Bible Study Who Can Lay This To 'REST'??

[Jake]

The ones that have to be let grown until the end time harvest naturally do not do the harvesting. They are the great crowd. They may assist the first fruits though as they are harvested. Every harvest has its first fruits that mature ahead of the rest of the field.

We have a good example of how it works at 1 Corinthians chapter 3.

1 Corinthians 3:9 "For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building."

The definition of "husbandry" is "cultivating". So we see in deed that the first fruits are the ones harvested early on to be the workers in that field and they have been doing so from the beginning days of the church of Christ.

So we ought to not mistakenly think that there exists no harvested wheat to do the work. They are the body of Christ, first fruits by virtue of Christ who is the principal first fruit.

Also, "angel" merely means "messenger". These first fruits who are one in the principal first fruit who is Christ are Christ's messengers as his body in this earth. They carry the word that Christ said would do the judging in the last day.

As his body: John 12:48 "He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day."

Matthew 16:19 "And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."

John 14:12 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

OH! Yes, that does make sense, thanks.
Cool! Learn something new everyday.

 

[Elijah674]

Sorry, I am getting tired and misunderstood for a second.

I said the tares are being purged out from Christ's true church.

Let's see if the good seed participates in that?

John 12:48 "He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day."

Who preaches that word?

The good seed is the body of Christ, isn't it?

Looks to me like if the word Christ speaks judges in the last day ...............

He must do it through his body.

1 Peter 4:17 "For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?"

*******

Elijah here:
Sorry, but I see Eccl. 1:9-10 & Eccl. 3:15 with nothing new. So 'i' do not quite agree with this sentence..
'I said the tares are being purged out from Christ's true church.'

The way that 'i' see it, is that the past Virgin Church Fold stayed put as the tares & that the Wheat [Remnant] started up the Acts Fold. See Isa 5:3, Matt. 23:38, Matt, 25 AWAKENED [OUTSIDE ONES!] Plus the Prophecy of Matt. 10:5-6 & then who were the ones of verse 15?! They were The tares that stayed put & made up the apostate church fold! Compare John 12:42-43.

And then the repeat in Rev. finds Laodicea SPEWED out & replaced with her (Christs) faithful Remnant of Rev. 3:10, (the sixth candlestick!) and which stayed put as tares?? See ibid 9.

 

[Who Says]

I Added:
I'm not sure, you are connect Matthew with Corinthians, one is the tares, those are of the devil.
Cor is talking about who we build our foundation on. I'm not really seeing this connection (yet).
Hi-lighted so you will see I added and I am not arguing here, just trying to see your connection. Thanks.

Paul was working in that very same field doing the harvesting of the first fruits out of it to bring that them into Christ. That is what the word "husbandry" tells us.

Merriam - Webster Dictionary: Definition of HUSBANDRY

1 archaic : the care of a household


2 : the control or judicious use of resources : conservation


3 a : the cultivation or production of plants or animals : agriculture b : the scientific control and management of a branch of farming and especially of domestic animals

How do we now whether it is 1 or 2 or 3 ?

1 Corinthians 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

It is obvious they are the workers in that field.

There is not but one field for them to be in.

The field is the world.

And first fruits are always the first wheat harvested.

When Jesus said the field is the world at Matthew 13:38 the word used is <G2889> kosmos -- pronounced: kos'-mos
probably from the base of 2865; orderly arrangement, i.e. decoration; by implication, the world (in a wide or narrow sense, including its inhabitants, literally or figuratively (morally)): KJV -- adorning, world.


But when he says: Matthew 13:40 "As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world." This time the word used for world is <G0165>
aion -- pronounced: ahee-ohn'
from the same as 104; properly, an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; specially (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future):

 

[Who Says]

*******

Elijah here:
Sorry, but I see Eccl. 1:9-10 & Eccl. 3:15 with nothing new. So 'i' do not quite agree with this sentence..
'I said the tares are being purged out from Christ's true church.'

The way that 'i' see it, is that the past Virgin Church Fold stayed put as the tares & that the Wheat [Remnant] started up the Acts Fold. See Isa 5:3, Matt. 23:38, Matt, 25 AWAKENED [OUTSIDE ONES!] Plus the Prophecy of Matt. 10:5-6 & then who were the ones of verse 15?! They were The tares that stayed put & made up the apostate church fold! Compare John 12:42-43.

And then the repeat in Rev. finds Laodicea SPEWED out & replaced with her (Christs) faithful Remnant of Rev. 3:10, (the sixth candlestick!) and which stayed put as tares?? See ibid 9.

