Why did Jesus tell people to count the cost of following Him if salvation is without cost?

[Dorothy Mae]

Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. 28For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it? 29Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it begin to mock him, 30saying, ‘This man began to build and was not able to finish.’ 31Or what king, going out to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and deliberate whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand? 32And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends a delegation and asks for terms of peace. 33So therefore, any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple.

 

[Robert Pate]

Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. 28For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it? 29Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it begin to mock him, 30saying, ‘This man began to build and was not able to finish.’ 31Or what king, going out to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and deliberate whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand? 32And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends a delegation and asks for terms of peace. 33So therefore, any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple.

All that come to Christ as repentant sinners to be saved by him will suffer persecution. This is why they are given the Holy Spirit who is also known as the comforter. The work of the Holy Spirit is to make them a witness for Christ and his Gospel. Being a witness for Christ in this ungodly world can bring trouble into one's life. There may be a price to pay for being a Christian.

 

[hawkman]

Everything free in this world has come from someone else paying the price.

 

[WIP]

Everything free in this world has come from someone else paying the price.

Agree. Nothing is truly free. Someone pays. Of course, this is just my opinion but unfortunately, most of those that get it free are not grateful as they should be. Every morning I like to take the time to thank God for all His gifts, His love, His kindness, His forgiveness, His grace, His mercy,..... For we deserve none of it.

 

[Free]

Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. 28For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it? 29Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it begin to mock him, 30saying, ‘This man began to build and was not able to finish.’ 31Or what king, going out to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and deliberate whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand? 32And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends a delegation and asks for terms of peace. 33So therefore, any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple.

It seems that the point you're missing is that when salvation is said to be free, that only means that it is not by works, it is only by grace. But, yes, it will, in another sense, cost us all we have.

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. (ESV)

 

[hawkman]

Being a witness for Christ in this ungodly world can bring trouble into one's life.

And we are to be ready .

Ephesians 6

11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

There may be a price to pay for being a Christian.

Ah, so you admit there’s a price to be paid. I agree. Following Jesus is not free.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

It seems that the point you're missing is that when salvation is said to be free, that only means that it is not by works, it is only by grace. But, yes, it will, in another sense, cost us all we have.

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. (ESV)

The theology that insists it’s all free and costs us nothing whatsoever at any time will lead to believers unwilling to pay any price. Every single person I’ve heard who is deep in understanding God and His ways always had to pay a heavy price for those pearls, without exception. They never say following Jesus is free. They say it cost them a lot but worth it, more than worth it.

The point you’re missing is Jesus himself said to count the cost. His disciples paid that price. Jesus didn’t say salvation costs a man nothing.

I repeat, conceiving a child is absolutely free. Doesn’t cost the parents anything. But no one says that children are not at all costly.

 

[Free]

The theology that insists it’s all free and costs us nothing whatsoever at any time will lead to believers unwilling to pay any price.

Maybe there are some that say that, but I haven't heard it. I've always heard from the pulpit that salvation is free, but it will cost you everything you have.

You have two threads going about this topic, wondering why salvation is said to be free. That is because the Bible tells us that it is free. Salvation itself is a free gift to us from God; it cannot be obtained by works. Walking the Christian life, once justified, will cost a lot, perhaps everything, and we have to be willing to accept that.

The point you’re missing is Jesus himself said to count the cost. His disciples paid that price. Jesus didn’t say salvation costs a man nothing.

I never said otherwise.

I repeat, conceiving a child is absolutely free. Doesn’t cost the parents anything. But no one says that children are not at all costly.

This is exactly what I have said.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Maybe there are some that say that, but I haven't heard it. I've always heard from the pulpit that salvation is free, but it will cost you everything you have.

Then it’s not free. It’s not earned. It’s not won. But let me ask you, does a man have to repent of his sins to be forgiven? If so, salvation isn’t free. One can receive a gift that costs a man a lot. I gave the example if a baby. Absolutely free to conceive.

You have two threads going about this topic, wondering why salvation is said to be free. That is because the Bible tells us that it is free.

The Bible says to count the cost. I quoted it.

Salvation itself is a free gift to us from God; it cannot be obtained by works.

Can it be obtained without repentance?

Walking the Christian life, once justified, will cost a lot, perhaps everything, and we have to be willing to accept that.

If you’re told it’s free, you won’t be able to do so. You’ll hide behind not having to pay anything.

I never said otherwise.


This is exactly what I have said.

OK. Sounded like you’re missing that bit. You emphasize it being free despite Jesus saying continually it costs a man.

 

[for_his_glory]

John 15:19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.
John 15:20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.
John 15:21 But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.

Count the cost of your own life the persecutions you will possibly receive as Christ received them as we are no greater in counting the cost of Jesus laying His life down for another.

Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

 

[Free]

Then it’s not free. It’s not earned. It’s not won. But let me ask you, does a man have to repent of his sins to be forgiven? If so, salvation isn’t free. One can receive a gift that costs a man a lot. I gave the example if a baby. Absolutely free to conceive.

The Bible says to count the cost. I quoted it.

Can it be obtained without repentance?

If you’re told it’s free, you won’t be able to do so. You’ll hide behind not having to pay anything.

OK. Sounded like you’re missing that bit. You emphasize it being free despite Jesus saying continually it costs a man.

You're the one who has made two threads wondering why people are saying salvation is free. I, and others, have given biblical evidence that salvation is free, which is why people say it is free.

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. (ESV)

Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,
Eph 2:9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. (ESV)

2Ti 1:9 who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began, (ESV)

Tit 3:4 But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared,
Tit 3:5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
Tit 3:6 whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
Tit 3:7 so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life. (ESV)

Salvation is a free gift from God; there is absolutely nothing we can do to merit salvation. To say otherwise is to go against Scripture. But, yes, saying it is free is only part of the message. People still need to be told that although salvation is free, we are to be willing to give even our lives for the gospel. These are two sides of the same coin.

