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Baptisims

Butch5 said:
A little research will show it's fact.

For in one Spirit were we all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether bond or free; and were all made to drink of one Spirit. (1 Cor. 12:13 ASV)

For ain one Spirit we were all baptized into one body-- bJews or Greeks, slaves1 or free-- and call were made to drink of one Spirit. (1 Cor. 12:13 ESV)

for also in one Spirit we all to one body were baptized, whether Jews or Greeks, whether servants or freemen, and all into one Spirit were made to drink, (1 Cor. 12:13 YLT)

The denominational slant is those translators making the Holy Spirit are baptizer when the Scriptures don't.
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For “in one Spirit“ is the same as “by one Spirit“, what is the difference you are trying to show by these translations?


So you don’t believe the Holy Spirit baptizes each person into Christ?


For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13 NKJV


For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13 NASB


For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13 KJV





JLB
 
JLB said:
What else is there besides Jews, if not Gentiles?



JLB
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Again, at the time of Joel they saw mankind in two groups, Jew and Gentile. Therefore "all flesh" refers to mankind in two groups Jew and Gentile and not each and every person.

In Romans chapter 1 and 2 Paul proves both Gentiles and Jews have sinned. Paul then says all have sinned. "ALL" here refers to both groups Jew and Gentile and not each and every person. Nowhere in the context does Paul speak of all individuals sinning but the two GROUPS Jew and Gentile.
 
JLB said:
For “in one Spirit“ is the same as “by one Spirit“, what is the difference you are trying to show by these translations?


So you don’t believe the Holy Spirit baptizes each person into Christ?


For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13 NKJV


For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13 NASB


For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13 KJV





JLB
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In and by are two different words. They mean different things. No I don't believe the Holy Spirit baptizes people. I see nothing in Scripture that would suggest this. As far as I can see this is the only passage where people get this idea and I believe it's wrongly translated. People are baptized in or with the Spirit. We find this in Scripture. I believe this passage should be translated in or with the Spirit.

I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: (Matt. 3:11 KJV)

13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.1 (1 Cor. 12:13 KJV)

In these two verses the words by and with are the same Greek word, en, which essentially means in. It's also translated with.

If as you suggest, the Spirit baptizes, what exactly what is this baptism. What is the Spirit baptizing people into? Remember the word baptize simply means to immerse. Jesus immersed the apostles in the Spirit. What is the Spirit supposedly immersing people into?
 
Butch5 said:
In and by are two different words. They mean different things. No I don't believe the Holy Spirit baptizes people.
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Who is it that your believe makes us to drink of one Spirit?

Man?


But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually as He wills.
For as the body is one and has many members, but all the members of that one body, being many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:11-13


We are baptized into Christ, before we are baptized in water by man.

Then we are baptized with the Holy Spirit by Jesus.

And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Acts 1:4-5


This is called the Promise of the Father which is for all.



JLB
 
JLB said:
Who is it that your believe makes us to drink of one Spirit?

Man?


But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually as He wills.
For as the body is one and has many members, but all the members of that one body, being many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:11-13


We are baptized into Christ, before we are baptized in water by man.

Then we are baptized with the Holy Spirit by Jesus.

And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Acts 1:4-5


This is called the Promise of the Father which is for all.



JLB
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God. If you look further back in the chapter we see He is the antecedent.

6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.
13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.1 (1 Cor. 12:6-13 KJV)


I don't accept your statement that one is baptized into Christ before water baptism. People are baptized in the name of Christ. That is being baptized into Christ.
 
Butch5 said:
God. If you look further back in the chapter we see He is the antecedent.

6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.
13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.1 (1 Cor. 12:6-13 KJV)


I don't accept your statement that one is baptized into Christ before water baptism. People are baptized in the name of Christ. That is being baptized into Christ.
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Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. Acts 8:14-17



  • they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit.

  • They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Water Baptism.

They had not yet received the Holy Spirit -
Baptized with the Holy Spirit


  • Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.



JLB
 
JLB said:
Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. Acts 8:14-17



  • they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit.

  • They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Water Baptism.

They had not yet received the Holy Spirit -
Baptized with the Holy Spirit


  • Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.



JLB
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What is your point here?
 
Butch5 said:
When Jesus came up out of the water the Holy Spirit descended on Him like a dove
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Jesus was also the first fruits of the resurrection of the dead.


So what’s your point.
 
Butch5 said:
When Jesus came up out of the water the Holy Spirit descended on Him like a dove
Click to expand...

As you can see from scripture people were baptized in water, then later they received the Holy Spirit, showing that people don’t receive the Spirit while under the water or coming up out of the water.


Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. Acts 8:14-17


  • They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
  • Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.




JLB
 
Butch5 said:
That has nothing to do with the discussion. You said no one receives the Holy Spirit at water baptism. Jesus did.
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So your saying Jesus did not have the Holy Spirit before He was baptized in water?

Is that your testimony?



JLB
 
JLB said:
As you can see from scripture people were baptized in water, then later they received the Holy Spirit, showing that people don’t receive the Spirit while under the water or coming up out of the water.


Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. Acts 8:14-17


  • They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
  • Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.




JLB
Click to expand...
Actually, if you study that closely you'll see that the laying on of hands is a reference to receiving spiritual gifts. The Holy Spirit falling upon someone refers to them receiving spiritual gifts. Notice in the passage Simon saw this and wanted that power for himself. You don't see someone receiving the Holy Spirit. The Spirit can't be seen.

Here we see the Holy Spirit coming upon the disciples with spiritual gifts. They spoke in tongues.

And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. (Acts 2:1-4 KJV)

However, they had already received the Holy Spirit prior to this.

And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: (Jn. 20:22 KJV)

We can see from this that receiving the Spirit and the Spirit coming on someone are two different things.
 
Butch5 said:
Actually, if you study that closely you'll see that the laying on of hands is a reference to receiving spiritual gifts. The Holy Spirit falling upon someone refers to them receiving spiritual gifts. Notice in the passage Simon saw this and wanted that power for himself. You don't see someone receiving the Holy Spirit. The Spirit can't be seen.

Here we see the Holy Spirit coming upon the disciples with spiritual gifts. They spoke in tongues.

And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. (Acts 2:1-4 KJV)

However, they had already received the Holy Spirit prior to this.

And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: (Jn. 20:22 KJV)

We can see from this that receiving the Spirit and the Spirit coming on someone are two different things.
Click to expand...

If you will read the scripture you will see that laying on of hands from the Apostles is mainly how the Holy Spirit was received.

It’s a reference to the baptism with the Spirit.


Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. Acts 8:14-17


  • They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
  • Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.
 
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