After the unsaved die there is a judgment. What is being determined?

[Alfred Persson]

As for Hebrews 9:27, Christ said Christians “shall not come into judgment (2920 κρίσις krisis), but has passed from death into life” (Jn. 5:24 NKJ) [2]. That means the “judgment” (2920 κρίσις krisis) in Hebrews 9:27 is deciding what happens to non-Christians after they die, not Christians who have been saved by grace (Eph. 2:5-10).

“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment (2920 κρίσις krisis), but has passed from death into life. (Jn. 5:24 NKJ)

Therefore, the “judgment” in Hebrews 9:27 is “the postmortem opportunity for salvation”, because after this judgment Christ will appear: “To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time…for salvation.” (Heb. 9:28 NKJ).

27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment (2920 κρίσις krisis),
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:27-28 NKJ)
Some have reported a time of "judgment" after they died during their "Recalled Death Experience"

At frame 25:00 begins one of these:

Only after we die do we know if these reports are accurate. But nothing about a judgment immediately after death, is unscriptural.

 

[Alfred Persson]

All in Christ go into the presence of their LORD when they die, immediately they are "gathered to their people" in heaven just as Abraham and Lazarus were, having passed from death into life any judgment about that would be redundantly unnecessary.

Abraham died physically, and then his soul was gathered to his people. Three facts can be deduced from this: 1.)Sheol/Hades is not the grave; 2.)Souls survive death of the body; 3.)The righteous go into the presence of God before their bodies are buried.


8 Then Abraham breathed his last and died in a good old age, an old man and full of years, and was gathered to his people.
9 And his sons Isaac and Ishmael buried him in the cave of Machpelah, which is before Mamre, in the field of Ephron the son of Zohar the Hittite,
10 the field which Abraham purchased from the sons of Heth. There Abraham was buried, and Sarah his wife. (Gen. 25:8-10 NKJ)

All who die without Christ are judged when they die (See Post #1), to determine what they receive in hades while waiting for the resurrection:


22 "So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried.
23 "And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24 "Then he cried and said,`Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.' (Lk. 16:22-24 NKJ)


Evidently all the OT saints had Christ's ransom sacrifice applied to cover their sins even before Christ was sacrificed at Calvary.

That is implied in Hebrews and follows from God's timeless perspective----Christ was slain before the foundation of the world so His sacrifice can be applied to all faithful from Adam and Eve onward:

24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;
25 not that He should offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood of another--
26 He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:24-28 NKJ)

The Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. (Rev. 13:8 NKJ)

 

[KV-44-v1]

wow, this is an interesting angle.
God's Eternality!

 

[Alfred Persson]

wow, this is an interesting angle.
God's Eternality!

It answers a lot of questions about OT saints, how they really were saved by faith just as Paul says.

 

[Who Me]

But nothing about a judgment immediately after death, is unscriptural.

What is ' judgement ' ?
It can be as awesome as a high court judge passing a dreadfully sentance on a convicted criminal, as joyful as the same judge declaring an accused person is innocent of all charges or as simple as choosing chips as apposed to mash.

As John3:16-18 says belief or non belief results in life or death.

Judgement for the Christian is or will be as simple as being known by God as his.
Both Hebrews and revelation talk about a universal judgment, neither imply that Christians are excempt from judgement.
Paul talks of our work for Christ being judged by fire and being burnt up.1cor3:10-16

The Chrisrian life is not to be a leisurely coast downhill to heaven, but an uphill slog.
We are to desire the " Well done, good and faithful servant. "

 

[Alfred Persson]

What is ' judgement ' ?
It can be as awesome as a high court judge passing a dreadfully sentance on a convicted criminal, as joyful as the same judge declaring an accused person is innocent of all charges or as simple as choosing chips as apposed to mash.

As John3:16-18 says belief or non belief results in life or death.

