Why Faith Alone?

[journeymanisnothing]

I believe the Bible teaches salvation is by faith alone, because

For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 1Cor.1:21

God deliberately chose something that is foolish to the thinking of this world?.....which is necessary to be saved?

Why would God do that? I believe the reason is, because to live by faith in this world, humility is necessary.

It's humbling to admit we've deeply hurt someone who loves us dearly, but sinners can avoid that humbleness when they think it's foolish to believe in God to begin with.

 

[Robert Pate]

I believe the Bible teaches salvation is by faith alone, because

For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 1Cor.1:21

God deliberately chose something that is foolish to the thinking of this world?.....which is necessary to be saved?

Why would God do that? I believe the reason is, because to live by faith in this world, humility is necessary.

It's humbling to admit we've deeply hurt someone who loves us dearly, but sinners can avoid that humbleness when they think it's foolish to believe in God to begin with.

Faith alone means that it is by Christ alone. We had nothing, absolutely nothing to do with our salvation, it took place over 2,000 years ago, all that we do is believe. "God was in Christ reconciling us and the world unto himself" 2 Corinthians 5:18-19.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

Faith alone means that it is by Christ alone. We had nothing, absolutely nothing to do with our salvation, it took place over 2,000 years ago, all that we do is believe.

I believe we had nothing to do with Christ allowing himself to be sinned against, without killing his murderers, because Jesus is exactly like our Father,

he, being full of compassion, forgave their iniquity, and destroyed them not: yea, many a time turned he his anger away, and did not stir up all his wrath. Psa.78:38

"God was in Christ reconciling us and the world unto himself" 2 Corinthians 5:18-19.

Right,
vs.19 not imputing their trespasses unto them; (!not holding them accountable for what they did to him!)
We all know the abominable way Jesus was mistreated.

vs.19 and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. (! To tell others how Gods' mercy is shown by the Son.

vs.20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

May people hear the gospel by seeing us formed into our Saviors image.

-

 

[journeymanisnothing]

jaybo:
You're going on and on with your misinterpretation of Scripture. Sharing of wine and bread with other Christians in memory of Jesus has nothing to do with your obsession.

I'm not obsessed. I'm explaining the scriptures by understanding the surrounding text and by comparing it to other areas of scripture to see if they agree..... and they all do.
I've commented directly on the one verse you keep repeating. I've shown by comparing the subject with other passages of scripture how everything agrees.
Why don't you look at the passages I cited and tell me what you think they mean, instead of commenting by saying, "No it isn't."

 

[Robert Pate]

I believe we had nothing to do with Christ allowing himself to be sinned against, without killing his murderers, because Jesus is exactly like our Father,

he, being full of compassion, forgave their iniquity, and destroyed them not: yea, many a time turned he his anger away, and did not stir up all his wrath. Psa.78:38

Right,
vs.19 not imputing their trespasses unto them; (!not holding them accountable for what they did to him!)
We all know the abominable way Jesus was mistreated.

vs.19 and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. (! To tell others how Gods' mercy is shown by the Son.

vs.20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

May people hear the gospel by seeing us formed into our Saviors image.

-

I would rather that they see a sinner saved by God's goodness.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

I would rather that they see a sinner saved by God's goodness.

And why do you think Jesus being spit on and not knocking the spitters teeth out, or Jesus being slapped in the face and knocking the slappers face off isn't "Gods' goodness?"

My friend,
You seem to have the wrong notion about Jesus "abolishing the law." Our Savior "did away with the law", because if he brought Moses law into the picture, the people who sinned against him would have been killed,

He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth. Isa.53:7

And there arose certain, and bare false witness against him.....the high priest... asked Jesus...Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee? But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Mk .14:57,60-61

Jesus could have had those who lied about executed in violation of Deu.19:16-19. So, he opened not his mouth in judgement against them,

But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Rom.3:21

 

[journeymanisnothing]

And now apart from law hath the righteousness of God been manifested, testified to by the law and the prophets, Rom.3:21

Gods' righteousness is testified to by the law.....apart from the law. If we think about how that happened by Christ, we'll see that by Moses' law, the Messiah endured capital crimes against himself and would be justified in condemning those guilty, but endured mankinds sins "without the law."

