Does God LOVE everybody

[Follower Of Christ]

That would presuppose that you know the thoughts of all, without exception, Calvinists. And that we are all exactly alike. Which is a preposterous appeal to the authority of the poster's words. Even haphazard critical thinking recognizes an agenda that most likely will not be supportable by actual facts.

In addition, the doctrines (and there are many, some of which you probably agree with)in Calvinism are derived from the very opposite of tunnel vision, and the singular focus if one wants to call it that, is God himself equally and equal to Jesus. Even the Structure of TULIP illustrates this doctrinally. One thing leads to the next to the next to the next, producing automatic and necessary conclusions. It is systematically derived and careful not to arrive at any doctrine that will contradict any carefully exegeted scripture. It lets scripture do the interpreting of scripture, iow, what is clear shedding light on what is not clear. And always making sure nothing ever takes away from or adds to what God reveals of himself. Anyone of course has the right to disagree with what Calvinism teaches, but if it is done publicly as on a forum, the opposing views should be thoroughly supported with something besides isolating certain scriptures from not only their immediate context but from the full counsel of God.

Iow, don't produce contradictions within the scriptures. A Calvinist is most likely going to do this with whatever you present, so be prepared to debate accordingly. I have only read a few of the posts in this thread, but what I have seen so far from those of C/R or leaning that way, is a great example of how they support and defend their position.

I doubt it as it looks like nonsense completely unrelated to the doctrine of unconditional election to me.

First, I thank you for your reply.

Second, you haven't answered my question. If one answers no, God does not love the family tree, then God does not love Z either even though Z is saved. This cannot be true by scripture. If one answers yes, then God loves all and that means according to Calvinists God loves also the unsaved. Can Calvinists change their mind and believe God also loves the unsaved? I leave it up to them.

You are deviating from my point in your post. The great thing about logic is that it can be used to prove the truth of man made assertions about scripture in this case the Calvinist Doctrine. The Calvinist Doctrine is not found in the bible, but is man's interpretation of God's plan of Salvation. You accuse me of something you are guilty of namely being in the mind of God and knowing his plans for salvation of mankind. That is strange Arial.

Let me paraphrase: A Calvinist believes that God has elected certain people before time to be saved and damned the rest. That is unconditional election. Calvinist believes A or unconditional election to be true.

In order to save some person Z, through time and space God has to set a contingency plan through a family tree to have Z be born in the first place. I asked does God love the family tree which is the product of his plan? God has given you reasoning faculties to go through the implications of my question. I am not going to repeat myself.

It's elementary my dear Arial. And no I do not hold onto any man made doctrine be it Calvinism, Molinism etc. The scripture suffices for me. Like Paul said in 1 Corinthians 2:2 "For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified."

As a result, proving some man made doctrine is false is easy to me for I am not invested in any man made doctrine.

Blessings!

 

[electedbyHim]

First, I thank you for your reply.

Second, you haven't answered my question. If one answers no, God does not love the family tree, then God does not love Z either even though Z is saved. This cannot be true by scripture. If one answers yes, then God loves all and that means according to Calvinists God loves also the unsaved. Can Calvinists change their mind and believe God also loves the unsaved? I leave it up to them.

You are deviating from my point in your post. The great thing about logic is that it can be used to prove the truth of man made assertions about scripture in this case the Calvinist Doctrine. The Calvinist Doctrine is not found in the bible, but is man's interpretation of God's plan of Salvation. You accuse me of something you are guilty of namely being in the mind of God and knowing his plans for salvation of mankind. That is strange Arial.

Let me paraphrase: A Calvinist believes that God has elected certain people before time to be saved and damned the rest. That is unconditional election. Calvinist believes A or unconditional election to be true.

In order to save some person Z, through time and space God has to set a contingency plan through a family tree to have Z be born in the first place. I asked does God love the family tree which is the product of his plan? God has given you reasoning faculties to go through the implications of my question. I am not going to repeat myself.

It's elementary my dear Arial. And no I do not hold onto any man made doctrine be it Calvinism, Molinism etc. The scripture suffices for me. Like Paul said in 1 Corinthians 2:2 "For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified."

