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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Did God create hell?
- Thread starter Grazer
- Start date
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VirginShallConceive
Guest
Good job. Here are a few verses that support my view. John 3:16, John 3:36, John 4:14, John 5:24, Matt. 10:28, Romans 9:22, as well as the the several times that the term 'second death' is used in Revelation. Now which one do you like? It seems some of you would rather believe that God would torment someone for eternity...i don't know...i would hope not....maybe it is more of a 'fear thing'...thats what i think it is for most people ...they have this fear that if they don't believe in some kind of eternal hell that they may be cast into it. Like i have said before this traditional view of the unsaved being roasted for ever and ever with no hope of mercy is a great form of mind-control.
Exactly. And the most adept manipulators of the various verses can use the verses that support your view to lure them in. Once the doors are locked behind them, out come the "eternal torture in hell fire" verses.
:toofunny
Wrath means anger. Because they don't have the blood of Jesus to wash them of their sins then God is still angry with them and they will be judged and NOT given eternal life but will suffer the second death in the lake of fire. They will burn up...die...cease to exsist...never to be again...the result of the second death is eternal.
Uh...yeah..ok...where are we going with this???
You keep telling us that God tells us to love our enemies. Which is true.
You appear to be saying God does not have the right to tell us to do one thing and then He do another.
God tells us to not allow the sun to go down on our anger. Yet He is angry every day.
Can we both agree that God's judgement is perfect and he is a just judge?
So God is angry everyday?? You mean he just sits around mad all the time?lol Oh yes...we can agree on that...that is why a merciful and loving God who tells us to forgive our enemies would not turn around and torture them for eternity...you need to apply some simple logic to some of your arguements. Would you tell your child not to do something because you think it is evil and then turn around and do it yourself and be in the right??
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Guest
Guest
I'm sorry urk didn't mean to ignore you... i thought you were saved...So you need me to tell you how to be saved?? I will if you want me to...but first let me know if you are saved for sure.
Yes, I've been in Christ for seven years now. Let's assume i'm not saved though, how would you approach me. What would you say to me, as a sinner?
westtexas
Member
- Jul 6, 2009
- 1,263
- 20
Actually, I'm not looking to argue but hoping for a good discussion. Arguments are a waste of time for those posting as well as for those reading. A good discussion, however, can be edifying for both those posting as well as those reading. I've got better things to do with my time than argue. You'll also get no argument from me that there is biblical support for both eternal punishment and for annihilationism, and a much weaker one for Universalism (which is prohibited in this section in case anyone wants to turn the discussion in that direction). It IS a grey area if you care to call it that. I enjoy this topic and have studied all 3 views for many years and enjoy discussing them all. I personally believe though that there is more support, both scripturally and linguistically, for eternal punishment. It's also obvious from your post above that you are merely glancing through what is presented to you and typing out a response. I can't speak for anyone else on this thread but I agree that the unrighteous are NOT given eternal life. Go back and read post #215. They are however punished eternally. If you don't care to discuss what you believe and why you believe as you do, no big deal.
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VirginShallConceive
Guest
And just remember the "elephant in the room". The ones who claim that they believe in eternal punishment don't act like it.
None of them. Not a single one of them.
Period.
The ones who don't believe in eternal punishment do act like it.
My advice to the "Yes, eternal punishment" claimers is:
It's over. Please spare yourself any further embarrassment, and come rejoice with us.
Amen.
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Guest
Guest
What are you talking about, it's never over until the devil is over. You have that backwards. The one's who believe in eternal punishment aren't afraid to preach it because they already know where their going after they die. The one's who don't believe in eternal punishment should have their faith questioned.
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VirginShallConceive
Guest
Don't forget, in an existence that does contain eternal punishment, everyone who had half a heart who was aware of this eternal punishment would be frantically running around trying to save as many souls as they possibly could, because of the simple fact that this life is infinitely short when compared with eternity. Engaging in leisurely activities while on this earth would be uncharacteristicly selfish considering what looms eternally after this brief worldly existence.
Period.
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Guest
Guest
But you're missing the point, a preacher can preach his head off for 20 years, but it's the unbelievers unbelief in who Jesus Christ is that releases him into hell. What is your belief in who Jesus Christ is?
westtexas
Member
- Jul 6, 2009
- 1,263
- 20
You are painting with a pretty wide brush. This is quite a judgemental statement. I appreciate the laugh.
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VirginShallConceive
Guest
The preacher who preaches constantly, passes out for the minimal amount of sleep that his/her body forces upon itself, and only stops momentarily to grab a bite to eat in order to keep his/her body alive so that they can continue preaching for has long and hard as they possibly can, saves more souls in twenty years than the preacher who preaches considerably less than that in the same twenty years.
It's simple mathematics.
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VirginShallConceive
Guest
Yes. A wide, undeniably justified brush.
No, I would say it's a factual statement based on simple observation. Read my previous post and tell me if you have ever witnessed anyone that extremely dedicated to their preaching. In a world where eternal punishment awaits certain souls, the world should be teeming with preachers like that.
Period .
It's a laughing matter in the world that you and I both live in, which is the real world, so enjoy the laugh. This one's on me.
In a far-fetched world where an eternal Hell awaits certain souls, this would be no laughing matter for anyone with half a heart.
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Guest
Guest
You're still missing the point, and your math is off a little bit. Where does your belief in who Jesus Christ is add up into your equation there? Why do you think an unbeliever remains an unbeliever for 20 years example? Because of their unbelief in who Jesus Christ is. The preacher that preaches less might have a stronger message for you than the everyday church preacher. The preacher that preaches less might be strong in the spirit and the Word of God. It's amazing how many times I ask the same question over and over, and people avoid it over and over. What is your belief in who Jesus Christ is?
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VirginShallConceive
Guest
Jesus Christ is the Savior. Jesus knows your every thought. He knows if you truly believe in an eternal Hell that awaits certain souls, and you aren't behaving like the hypothetical "Constant Preacher" that I mentioned above, He knows you are selfish. It's simple logic.
I don't believe that you believe in an eternal Hell. My belief is that I know you don't believe, because you aren't the "Constant Preacher", and because I know that if the stakes were that high, you would be that benevolent individual. I believe that Jesus knows this as well, because He knows everything.