Try these:

Isaiah 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.
4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.
5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the LORD.

Micah 4:1 ¶But in the last days it shall come to pass, that the mountain of the house of the LORD shall be established in the top of the mountains, and it shall be exalted above the hills; and people shall flow unto it.
2 And many nations shall come, and say, Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.
3 And he shall judge among many people, and rebuke strong nations afar off; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up a sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

 

[Who Says]

Yes, it is going on, happening, I don't think it's done yet. But yes, for a later thread.

It is definitely not done yet. It will take wrath of God to end it.

 

[Who Says]

i wasnt raised in a typical christian home, as i was a jw and come from jewish ancenstry. i was lead to read from the torah.tanakh first then onto the new testament.solo fide is often misunderstood these days.

We are in complete agreement on that. :yes

 

[Jake]

Paul was working in that very same field doing the harvesting of the first fruits out of it to bring that them into Christ. That is what the word "husbandry" tells us.

Merriam - Webster Dictionary: Definition of HUSBANDRY

1 archaic : the care of a household


2 : the control or judicious use of resources : conservation


3 a : the cultivation or production of plants or animals : agriculture b : the scientific control and management of a branch of farming and especially of domestic animals

How do we now whether it is 1 or 2 or 3 ?

1 Corinthians 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

It is obvious they are the workers in that field.

There is not but one field for them to be in.

The field is the world.

And first fruits are always the first wheat harvested.

When Jesus said the field is the world at Matthew 13:38 the word used is <G2889> kosmos -- pronounced: kos'-mos
probably from the base of 2865; orderly arrangement, i.e. decoration; by implication, the world (in a wide or narrow sense, including its inhabitants, literally or figuratively (morally)): KJV -- adorning, world.


But when he says: Matthew 13:40 "As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world." This time the word used for world is <G0165>
aion -- pronounced: ahee-ohn'
from the same as 104; properly, an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; specially (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future):

I do see this and it makes perfect sense.

My question was on this verse you provided: (Post #33)
1 Corinthians 3:11 ¶For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
16 ¶Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
18 ¶Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.
19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.
20 And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.
21 ¶Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are yours;

You stated the tares can be saved through this test stated in this verse and my understanding of this verse is for those already saved because our foundation is Jesus Christ and that is what this scripture states, and our works are what is tested. Then it goes on to talk about how we are the temple of God. My confusion is coming from knowing the enemy planted the tares and those are not the temple of God, they are the enemy already and can not be saved. In fact, this verse states we can lose our salvation as people already saved, we can only lose something if we had it in the first place.

Yet you state they can be saved by being tested by fire and use this verse to show why. I do not see a connection with this verse and by using this verse you are trying to show the tares can eventually be saved. This is what I was questioning. Can you explain this and how you connect these two together?
Thanks.

 

[Who Says]

I do see this and it makes perfect sense.

You stated the tares can be saved through this test stated in this verse and my understanding of this verse is for those already saved because our foundation is Jesus Christ and that is what this scripture states, and our works are what is tested. Then it goes on to talk about how we are the temple of God. My confusion is coming from knowing the enemy planted the tares and those are not the temple of God, they are the enemy already and can not be saved. In fact, this verse states we can lose our salvation as people already saved, we can only lose something if we had it in the first place.

Yet you state they can be saved by being tested by fire and use this verse to show why. I do not see a connection with this verse and by using this verse you are trying to show the tares can eventually be saved. This is what I was questioning. Can you explain this and how you connect these two together?
Thanks.

In the brakets ( ) are quotes taken from you above:

("you state they can be saved by being tested by fire and use this verse to show why")

No, I use it not to show why. I use it to show that it is possible. If you want to know why testing by fire refines us that information is all in the Bible, too.

("are trying to show the tares can eventually be saved")

Yes, most definitely. God is about saving, he takes no delight in the death of someone wicked: Ezekiel 33:11 "Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?"


("my understanding of this verse is for those already saved because our foundation is Jesus Christ")

But you are missing the fact that these ones are not building on the foundation of Christ. That is why Paul starts out his counsel to them saying this: 1 Corinthians 3:11 "For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ." These ones are presenting God an offering similar to Cain's.

Now look at the things they build with and ask yourself which of those things correspond to building on Christ and which of them do not:
1 Corinthians 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

I highlighted all of Christ's materials in red. The foundation items we see for Christ are used often in describing heavenly things. Gold, silver, precious stones are items that have already been formed and refined under heat. Being pure they can be used to represent heavenly spiritual things. And here they constitute what the spiritual saved man would build with.