 

[Highway54]

I believe the Bible teaches salvation is by faith alone, because

For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 1Cor.1:21

God deliberately chose something that is foolish to the thinking of this world?.....which is necessary to be saved?

Why would God do that? I believe the reason is, because to live by faith in this world, humility is necessary.

It's humbling to admit we've deeply hurt someone who loves us dearly, but sinners can avoid that humbleness when they think it's foolish to believe in God to begin with.

People believe all kind of things sir, as we are thinkers. Those of Mat 7:21-23 had great faith, but didn't make it. What was the reason Jesus said, and what is the lesson for us?

 

[journeymanisnothing]

People believe all kind of things sir, as we are thinkers. Those of Mat 7:21-23 had great faith, but didn't make it. What was the reason Jesus said, and what is the lesson for us?

Our Lord said it was because,

every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not Mt.7:26

In Mt.5-7, Jesus was expounding on the law of Moses, which shows us we've all sinned and should love the mercy of God,
like the Pharisee/ publican parable,

I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted. Lk.18;14

 

[Mungo]

I believe the Bible teaches salvation is by faith alone, because

For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 1Cor.1:21

God deliberately chose something that is foolish to the thinking of this world?.....which is necessary to be saved?

Why would God do that? I believe the reason is, because to live by faith in this world, humility is necessary.

It's humbling to admit we've deeply hurt someone who loves us dearly, but sinners can avoid that humbleness when they think it's foolish to believe in God to begin with.

I'm sure you are aware the nowhere in scripture does it state that we are saved by faith alone.

But also in his book How Can I Get To Heaven? Robert Sungenis says that Paul used the word faith over 200 times but not once did he couple it with alone or only. He also pointed out that Paul used the word alone more frequently than any other NT writer. "Many of these instances appear right alongside the very contexts that contain teaching on faith and justification. Thus it is obvious that even while Paul was teaching about the nature of justification he was keenly aware of the word alone and it's qualifying properties. This would lead us to expect that if Paul wanted to teach clearly that man was justified by faith alone, he would have utilized that phrase, since it would have made his point undisputable."

 

[Robert Pate]

I'm sure you are aware the nowhere in scripture does it state that we are saved by faith alone.

But also in his book How Can I Get To Heaven? Robert Sungenis says that Paul used the word faith over 200 times but not once did he couple it with alone or only. He also pointed out that Paul used the word alone more frequently than any other NT writer. "Many of these instances appear right alongside the very contexts that contain teaching on faith and justification. Thus it is obvious that even while Paul was teaching about the nature of justification he was keenly aware of the word alone and it's qualifying properties. This would lead us to expect that if Paul wanted to teach clearly that man was justified by faith alone, he would have utilized that phrase, since it would have made his point undisputable."

Paul taught that salvation is not by works, Romans 4:5. He also taught that salvation is not by obedience to the law, Romans 3:20. So, what is left? Think real hard now, no works, no obedience. Could it be by faith? If it is not by works or obedience it is by faith and by faith alone.

 

[Mungo]

Paul taught that salvation is not by works, Romans 4:5.

Salvation is not by "works of the law" (Rom 3:20 & 28) not all works.

He also taught that salvation is not by obedience to the law, Romans 3:20. So, what is left? Think real hard now, no works, no obedience. Could it be by faith? If it is not by works or obedience it is by faith and by faith alone.

As I repeatedly point out to you and you just avoid answering, when Paul writes of "law" in Romans he means the Old Covenant Law not ALL law.

 

[Robert Pate]

Salvation is not by "works of the law" (Rom 3:20 & 28) not all works.




As I repeatedly point out to you and you just avoid answering, when Paul writes of "law" in Romans he means the Old Covenant Law not ALL law.

So, you want to believe that some works are necessary for salvation, but not all works. And then you want to believe that some of the law has been abolished but not all of the law. It appears to me that you don't know what to believe.

