Bible Study Age of accountability is nowhere found in the Bible

[stovebolts]

time for me to move on ... This thread clearly shows who would rather place their Salvation on a human action then those who are saved by Grace.

Explain...

 

[WIP]

WIP
An infant cannot believe in what it does not know or understand.
Are you saying only those who believe are saved which means all infants, even those aborted are in hell?

I just leave that up to God for I don't think we are in a position to make an assertion one way or the other. The Bible does not specifically say what happens to infants or young children accept possibly where Jesus says to let the children come to Him for such as these is the Kingdom of heaven.

 

[stovebolts]

I just leave that up to God for I don't think we are in a position to make an assertion one way or the other. The Bible does not specifically say what happens to infants or young children accept possibly where Jesus says to let the children come to Him for such as these is the Kingdom of heaven.

Have you ever burried one of your children? How about two of them?

Maybe you've never had the need to dig deep enough to find the answers. Jesus tells us to ask, seek and knock. The scriptures are very dynamic, and there is much in them.

Have you ever read a passage and said, wow! Didn't see that before! Sometimes we pass right over things not really understanding what were looking at. It doesn't mean something is not in the Bible, it just means it hasn't been revealed to you.

Listen, your a very lucky man, I envy you. I wasn't so lucky to brush this topic off as easily as your able.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

Now let me just say that I'm not saying that there aren't any children who have gained the knowledge to differ between right and wrong and have decided to reject Christ aren't in Hell, I just really don't know and it's not my place to decide either since I'm not the judge only Jesus is and I'm not Jesus. I'm just saying how can a baby or animal be judged when there isn't anything that they can be judged on since they don't sin?

 

[GodsGrace]

I just leave that up to God for I don't think we are in a position to make an assertion one way or the other. The Bible does not specifically say what happens to infants or young children accept possibly where Jesus says to let the children come to Him for such as these is the Kingdom of heaven.

i
I posted that scripture because I think it's the only scripture we could go by.

Why?

Because God revealed Himself gradually in the O.T. He didn't bombard us all at once with everything we need to know.

Also, the beginning of the O.T. was 4,000 years ago.
Revelation became more and more clear...

Jesus is the ultimate and final revelation...I think we should go more by what HE said than something written by someone in the O.T.

IF there seems to be a conflict, that is.

 

[sunflower]

If I might jump in and go ahead and share my own thoughts about this. Idk a lot of scripture admittingly but Hell is a place for those who reject Christ,.. so how can a baby reject Christ if he or she doesn't even know how to wipe themselves for goodness sakes!? Of course I believe that babies go to Heaven! They can't sin and they don't even know what sin is or how to repent from it just like animals and I do believe that we will see Fido and Fluffy in Heaven someday as well.

My favorite part of your comment is the part above.."and I do believe that we will see Fido and Fluffy in Heaven someday as well." Also adding and ,a little bit more seriously, that I don't think baptism (of infants or anyone else) can guarantee a ticket to heaven. When an infant or young child is baptized I see it mainly as something the parents are doing to dedicate the child to God and the community is doing to welcome the child. That is, in some churches. In others there is a dedication of the child to God and welcome to the community time usually during regular services. This shows the intent of the parents more than it reflects the faith of the child and as such it does not guarantee heaven nor can I say that without it heaven is lost. As for accountability children (eventually) and adults still need to make their own decisions. No one else can do that for them. I am not down playing baptism, but up playing the personal choice to receive by faith the gift of salvation. Just my....

 

[WIP]

Have you ever burried one of your children? How about two of them?

Maybe you've never had the need to dig deep enough to find the answers. Jesus tells us to ask, seek and knock.

Listen, your a very lucky man, I envy you. I wasn't so lucky to brush this topic off as easily as your able.

I understand where you're coming from as I am aware of the history you speak of. I'm not trying to make light of your loss. Only throwing out Scripture for the sake of discussion. I don't usually pick sides specifically but rather throw out observations that may be in contrast for the sake of digging deeper. We can't dig deeper unless we open our minds and our ears to hearing more than just what we want to hear because we have a tendency to let our emotions get in the way. Somewhere in there is the answer or maybe not as I've already stated that there are times when maybe we should let God be God.

 

[WIP]

My favorite part of your comment is the part above.."and I do believe that we will see Fido and Fluffy in Heaven someday as well." Also adding and ,a little bit more seriously, that I don't think baptism (of infants or anyone else) can guarantee a ticket to heaven. When an infant or young child is baptized I see it mainly as something the parents are doing to dedicate the child to God and the community is doing to welcome the child. That is, in some churches. In others there is a dedication of the child to God and welcome to the community time usually during regular services. This shows the intent of the parents more than it reflects the faith of the child and as such it does not guarantee heaven nor can I say that without it heaven is lost. As for accountability children (eventually) and adults still need to make their own decisions. No one else can do that for them. I am not down playing baptism, but up playing the personal choice to receive by faith the gift of salvation. Just my....

I know and understand that for many it may be easier to put God in our own basket because it makes Him to be what we want Him to be. It brings comfort to us when we do that and makes difficult life situations easier to bear.