 

[WIP]

Maybe there are some that say that, but I haven't heard it. I've always heard from the pulpit that salvation is free, but it will cost you everything you have.

You have two threads going about this topic, wondering why salvation is said to be free. That is because the Bible tells us that it is free. Salvation itself is a free gift to us from God; it cannot be obtained by works. Walking the Christian life, once justified, will cost a lot, perhaps everything, and we have to be willing to accept that.


I never said otherwise.


This is exactly what I have said.

Maybe it depends on one's perspective. From the perspective that we don't have to, nor can we, do anything to earn salvation it is free. On the other hand, receiving salvation comes at a price. When we accept the gift of life, we can and most likely will face persecutions from the world. We don't buy salvation but receiving can be costly.

Jesus was speaking to His disciples but I think it applies all of His disciples down through the ages and into the future.

18 “If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you.
19 If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.
John 15:18-19 ESV

12 Indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted,
13 while evil people and impostors will go on from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.
2 Timothy 3:12-13 ESV

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Maybe it depends on one's perspective. From the perspective that we don't have to, nor can we, do anything to earn salvation it is free. On the other hand, receiving salvation comes at a price. When we accept the gift of life, we can and most likely will face persecutions from the world. We don't buy salvation but receiving can be costly.

Jesus was speaking to His disciples but I think it applies all of His disciples down through the ages and into the future.

18 “If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you.
19 If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.
John 15:18-19 ESV

12 Indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted,
13 while evil people and impostors will go on from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.
2 Timothy 3:12-13 ESV

In their world, persecution was a real price. In our world, it’s not. But if a man refuses to surrender the sin he enjoys assuming it’s all forgiven anyway and so doesn’t matter to God and no one else counts, he is in danger of becoming a lawless one, that is, one who refuses to submit to laws of God or man. Jesus rejected lawless ones although they indeed “called upon the name of the Lord” (used the “right” words.) The freedom from sin means the power to refuse sin, not freedom from its consequences.

Again, salvation is as free as conceiving a child or finding your sweetheart for life. You cannot buy either. But from the point of accepting them, you will begin to pay. We can focus on how our baby was free or on how our sweetheart came to love us for free, but that is for one, narcissism pure and for two, likely to render us less likely to realize the price. If we don’t pay the price, the child, the sweetheart and salvation are in danger of suffering neglect with the real consequences of losing the “free” gift.

Interestingly enough, many refer to their spouse and offspring as gifts of God. No one ever talks about these gifts were free costing them nothing at all. I wonder if those who harp on how salvation for them was free would like it if their parents talked incessantly about how having them was free….Or their sweetheart talking constantly about how them being loved was free. How would they like it if their cherished ones referred to that relationship as a “free gift” all the time?

 

[WIP]

In their world, persecution was a real price. In our world, it’s not.

Persecution doesn't necessarily mean death. It can be as simple as teasing. There are places in this world today where it can be life-threatening to be Christian. There are people in my life I have to tip-toe around if I want to remain in a relationship with them. Maybe I should just accept not having a relationship with them and shake the dust off my feet but by remaining in a relationship with them I believe there is still a chance that I may some day God may use me to be influential in their lives. So, for me, that is a price I am paying right now.

 

[Edward]

Ah, so you admit there’s a price to be paid. I agree. Following Jesus is not free.

Sure there is a price to be paid. The 64 thousand dollar quwston is, are you a wise investor?

Matthew 13:
44 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.

45 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls:

46 Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.../

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Persecution doesn't necessarily mean death. It can be as simple as teasing. There are places in this world today where it can be life-threatening to be Christian. There are people in my life I have to tip-toe around if I want to remain in a relationship with them. Maybe I should just accept not having a relationship with them and shake the dust off my feet but by remaining in a relationship with them I believe there is still a chance that I may some day God may use me to be influential in their lives. So, for me, that is a price I am paying right now.

To those who have suffered real loss because of their stance, teasing hardly qualifies as persecution.

 

[WIP]

To those who have suffered real loss because of their stance, teasing hardly qualifies as persecution.

What difference does that make? For me, to get the wrath of being the brunt of jokes and the casting out is not easy to take. Where do you draw that line and please be very descript so that I know without a doubt when I am suffering persecution?

 

[Free]

Maybe it depends on one's perspective. From the perspective that we don't have to, nor can we, do anything to earn salvation it is free. On the other hand, receiving salvation comes at a price. When we accept the gift of life, we can and most likely will face persecutions from the world. We don't buy salvation but receiving can be costly.

Jesus was speaking to His disciples but I think it applies all of His disciples down through the ages and into the future.

18 “If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you.
19 If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.
John 15:18-19 ESV

12 Indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted,
13 while evil people and impostors will go on from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.
2 Timothy 3:12-13 ESV

Yes, that is my point. But there are still a couple of reasons why that cost isn't as costly as some are making it out to be. Firstly, it is still God that works in us and through us, if we let him. It is he that sustains and sanctifies us, and he will bring the work he started in us to completion. Secondly, how costly is it compared to eternal life? It is relatively costly in terms of our temporary life, but we are still to count it all joy since God uses it to make us into he wants us to be.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

What difference does that make? For me, to get the wrath of being the brunt of jokes and the casting out is not easy to take. Where do you draw that line and please be very descript so that I know without a doubt when I am suffering persecution?

If you talked to a man who lost his job because he was a christian, would you feel you suffered the same as he did? Isn’t there a difference?