Why do you believe?

[Logan Phipps]

Hello everyone, I am a recent christian turned agnostic. (Please don't try to change my view points) but I would like to know why you believe what you believe? I personally let go of Christianity for many reasons, 1. because I am not intrested in following a god that has no business in helping me or trying to make me better, I have prayed,prayed, and prayed some more, but nothing not one speck of help from him. 2. I was happy when I was an unbeliever, and when I because a christian I was sad, depressed, anxiety ridden and ocd ridden all because if christianity, before this I was fine, but these past few months have been the worst of my life and after a year of faith, I am done. I have given up of the god of Christianity. 3. Too many rules, I have been troubled by soany rules in my life that I simply could not live without worrying about of I was sinning and I got sick of it ang gave it up. I still believe there could be a god, but that god is not knowable and not able to understand. I also do not believe in sin or salvation.

 

[OzSpen]

from a Catholics pov, sola scriptura is too rigid. we listen and access more than one source. Pope, Church fathers, Church hierarchy including catholic theologians. And there is the monastic tradition too which has an interesting monastic perspective. You want go broad, go catholic.

How do you determine if any of these traditions is reliable or not?

 

[OzSpen]

Because the more I believe the more is added to me, even with signs that follow those who believe confirming, that we love God and brother from within our Spirit as it happens in our new created self from Jesus with the supernatural wonderful fear of God ..

To whom are you replying, please back quote.

 

[skyhigh]

you

How do you determine if any of these traditions is reliable or not?

you mean like scripture for instance?
we trust what early Christians wrote. Jesus made Peter the Rock of the Church, handed him the key and it has been an apostolic succession since then. Jesus had to leave someone in charge, otherwise the Word couldn't be passed down with any authority. And who wrote New testament? The Early Christian Church of course

 

[Randy]

Why you believe:
Those that listen and learn from the Father go to the Son. The Spirit speaks what he hears. They shall all be taught by God.
Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.
And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.
Jesus on the Spirit John 14
But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live.20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”

 

[Garion]

I really don't think that that should be the point though. The fear of going to Hell should not be the reason for turning to God. Especially if that's your only reason. Again, that's just only my opinion.

It shouldn't be the point but in today's world where we have reverted back to primal urge self preservation is a great starting point.

I fully agree with you that people should fully appreciate the Lord and His advice to really benefit.

We live in a world that does not give people a reason to believe in God so I think that anything that will get a persons foot in the door of belief is a great starting point.

 

[Garion]

My point is that you are still relying on someone interpreting the Scriptures. I agree that there are a lot of "Scholars" who get it wrong. However, if we follow this reasoning you shouldn't go to the doctor when you're sick because there are a lot of quacks out there. They get it wrong too.

I'm not relying on someone interpreting Scripture I rely on what my mother taught me of Gods advice.

 

[Garion]

To whom are you addressing your comment? I do wish you would learn to back quote ALL of the time so I know if you are addressing my post or not.

Yes, I know Scripture can be twisted. Is this the pot calling the kettle black??

Like I said I don't want to argue.... you got my point that's what matters.

Sorry for not quoting I'm use to a different site.

 

[Garion]

How do you determine if any of these traditions is reliable or not?

This is why I don't put absolute faith in Scripture.

I believe that there is a great chance that it has been corrupted by satan throughout the ages because there are incongruencies.

I believe that God's should be passed from generation to generation within the family.

I trust my mother with my life and soul which is as it should be.

Satan's ultimate goal is chaos he is achieving this with deceit and misdirection and Scripture may be part of that.

I say this because I've seen people who dedicate their life to Scripture yet they still miss God's point.

 

[Garion]

you


you mean like scripture for instance?
we trust what early Christians wrote. Jesus made Peter the Rock of the Church, handed him the key and it has been an apostolic succession since then. Jesus had to leave someone in charge, otherwise the Word couldn't be passed down with any authority. And who wrote New testament? The Early Christian Church of course

This is why I don't put absolute faith in Scripture.

I believe that there is a great chance that it has been corrupted by satan throughout the ages because there are incongruencies.

I believe that God's should be passed from generation to generation within the family.

I trust my mother with my life and soul which is as it should be.

Satan's ultimate goal is chaos he is achieving this with deceit and misdirection and Scripture may be part of that.

I say this because I've seen people who dedicate their life to Scripture yet they still miss God's point.

I don't trust what early Christians wrote, I don't know them personally so I have no reason to.

God says to put your faith in HIM not anybody else.

 

[Randy]

I was steered to Jesus from youth from a christian Mother so as far back as my memory goes and long before theological arguments I have believed and loved Jesus. So when I prayed as a young child something must have took. I believe the Lord responded to my faith in Him. I know Jesus knows me and I know Him. The Spirit has witnessed to my Spirit that I belong to Jesus. I know with certainty Jesus Lives!

 

[K2CHRIST]

I really don't think that that should be the point though. The fear of going to Hell should not be the reason for turning to God. Especially if that's your only reason. Again, that's just only my opinion.

Jesus talked more about Hell than anyone, and I know His purpose was to turn people to God! I think a man name Ray Comfort did a great job of explaining that, but not as good a job as Jesus did. Hell, is a very good reason for turning to God! There are other reasons like heaven, love, wisdom, knowledge, and more in this world and the next, but not going to hell is a great reason to turn to God.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

Jesus talked more about Hell than anyone, and I know His purpose was to turn people to God! I think a man name Ray Comfort did a great job of explaining that, but not as good a job as Jesus did. Hell, is a very good reason for turning to God! There are other reasons like heaven, love, wisdom, knowledge, and more in this world and the next, but not going to hell is a great reason to turn to God.