Now look what the man whose materials would burn if tested by fire aquaint to.
Wood, hay, stubble constitutes the earthy weak things. Man's flesh came from the earth's ground just as those things. Man's flesh is weak just as those things. They then well repreent the fleshly man (not the spiritual saved man). And he being in the church is a tare. I can show other places it talks about it in the scriptures later. But for now I will move this forward.

("Then it goes on to talk about how we are the temple of God. My confusion is coming from knowing the enemy planted the tares and those are not the temple of God, they are the enemy already and can not be saved. In fact, this verse states we can lose our salvation as people already saved, we can only lose something if we had it in the first place.")

These are plural pronouns Rockie. Paul is not saying the person themself is the Temple. He is refering to them as the one body of Christ. The body of Christ is what is holy and it is God's Temple. This is why I told you some time ago about plural and singular pronouns in the Greek. The KJV always uses thee, thou, thy, and thine when the pronoun in the original text is singular. When the KJV uses you, ye, or your these are always plural words in the original text.

Because Paul is talking about them destroying the Body of Christ which is God's Temple, that is why it is such a serious thing. 1 Corinthians 3:17 "If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye {ye plural, meaning the body of you together in Christ} are." Compare Ephesians 2:18-22

1 Corinthians 3:17 If any man <G1536> defile <G5351> the <G3588> temple <G3485> of God <G2316>, him <G5126> shall <G5351> God <G2316> destroy <G5351>; for <G1063> the <G3588> temple <G3485> of God <G2316> is <G2076> holy <G0040>, which <G3748> temple <G9999> ye <G5210> are <G2075>.

<G5210> humeis -- pronounced: hoo-mice'
irregular plural of 4771; you (as subjective of verb): KJV -- ye (yourselves), you.

I have many things to show you yet. But I am tired and better discipline myself to rest. We will cover more tommorrow if you would like.

God bless your humble and meek spirit, Rockie.

 

[Who Says]

I will try to help us understand how to read scripture with proper consideration for differentiating plural and singular pronouns of the original text. First I will post this little chart I put together.

Singular Number Pronouns in the KJV
Nominative = I, thou, he/she/it
Objective = me, thee, him/her, it
Possessive = my, mine, thy, thine, his/hers/its
1st Person = I, me, my, mine
2nd Person = thou, thee, thy, thine
3rd Person = he/she/it, him/her/it, his/hers/its

Plural Number Pronouns in the KJV
Nominative = we, ye, they
Objective = us, you, them
Possessive = our, ours, your, yours, their, theirs
1st Person = we, us, our, ours
2nd Person = ye, you, your, yours
3rd Person = they, them, their, theirs

Nominative = case of the subject
Objective = case of the object of the verb, indirect object of the verb or object of a preposition
Possessive = case of possessing or sourcing

 

[Nathan]

Maybe I am wrong, but this thread might be missing th OP 'point'?

Nothing wrong, I think good discussion has ensued. But I think the whole idea, and we have been talking about it to a degree, is that we are in the "sixth" day of 'creation', where God is working hard among us.

We are in the time of harvest. Times of resting will soon come. But the blatant fact that we are being worked on and in, dictates that there is still some seriousness to this life.

Sometimes I get taken as a "woe is me" kind of guy. Instead of the blissful "all is well with my soul" sort of people you meet. But the fact is all IS well with my soul. But my soul grieves for those who have not been born again.

Harvesting is hard work. Sure, there are good times to be had while "working". There is enjoyment in the work. But what we find is peoples minds centered elsewhere for enjoyment. When speaking of "endtimes", they do not want to consider that "last hard effort" that comes at the end of the harvest.

What you have is "lazy" gluttons who want to sit in the "rest" that always follows the harvest, and turn a blind eye to the work being done. I am not sure if it's just here in America, but it could stem from our lack of true work. We do not really 'work' anymore. And for that matter, we do not really rest anymore either. We have come to the point of not understanding what each part really means. How can you know "rest" if you know not "work"?

 

[Who Says]

That is sure right Nathan.

I often think of Enoch in relation to it.

I relate to what he must have felt.

 

[Nathan]

That is sure right Nathan.

I often think of Enoch in relation to it.

I relate to what he must have felt.

Add Noah to that list. I mean come on, a boat that is around 450' long, 75' wide, and 45' tall. That is some major work. ;)

He had three boys to help him, but that is an amazing thing. I wonder if they had "power" tools back then?