As a result, proving some man made doctrine is false is easy to me for I am not invested in any man made doctrine.

Blessings!

As a result, proving some man made doctrine is false is easy to me for I am not invested in any man made doctrine.

But you have not proven anything to be false.

The doctrines of grace are not man made, this doctrine is formed systematically and Biblical from all 66 books of the Bible. You cannot have one without the other.

Even Jesus taught them.

JESUS ON TOTAL DEPRAVITY
Mark 7:15-23
Mark 10:18
Luke 18:9–14, Jesus commends the tax collector’s realistic view of himself as “a sinner.
John 8:34
John 3:19-21
John 8:44
Matthew 7:18

JESUS ON UNCONDITIONAL ELECTION
John 13:18
John 6:37-40
John 17:6-9
John 10:29
Matthew 11:25-30
Matthew 22:14

JESUS ON LIMITED ATONEMENT
John 10:11
John 10:15
Matthew 26:28
Luke 19:10
John 6:35-40

JESUS ON IRRESISTABLE GRACE
John 1:12-13
John 6:63-65
John 17:2
John 6:44
John 6:37
John 11:43

JESUS ON PERSEVERANCE OF THE SAINTS
John 6:39-40
John 10:27-30
John 5:24
John 6:47
John 17:2
John 3:16

 

[Whatever]

Now my question is does God love this family tree

You guys seem to be fixated on who God loves. I think God told the Jews after He brought them out of Egypt, that He loved and chose them. But after they were afraid to go into the land the first time, He told them that He would make them wander in the desert for 40 years till all that generation from 20 years and older died off. Then those 19 and under would finally go in and settle the land.

Heb 3:16 For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses? 17 Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who did not obey?

I always figured this meant that they all went to Hell. Except for Moses, Joshua and Caleb.
So here we have God bypassing the whole group that He led out of Egypt and swearing that they will not enter His rest, but letting the next generation go in. Kind of like the scenario you brought up.

I can't say He loved them or not. He was angry with them for 40 years.
And unless you want to deny God's omniscience (Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning) and infallible foreknowledge He already know they would do this.
God says several times that He does not change, so I can't see Him loving somebody and then changing and hating them later.

Calvinist haters are just like Atheists, always trying to bring up the most complex "what if's" to prove we are wrong.

 

[Arial]

Second, you haven't answered my question. If one answers no, God does not love the family tree, then God does not love Z either even though Z is saved. This cannot be true by scripture. If one answers yes, then God loves all and that means according to Calvinists God loves also the unsaved. Can Calvinists change their mind and believe God also loves the unsaved? I leave it up to them.

There is no logic in that. It starts with something that doesn't even exist in either Scripture or unconditional election. What does a family tree have to do with it? God does not elect family trees and he does not have to love, with a saving love, everyone in a family tree in order to save one person in that family tree. God cannot love Z even though Z is saved (which would indicate God did love him) unless God also loves the entire family tree with a saving love ? ! It is a false equivalency fallacy is what it is.

You are deviating from my point in your post. The great thing about logic is that it can be used to prove the truth of man made assertions about scripture in this case the Calvinist Doctrine. The Calvinist Doctrine is not found in the bible, but is man's interpretation of God's plan of Salvation.

You might want to read with an eye to logic, that statement again. You actually said that logic can be used to prove the Calvinist doctrine. Now, use logic to prove that unconditional election is not true. And what you presented as logic before was the opposite of logic. And do so with the scriptures.

You accuse me of something you are guilty of namely being in the mind of God and knowing his plans for salvation of mankind. That is strange Arial.

When did I accuse you of that? I will expect to see the quote.

It's elementary my dear Arial.

Oh please!! Give me a break. Lower the curtain.

And no I do not hold onto any man made doctrine be it Calvinism, Molinism etc. The scripture suffices for me. Like Paul said in 1 Corinthians 2:2 "For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified."

But wait a second. Isn't Paul a man? And all the other apostles, weren't they men? Why do you not consider that a man made doctrine. That is one of the most incongruous cop outs floated on forums. I actually hadn't seen it used for a couple of years and thought, at last, the catch phrase passed from popularity.