If that's your opinion, then so be it. I'm not trying to start an argument, I was just simply stating my opinion.

 

[brujaq]

To whom are you replying, please back quote.

Just general chat Oz ..

 

[Garion]

Jesus talked more about Hell than anyone, and I know His purpose was to turn people to God! I think a man name Ray Comfort did a great job of explaining that, but not as good a job as Jesus did. Hell, is a very good reason for turning to God! There are other reasons like heaven, love, wisdom, knowledge, and more in this world and the next, but not going to hell is a great reason to turn to God.

Yep,for me not going to hell is the meat and potatoes...going to heaven? That's just gravy.

 

[PeterJens]

Hello everyone, I am a recent christian turned agnostic. (Please don't try to change my view points) but I would like to know why you believe what you believe? I personally let go of Christianity for many reasons, 1. because I am not intrested in following a god that has no business in helping me or trying to make me better, I have prayed,prayed, and prayed some more, but nothing not one speck of help from him. 2. I was happy when I was an unbeliever, and when I because a christian I was sad, depressed, anxiety ridden and ocd ridden all because if christianity, before this I was fine, but these past few months have been the worst of my life and after a year of faith, I am done. I have given up of the god of Christianity. 3. Too many rules, I have been troubled by soany rules in my life that I simply could not live without worrying about of I was sinning and I got sick of it ang gave it up. I still believe there could be a god, but that god is not knowable and not able to understand. I also do not believe in sin or salvation.

I understand this perspective. But let me put this on its head. The rules come from a heart, if the heart is right
the rules help to show when things have gone wrong. The rule itself is just a red flag, that we need to change our
perspective and focus. So if rules dominate one has already lost the focus on ones heart and God.
Imagine learning to drive a car. If you do not follow the rules, crash, no car, no travel, and sometimes no life.
So we then say we should not drive because there are so many rules? No we learn the rules because we want
to get from a to b quickly and safely and it is the best method available.

Jesus came to me and compared my way of living and loving to His. He pointed out how much I wanted to conform
to be accepted, to worry about how others felt, and was only prepared to do a little, but Jesus was prepared to do so
much. It flawed me, and showed my how much I had to learn.

When we say God has not spoken to me, what is the bible? How many people over the centuries have read and
lived this book and told about Gods ways and methods of reaching out to us? So it is us who refuse to listen, or
put effort in, on push the boundaries of what we are prepared to do. We mostly want excuses, because it is safe,
and when we step out in faith, He is there. I have found so many times, He speaks to me when I step out in
faith, not before, so silence is always my fault, I need to show willing and be willing.

The first step spiritually for me was praise. I started to sing Praise to the King, alone in my room. My heart lifted
my spirit and soul soared. It was exercising faith of God in the spiritual, the world of heaven come to earth.
So I ask you, go to that quiet place, and praise God for His word, His blessing, His forgiveness and He will meet
with you. Take up His word and listen to what it is saying, and it will find you where you need it. A living relationship
has to begin and be alive with emotion, joy and sadness to be alive. Breath life into faith, God bless, Amen.

 

[for_his_glory]

I believed in what Jesus said because my mother told me that His advice is just.

I am honestly not trying to be insulting or belittle your beliefs but I don't see any reason to be born again when I believed from the beginning because I trust my mother.

I was temporarily side tracked from Gods advice but it was a conscious willful spiteful act... I knew that how I was living was wrong.

No, you have not been insulting or belittling our beliefs as you are free to chose what you believe. We do use scripture as being inspired by God as His word that teaches and instructs us into all His righteousness for our sake that when Christ returns we will have been prepared to be with Him forever. I have no idea what your mother has taught you, but if you are not Spiritually born again you will have no place with Jesus when He returns. Ephesians 2: 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

 

[Garion]

No, you have not been insulting or belittling our beliefs as you are free to chose what you believe. We do use scripture as being inspired by God as His word that teaches and instructs us into all His righteousness for our sake that when Christ returns we will have been prepared to be with Him forever. I have no idea what your mother has taught you, but if you are not Spiritually born again you will have no place with Jesus when He returns. Ephesians 2: 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

That's great,im not trying to be negative I can't stress this enough but me not going to Heaven for not being "born again" is your opinion based on Scripture written by people that you don't know.

Just because you trust them that doesn't mean that I will.

My mother taught me God's advice and it was handed down to her by her mother.

Scripture has inconsistencies that I don't trust like He's going to throw children in a lake of fire because of what their parents taught them yet He's such a nice guy that everyone goes to Heaven as long as they repent.

I think that Satan corrupted many aspects of Christianity to confuse us and it worked.

Like being "born again" is a ritual right?

Doesn't He advise against ritualism and idolatry?

 

[for_his_glory]

That ignores the biblical evidence I provided.

I don't see it that way as Job was speaking about himself that he was afraid of God. We might have started out fearing God in the beginning as we knew not His attributes as being a just and loving God and a loving God would not want His children to be afraid of Him, but to reverence and respect Him as being the God of all creation. Just how I see it

 

[Garion]

Also do you see how y'all argue back and forth over Scripture that is unprovable?

That's another negative aspect that I try not to participate in.

Satan confuses us which leads to argumentation which leads to chaos.

Now I know that y'all will say that "I know in my heart that it's true" but that's hardly quantitative.

That's just your opinion.

 

[for_his_glory]

Exactly but they are in denial because they've swallowed the whole "saved" paradigm. It's too late to back out. All or nothing no buts or maybes. it shows their theology is too rigid.

Do you believe in a work based salvation that you have to work for it, or by grace are you saved through faith; and that not of yourselves as it is the gift of God?