Considering the early Church compiled the New Testament, what authority did they have to do so—and do you recognise that same authority today?

[for_his_glory]

For the purpose of this discussion, I was careful to distinguish the Apostles from the early church. Generally speaking, we understand the early church to mean the earliest of times after the Apostles.

There is no such thing as apostolic succession. If you look at the description of the church in Revelation 21:14 the Apostles, and the Apostles, alone, are the foundation of the church:

14The wall of the city had twelve foundations bearing the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

They laid the foundation of the church and it is that foundation, and that foundation, alone, that we recognize and honor. That doesn't mean there are not various offices of ministry that have passed down to later generations (Pastor, teacher, etc.). It means there are Twelve original Apostles composing the foundation of the church, and them alone. No Popes are in the Apostolic foundation of the church. They are not necessary. The ministry of the original Apostles continues through their own anointed and inspired writings, preserved for us by God, despite the failings of the church through which they have been preserved.

Although I agree with you, I have to say that Christ is the foundation of the Church being the collective body of Christ with He being the head of the body, Ephesians 1:15-23; Colossians 1:15-19 . But without the letters that the Apostles wrote to the church we would not have the written word of God.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Although I agree with you, I have to say that Christ is the foundation of the Church being the collective body of Christ with He being the head of the body, Ephesians 1:15-23; Colossians 1:15-19 . But without the letters that the Apostles wrote to the church we would not have the written word of God.

Christ is the Cornerstone, the apostles and prophets are the foundation, and we are the living stones built on that foundation:

19...God’s household, 20built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus Himself as the cornerstone. 21In Him the whole building is fitted together and grows into a holy temple in the Lord. Ephesians 2:19-21

5you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 1 Peter 2:5

 

[for_his_glory]

Christ is the Cornerstone, the apostles and prophets are the foundation, and we are the living stones built on that foundation:

19...God’s household, 20built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus Himself as the cornerstone. 21In Him the whole building is fitted together and grows into a holy temple in the Lord. Ephesians 2:19-21

5you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 1 Peter 2:5

I agree and thank you for those scriptures.

 

[LanaPodesta]

If what one is teaching you does not line up with scripture then know it probably is not a truth

So you don't think scripture is open to interpretation?

 

[for_his_glory]

So you don't think scripture is open to interpretation?

Interpretation needs to come through the Holy Spirit and not man's interpretations of a carnal understanding, unless the man/woman is anointed by the Holy Spirit to speak all truths. We can clearly see that not everyone has the same interpretation of scripture by there understanding. It's like the parables Jesus gave us. He always gave the understanding of each one, but by others we find various interpretations. None of us knows everything that is taught in the Bible and sometimes we do get it wrong, but the Holy Spirit will always send us correction when needed.

2Pe 1:16 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.
2Pe 1:17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
2Pe 1:18 And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.
2Pe 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
2Pe 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
2Pe 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

So you don't think scripture is open to interpretation?

The truth is not open to interpretation. If it was, it would not be the truth.

 

[LanaPodesta]

The truth is not open to interpretation. If it was, it would not be the truth.

Then the question is how you know YOUR interpretation is correct?

 

[LanaPodesta]

sometimes we do get it wrong

Speak for yourself. The Church does not 'get it wrong' which is why I follow the Church.

 

[for_his_glory]

Speak for yourself. The Church does not 'get it wrong' which is why I follow the Church.

I am speaking for myself as I in the past have been deceived by a few churches (ministers) being mislead as they teach a majority rule bandwagon teaching that comes against the word of God. Test the spirits that speak to you, 1John 4:1-6.

 

[LanaPodesta]

I am speaking for myself as I in the past have been deceived by a few churches (ministers) being mislead as they teach a majority rule bandwagon teaching that comes against the word of God. Test the spirits that speak to you, 1John 4:1-6.

There is only ONE Church.

 

[Free]

There is only ONE Church.

That which is made up of all true believers, whether Catholic, Orthodox, Protestant, Coptic, etc.; not that everyone in those traditions is a true believer, not by a long shot.

Not sure if you saw this:

https://christianforums.net/threads...that-same-authority-today.114120/post-1951799

 

[for_his_glory]

There is only ONE Church.

And what church would that be as God is not about denominations nor non-denominations.

 

[LanaPodesta]

That which is made up of all true believers, whether Catholic, Orthodox, Protestant, Coptic, etc.; not that everyone in those traditions is a true believer, not by a long shot.

Not sure if you saw this:

https://christianforums.net/threads/considering-the-early-church-compiled-the-new-testament-what-authority-did-they-have-to-do-so—and-do-you-recognise-that-same-authority-today.114120/post-1951799

There is the invisible Church and the visible Church. All who belong to the latter belong to the former.

 

[LanaPodesta]

And what church would that be as God is not about denominations nor non-denominations.

Who says?

 

[LanaPodesta]

Yes, because, again, that table of contents shows that some parts of their theology are just plain wrong

That's contradictory. Could you give an example?

 

[for_his_glory]

Who says?

God says.

Latin root word for religion is bondage, which is different then that of Gods pure religion of James 1:27, but that of following tradition and the doctrine of a mans church, not Gods true church. Religion tells you what you can and cannot do and becomes socially acceptable by mans interpretations, traditions and doctrines. Religion is what nailed Christ to the cross because this Bible is not socially acceptable to society, if it were then Christ would have died in vain. God is not about mans religion, nor does he recognize religion. God is about a personal relationship with you and His son Jesus Christ.