In all seriousness, how hard would it have been for him? To be showing them, not just with words, but with his actions that they were all fixing to perish. The ark, a physical and literal testimony of what was fixing to happen. But people looked at it as foolishness and unneeded.

They were fine with the life they had here(there). No thoughts that it is only temporary. I am sure, that a great number of them heard Noah preaching. I am sure they pondered it in their heart. But then decided that what they had was good enough for them.

Why people in this day and age think that THIS life is the rest from all is beyond me. Well, I take that back. I used to think this. But in reality we do have rest here and now through faith, but that faith is a working faith. Maybe its the idea of what a "yoke" is that throws people off.

 

[Elijah674]

*******

Elijah here:
Sorry, but I see Eccl. 1:9-10 & Eccl. 3:15 with nothing new. So 'i' do not quite agree with this sentence..
'I said the tares are being purged out from Christ's true church.'

The way that 'i' see it, is that the past Virgin Church Fold stayed put as the tares & that the Wheat [Remnant] started up the Acts Fold. See Isa 5:3, Matt. 23:38, Matt, 25 AWAKENED [OUTSIDE ONES!] Plus the Prophecy of Matt. 10:5-6 & then who were the ones of verse 15?! They were The tares that stayed put & made up the apostate church fold! Compare John 12:42-43.

And then the repeat in Rev. finds Laodicea SPEWED out & replaced with her (Christs) faithful Remnant of Rev. 3:10, (the sixth candlestick!) and which stayed put as tares?? See ibid 9.

______________________________

Me again:
OK: Nate, 'i' cautiously tried your approach??;) in the above. (using.. 'As ... 'i' see it) But look where this thread of 'Who Can Lay It To Rest'?? has gone?
These above Words have been layed to 'REST' huh?? (the Lord's 7th Day Sabbath 'REMEMBER' type it seems!)

The verses are [THE WORDS] OF GOD! Add to these Inspired Words His of 2 Thess. 2:3's SHAKING or great falling away + Rev. 18:4's REQUIRED SEPERATION or ETERNAL SECOND DEATH, and then we here again that ...

'I said the tares are being purged out from Christ's true church.'

So something new has deleated all of Gods Word above huh! Eccl. 3:15. And in bottom/line this 'church' is OSAS, stay yoked to it!

And so far we 'sneakily' have not even been told 'which' this fold is, except that the 7th Day Sabbath is not important to it. (and that is upfront like Christ, huh?) Well friend, this is the type of game playing that 'i' had in mind! When one goes on the devils ground to 'LEARN' from him, you surely will! And when one thinks personally that I,I,I,I,, 'I AM WITH NO CONDEMNATION AND PERFECT' so that he is NO match for me, then, before long it is that he has you hook line & sinker! Eccl. 3:15.

And even as we 'hear' some say...
to just learn because God had told her & Adam of his great wisdom that he 'still' has is STUPID & DANGEROUS! Jer. 17:5

Yet, The Word of God has Rev. 2:5 speaking for those who only will be in His Holy Mountain, and it is not here yet! as we see in Rev. 21! (see verse 7-8) And although God in Micah 2:10-13 only finds these few Remnant, who followed Him [[out]], nevertheless we see the LORD WITH THEM, even on 'the head of them,' for the 'breaker is come up before them: they have broken up [AND HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE GATE, AND HAVE GONE OUT] BY IT: AND [*THEIR KING SHALL PASS BEFORE THEM.] And again in Matt. 25 who left whom?

And you might, if you still care to? read Isaiah 52:11-12 for this [NO HAST] process... (both times) but you can be sure that Rom. 8:14 MUST APPLY!

Whatever?? But presumption leads into the Great Transgression! Ps. 19:13 And.. the Eternally SAVED ONES ARE DOCUMENTED in Rev. 12:17

--Elijah

 

[Jake]

Add Noah to that list. I mean come on, a boat that is around 450' long, 75' wide, and 45' tall. That is some major work. ;)

He had three boys to help him, but that is an amazing thing. I wonder if they had "power" tools back then?

In all seriousness, how hard would it have been for him? To be showing them, not just with words, but with his actions that they were all fixing to perish. The ark, a physical and literal testimony of what was fixing to happen. But people looked at it as foolishness and unneeded.

They were fine with the life they had here(there). No thoughts that it is only temporary. I am sure, that a great number of them heard Noah preaching. I am sure they pondered it in their heart. But then decided that what they had was good enough for them.