Judgement for the Christian is or will be as simple as being known by God as his.
Both Hebrews and revelation talk about a universal judgment, neither imply that Christians are excempt from judgement.
Paul talks of our work for Christ being judged by fire and being burnt up.1cor3:10-16

The Chrisrian life is not to be a leisurely coast downhill to heaven, but an uphill slog.
We are to desire the " Well done, good and faithful servant. "

Sound exegesis will define which kind of judgment is meant by reading the context and letting it pick the definition:

26 He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:26-28 NKJ)

Christ's sacrifice is the theme, what happens to the unsaved after death is the time, and after the judgment some "eagerly wait for Him" for salvation, at His second coming.

Therefore, this judgment determines one's experience in Hades, whether its in eager expectation of the coming of Christ, or not.

 

[Who Me]

Sound exegesis will define which kind of judgment is meant by reading the context and letting it pick the definition:

26 He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:26-28 NKJ)

Christ's sacrifice is the theme, what happens to the unsaved after death is the time, and after the judgment some "eagerly wait for Him" for salvation, at His second coming.

Therefore, this judgment determines one's experience in Hades, whether its in eager expectation of the coming of Christ, or not.

And the context is that the author is addressing Jewish Christians not non Christian Jews or generally non Christians.

 

[Alfred Persson]

And the context is that the author is addressing Jewish Christians not non Christian Jews or generally non Christians.

Yes, Jews were mainly his audience. But its about Jesus' sacrifice and how it applies since the foundation of the world, even though Christ only appeared "once" at the end of the ages.

So "appointed for men to die once" includes everyone Jew and Gentile.

Christians are excluded from this judgment because we have already passed from death into life. Already saved by grace.

 

[Who Me]

Yes, Jews were mainly his audience. But its about Jesus' sacrifice and how it applies since the foundation of the world, even though Christ only appeared "once" at the end of the ages.

So "appointed for men to die once" includes everyone Jew and Gentile.

Christians are excluded from this judgment because we have already passed from death into life. Already saved by grace.

If the first part of the verse applies to Christians, then the last part equally applies to Christians.

 

[Alfred Persson]

If the first part of the verse applies to Christians, then the last part equally applies to Christians.

Christians are saved by grace through faith in Christ before they died, so have passed from death into eternal life. They aren't in this judgment of the unsaved Jews and Gentiles who die:

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. (Jn. 5:24 NKJ)

 

[Who Me]

Christians are saved by grace through faith in Christ before they died, so have passed from death into eternal life. They aren't in this judgment of the unsaved Jews and Gentiles who die

As I said in my first reply to you. Judgement does not automatically mean condemnation, it can also been the granting of a reward, recognition of behaviour, of being saved.

 

[Alfred Persson]

As I said in my first reply to you. Judgement does not automatically mean condemnation, it can also been the granting of a reward, recognition of behaviour, of being saved.

The context is about Christ's sacrifice, how He appeared ONCE at the end of the ages, to ransom all who repent and believe in Him from the foundation of the world.

Its not about rewards.

Christ exempted believers from any judgment concerning their eternal life, which they have been given the moment they believed. Otherwise it wouldn't be "eternal life", it be "temporary life."

 

[Who Me]

The context is about Christ's sacrifice, how He appeared ONCE at the end of the ages, to ransom all who repent and believe in Him from the foundation of the world.

Its not about rewards.

Christ exempted believers from any judgment concerning their eternal life, which they have been given the moment they believed. Otherwise it wouldn't be "eternal life", it be "temporary life."

But judgement is about punishment and or rewards.

 

[Alfred Persson]

But judgement is about punishment and or rewards.

Not in this context, salvation is specifically mentioned:

24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;
25 not that He should offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood of another--
26 He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:24-28 NKJ)

 

[LeviR]

Judgment is not for all but only for the many who enter covenant with God. The faithful are redeemed. The wicked are those who are in default of the faith of the covenant.
Like the pig retuning to the mud after being washed.
See Daniel 12: he says “many….”.
And Jesus says as a fisherman cast his net into the sea. He catches not everyone in the sea but only the good and bad in covenant.
The rest of the fish never get drawn into his net.

