Different scholars can have really different views..
How do you know where literalism is intended?
Christian Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
-
Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
-
Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
-
-
-
How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
-
1/3 shall die - Non-Christians will die
- Thread starter Classik
- Start date
How do you know where literalism is intended?
World War II was the deadliest military conflict in history. Over 60 million people were killed, which was over
The crusaides 2.5% of the world population. The tables below give a detailed country-by-country count of human losses.
The Catholic Church was particularly suppressed in Poland. Between 1939 and 1945, an estimated 3,000 members (18%) of the Polish clergy, were murdered;
Eighty per cent of the Catholic clergy and five bishops of Warthegau were sent to concentration camps in 1939;
Dachau concentration camp alone, 2,600 Catholic priests from 24 different countries were killed.[58]\
The crusades
While it’s impossible to know for sure how many people perished during the Mongol conquests, many historians put the number at somewhere around 40 million. Censuses from the Middle Ages show that the population of China plummeted by tens of millions during the Khan’s lifetime, and scholars estimate that he may have killed a full three-fourths of modern-day Iran’s population during his war with the Khwarezmid Empire. All told, the Mongols’ attacks may have reduced the entire world population by as much as 11 percent
Ten worst natural disasters[edit]
RankDeath toll (estimate)EventLocationDate
11,000,000–4,000,000*[1]1931 China floodsChinaJuly, August, 1931
2900,000–2,000,000[2]1887 Yellow River floodChinaSeptember, October, 1887
3830,000[3]1556 Shaanxi earthquakeChinaJanuary 23, 1556
4242,000–655,0001976 Tangshan earthquakeChinaJuly 28, 1976
5500,000–1,000,000[1]1970 Bhola cycloneEast Pakistan (now Bangladesh)November 13, 1970
6300,000[4]1839 India CycloneIndiaNovember 25, 1839
6300,000[5]1737 Calcutta cycloneIndiaOctober 7, 1737
8273,400[6]1920 Haiyuan earthquakeChinaDecember 16, 1920
9250,000–300,000[7]526 Antioch earthquakeByzantine Empire (now Turkey)May 526
10260,000[8]115 Antioch earthquakeRoman Empire (now Turkey)December 13, 115
The crusaides 2.5% of the world population. The tables below give a detailed country-by-country count of human losses.
The Catholic Church was particularly suppressed in Poland. Between 1939 and 1945, an estimated 3,000 members (18%) of the Polish clergy, were murdered;
Eighty per cent of the Catholic clergy and five bishops of Warthegau were sent to concentration camps in 1939;
Dachau concentration camp alone, 2,600 Catholic priests from 24 different countries were killed.[58]\
The crusades
While it’s impossible to know for sure how many people perished during the Mongol conquests, many historians put the number at somewhere around 40 million. Censuses from the Middle Ages show that the population of China plummeted by tens of millions during the Khan’s lifetime, and scholars estimate that he may have killed a full three-fourths of modern-day Iran’s population during his war with the Khwarezmid Empire. All told, the Mongols’ attacks may have reduced the entire world population by as much as 11 percent
Ten worst natural disasters[edit]
RankDeath toll (estimate)EventLocationDate
11,000,000–4,000,000*[1]1931 China floodsChinaJuly, August, 1931
2900,000–2,000,000[2]1887 Yellow River floodChinaSeptember, October, 1887
3830,000[3]1556 Shaanxi earthquakeChinaJanuary 23, 1556
4242,000–655,0001976 Tangshan earthquakeChinaJuly 28, 1976
5500,000–1,000,000[1]1970 Bhola cycloneEast Pakistan (now Bangladesh)November 13, 1970
6300,000[4]1839 India CycloneIndiaNovember 25, 1839
6300,000[5]1737 Calcutta cycloneIndiaOctober 7, 1737
8273,400[6]1920 Haiyuan earthquakeChinaDecember 16, 1920
9250,000–300,000[7]526 Antioch earthquakeByzantine Empire (now Turkey)May 526
10260,000[8]115 Antioch earthquakeRoman Empire (now Turkey)December 13, 115
Classik
Member
Classik
Member
Nooooooooooo
lol. mass suicide as the teams are jailed and the arenas turned into worship centers for the false gods.