Why people in this day and age think that THIS life is the rest from all is beyond me. Well, I take that back. I used to think this. But in reality we do have rest here and now through faith, but that faith is a working faith. Maybe its the idea of what a "yoke" is that throws people off.

Personally, I think people get confused when we say our rest is in Jesus or we rest in Jesus because it does not abdicate that we should be doing nothing. Even in the new earth we will not "rest" persay as we are not going to be flying around on clouds doing nothing, there will never be a time where we live in complete leisure, doing nothing. And some: People have confused "works can not save you", with obedience.
Our rest is Jesus now means that as we allow the Spirit to conform us to His image, we are dying to ourselves and allowing the Spirit to work in us and through us. We are in agreement with the Spirit that Yes, we want this transformation and we want to be in God's Will, that is being set free and that is choosing life.
Otherwise, our own works, will cause us to be chasing our tails and we will never be doing His will nor being transformed, so the rest is, allowing Jesus to do the transforming for us.
My personal prayer is that I will be walking the Word AT ALL TIMES, walking as Jesus walked, this is what we are called to do and we can not do this if we are really "resting" as we "think" resting to mean. It is relying on Him for all things.

 

[Alabaster]

______________________________

Me again:
OK: Nate, 'i' cautiously tried your approach??;) in the above. (using.. 'As ... 'i' see it) But look where this thread of 'Who Can Lay It To Rest'?? has gone?
These above Words have been layed to 'REST' huh?? (the Lord's 7th Day Sabbath 'REMEMBER' type it seems!)

The verses are [THE WORDS] OF GOD! Add to these Inspired Words His of 2 Thess. 2:3's SHAKING or great falling away + Rev. 18:4's REQUIRED SEPERATION or ETERNAL SECOND DEATH, and then we here again that ...

'I said the tares are being purged out from Christ's true church.'

So something new has deleated all of Gods Word above huh! Eccl. 3:15. And in bottom/line this 'church' is OSAS, stay yoked to it!

And so far we 'sneakily' have not even been told 'which' this fold is, except that the 7th Day Sabbath is not important to it. (and that is upfront like Christ, huh?) Well friend, this is the type of game playing that 'i' had in mind! When one goes on the devils ground to 'LEARN' from him, you surely will! And when one thinks personally that I,I,I,I,, 'I AM WITH NO CONDEMNATION AND PERFECT' so that he is NO match for me, then, before long it is that he has you hook line & sinker! Eccl. 3:15.

And even as we 'hear' some say...
to just learn because God had told her & Adam of his great wisdom that he 'still' has is STUPID & DANGEROUS! Jer. 17:5

Yet, The Word of God has Rev. 2:5 speaking for those who only will be in His Holy Mountain, and it is not here yet! as we see in Rev. 21! (see verse 7-8) And although God in Micah 2:10-13 only finds these few Remnant, who followed Him [[out]], nevertheless we see the LORD WITH THEM, even on 'the head of them,' for the 'breaker is come up before them: they have broken up [AND HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE GATE, AND HAVE GONE OUT] BY IT: AND [*THEIR KING SHALL PASS BEFORE THEM.] And again in Matt. 25 who left whom?

And you might, if you still care to? read Isaiah 52:11-12 for this [NO HAST] process... (both times) but you can be sure that Rom. 8:14 MUST APPLY!

Whatever?? But presumption leads into the Great Transgression! Ps. 19:13 And.. the Eternally SAVED ONES ARE DOCUMENTED in Rev. 12:17

--Elijah

Bottom line, Elijah...what are you saying?

 

[Nathan]

______________________________

Me again:
OK: Nate, 'i' cautiously tried your approach??;) in the above. (using.. 'As ... 'i' see it) But look where this thread of 'Who Can Lay It To Rest'?? has gone?
These above Words have been layed to 'REST' huh?? (the Lord's 7th Day Sabbath 'REMEMBER' type it seems!)

The verses are [THE WORDS] OF GOD! Add to these Inspired Words His of 2 Thess. 2:3's SHAKING or great falling away + Rev. 18:4's REQUIRED SEPERATION or ETERNAL SECOND DEATH, and then we here again that ...

'I said the tares are being purged out from Christ's true church.'

So something new has deleated all of Gods Word above huh! Eccl. 3:15. And in bottom/line this 'church' is OSAS, stay yoked to it!

And so far we 'sneakily' have not even been told 'which' this fold is, except that the 7th Day Sabbath is not important to it. (and that is upfront like Christ, huh?) Well friend, this is the type of game playing that 'i' had in mind! When one goes on the devils ground to 'LEARN' from him, you surely will! And when one thinks personally that I,I,I,I,, 'I AM WITH NO CONDEMNATION AND PERFECT' so that he is NO match for me, then, before long it is that he has you hook line & sinker! Eccl. 3:15.

