Why do you hate?

[Vic C.]

Off topic Drew. Deal with your displeasure with Relic over her comments and opinions of public figures in another thread or better yet, in a PM.

Thanks.

 

[RND]

I was never sexualy abused. I grew up with a strong male figure. I grew up in an enviroment that encouraged me to date women. I'm not feminine.

I'm gay, and have always been.

And yet, the Lord has given you a way to escape:

1Cr 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].

Explain to me the common factor that we all suposedly share.

The fact that God loves us and doesn't desire any should perish.

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

 

[Vic C.]

One more off topic and /or personal post and yet another thread goes bye-bye.

 

[JoJo]

I think it's important for Christians to note that the OP voices concern about viewing Christians as hateful. I think that's sad! We are the last people who should be accused of hate, but do we deserve it sometimes?

It's not the Biblical information we present that makes people think we're hateful, it's how we present it.

 

[walter]

I agree, generalizations are unfair. But Bones, does it bother you that this is the impression we might be giving off? Do we look like hypocrites?

We must understand that we are no better than anyone else. Too many christians think they are better than non-christians because we have salvation in direct opposition to what Jesus said. He said salvation is a gift for all. A "gift". You don't earn a gift, it is given freely and even to the undeserving.
I think it's time we think of ourselves as undeserving instead of entitled. That is so much closer to the truth.

As far as hating, well, the thread starter presumes way too much. If you start with that premise you show your bias right off the bat. If you truly want to understand you must leave all preconceptions at the door, then come in and talk.
That goes for all of us equally, christians and non-christians alike.

 

[Drew]

We must understand that we are no better than anyone else

Well, in a sense you are right, of course. But in another sense, we should shine like lights compared with the unredeemed. So when Christians villify gays, or distort the truth, or whatever, some very hard questions need to be asked.

And I will leave it to the reader to guess the principle question that needs to be asked.

 

[glorydaz]

I agree, generalizations are unfair. But Bones, does it bother you that this is the impression we might be giving off? Do we look like hypocrites?

We must understand that we are no better than anyone else. Too many christians think they are better than non-christians because we have salvation in direct opposition to what Jesus said. He said salvation is a gift for all. A "gift". You don't earn a gift, it is given freely and even to the undeserving.
I think it's time we think of ourselves as undeserving instead of entitled. That is so much closer to the truth.

As far as hating, well, the thread starter presumes way too much. If you start with that premise you show your bias right off the bat. If you truly want to understand you must leave all preconceptions at the door, then come in and talk.
That goes for all of us equally, christians and non-christians alike.

True. A Christian's righteous acts, if done in the flesh, are just as filthy as the next guy's.
We all battle the flesh...be it pride or lust.

 

[JoJo]

We must understand that we are no better than anyone else. Too many christians think they are better than non-christians because we have salvation in direct opposition to what Jesus said. He said salvation is a gift for all. A "gift". You don't earn a gift, it is given freely and even to the undeserving.

I agree totally, but aren't we called the salt of the earth? Shouldn't we, as representatives of Christ, act in a manner worthy of the title of God's children? In short, shouldn't we behave better as people watch our actions and judge us accordingly?

 

[jasoncran]

we check the flesh early in the morning. and that "perversion" thing never happened to me before 10 or after save one isolated incident in which a gay man assaulted(rather harrased) me. my some serious unwanted gestures and touching. i should have put him on the floor then told my commanding officers or the nearest chaplain.

but this has had direct bearing on my acting out on the homosexualy or bi ? attraction to a man. Do i hate this man now? no, i have forgiven him, but i seriously cant stand him. pray for him.

why do nonmembers or never have members of the lbgt assume that all lbgt have seen or been involved in perversion. what if the person never had a good role model for a man, my case, or it just happened to them. i wont lie, i asked the lord why i went into that relationship, and when i feel up to i will tell.

 

[LostSoul]

I have noticed that a lot of christians seems to disapprove of so much.

As an atheist (I don't hate god, I just don't believe), I accept people for who they are, I try not to judge people, and I do what I can to help them if I can.
You may say I'm judging or hating christians, but I'm not, I'm trying to understand.