Yep,all those who play soccer will instantly get the Mark...
Kathi The reason americans ignore or write off the tribulation of other christians, pretending it doesn't exist is because america lives in a bubble of protection. Our daily lives consist of getting up, going to work, coming home and worshiping our idols or tv's or our pets or whatever. The worst kind of persecution you will probably face is being ignored or having friends delete you from Facebook because they hate your Jesus. You will probably never in your lifetime have to be forced on top of a mountain without food or water, you will never have to go through being beheaded for your faith or thrown into gas chambers.
America lives in this bubble, and this bubble is filled with greed, humanism, video games and bubble gum celebrities. The american life is simply based on getting up and going to work. You never had to fight in a war or had to watch your friend die from a bullet wound. You never had to be the medic who had to fix the bullet wound. You never have to see your friend's leg or arm getting blown off. Kathi, do you realize how many soldiers come home with post traumatic stress disorder and with suicidal thoughts. You never had to watch your family or friends die of genocide or having them beheaded. The war isn't on your front lawn yet, and probably never will be because you have an american army that dies for your freedom. So yeah I don't understand why a christian would think God is going to protect them from tribulation. Most christians confuse tribulation with God's wrath, and that's what denial is. But you don't have to worry about any of this, because you live in america.
America lives in this bubble, and this bubble is filled with greed, humanism, video games and bubble gum celebrities. The american life is simply based on getting up and going to work. You never had to fight in a war or had to watch your friend die from a bullet wound. You never had to be the medic who had to fix the bullet wound. You never have to see your friend's leg or arm getting blown off. Kathi, do you realize how many soldiers come home with post traumatic stress disorder and with suicidal thoughts. You never had to watch your family or friends die of genocide or having them beheaded. The war isn't on your front lawn yet, and probably never will be because you have an american army that dies for your freedom. So yeah I don't understand why a christian would think God is going to protect them from tribulation. Most christians confuse tribulation with God's wrath, and that's what denial is. But you don't have to worry about any of this, because you live in america.
1 Thessalonians 5:9
Revelation 3:10
These verses tell me I will not experience the tribulation.But you can read them for whatever purpose you wish.
Sinthesis
Member
I often wonder what the reaction of today's chicken-littles would be towards something like the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic.
I am vet of Afghanistan, and many saved vets that have deployed are futurists,however I am not a futurist and my overseas time did little to convince me that futurism was wrong. it was simply reading the bible.
no, not according to Scripture. others disagree, but look it up.
perhaps, but if just TEN PEOPLE RIGHTEOUS , 10, 1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1, that's all,
had been in Lot's town,
Yhwh would have spared it for those TEN, only TEN people righteous. i.e. not even 1/2% !
so it may be very very very optimistic to expect even 3% of the world's population are any better than they were in sodom and gomorrah, or in Noah's day,
BOTH OF which Jesus said the last days would be like.
Yhwh's protection is divine and perfect and pertains to the true and eternal lives of His people --- not necessarily the temporal lives as see it is written in Scripture >>
Revelation 6:9-11Amplified Bible (AMP)
9 When the Lamb broke open the fifth seal, I saw at the foot of the altar the souls of those whose lives had been sacrificed for [adhering to] the Word of God and for the testimony they had borne.10 They cried in a loud voice, O [Sovereign] Lord, holy and true, how long now before You will sit in judgment and avenge our blood upon those who dwell on the earth?
11 Then they were each given a long and flowing and festive white robe and told to rest and wait patiently a little while longer, until the number should be complete of their fellow servants and their brethren who were to be killed as they themselves had been.
and Yhwh give authority to the beast to kill the saints >>
Revelation 13:4-8Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
4 They worshipped the dragon, because he had given his authority to the beast; and they worshipped the beast, saying,
“Who is like the beast?
Who can fight against it?”