And even as we 'hear' some say...
to just learn because God had told her & Adam of his great wisdom that he 'still' has is STUPID & DANGEROUS! Jer. 17:5

Yet, The Word of God has Rev. 2:5 speaking for those who only will be in His Holy Mountain, and it is not here yet! as we see in Rev. 21! (see verse 7-8) And although God in Micah 2:10-13 only finds these few Remnant, who followed Him [[out]], nevertheless we see the LORD WITH THEM, even on 'the head of them,' for the 'breaker is come up before them: they have broken up [AND HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE GATE, AND HAVE GONE OUT] BY IT: AND [*THEIR KING SHALL PASS BEFORE THEM.] And again in Matt. 25 who left whom?

And you might, if you still care to? read Isaiah 52:11-12 for this [NO HAST] process... (both times) but you can be sure that Rom. 8:14 MUST APPLY!

Whatever?? But presumption leads into the Great Transgression! Ps. 19:13 And.. the Eternally SAVED ONES ARE DOCUMENTED in Rev. 12:17

--Elijah

I 'hear' you. Believe me. I do 'care' to, and have. I am reminded of Paul's God given "work" to do.

Rom 15:17-21 In Christ Jesus, then, I have reason to be proud of my work for God. For I will not venture to speak of anything except what Christ has accomplished through me to bring the Gentiles to obedience--by word and deed, by the power of signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God--so that from Jerusalem and all the way around to Illyricum I have fulfilled the ministry of the gospel of Christ; and thus I make it my ambition to preach the gospel, not where Christ has already been named, lest I build on someone else's foundation, but as it is written, "Those who have never been told of him will see, and those who have never heard will understand."

I have found that there is a whole field around me. Some spots need seed, others need some nutrients, and still some need care. While He has me in the field, I take GREAT care to make sure it is not "I" who seeks to be unyoked from Him.

 

[Who Says]

______________________________

Me again:
OK: Nate, 'i' cautiously tried your approach??;) in the above. (using.. 'As ... 'i' see it) But look where this thread of 'Who Can Lay It To Rest'?? has gone?
These above Words have been layed to 'REST' huh?? (the Lord's 7th Day Sabbath 'REMEMBER' type it seems!)

The verses are [THE WORDS] OF GOD! Add to these Inspired Words His of 2 Thess. 2:3's SHAKING or great falling away + Rev. 18:4's REQUIRED SEPERATION or ETERNAL SECOND DEATH, and then we here again that ...

'I said the tares are being purged out from Christ's true church.'

So something new has deleated all of Gods Word above huh! Eccl. 3:15. And in bottom/line this 'church' is OSAS, stay yoked to it!

And so far we 'sneakily' have not even been told 'which' this fold is, except that the 7th Day Sabbath is not important to it. (and that is upfront like Christ, huh?) Well friend, this is the type of game playing that 'i' had in mind! When one goes on the devils ground to 'LEARN' from him, you surely will! And when one thinks personally that I,I,I,I,, 'I AM WITH NO CONDEMNATION AND PERFECT' so that he is NO match for me, then, before long it is that he has you hook line & sinker! Eccl. 3:15.

And even as we 'hear' some say...
to just learn because God had told her & Adam of his great wisdom that he 'still' has is STUPID & DANGEROUS! Jer. 17:5

Yet, The Word of God has Rev. 2:5 speaking for those who only will be in His Holy Mountain, and it is not here yet! as we see in Rev. 21! (see verse 7-8) And although God in Micah 2:10-13 only finds these few Remnant, who followed Him [[out]], nevertheless we see the LORD WITH THEM, even on 'the head of them,' for the 'breaker is come up before them: they have broken up [AND HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE GATE, AND HAVE GONE OUT] BY IT: AND [*THEIR KING SHALL PASS BEFORE THEM.] And again in Matt. 25 who left whom?

And you might, if you still care to? read Isaiah 52:11-12 for this [NO HAST] process... (both times) but you can be sure that Rom. 8:14 MUST APPLY!

Whatever?? But presumption leads into the Great Transgression! Ps. 19:13 And.. the Eternally SAVED ONES ARE DOCUMENTED in Rev. 12:17

--Elijah

Tell me when in the entire church history the tares were not being opposed and put out to the edge of the field to be set fire to whenever it proved more damaging than fruitful to maintain and keep trying to rehabilitate them in God's flock and I mean Other than since the great apostacy set in?

