spiritual demonic attacks endured by this individual. Wherein, he resisted/denied the powers of darkness spiritual. Zechariah 4:10 it is something only the Eyes (Spirit) of the Lord sees. It can't be seen in the physical. Revelation 5:6 the Eyes are the Spirits Revelation 4:5 the 7 lamps 7 eyes = 7 Spirits.

Of course the Golden oil represents the anointing and refining power of the Holy Spirit. The olive trees and lampstands represent the 2 witnesses. Revelation 11:3-4 Zechariah 4:11 a question is asked no response Zechariah 4:12 a question is asked and a response is given Zechariah 4:14 Revelation 11:4. The olive branches represent individual gentile believers overflowing with the anointing of the Holy Spirit. Did we forget the objects represent Gods message to Zerubbabel? Or did we forget about Zechariah 4:6 already? One lampstand in the vision one message to 1 witness. The olive trees are for indentification purposes.

People have the misconception that these witnesses are something special on their own. WRONG! Like a lampstand they are USELESS without the Lamps (Holy Spirit) and oil (anointing power of Holy Spirit and Christ). Merely 2 vessels.

Zechariah 4 is ALL about The word of the Lord to Zerubbabel. He is a type of the witness. Actually this is his God given name. There is NOTHING in Zechariah 4 that pertains to the Zerubbabel of the second temple era. nope, not even Zechariah 4:7-10.

Of course, another message to that same witness can be found in Haggai 2:20-23. This is NOT a messages to the Zerubbabel of the second temple era. This is a message for us/him in this day and age. We know for sure this is a future message as the Lord has NOT yet shaken BOTH the heavens and the earth. We find this fact in Hebrews 12:25-27. Of course, that Zerubbabel was long gone by the time Hebrews was written. After this shaking (some sort of a war) God will make "Zerubbabel" the witness as His signet Haggai 2:23. A signet denotes authority or power to speak (witness) on behalf of Christ. Revelation 11:3. This will be the beginning of the anointing of the witnesses, but will not yet be the final 1260 days of their ministry, wherein, they will be clothed in sackcloth.

 

[JohnDB]

it does not say the witness are 2 guys..as i said post # 11 i have not developed a view. still reading and trying to figure it out. guess i was not clear,,,, i have studied scripture read commentaries, sites , for years and have not yet come to a conclusion in my head/heart

thanks for posting the passage

The answer you seek is in Genesis in the tale of Sodom and Gomorrah AND comparisons of the Gospels of THE tale of the Demon Posessed man in Gadarenes.

Now do a very careful inductive study of all three stories. Diagramming carefully each and every sentence.

Your answer is there.

 

[reba]

HUH?

 

[JohnDB]

HUH?

The Apocalypse of John is a "Final exam" of scriptures.
The solution is mostly revealed in those scriptures and one of the Prophet's books...but if you want the answer I am not permitted to hand it to you but I am allowed to direct you to where you can find the answers you are wanting. When you have done as I have directed ask me and I will point you to the last portion.

 

[reba]

not following the riddle

 

[JohnDB]

not following the riddle

I'm being as flat and opaque as possible.

I know it doesn't make sense... But neither does taking a bath in a muddy river to cure leprosy on your hand. But then it did work for Naamon now didn't it?

 

[Fusion77]

As I stated

The key, of course, is in Zechariah 4. Only, it took more to unlock the true meaning. It really starts in Zechariah 3:8 it states that Joshua and the friends that sit before him are a SIGN or a SYMBOL. Joshua symbolizes the Branch (Christ). Of course, there are also friends before Joshua that are a symbol as well. 3 verse after Zechariah 3:8 with the same encounter, with the same angel and the same prophet is roused from a sleep like state. He awakens to a vision of several objects. Zechariah 4:2-3 those objects represent Gods Message to Zerubbabel Zechariah 4:6. Those objects = "Not by might, not by power but by my Spirit saith the Lord of hosts" directed to Zerubbabel. It's not the Zerubbabel any one would think. He is merely Symbolic of the witness. It's Gods message to one of the witnesses saying not your power but by My Spirit that you'll do these things. This is the one whom God calls Zerubbabel a type, just like Zechariah 3:8 says. There is NOTHING in Zechariah 4 that has ANYTHING to do with the second temple era, or the Zerubbabel of that age. It's all about the 2 witnesses specifically Gods message to one of them. I'll show this later.

