I cant say the same for you friend, reading scripture doesn't seem to help you. Only thing can help you is if God has mercy on you friend, and He will if you are one of His elect
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Does man naturally have ability to Seek God ?
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
But it seems that you are unwilling to even read the scriptures that are set before you.
So, am I reading you right in estimating that you are saying that if a person does not have faith, they are not born again?
Because it seems to me that you are saying that being born again comes before faith; and if that is the case, then faith isn't necessary for being born again; you don't really even need to receive Christ.
You don't even really need to even know the Bible.
God is love...and therefore He loves everyone.
He also died for everyone (1 John 2:2).
The only reason why some do not get saved is because they reject the only provision for salvation that God has set forth to them (see 1 Corinthians 15:1-4).
Here I am not only speaking to you...you may be a lost cause, as you appear to have been brainwashed by a doctrinal philosophy.
I am talking to those who are looking on.
I encourage you, be reconciled to Christ by placing your faith in Him and what He did for you on the Cross.
For apart from faith, you will not be saved.
You will have access by faith into the grace wherein you will stand (Romans 5:2).
Consecrated Life
Member
Jesus Christ is the Truth .
Yet, you just got done saying that a person must be born again BEFORE they can believe in Christ who is The Truth .
By your definition we are now talking about two distinctly individual events.
One following the other in specific order. as you claimed, being born again first, and then in post-birth, coming to believe.
"The Truth is, you cant believe in Christ until you are born again, Saved" ( brightframe52 )
Did you forget giving that definition already ?
Or did you now feel you made a mistake in claiming this two part process ?
If you did not make a mistake in making this claim of two individual events being required I again ask you characterize a person who had only completed the " born again " component of the two part process.
I take it that you completed step 1 of the process when you were born again prior to completing step 2 ?
So this should be easy for you answer based upon your own experience.
How were you different after being " born again" but still an unbeliever ?
Being " born again" sounds quite life changing, how were you changed ?
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I read scripture all the time.
If God Loves everyone as you falsely state, then you dont believe Gods Love in and of itself saved anyone, the same goes for His death. Am I right ?
A Born again person will believe the Truth 2 Thess 2:13
heartwashed
If Christ died for ones sins then He died for the sins of unbelief and rejecting Him, because those are sins people needed to be saved from ! Thats why He saves His People from their sins, DUH
If Christ died for ones sins then He died for the sins of unbelief and rejecting Him, because those are sins people needed to be saved from ! Thats why He saves His People from their sins, DUH
Consecrated Life
Member
So what about the person who completes step one of the process, and is born again, but has not yet completed step two?
As you have detailed there being a pause in between step one and step two.
It is this period of pause dividing the two steps that you have detailed that concerns me.
".. you cant believe in Christ until you are born again, Saved" ( brightframe52 )
Many spiritual mishaps could happen in this separation period you claim.
What about the person who becomes born again listening to the Christian radio station as they are driving down the highway and is then hit head on by a semi truck before they get the chance to advance to believing ?
What is their final estate ?
And what is the final spiritual estate of the person who becomes born again , is then overcome by sleep , decides to take a nap before completing step two, and then dies in their sleep ?
Did you read the scriptures in question that I had quoted to you (1 John 4:8, 1 John 4:16)?
His love (and His death) saves those who avail themselves of what He did for them on the Cross by putting their faith in it.
Unbelief and rejecting Him are forgiven only if they are repented of.
consecrated
Sounds like to me you are second guessing God, all that is Gods business
Thats right. Except a man is born again he cant see the kingdom of God Jn 3. Man not born again is dead to God
You worried about the wrong thing, all that is Gods business, under His Sovereign control
Thats Gods business
If Christ died for them, and paid their sin debt, they are saved
You sound like a person who doesnt know who God is, and dont understand He is in control of all situations.
Sounds like to me you are second guessing God, all that is Gods business
Thats right. Except a man is born again he cant see the kingdom of God Jn 3. Man not born again is dead to God
You worried about the wrong thing, all that is Gods business, under His Sovereign control
Thats Gods business
If Christ died for them, and paid their sin debt, they are saved
You sound like a person who doesnt know who God is, and dont understand He is in control of all situations.
More Salvation by works, by a person availing themselves, lol
Oh no, unbelief and rejection of Him are forgiven, and thats why God gives them Faith and repentance.
Only people who Christ didnt die for are going to die in their sins in unbelief. Repentance is given to them God has forgiven Acts 5:31
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
You see that ? He as Saviour gives both, forgiveness of sins and repentance. But its only to Israel, another name for Gods elect.
Consecrated Life
Member
So having full knowledge of God's mandatory two step salvation requirement, you have no clue what happens if step two is not completed ?
"The Truth is, you cant believe in Christ until you are born again, Saved" ( brightframe52 )
How is it possible to know so much about 1/2 of a specific thing and know absolutely nothing about the 1/2 all at the same time ?
Christ died for everyone, 1 John 2:2.
1Jo 2:2, And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
Again sounds to me you are second guessing God, for Salvation, all of it, every aspect of it is of God, His performance.
1 Jn 2:2 doesnt say Christ died for everyone, and none of them in the whole world hereshall die in their sins
Only people who Christ didn't die for are going to die in their sins in unbelief.
When it says, "the whole world" it is speaking of the whole world; not just a subsection of the world.
Consecrated Life
Member
You made the claim of a two step requirement for salvation .
God did not .
That is why you provided no supporting scripture for your claim:
"The Truth is, you cant believe in Christ until you are born again, Saved" ( brightframe52 )
Therefore you being the author of a two step salvation I am second guessing you alone about the implications inherent in a pause before step two.
Why are you running away from your own claim ?
The whole world of the saved 1 Jn 2:2. People who are lost Christ didnt die for and are exempt from the whole world of 1 Jn 2:2
The lost people belong to the whole world of them lying in the wicked one 1 Jn 5:19
19 And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.