5 It was given a mouth speaking arrogant blasphemies; and it was given authority to act for forty-two months. 6 So it opened its mouth in blasphemies against God to insult his name and his Sh’khinah, and those living in heaven; 7 it was allowed to make war on God’s holy people and to defeat them; and it was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation. 8 Everyone living on earth will worship it except those whose names are written in the Book of Life belonging to the Lamb slaughtered before the world was founded.
It all depends on how you read Scripture.If you take the Bible literally you would be a believer in the rapture.
I believe the Bible is literally true, and I talk to the Author of the Bible daily. He is right. There is no rapture pre-trib like many churches make out since 1832 and the woman's dream, --- we who believe in, abide in , and are immersed in Yeshua will suffer for His Names Sake joyfully and willingly.
corrie ten boom warned the churches in america of their terrible mistake and the wrong direction they were going(in teaching about such a rapture).
she showed how over 80% of true believers in other countries were already going through severe persecution and tribulation - it is not to be escaped, but embraced according to Yeshua in Scripture. He knows it is hard, and Promises to show all of His children how to endure.
in other threads, the Scripture was all explained plain and simple, as revealed by Yeshua.
corrie ten boom warned the churches in america of their terrible mistake and the wrong direction they were going(in teaching about such a rapture).
she showed how over 80% of true believers in other countries were already going through severe persecution and tribulation - it is not to be escaped, but embraced according to Yeshua in Scripture. He knows it is hard, and Promises to show all of His children how to endure.
in other threads, the Scripture was all explained plain and simple, as revealed by Yeshua.
don't worry about if or when , if ever, the rapture happens.
instead , obey Yeshua, and you won't even think about it. >>
from Mark 8 The Message (et al) “It is necessary that the Son of Man proceed to an ordeal of suffering, ...
32-33 But Peter grabbed him in protest. Turning and seeing his disciples wavering, wondering what to believe, Jesus confronted Peter. “Peter, get out of my way! Satan, get lost! You have no idea how God works.”
34-37 Calling the crowd to join his disciples, he said, “Anyone who intends to come with me has to let me lead. You’re not in the driver’s seat; I am. Don’t run from suffering; embrace it. Follow me and I’ll show you how. Self-help is no help at all. Self-sacrifice is the way, my way, to saving yourself, your true self. What good would it do to get everything you want and lose you, the real you? What could you ever trade your soul for?
38 “If any of you are embarrassed over me and the way I’m leading you when you get around your fickle and unfocused friends, know that you’ll be an even greater embarrassment to the Son of Man when he arrives in all the splendor of God, his Father, with an army of the holy angels.”
Christians immersed in Yeshua are told(in several places, and in spirit) that they will be treated like He was, including physical pain and suffering and humiliation in /by society and in/by churches.
instead , obey Yeshua, and you won't even think about it. >>
from Mark 8 The Message (et al) “It is necessary that the Son of Man proceed to an ordeal of suffering, ...
32-33 But Peter grabbed him in protest. Turning and seeing his disciples wavering, wondering what to believe, Jesus confronted Peter. “Peter, get out of my way! Satan, get lost! You have no idea how God works.”
34-37 Calling the crowd to join his disciples, he said, “Anyone who intends to come with me has to let me lead. You’re not in the driver’s seat; I am. Don’t run from suffering; embrace it. Follow me and I’ll show you how. Self-help is no help at all. Self-sacrifice is the way, my way, to saving yourself, your true self. What good would it do to get everything you want and lose you, the real you? What could you ever trade your soul for?
38 “If any of you are embarrassed over me and the way I’m leading you when you get around your fickle and unfocused friends, know that you’ll be an even greater embarrassment to the Son of Man when he arrives in all the splendor of God, his Father, with an army of the holy angels.”
Christians immersed in Yeshua are told(in several places, and in spirit) that they will be treated like He was, including physical pain and suffering and humiliation in /by society and in/by churches.
if we take the bible literally? ok I love that. if I take literally about a comet or star hitting the earth duing a judgement that somehow, all men can breathe that aren't near the area upon impact and the sky doesn't darken? a Christian in those areas is going to be feeling that. but wait pretribbers see those as non-saints.