1 Corinthians 5:7 "Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

1 Timothy 1:20 Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme.

Jude 1:3 ¶Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Titus 1:10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision:
11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake.
12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.
13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.
15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.
16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

2 Corinthians 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.
3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

2 Corinthians 11:12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.
13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Acts 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.

 

[Elijah674]

Originally Posted by Nathan
Add Noah to that list. I mean come on, a boat that is around 450' long, 75' wide, and 45' tall. That is some major work. ;)

He had three boys to help him, but that is an amazing thing. I wonder if they had "power" tools back then?

In all seriousness, how hard would it have been for him? To be showing them, not just with words, but with his actions that they were all fixing to perish. The ark, a physical and literal testimony of what was fixing to happen. But people looked at it as foolishness and unneeded.

They were fine with the life they had here(there). No thoughts that it is only temporary. I am sure, that a great number of them heard Noah preaching. I am sure they pondered it in their heart. But then decided that what they had was good enough for them.

Why people in this day and age think that THIS life is the rest from all is beyond me. Well, I take that back. I used to think this. But in reality we do have rest here and now through faith, but that faith is a working faith. Maybe its the idea of what a "yoke" is that throws people off.

--Elijah here???
You say but not in seriousness..

Add Noah to that list. I mean come on, a boat that is around 450' long, 75' wide, and 45' tall. That is some major work. ;)

He had three boys to help him, but that is an amazing thing. I wonder if they had "power" tools back then?

I think that the 120 years of Noah's building & his Preaching the Eternal Gospel of Rev. 14:6 [[WITH]] THE HOLY SPIRITS STRIVINGS MUST BE INCLUDED HERE??

And again: These ones ALL lived to a good old ripe age of nearly 1000 year old with their IQ + Physical endurance still nearly there!
See Gen. 5 + verse 36

And working 'faith' can go in opposit directions. Yet, both are LOVINGLY required, with even satan found with his finally 'desired' ones in Gen. 4:7. Do you suppose that this desire is satan's counterfiet 'REST?' With No more STRIVING of the HOLY SPIRIT!
And the ARKS DOOR did Close along with the Matt. 25:10 DOOR! And of ALL OF THESE ONES, the only ones who were RESTING from the storm were the ones [WHO OBEYED] & were in THE ARK.. CHRIST! Rom. 8:1 + Rom. 8:14! Yet Nate, as you have said, (bottom/line) Noah & son's were inside yet think of the WORK that they still had to do?
The Ark was full of God's creation!

What is interesting is the thought of Christ's long forbearance, some in heaven must of been very very close to enter back in, along with these ones who also had the Strivings of the Holy Ghost at the Arks building with some going in & then coming back out! (Heb. 6:6 Rev. 2:5) and the ones of Matt. 25's parable being explained in Matt. 10:5-6 on, in detail, and with only this few Remnant ones being finally 'IN' CHRIST! If one believes the Eccl. 1:9-10 & Eccl. 3:15 verses as I do.

 

[Nathan]

Personally, I think people get confused when we say our rest is in Jesus or we rest in Jesus because it does not abdicate that we should be doing nothing. Even in the new earth we will not "rest" persay as we are not going to be flying around on clouds doing nothing, there will never be a time where we live in complete leisure, doing nothing. And some: People have confused "works can not save you", with obedience.
Our rest is Jesus now means that as we allow the Spirit to conform us to His image, we are dying to ourselves and allowing the Spirit to work in us and through us. We are in agreement with the Spirit that Yes, we want this transformation and we want to be in God's Will, that is being set free and that is choosing life.
Otherwise, our own works, will cause us to be chasing our tails and we will never be doing His will nor being transformed, so the rest is, allowing Jesus to do the transforming for us.
My personal prayer is that I will be walking the Word AT ALL TIMES, walking as Jesus walked, this is what we are called to do and we can not do this if we are really "resting" as we "think" resting to mean. It is relying on Him for all things.

Right Rockie. The rest is knowing that He works through us. But that working through us is bringing us to complete obedience.

But the point is, that God does not change. We have this sure, steadfast anchor, this Rock, the Cornerstone of our Salvation. We KNOW what the right way is, and we KNOW what way He will lead us.

The simple matter of the fact is that people want 'some' but not ALL of His leadership. I know this, I have been there, I sometimes am brought out of there still. I will never deny the fact that I am a sheep and sometimes do stray. But I do not say, or should not stay in, the "presumptuous" place of saying that I will ALWAYS stray and so it "is what it is". I know when I am straying, and not being led, because His WHOLE word tells me.