 

[kjw47]

As for Hebrews 9:27, Christ said Christians “shall not come into judgment (2920 κρίσις krisis), but has passed from death into life” (Jn. 5:24 NKJ) [2]. That means the “judgment” (2920 κρίσις krisis) in Hebrews 9:27 is deciding what happens to non-Christians after they die, not Christians who have been saved by grace (Eph. 2:5-10).

“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment (2920 κρίσις krisis), but has passed from death into life. (Jn. 5:24 NKJ)

Therefore, the “judgment” in Hebrews 9:27 is “the postmortem opportunity for salvation”, because after this judgment Christ will appear: “To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time…for salvation.” (Heb. 9:28 NKJ).

27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment (2920 κρίσις krisis),
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:27-28 NKJ)
Some have reported a time of "judgment" after they died during their "Recalled Death Experience"

At frame 25:00 begins one of these:

Only after we die do we know if these reports are accurate. But nothing about a judgment immediately after death, is unscriptural.

The judgement is for the resurrected. God already judged sin-the wages of sin = death. Once one dies those are aquitted of all past sin( Rom 6:7)--Its why satan will be loosed for a little While=to test the faith of the resurrected ones. The resurrected get a second chance, in perfect conditions on earth, back in a perfect state. During Jesus' 1000 year reign. No satan influences until he gets loosed again to test their faith.
Believe in him( Father) who sent me, and at John 17:3 Jesus teaches his Father, one who sent him is THE ONLY TRUE GOD. And one must know him as that to get eternal life. That is where satan has mislead billions, they do not know the Father as the only true God.

 

[Alfred Persson]

The judgement is for the resurrected. God already judged sin-the wages of sin = death. Once one dies those are aquitted of all past sin( Rom 6:7)--Its why satan will be loosed for a little While=to test the faith of the resurrected ones. The resurrected get a second chance, in perfect conditions on earth, back in a perfect state. During Jesus' 1000 year reign. No satan influences until he gets loosed again to test their faith.
Believe in him( Father) who sent me, and at John 17:3 Jesus teaches his Father, one who sent him is THE ONLY TRUE GOD. And one must know him as that to get eternal life. That is where satan has mislead billions, they do not know the Father as the only true God.

It doesn't say they are judged after resurrected, it says judged after they die. AND this happened before Christ's second coming, before the resurrection:

24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;
25 not that He should offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood of another--
26 He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:24-28 NKJ)

Christians are saved in this life when we believe, not at the second coming.

 

[Alfred Persson]

Judgment is not for all but only for the many who enter covenant with God. The faithful are redeemed. The wicked are those who are in default of the faith of the covenant.
Like the pig retuning to the mud after being washed.
See Daniel 12: he says “many….”.
And Jesus says as a fisherman cast his net into the sea. He catches not everyone in the sea but only the good and bad in covenant.
The rest of the fish never get drawn into his net.

It doesn't say "its appointed for many who enter the covenant with God to be judged"

24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;
25 not that He should offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood of another--
26 He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:24-28 NKJ)

What book are you reading?

 

[kjw47]

It doesn't say they are judged after resurrected, it says judged after they die. AND this happened before Christ's second coming, before the resurrection:

24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;
25 not that He should offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood of another--
26 He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:24-28 NKJ)

Christians are saved in this life when we believe, not at the second coming.

Romans 6:7--Acquitted of all sin at death.) The bible does not teach 2 different truths.

 

[Alfred Persson]

Romans 6:7--Acquitted of all sin at death.) The bible does not teach 2 different truths.

Paul says humans are freed from being slaves to sin at death.

6 knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin.
7 For he who has died has been freed from sin (Rom. 6:6-7 NKJ)

Being freed from the power of sinful lusts of the body at physical death, doesn't mean one is acquitted.

After being freed from the lusts of the body by death, a judgment for doing the sin occurs:

And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment, (Heb. 9:27 NKJ)

It doesn't say anyone is acquitted. Where did you see that?