Like Paul said in 1 Corinthians 2:2 "For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified."

And yet, here you are; talking, talking, talking about things you do not know.

As a result, proving some man made doctrine is false is easy to me for I am not invested in any man made doctrine.

If it is so easy, I will be waiting for you to prove that what you call man made is both man made and false.

 

[hawkman]

All posters remember our rules please .

With 1 Peter 3:15-16 in mind, the following must be adhered to when posting in the Theology forum:

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8. As this forum is for serious theological discussion, relevant verses from the Bible and/or other supporting documentation must be given to support one's assertions, especially when asked for by others.
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10. Violations of these rules are subject to the same disciplinary actions as failing to adhere to the ToS. Please also see Staff Expectations.

 

[JLB]

But you have not proven anything to be false.

The doctrines of grace are not man made, this doctrine is formed systematically and Biblical from all 66 books of the Bible. You cannot have one without the other.

Even Jesus taught them.

JESUS ON TOTAL DEPRAVITY
Mark 7:15-23
Mark 10:18
Luke 18:9–14, Jesus commends the tax collector’s realistic view of himself as “a sinner.
John 8:34
John 3:19-21
John 8:44
Matthew 7:18

JESUS ON UNCONDITIONAL ELECTION
John 13:18
John 6:37-40
John 17:6-9
John 10:29
Matthew 11:25-30
Matthew 22:14

JESUS ON LIMITED ATONEMENT
John 10:11
John 10:15
Matthew 26:28
Luke 19:10
John 6:35-40

JESUS ON IRRESISTABLE GRACE
John 1:12-13
John 6:63-65
John 17:2
John 6:44
John 6:37
John 11:43

JESUS ON PERSEVERANCE OF THE SAINTS
John 6:39-40
John 10:27-30
John 5:24
John 6:47
John 17:2
John 3:16

Not one single scripture mentioned.


Can't you at least post one scripture, and show us where Jesus mentioned,

Limited Atonement
Perseverance of the Saints
Unconditional election


Let's look at one.

JESUS ON PERSEVERANCE OF THE SAINTS
John 6:39-40
John 10:27-30
John 5:24
John 6:47
John 17:2
John 3:16

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16

Where is "perseverance of the saints" mentioned in John 3:16?

It does mention... God so loved the world.


JLB

 

[electedbyHim]

Not one single scripture mentioned.


Can't you at least post one scripture, and show us where Jesus mentioned,

Limited Atonement
Perseverance of the Saints
Unconditional election


Let's look at one.

JESUS ON PERSEVERANCE OF THE SAINTS
John 6:39-40
John 10:27-30
John 5:24
John 6:47
John 17:2
John 3:16

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16

Where is "perseverance of the saints" mentioned in John 3:16?

It does mention... God so loved the world.


JLB

Where is "perseverance of the saints" mentioned in John 3:16?

Its in the verse, in red.
John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

 

[Follower Of Christ]

Dear brothers and sisters in Christ, all I wanted to contribute today was that if TULIP is true than "God loves everybody" is true too. You cannot have the former without the latter. Please read what I have written carefully.

Hence if one claims to adhere to the biblical theology of Calvin, one has to admit that God Loves Everybody.

Blessings and may the peace of Christ be with you all!

 

[JLB]

Its in the verse, in red.
John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Still no mention of perseverance.

Enduring to the end is something a Christian must do, in order to be saved.

But he who endures to the end shall be saved. Matthew 24:13

Peter says it this way -

6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 8 whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:6-9


We must choose to persevere through persecution and not turn away from Christ, so that we may endure to the end, and receive the salvation of our souls.

Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved. But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13

• who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away

 

[electedbyHim]

Still no mention of perseverance.

Enduring to the end is something a Christian must do, in order to be saved.

But he who endures to the end shall be saved. Matthew 24:13

Peter says it this way -

6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 8 whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:6-9


We must choose to persevere through persecution and not turn away from Christ, so that we may endure to the end, and receive the salvation of our souls.

Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved. But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13

• who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away

Enduring to the end is something a Christian must do, in order to be saved.

Works based salvation, got it.?

The Lord I serve sees my salvation to the end, becuase if left up to me, I would be on my way to hell when I die.

 

[JLB]

Works based salvation, got it.?

The Lord I serve sees my salvation to the end, becuase if left up to me, I would be on my way to hell when I die.

Enduring to the end is something a Christian must do, in order to be saved.

God gives us grace and strength, but we must actually do the enduring.

God doesn't endure for us.

But he who endures to the end shall be saved. Matthew 24:13

Peter says it this way -

6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 8 whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:6-9


Notice that the salvation of your soul comes after you persevere various trials, as an end result of your faith; keeping your faith to the end.


That's not works based salvation, that is actually what persevering means... continuing in the faith regardless of the persecution or trial without turning away from Christ.


Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end,
Hebrews 3:12-14

 

[electedbyHim]

Enduring to the end is something a Christian must do, in order to be saved.

God gives us grace and strength, but we must actually do the enduring.

God doesn't endure for us.

But he who endures to the end shall be saved. Matthew 24:13

Peter says it this way -

6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 8 whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:6-9


Notice that the salvation of your soul comes after you persevere various trials, as an end result of your faith; keeping your faith to the end.


That's not works based salvation, that is actually what persevering means... continuing in the faith regardless of the persecution or trial without turning away from Christ.


Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end,
Hebrews 3:12-14

Believe as you will.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[brightfame52]

God's Love is not His Providential Care !

People have confused God's providential care for all His creatures with His Eternal Love which is only for His Children Chosen in Christ Jesus before the World began, which is a huge difference. God as creator can and does providentially care and provide for all His Creatures without Loving them All in Christ Jesus, for instance, if one is a chief warden of a prison house of horrible and wicked prisoners of the worst kind, even though while they are under his watch and he must provide for their needs and care for them, give them water and food, medical attention if need be and etc, nevertheless he will do all this without having Loved them, these are things he must do, without having a tender affection for them as he does for his own children, that he provides for, for then is his disposition different ! God does provide those He does not Love in Christ with the necessities of Life because He is their Creator and must sustain them as long as His Purpose deems it necessary. Matt 5:45

That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

True Believers will emulate their Heavenly Father in this, as Jesus instructed here Lk 10:29-37, even though the stranger had religious differences and are our enemies in this cause, nevertheless, we should not withhold common mercies unto them when it is in our power to give it. This does not mean we Love them in Christ as our brother, in fact, they are enemies in that respect, but we do share a common lot together as God's Creatures, and should seek to be merciful to them if need be ! That is how God is towards them, even though He provideth not for their Eternal Salvation in Jesus Christ ! 8

 

[brightfame52]

Whats the difference ?

What's the difference between sinners God hates as in Ps 5:5

5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.

Now notice, the scripture states here that God hates not just the iniquity of these sinners, but the worker or workers of iniquity, the very persons who are committing the iniquity !

But now, on the other hand, those Christ died for, scripture testimony states clearly that God Loved them as sinners, as workers of iniquity as per Rom 5:8

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Now clearly, the testimony here is that God commendeth His Love towards these, WHILE WE WHERE YET SINNERS !

So clearly, any honest heart can see that there is a difference with God in these Two different sets of sinners. One set is hated, and the other set is Loved.

Now here is the difference. The group that is Loved Rom 5:8, they had all their transgressions charged to Christ, their iniquities were never charged to them but to Christ in order that He would for them make full satisfaction to God's Law and Justice, God sent Christ to be the propitiation for their sins because He Loved them 1 Jn 4:10

Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

But those sinners that God hates Ps 5:5 those are all sinners whom sins and transgressions and iniquities are charged unto themselves, Yes iniquity is still charged upon their persons, and never was it charged to Christ in their behalf ! So consequently they will always be before God's Law and Justice, Workers of Iniquity, and even in spite of all their sincere religious endeavors, all they will hear in the Last Day of Judgment is these words Matt 7:22-23

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

So that is the difference, one group of sinners that God Loved while in their wickedness had all their wickedness charged to Christ, whereas, the group of sinners that God hates, had all their wickedness charged to themselves !

