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Does man naturally have ability to Seek God ?

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Dorothy Mae said:
So, God's will/pleasure is that we love Him and other people. For love to be love, there must be at the ab
Dorothy Mae said:
Every parent knows what this is like.
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ility to choose to love or not.
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That is a modern philosophical idea. Show me where the Bible says that.
Dorothy Mae said:
Every parent knows what this is like.
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Yes, and every parent is a fallible, limited created being that does not have the omniscience and eternal existence that BGod has.
Dorothy Mae said:
Notice this was creation, not the dealings of God with moral beings. What did God do shortly after this? He put two trees in the garden and TOLD THE MAN NOT TO EAT of one of them. If God did not give man the right to free choose, why did He give him the choice in the garden? And what God's will done in reference to not eating of the tree?
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That second tree was put there precisely so that they would eat of it and fall and start the process of sin that Jesus would come and die and ransom many people and bring them to glory. And there is a difference between what God desires and what He commands. He commanded them to not eat from that tree, but it was His will that they would so that if would effect the whole history of mankind.
Dorothy Mae said:
I am curious, how many "kinds of men" are there and what are they?
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And you claim to be highly educated? Jews, Greeks, Germans, French, Italians, Japanese, and a thousand other groups and languages.
Dorothy Mae said:
All kinds of people includes all people in all times everywhere.
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No it does not.
Act 10:11 and saw heaven opened and an object like a great sheet bound at the four corners, descending to him and let down to the earth. 12 In it were all kinds (pas) of four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, creeping things, and birds of the air.

It is clear that when you read on, it was only some unclean animals.
Act 10:14 But Peter said, "Not so, Lord! For I have never eaten anything common or unclean."
 
Writer Moreno Dal Bello makes an excellent point:

By nature, that is, in his natural state, man is dead in sins, but God is alive. A saved man is not one who sought God, but one who was sought out by God and found. God searches for His sheep until He finds them (see Rom. 3:11 & Lk. 15:4,5 & Ezek. 34:11,12). Man is a sinner, God is the Saviour. Man is lost, God is the Seeker. Man is dead in sins, God is the one Who makes alive. By nature, man does not know he is lost and dead in sins, therefore, it is the Shepherd Who seeks out His sheep until He finds them. “…I was found of them that sought Me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after Me” (Rom. 10:20)
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Apart from the first cause of God the Father, men come to Christ of their own carnal faith, their own carnal will, based on their own carnal works, their own carnal intellect, seeking for some carnal gain . The Father is the first cause of all of those which ever come[Spiritually] to the Son for Salvation. Otherwise man is so completely helpless, being dead in sins, alienated from the life of God, and enemies, haters of God in their hearts and minds that they neither cannot nor will not come to Christ. So, outside of the act of God’s election none from among fallen mankind will come to Christ and be saved.

Jn 6:44

44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Rom 5:6

6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

Eph 2:5

Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

Eph 4:18

Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

Rom 1:30

Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

Jn 5:40

40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

Rom 3:11

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

Col 1:21

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled 9
 
Scripture is very clear on this. I see that those who oppose this teaching are no longer here to defend their position that they have free will to choose salvation.

Grace and peace to you.
 
brightfame52 said:
The Father is the first cause of all of those which ever come[Spiritually] to the Son for Salvation.
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Just curious brightfame52, but based on the above, do you believe that after the Father moves someone to come to the Son they become saved by their coming to Him (meaning coming to a true faith in the Son), or instead, that they are first saved and from/by that they come to a true faith in the Son? In other words, do you believe that (their) faith comes before salvation as a prerequisite to it, or afterwards as a result of it?
Just curious how you see it?
 
rogerg said:
Just curious brightfame52, but based on the above, do you believe that after the Father moves someone to come to the Son they become saved by their coming to Him (meaning coming to a true faith in the Son), or instead, that they are first saved and from/by that they come to a true faith in the Son? In other words, do you believe that (their) faith comes before salvation as a prerequisite to it, or afterwards as a result of it?
Just curious how you see it?
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Afterwards as a result of it.

