Christian Forums
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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Focus on the Family
Strengthening families through biblical principles.
Focus on the Family addresses the use of biblical principles in parenting and marriage to strengthen the family.
Read daily articles from Focus on the Family in the Marriage and Parenting Resources forum.
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J
Jesus My Wisdom
Guest
mcrees said:I satnd corrected, we are a Holy Nation.
Our earthly leader is George Bush, our Spiritual leader is Christ.
Sounds almost like Roman Catholicism. Indeed, that is where these ideas came from.
Render therefore unto Caesar (Bush) the things which be Caesar's (Bush's) and unto God the things which be God's.
But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God's own people
So who you gonna render yourself to? Were the early Christians wrong to disobey Caear?
God and Bush are in agreement? Whatever Bush does God wanted him to do? Sounds like an American version of the Pope and the Catholic church.
I have to say I find it a bit troubing that an Amerian would regard Bush similar to Emperor Caesar. But I guess the truth is that a "President" is just a name for the Amerian King?
And America is the Holy Nation of God now?
Or does God have many holy nations?
And how do these nations fit in with his holy nation the church?
JMW
A
antitox
Guest
Yes, Bush is the leader of this nation. And it isn't Roman catholicism. We are supposed to support these leaders. Rom. 13:1 "Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God."
Those in America who are believers are part of God's holy nation. Everyone I know who is a profound Bible believer has a patriotism and a respect for the offices of our country.
Those in America who are believers are part of God's holy nation. Everyone I know who is a profound Bible believer has a patriotism and a respect for the offices of our country.
I
Intoxicated by Life
Guest
antitox said:"Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God."
Including Hitler?
A
antitox
Guest
Do you perceive Bush as a Hitler?
I
Intoxicated by Life
Guest
antitox said:Do you perceive Bush as a Hitler?
Did I say, or even imply that? No. Answer the question.
A
antitox
Guest
Of course not, but you stated your question right after the Romans 13 quote. :roll:
J
Jesus My Wisdom
Guest
antitox said:Of course not, but you stated your question right after the Romans 13 quote. :roll:
So it was a good thing for the nation of Germany to respect and obey Hitler?
A
antitox
Guest
Once again, of course not.
J
Jesus My Wisdom
Guest
antitox said:Once again, of course not.
And why did you quote this passage?
Rom. 13:1 "Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God."
A
antitox
Guest
Jesus My Wisdom said:antitox said:Once again, of course not.
And why did you quote this passage?
Rom. 13:1 "Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God."
The discussion involved a U.S. President, not a cold-blooded dictator.
Are you trying to change the discussion?
I
Intoxicated by Life
Guest
antitox said:Rom. 13:1 "Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God."
Why does this not include Hitler?
I
Intoxicated by Life
Guest
Veritas said:Hitler overstepped his proper function as an authority. When that happens, I believe a Christian is to obey God rather than man.
There are examples of this in Acts 4:19 and 5:29
At what point EXACTLY did Hitler overstep? When should people know to turn against their leaders? Where is the point where it suddenly changes?
Intoxicated by Life wrote:
Ideally, I've already answered this: when the "proper function" is lost. But I know what you're asking, and I don't even know if we can determine this in hindsight. Maybe we can and I just don't know. But I do know this is one of the questions that the German theologian Dietrich Bonhoeffer struggled with during that time. If you're interested, you should check out some of his works.
I'm sorry I can't answer better. But I think that every situation is different and there may not be a recognizable point for us to see. It may be that the best we can do is to try to make our whole life an answer to the call of God, and act accordingly.
At what point EXACTLY did Hitler overstep? When should people know to turn against their leaders? Where is the point where it suddenly changes?
Ideally, I've already answered this: when the "proper function" is lost. But I know what you're asking, and I don't even know if we can determine this in hindsight. Maybe we can and I just don't know. But I do know this is one of the questions that the German theologian Dietrich Bonhoeffer struggled with during that time. If you're interested, you should check out some of his works.
I'm sorry I can't answer better. But I think that every situation is different and there may not be a recognizable point for us to see. It may be that the best we can do is to try to make our whole life an answer to the call of God, and act accordingly.
I
Intoxicated by Life
Guest
Then how are we to know? I think ordering an onprovolked attack against a country after the rest of the world, including the Pope, has all but begged us not to, seems a downright evil thing to do. If I had givin the order I would fully expect to find the afterlife rather unpleasant...
F
Fantomex
Guest
Well, I went to Iraq to help the Iraqi people gain freedom :D
I
Intoxicated by Life
Guest
Fantomex said:Well, I went to Iraq to help the Iraqi people gain freedom :D
Do you think that's why you were sent there?
And also, you in a unique position to answer- do you think they're gratefull?
Fantomex said:Well, I went to Iraq to help the Iraqi people gain freedom :D
I have a buddy over ther right now. I thank you both for your service.
F
Fantomex
Guest
Intoxicated by Life said:Fantomex said:Well, I went to Iraq to help the Iraqi people gain freedom :D
Do you think that's why you were sent there?
And also, you in a unique position to answer- do you think they're gratefull?
Actually I am not in a position to say if they are grateful or not. I was on a boat and did not come in contact with any Iraqi people.
But I do wholeheatedly believe the reason I was sent was to give those people freedom.
Thanks to everyone who suppourts our troops