 

[Mungo]

So, you want to believe that some works are necessary for salvation, but not all works.
And then you want to believe that some of the law has been abolished but not all of the law. It appears to me that you don't know what to believe.

I've been very clear with you what I believe.
I haven't said that "some" works are necessary.
I believe Jesus when he said "He who believes and is baptized will be saved".
If you want to class baptism as a work (as you seem to want to) then that is the normal way that God has given us to be saved. It's Faith + Baptism = Salvation.

I was very clear that the Law that has been abolished is the Old Covenant law not "some of the law".
I've given you scripture on that but you just try to ignore it.

 

[Robert Pate]

I've been very clear with you what I believe.
I haven't said that "some" works are necessary.
I believe Jesus when he said "He who believes and is baptized will be saved".
If you want to class baptism as a work (as you seem to want to) then that is the normal way that God has given us to be saved. It's Faith + Baptism = Salvation.

I was very clear that the Law that has been abolished is the Old Covenant law not "some of the law".
I've given you scripture on that but you just try to ignore it.

Baptism is a work of the law. Paul said, "Therefore by the deeds of the law (what you do) no flesh will be justified in his sight" Romans 3:20. So, you apparently believe that Christ's chosen apostle is a liar.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

I'm sure you are aware the nowhere in scripture does it state that we are saved by faith alone.

You're right, but we are saved by "faith alone in Gods' mercy", which is how even our Savior, God as a man, by example lived according to the law he gave Moses,

Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. Mt.5:7

But also in his book How Can I Get To Heaven? Robert Sungenis says that Paul used the word faith over 200 times but not once did he couple it with alone or only. He also pointed out that Paul used the word alone more frequently than any other NT writer. "Many of these instances appear right alongside the very contexts that contain teaching on faith and justification. Thus it is obvious that even while Paul was teaching about the nature of justification he was keenly aware of the word alone and it's qualifying properties. This would lead us to expect that if Paul wanted to teach clearly that man was justified by faith alone, he would have utilized that phrase, since it would have made his point undisputable."

Paul viewed the law this way,

the doers of the law shall be justified....Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts Rom.2:13,15

The purpose of the law was to show us we need Gods' mercy,

I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; Heb.10:16

For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment. Jas.2:13

 

[Mungo]

Baptism is a work of the law. Paul said, "Therefore by the deeds of the law (what you do) no flesh will be justified in his sight" Romans 3:20. So, you apparently believe that Christ's chosen apostle is a liar.

Paul doesn't say that baptism is a "work of the law".
Jesus said "He who believes and is baptized will be saved".
Are you calling Jesus a liar?

This is a very one-sided discussion.
I answer the points you make - You ignore the points I make.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

Paul taught that salvation is not by works, Romans 4:5. He also taught that salvation is not by obedience to the law, Romans 3:20. So, what is left? Think real hard now, no works, no obedience. Could it be by faith? If it is not by works or obedience it is by faith and by faith alone.

Robert,
Paul wasn't teaching that sinners are righteous without obedience. He was teaching that since the law condemns all of us, we live by the love Christ showed us. We conduct ourselves by his mercy,

Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law. Rom.3:31

 

[Robert Pate]

Robert,
Paul wasn't teaching that sinners are righteous without obedience. He was teaching that since the law condemns all of us, we live by the love Christ showed us. We conduct ourselves by his mercy,

Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law. Rom.3:31

There is none righteous, Romans 3:10. Because all are born after Adam, Romans 3:12. We are all corrupt and need to be changed, 1 Corinthians 15:54. We establish the law by being "In Christ" Romans 5:1.

 

[Robert Pate]

Paul doesn't say that baptism is a "work of the law".
Jesus said "He who believes and is baptized will be saved".
Are you calling Jesus a liar?

This is a very one-sided discussion.
I answer the points you make - You ignore the points I make.

Baptism is an Old Covenant work of the law. Under the New Covenant Christians are saved and justified by faith. Faith in Christ and his Gospel, Ephesians 1:13.