And Im glad you saw that statement, I thought about it after I posted. Yet what I meant to say and mean, that apart from the Fathers Divine intervention, men think they are coming to Christ, they are mere stony ground hearers so to speak. Their profession was merely with their natural faith, not rooted from the New Birth, Faith the fruit of the Spirit, and so they eventually fall away from their profession Matt 13:20-21

20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;

21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
 
Several reasons why men by nature dont seek after the True and Living God:

1st- because man has a enslaved will to sin, we are naturally servants of sin. Jesus told some men this Jn 8:34

Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

This is man by nature Ecc 7:20

For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not.

Therefore by nature we are slaves/servants to sin which keeps us from seeking the True and Living God.

2nd- By nature our affections are attached to darkness rather than Light and God is Light Jn 3:19

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. This is because before regeneration we are darkness Eph 5:8

For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:

Yet God is absolute light 1 Jn 1:5

This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

3rd- Naturally We have a darkened Spiritual understanding Eph 4:18

Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

By Nature we dont understand God nor the things of God Rom 3:11

There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

1 Cor 2:14

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

The word know here ginóskó means understand for instance Lk 18:34

34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

So man naturally cannot understand God and the things of God !

These are only a few reasons why man does not seek the True God, there are many others !
 
Man naturally doesnt seek God because he cannot, simply because a person that is dead cannot do anything. Just like in physical death, a person in that condition cannot make any physical decisions, he or she will not because they cannot being dead. A physically dead person cannot and will not walk, or talk physically, and unfortunately cannot, and cannot desire to do those things, activities. So its the same with men spiritually dead to God. Rom 3:11

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

Jn 6:44, 65

44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

The inability is because man is dead spiritually to God, though much alive in the physical sphere of things.15
 
brightfame52 said:
Man naturally doesnt seek God because he cannot, simply because a person that is dead cannot do anything. Just like in physical death, a person in that condition cannot make any physical decisions, he or she will not because they cannot being dead. A physically dead person cannot and will not walk, or talk physically, and unfortunately cannot, and cannot desire to do those things, activities. So its the same with men spiritually dead to God. Rom 3:11
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[Eph 2:1 KJV]
1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;

[Eph 2:4-6 KJV]
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
6 And hath raised [us] up together, and made [us] sit together in heavenly [places] in Christ Jesus:

[Col 2:13 KJV]
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
 
rogerg said:
[Eph 2:1 KJV]
1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;

[Eph 2:4-6 KJV]
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
6 And hath raised [us] up together, and made [us] sit together in heavenly [places] in Christ Jesus:

[Col 2:13 KJV]
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
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Amen. Most people dont believe nor understand that natural man, us by natural birth, are totally dead to the True God, and any kind of Spiritual advancement towards Him must be the result of having been quicken from the dead, being dead in sin !
 
Man by nature is dead to God, spiritually dead as a result of his fall/sin in Adam, the representative man for men naturally. Let me explain, physical death means to be dead to physical life, the spirit/soul of a person is separated from the physical body, and so spiritual death is the separation of the soul/spirit of men from God, which is being dead to God, alienated from God and the spiritual communion and fellowship with God Eph 4:18

Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

This is a simple fact of the scripture Col 2:13

13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;16
 
brightfame52 said:
When I say men naturally i mean the unregenerate man, in the flesh, never born again ? Can this person seek after the True and Living God ? The answer is NO !

Scripture makes that clear, that man naturally doesnt seek after God Rom 3:9-12
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So how did Noah and Abram find God?
 
Interestingly and unfortunately, for the same reason those who are unable to accept the supremacy of God through election, they are also unable to hear, grasp or accept what you've posted even though it being perfectly clear. Why? Because only spiritual life can bring a renewed spiritual mind.

[1Co 2:14 KJV]
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.

[Col 3:10 KJV]
10 And have put on the new [man], which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

[Rom 12:2 KJV]
2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what [is] that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

[2Ti 1:7 KJV]
For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

[Rom 8:5-7 KJV]
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded [is] death; but to be spiritually minded [is] life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind [is] enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
 
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