Here is a simple test for everyone. If He told you to do something, would you do it? No matter what? People's opposition to the ALREADY written "Way" is based on false ideology. Its mans interpretation, or rather dedication, to mans way of thinking. That is why we must be transformed in our minds. Our heart has this, but our minds are caught in the battleground. Our hearts know that God's written way is love.

But people want to find "rest" in their OWN self interpretation of the Bible, rather than find rest in Him leading. They say they are led, but their actions speak otherwise. We all, while in this flesh, will have the 'ability' to stray/sin. But those who are in Christ will not stay there because He leads them away from that. To say that you are in Christ, being led by Him, and walking contrary to the documented "way" that He Himself walked, serves only to fool yourself.

Act 14:15-17 "Men, why are you doing these things? We also are men, of like nature with you, and we bring you good news, that you should turn from these vain things to a living God, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them. In past generations he allowed all the nations to walk in their own ways. Yet he did not leave himself without witness, for he did good by giving you rains from heaven and fruitful seasons, satisfying your hearts with food and gladness."

Rom 4:11-12 He received the sign of circumcision as a seal of the righteousness that he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised. The purpose was to make him the father of all who believe without being circumcised, so that righteousness would be counted to them as well, and to make him the father of the circumcised who are not merely circumcised but who also walk in the footsteps of the faith that our father Abraham had before he was circumcised.

Eph 2:10-16 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them. Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called "the uncircumcision" by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands--remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off(Gentiles, not Jews) have been brought near by the blood of Christ. For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace, and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility.

Its all about OBEDIENCE. Not obedience to a 'degree', but complete obedience. The Jews had the Law as their guide, until He came to show them the RIGHTEOUS way. We were brought near to THEM, not the other way around, and now TOGETHER are being led in the way of Righteousness. The end of this way is final "rest".

 

[Nathan]

I think that the 120 years of Noah's building & his Preaching the Eternal Gospel of Rev. 14:6 [[WITH]] THE HOLY SPIRITS STRIVINGS MUST BE INCLUDED HERE??

And again: These ones ALL lived to a good old ripe age of nearly 1000 year old with their IQ + Physical endurance still nearly there!
See Gen. 5 + verse 36

And working 'faith' can go in opposit directions. Yet, both are LOVINGLY required, with even satan found with his finally 'desired' ones in Gen. 4:7. Do you suppose that this desire is satan's counterfiet 'REST?' With No more STRIVING of the HOLY SPIRIT!
And the ARKS DOOR did Close along with the Matt. 25:10 DOOR! And of ALL OF THESE ONES, the only ones who were RESTING from the storm were the ones [WHO OBEYED] & were in THE ARK.. CHRIST! Rom. 8:1 + Rom. 8:14! Yet Nate, as you have said, (bottom/line) Noah & son's were inside yet think of the WORK that they still had to do?
The Ark was full of God's creation!

What is interesting is the thought of Christ's long forbearance, some in heaven must of been very very close to enter back in, along with these ones who also had the Strivings of the Holy Ghost at the Arks building with some going in & then coming back out! (Heb. 6:6 Rev. 2:5) and the ones of Matt. 25's parable being explained in Matt. 10:5-6 on, in detail, and with only this few Remnant ones being finally 'IN' CHRIST! If one believes the Eccl. 1:9-10 & Eccl. 3:15 verses as I do.

Yes, it must be included here.

Hbr 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned by God concerning events as yet unseen, in reverent fear constructed an ark for the saving of his household. By this he condemned the world and became an heir of the righteousness that comes by faith.

Gen 6:22-7:1 Noah did this; he did all that God commanded him. Then the LORD said to Noah, "Go into the ark, you and all your household, for I have seen that you are righteous before me in this generation.

1Jo 3:10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

Sometimes we think of "witnessing" or "preaching" as a vocal thing. All too often do we disregard the fact that our very life is a witness to all. Who we are, what we do every moment of every day is a witness to everyone around, and even to us ourselves.

Gal 6:17 From now on let no one cause me trouble, for I bear on my body the marks of Jesus.

How did he receive these "marks"? It was not from rest...

1Cr 1:22-23 For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified, ---a stumbling block to Jews--- and ---folly to Gentiles---,

Why is there a designation between the Jew and Gentile? Why just a stumbling block to the Jew, but complete folly to the Gentile?