 

[JLB]

Whats the difference ?

What's the difference between sinners God hates as in Ps 5:5

5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.

Now notice, the scripture states here that God hates not just the iniquity of these sinners, but the worker or workers of iniquity, the very persons who are committing the iniquity !

But now, on the other hand, those Christ died for, scripture testimony states clearly that God Loved them as sinners, as workers of iniquity as per Rom 5:8

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Now clearly, the testimony here is that God commendeth His Love towards these, WHILE WE WHERE YET SINNERS !

So clearly, any honest heart can see that there is a difference with God in these Two different sets of sinners. One set is hated, and the other set is Loved.

Now here is the difference. The group that is Loved Rom 5:8, they had all their transgressions charged to Christ, their iniquities were never charged to them but to Christ in order that He would for them make full satisfaction to God's Law and Justice, God sent Christ to be the propitiation for their sins because He Loved them 1 Jn 4:10

Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

But those sinners that God hates Ps 5:5 those are all sinners whom sins and transgressions and iniquities are charged unto themselves, Yes iniquity is still charged upon their persons, and never was it charged to Christ in their behalf ! So consequently they will always be before God's Law and Justice, Workers of Iniquity, and even in spite of all their sincere religious endeavors, all they will hear in the Last Day of Judgment is these words Matt 7:22-23

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

So that is the difference, one group of sinners that God Loved while in their wickedness had all their wickedness charged to Christ, whereas, the group of sinners that God hates, had all their wickedness charged to themselves !

You were unsaved at one time. Aren't you glad God loved you and included you in His plan of salvation for the world?

• Christ died for the ungodly.
• But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us

For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die. But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Romans 5:6-8

How can anyone read these scripture and think God sent His Son to die for people that are supposedly already saved? The elect?

Could you provide a verse where Jesus or His Apostles taught us that God hates the unsaved.

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. John 3:16-17

 

[Whatever]

Could you provide a verse where Jesus or His Apostles taught us that God hates the unsaved.

We have provided these for you before and you just ignore them.

How can anyone read these scripture and think God sent His Son to die for people that are supposedly already saved? The elect?

Again, this is totally absurd. The elect (chosen) are chosen to be saved at a certain time in history.
Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you; Before you were born I sanctified you; I ordained you a prophet to the nations."
God elects Jeremiah before his mother even got pregnant.
God determines the exact time that Jeremiah will be born.
God ordained that Jeremiah would be a prophet.
God ordained the exact time and place Jeremiah would die.
Jeremiah like all the OT saints never received the promises
Hebrews 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises . . .
Hebrews 11:39 And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise,
Hebrews 11:40 God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us.

All these OT elect people are with the Lord now, still waiting for the "full completed" redemption of their bodies.
Romans 8:23 . . . even we ourselves groan within ourselves, eagerly waiting for the adoption, the redemption of our body.

 

[JLB]

Again, this is totally absurd. The elect (chosen) are chosen to be saved at a certain time in history.

Can we agree that Christ died for ungodly sinners; the ungodly sinners of the world?

For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die. But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Romans 5:6-8

 

[electedbyHim]

Can we agree that Christ died for ungodly sinners; the ungodly sinners of the world?

For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die. But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Romans 5:6-8

The answer is verse 8
Romans 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
That is, the Elect.

 

[JLB]

The answer is verse 8
Romans 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
That is, the Elect.

The ungodly sinners are the elect?

Sinners are those who are ungodly and are separated from Christ? Hebrews 7:26

For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die. But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Romans 5:6-8

 

[Whatever]

Can we agree that Christ died for ungodly sinners; the ungodly sinners of the world?

Not if you mean for every single ungodly sinner who has ever lived or ever will live.

John 10:11 "I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep.
John 10:26 . . . you are not of My sheep, . . .
John 8:44 You are of your father the devil . . .

I do not believe that Jesus died for the ungodly goats or tares.
Elect ungodly sinners were given to Jesus by the Father (John 17:6) and Jesus came and laid His life down for them.