You hate gay people because "it says so in the bible", yet you don't hate people who have sex with women during their periods, yet it says so in the bible. I could go on.

So, why do you hate/disapprove of certain people, and not others?

And aren't you supposed to "love thy neighbour"?

Cat, if you are still around....

While I may understand why you get the impression all, if not a great number of Christians hate gays this is not the complete truth. Yes, there are some misled believers out there that speak of nothing but hate towards those who engage in the homosexual lifestyle and that God hates them for their sin, this is not the case for all. I have a sister, who is also the godmother of my son, who is lesbian. She is one of the most responsible and amazing people I have ever known. Am I going to lie though and say that homosexuality is not a sin? No. Not any more than I will say that drunkeness, amongst other things are not sin, when in fact, they are. Sin is sin...plain and simple. We are to hate the sin, not the sinner. If we truly are to hate the sinner, we should look to ourselves and look upon ourselves with the same scorn we do others. For none of us are perfect. Though indeed, we are taught to live and strive to be as much like Christ as we can as Jesus was the perfect lamb.

 

[oy_vey_]

I liken this to those who claim we're racist if we don't support Obama. :yes
It isn't true, but it gives a reason to point a finger.

It also isn't true that someone is "born" gay. I realize it makes a person feel better about themselves if they can believe it, but it's simply not the truth. I'll be the first to admit there is often a very good reason for the sexual identity problems we see around us. I work with children that have been sexually abused...many from a very early age. We live in a sick, mixed-up world, and, unfortunately, sexual sins abound. I also spent ten years interviewing people from the gay community about their early sexual experiences. There's a common thread....one that does not go all the way back to their birth...but to their early formative years. I know God is able to do a mighty work in anyone's life once they recognize their sin and repent. Gays aren't the only ones with sexual sin problems, as we all know, but sexual sins are usually the hardest to let go. It's the sin we're to hate...not the person...same way God does.

I was never sexualy abused. I grew up with a strong male figure. I grew up in an enviroment that encouraged me to date women. I'm not feminine.

I'm gay, and have always been. Explain to me the common factor that we all suposedly share.

A spirit of gay perversion that passes on from one generation to the next. Those who have this familiar spirit passed onto them will continue in this spirit until they accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior and are freed from it. If they do not, they will die in their sins, and spend eternity separated from all goodness in a place of torment.

solo, I'm not sure I get you. Are you saying I got " a spirit of gay perversion" from my parents? (yes I'm gay). Are you hen saying my parents are gay? or might be? I do not think so.

 

[Cat]

LostLamb, I am still around, and have read all the posts.
But it is a lot to take in, and often my initial response to most of the posts would be in anger, so I am taking time to think over things and remain calm when replying.

Of the few things that bother me, one is, I apparently have no higher morals, which to me sounds like an insult. Just because I don't believe in a book.
Also, it seems to me that repent is fine. What you're saying it, someone could rape someone, but as long as they repent, they're ok. I mean, how is that in any way good?

 

[JoJo]

Of the few things that bother me, one is, I apparently have no higher morals, which to me sounds like an insult. Just because I don't believe in a book.

Cat, I don't know anything about your morals or standards. I am saying, however, that the standards Jesus sets for Christians should be followed meticulously by Christians. If Jesus told us to love one another, we should treat others with love and only love. Hence, Christians should never put themselves in a position to be accused of hate. Does that make sense?

 

[RND]

Of the few things that bother me, one is, I apparently have no higher morals, which to me sounds like an insult. Just because I don't believe in a book.

Question: If you discovered your idea of "higher morals" was different than God's would you consider changing your views?

For example, would you be willing to die for someone that hated your guts and told everyone you knew the same thing - that they hated your guts?

 

[glorydaz]

Of the few things that bother me, one is, I apparently have no higher morals, which to me sounds like an insult. Just because I don't believe in a book.
Also, it seems to me that repent is fine. What you're saying it, someone could rape someone, but as long as they repent, they're ok. I mean, how is that in any way good?