As I stated earlier, Joshua is a symbol or type of the Branch (Christ). Exactly as Zechariah 3:8 says. Zechariah 6:11-12 is a representation of Joshua the high priest being crowned as King. It is symbolic of the 2 offices of High priest and King coming together which is only possible with Christ. He is our High priest and sits on the throne of David eternally. This is nothing Joshua that high priest could ever fulfill. And again Zechariah 6:13 the counsel of peace will be between the 2 offices. The Branch is a known reference to the Messiah.

The true meaning of Zechariah 3 is an event that would transpire in future from that time in the Heavenly realm (it's in the past now). What we see in Zechariah 3:1-2 is Christ sometime after he ascended to the Father. Sometime after His time in the heart of the earth. Matthew 12:40. Of course, there was Satan the accuser of the brethren there saying "oh no, no that didn't count, you can't do that" Zechariah 3:3-4 this sin that was removed from Joshua (Christ), wasn't His sin, it was yours and mine. 2 Corinthians 5:22 He became sin who knew no sin and again 1 Peter 2:24. This is a picture of Christ coming out of the heart of the earth having removed our sin and sometime after that being accused by Satan possibly trying to claim that didn't count.

Of course Zechariah 3:6-7 is the Father instructing the Son of what awaits on earth and after. Of course, this is all for our benefit, as Christ knew the plan for our salvation. Zechariah 3:8 is informing us, that Joshua is a representation of the Branch (Christ), and that the friends (Zerubbabel and others) are also a representation of things to come. Isaiah 11:1 the Branch and Zechariah 3:9 and the stone again Isaiah 28:16 the Eyes on the stone (Spirits) Revelation 5:6 are upon that Stone Isaiah 11:2

Joshua = Jesus (same name)= Yeshua= Jehovah saves= the son of Jehozadak, which means Jehovah justified.
Joshua was high priest and symbolically crowned as King in Zechariah 6:11-12.
Zerubbabel of that age a physical worker,
The Zerubbabel of this age a spiritual worker. The Zerubbabel of that age the son of Pedaiah 1 Chronicles 3:19 physically adopted by Shealtiel. The Zerubbabel of this age, spiritually grafted (adopted) as an olive branch (individual gentile believer) into a the tree of righteous Jews Romans 11:17 as the spiritual son of Shealtiel. Zerubbabel a spiritual same likely not meaning seed of Babylon, but rather sower of seed in Babylon. (Zera) to sow or scatter seed and (Babel) Babylon. Like Egypt figurative for captivity or bondage to sin. Of course, the seed represents the word of God as stated in Luke 8:11.
These guys and all those friends before Joshua are a symbol of good things to come according to Zechariah 3:8. Zerubbabel was there. Who else to you think was there? There's more than 1. This tells us right here that many things in the second temple era (in a physical sense), typify things that have and will occur in our era, and when Christ has walked the earth. Though the things that are happening now are spiritual. What I'm saying is this. If I witness to someone and plant the seed, which helps lead them to salvation is that physical or Spiritual work? It's spiritual. This is a spiritual temple that were talking about now that typifies the second temple era. Ephesians 2:20 a spiritual foundation 1 Peter 2:4-6 built up as living stones a spiritual house.

 

[Eugene]

.
I believe one thing to consider in the nature of the two witnesses.

Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees (referring to the Holy Spirit?), and the two candlesticks (2 of the Churches Rev 1:20) standing before the God of the earth.

Who is with Jesus as He receives His own throne in Rev 4:2 just prior to the temptation to come upon all the earth?

Rev 4:4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold. There are but two of the seven churches mentioned as having crowns. I believe these to be those of Rev 2:10 that remained faithful unto death.

Rev 4:6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts (or Living ones) full of eyes before and behind. These will be those of Rev 3:10 which faithfully keep the word of God and are spared the temptation to come.

Rev 5:9 And they (24 elders & 4 beasts) sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; (Not just Israel)
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on (actually over the earth) the earth.

Their relationship to candlesticks in Rev 11:4 makes me think there may be more than two individuals witnessing during that 1260 days.

John 8:17. It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.

A thought just came to me which may or not have relevance and that is like John the Baptist of Luk 1:17 And he shall go before Him in the spirit and power of Elias. Are these two witnesses preparing the way for Jesus’ second appearing?
.