But is it the right thing to do? Jesus said, "Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.” Matthew 11:28-30 NKJV

Jesus said life will throw trials and tribulations at us. Do we base our comfort on what we decide makes the most sense or do we trust Him to give us rest from our burdens?

 

[for_his_glory]

wondering
I love gives the verses that support the age of accountability here.

These children in Deuteronomy 1:39 that knew not good or evil yet where given under the charge of Joshua who led them into the promise land were probably also taught by hearing what Joshua taught. God would have known they would be His own. Rally do not see anything related to an age of accountability other than they knew not good or evil yet.

 

[stovebolts]

I understand where you're coming from as I am aware of the history you speak of. I'm not trying to make light of your loss. Only throwing out Scripture for the sake of discussion. I don't usually pick sides specifically but rather throw out observations that may be in contrast for the sake of digging deeper. We can't dig deeper unless we open our minds and our ears to hearing more than just what we want to hear because we have a tendency to let our emotions get in the way. Somewhere in there is the answer or maybe not as I've already stated that there are times when maybe we should let God be God.

I agree with you Wip. But for me it's about the very nature of our God. Is our God a just and fair God.
Listen, I've done my fair share of wrongs in this life and if anyone deserves going to hell for the wrong they've done, it's me.
I understand God's grace, and I'm beginning to see God's love. Love is an emotion, and a very powerful emotion. Love can motivate us to do some pretty amazing things and scriptures say that love covers a multitude of sin... And God so loved the world, you know the rest.

I don't know everything, but I've put my time in researching this topic. I didn't go looking to have scripture tell me what I wanted to hear. I dug deep, asked a lot of questions and prayed for guidance. This is a topic that is close to me and a topic I am well versed in.

 

[WIP]

Please forgive me if I am coming across as holier than thou or something along those lines. That is not my intention at all.

 

[sunflower]

I know and understand that for many it may be easier to put God in our own basket because it makes Him to be what we want Him to be. It brings comfort to us when we do that and makes difficult life situations easier to bear.

But is it the right thing to do? Jesus said, "Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.” Matthew 11:28-30 NKJV

Jesus said life will throw trials and tribulations at us. Do we base our comfort on what we decide makes the most sense or do we trust Him to give us rest from our burdens?

I must be missing something because I don't get the connection to what I shared in my post. As for the question: "do we base our comfort on what we decide makes the most sense or do we trust Him to give us rest from our burdens?" I wasn't talking about comfort in my post and I certainly do agree with Matthew 11:28-30 above. I can only guess at what you may be saying. Please clarify. I can be dense. thanks.

 

[stovebolts]

These children in Deuteronomy 1:39 that knew not good or evil yet where given under the charge of Joshua who led them into the promise land were probably also taught by hearing what Joshua taught. God would have known they would be His own. Rally do not see anything related to an age of accountability other than they knew not good or evil yet.

You have to understand the narrative. These folks just came out of Egypt and had broken covenant, yet God takes them back only for them to reject Him even after receiving Torah.
These kids were given 20 years to learn good from evil (Torah) and enter the promised land. Where their parents perished in the wilderness. They were not held accountable for their parents sin and were given enough time to understand good and evil (Torah).

 

[stovebolts]

Please forgive me if I am coming across as holier than thou or something along those lines. That is not my intention at all.

I'm not looking at you like that at all, and I know your trying to be helpful.
You've said some really good things. You've spoken truth and I don't disagree with what you've written. Actually, what you've written is foundational to finding our rest in the Lord, and that rest is very important. So thank you for reminding us of it.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

I'm not looking at you like that at all, and I know your trying to be helpful.
You've said some really good things. You've spoken truth and I don't disagree with what you've written. Actually, what you've written is foundational to finding our rest in the Lord, and that rest is very important. So thank you for reminding us of it.

Yes and I actually posted the fact that there is only one real judge and I'm not it. I just state my beliefs and opinions when it comes to things like this. Not actual facts.

 

[dianegcook]

Parables are stories with a specific intent. They are not to be used outside of their intent, and when they are, we generally change the intent to serve our needs. By doing so, the intent becomes lost

My intent?
What was my intent?
I can not explain something that we are not allowed to discuss on this forum.
Are we not allowed to discuss the serpent seed, correct.?

 

[stovebolts]

My intent?
What was my intent?
I can not explain something that we are not allowed to discuss on this forum.
Are we not allowed to discuss the serpent seed, correct.?

My reply was directed solely at the parables.

If serpent seed theology was / is your intent ,then no, we do not allow that theology.

 

[dianegcook]

It is about the present Kingdom. Per Snodgrass, stories with intent, page 214:
It answers the question, "How can this be the kingdom if evil is present".
He goes on to say on page 215:
The parable contributes to discussions of theodicy and helps address our consternation that evil still is at work, that life is not fair, even though Christ and His kingdom have come. God is not the only one at work, and not all actions in the world can be attributed to God....

Huh

 

[dianegcook]

My reply was directed solely at the parables.

If serpent seed theology was / is your intent ,then no, we do not allow that theology.

Wasn't it JLB, and other speaking of the tares?

Matt.13:38-40
But the tares are the children of the wicked one?

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

Huh

I'm glad that I'm not the only confused one around here. 2