I seriously doubt anyone has high morals before they get saved...and if they do, they have some other equally deadly sin in their lives. We're all lost before we're found.

Repentance is more than just saying you're sorry. Repentance means a turning away from our sin and heading in the other direction. We may fall again...we may fall in a totally different area, but we're to keep pressing onward in obedience as best we can. The Lord looks at our heart...no one else can.
Raping someone is a willful sin. If we willfully sin, we can be assured we'll be chastened, and a chastening from the Lord is never pleasant.

 

[LostSoul]

Cat,

I am sorry if I gave the impression that sin is okay. It is not. Repentance, when true tends to lead us fully away from the sin in which we are commiting. No doubt though, we all have our inner demons to face off with on a daily basis. We all are tempted each and every day. Perhaps I am not the best person to answer your questions....but should you....perhaps want to look to scripture...a figure I would very much encourage you to read up about in the bible is Paul. He is the picture perfect example of how Christ can change the life of a single sinner.

 

[westtexas]

Of the few things that bother me, one is, I apparently have no higher morals, which to me sounds like an insult. Just because I don't believe in a book.

Cat, these higher morals are not set by anyone here. They are set by our Lord Jesus and they have been given to us in the book that you don't believe in. The Bible. I think every one here will tell you that these morals can be extremely tough to live out at times, but as Christians we strive to live by them and do a little better each day. Bless you my friend, Westtexas

 

[handy]

Cat,

In addition to what others have written about repentance, I do want to add that just because one has repented of a sin such as rape, this doesn't mean that there will be no consequences to face. If a rapist repents, that's a good thing because it means that he is on the pathway to never hurting another woman again.

Doesn't mean that he wouldn't or shouldn't be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law though.

BTW, I'm am glad that you are taking your time to think over things and remain calm when replying. It's a lesson more than a few around here can learn from!

Also, I don't doubt that you have morals. Everyone except psychopaths have some grounding in morals. As the atheists are putting on buses, one can be "good" for goodness sake.

The difference is as WestTex said, as Christians we are trying to live out the morals set forth to us by Jesus Christ. It's not an easy path as it requires not only actions and refraining from other actions, but also a correct and humble attitude along with it. And, it's a path in which most Christians will stumble and tumble on. The best thing about repentance and about Christ is that He is faithful and will forgive and help lead a truly repentant person along that path. Another thing about Christ though is that He cannot be fooled and takes a dim view of hypocrites, those who act all repentant and sorry but inwardly are not the least bit humbled.

 

[sheshisown]

As I went through reading the early posts I saw this picture...

[attachment=0:2z8gc69k]who_cares.jpg[/attachment:2z8gc69k]

Thank you Dora for that picture and your comments... I SO agree with you.
Having salvation is not just a good feeling about one's self during this life.

We ~ who have turned from our sin to God (repented) and recieved forgiveness and life through the sacrifice of Jesus~ have been SAVED FROM a terrible evil eternal destiny... :yes

To "silently stand by" busy with our own business, while many around us die without that safety~ with eternal torment and complete separation from all that is good as their sure end~ is truely the most selfish and hateful act I can think of. :verysad

sheshisown~

 

[jasoncran]

rnd, the lord will help lance when lance is ready to repent, and when and if he does, the lord will deliver him from that lifestyle either instantly, as i was changed from the bisexual nature to the normal hetero.or it will be a struggle,or lance may be going to a church , or watching us to see if the lord is real. he has paid much attenttion to my testimony and if you all notice that i changed the wording of what i was. but its still sin.

in any event lance,like me, will be reconstructed by the lord. as i was "damaged" by the lies of the devil, and had to be retaught manhood by the spirit so will all that were and are lbgt go through. this process for me continual.

lance , and all i'not saying that lance knows nothing of a being a man, and i harbor no i will toward him and certain dont want to offend. the lord must teach us what is to be a christain man or women.

that's where i come from.RND, this wasnt meant to say that what you told lance was bad, i justed wanted to eplain how i have seen others of lbgt delivered.