John 1:1 in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:2 the same was in the beginning with God.
John 1:3 all things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
John 1:4 in him was life; and the life was the light of men.
John 1:5 and the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:10 for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

The biggest deception Satan can use is to confuse the unlearned mind. God said his people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. You forget me and my word and I will forget you and your children. This is a pretty profound statement that holds so much truth. This is why this world is in the shape it is in today with so many religions claiming they are the true religion and only they will go to heaven and those who do not conform to their ways will go to hell.

Hosea 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.
Hosea 4:7 as they were increased, so they sinned against me: therefore will I change their glory into shame.
Hosea 4:8 they eat up the sin of my people and they set their heart on their iniquity.
Hosea 4:9 and there shall be, like people, like priest: and I will punish them for their ways, and reward them their doings.

Truth has now turned to deception of the carnal minds ways of thinking which produces mans interpretations, traditions of law and doctrine. Satan has such a foothold on religions and has side blinded all of us into believing whatever is taught behind the pulpit is truth because after all, they are the Priest, Rabbis, Pastors, etc. etc. and they should know what they are talking about because they are our teachers. Satan is pretty clever and the master of lies and deceit.

1Peter 5:8 be sober, be vigilant, because your adversary the devil is seeking to whom he may devour.
1Peter 5:9 Whom resist steadfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.
1Peter 5:10 but the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, establish, strengthen, settle you.

1Peter 4:11 If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles, (wisdom) of God, if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth, that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ to whom be praise and dominion forever and ever, Amen.

Revelation 22:18 for I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
Revelation 22:19 And if any man sh

 

[LanaPodesta]

God says.

Latin root word for religion is bondage, which is different then that of Gods pure religion of James 1:27, but that of following tradition and the doctrine of a mans church, not Gods true church. Religion tells you what you can and cannot do and becomes socially acceptable by mans interpretations, traditions and doctrines. Religion is what nailed Christ to the cross because this Bible is not socially acceptable to society, if it were then Christ would have died in vain. God is not about mans religion, nor does he recognize religion. God is about a personal relationship with you and His son Jesus Christ.

John 1:1 in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:2 the same was in the beginning with God.
John 1:3 all things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
John 1:4 in him was life; and the life was the light of men.
John 1:5 and the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:10 for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

The biggest deception Satan can use is to confuse the unlearned mind. God said his people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. You forget me and my word and I will forget you and your children. This is a pretty profound statement that holds so much truth. This is why this world is in the shape it is in today with so many religions claiming they are the true religion and only they will go to heaven and those who do not conform to their ways will go to hell.

Hosea 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.
Hosea 4:7 as they were increased, so they sinned against me: therefore will I change their glory into shame.
Hosea 4:8 they eat up the sin of my people and they set their heart on their iniquity.
Hosea 4:9 and there shall be, like people, like priest: and I will punish them for their ways, and reward them their doings.

Truth has now turned to deception of the carnal minds ways of thinking which produces mans interpretations, traditions of law and doctrine. Satan has such a foothold on religions and has side blinded all of us into believing whatever is taught behind the pulpit is truth because after all, they are the Priest, Rabbis, Pastors, etc. etc. and they should know what they are talking about because they are our teachers. Satan is pretty clever and the master of lies and deceit.

1Peter 5:8 be sober, be vigilant, because your adversary the devil is seeking to whom he may devour.
1Peter 5:9 Whom resist steadfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.
1Peter 5:10 but the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, establish, strengthen, settle you.

1Peter 4:11 If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles, (wisdom) of God, if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth, that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ to whom be praise and dominion forever and ever, Amen.

Revelation 22:18 for I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
Revelation 22:19 And if any man sh

God speaks through the Church.

 

[Free]

There is the invisible Church and the visible Church. All who belong to the latter belong to the former.

That's actually backwards; perhaps you misspoke. The visible Church is made up of both the invisible Church (the true Church) and unbelievers. And, it must be said that there is no single visible Church. The invisible Church is scattered throughout churches that are Catholic, Orthodox, Protestant, Coptic, etc.

That's contradictory. Could you give an example?

I guess it depends on what you meant by "their table of contents." I took it to mean the canon, since that was the context of your post. It doesn't logically follow that just because they put together the canon, they get their all theology correct. The Church and all of its leaders are all fallible.

The (false) doctrines of the immaculate conception and perpetual virginity of Mary really stand out.

 

[LanaPodesta]

That's actually backwards; perhaps you misspoke. The visible Church is made up of both the invisible Church (the true Church) and unbelievers. And, it must be said that there is no single visible Church. The invisible Church is scattered throughout churches that are Catholic, Orthodox, Protestant, Coptic, etc.

I didn't. All who belong to the LATTER (the visible Church) belong to the FORMER (the invisible Church). This can be said with certainty.

The (false) doctrines of the immaculate conception and perpetual virginity of Mary really stand out.

Regarding the latter, the Church that gave you scripture teaches Mary's perpetual virginity. To say otherwise is heresy.

 

[LanaPodesta]

The visible Church is made up of both the invisible Church (the true Church) and unbelievers. And, it must be said that there is no single visible Church. The invisible Church is scattered throughout churches that are Catholic, Orthodox, Protestant, Coptic, etc.

Wait, where are you getting this from? It doesn't say it in scripture. So how can you comment on it?