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Four views of the "Endtimes"

One simple one for you. How did people all through the Bible SEE the glory of God? I suspect that SEEING was done through their sense of sight.

Well, maybe one more, in case that one was a stumper. Did anyone ever HEAR God or Jesus?

"Taste and see that the lord is good"
I wonder what the hot coals FELT like on lips?

We could both go through the book, and find all sorts of verses like that. God communicated through people's senses all the time.

Now, I don't doubt for a moment that you are unable to know God this way, (but you COULD be able to... if you didn't choose to fight it so), but that doesn't change the truth of it.
 
JLB said:
I had never heard of the term futurist or preterist, before I came to this Forum.

I think labeling people with these names tends to put them under an umbrella of certain ideas and beliefs that they may or may not consider to be true.

For me, Jesus' Resurrection was in the past, the Resurrection of the dead in Christ and the Rapture is future.

Jesus Coming is in the future.

Jesus came in the flesh once, and He will appear a second time at the end of the age, and raise us up on the last Day, which is in the future.

so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28

For this belief, I am labeled a futurist.

For this belief I have been labeled a Dispensationalist.


JLB
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I agree with you. Labels can be very deceptive. Many of us have a combination of what we see as past and yet in the future.
God Bless you too, JLB
 
No schools of prophets?
Uh..... You might want to do a little more studying about Samuel and Elijah and Elisha.
 
Brother Mike said:
NO, NO and NO again. More error. Believers are anointed, and anointing does rub off on cloth. We are not to give heed to the cloth or any other so called power object. It's error
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Did the Bible lie about Paul sending his handkerchief and aprons around....... and his shadow falling on people... and what happened through those things?
 
Willie T said:
One simple one for you. How did people all through the Bible SEE the glory of God? I suspect that SEEING was done through their sense of sight.

Well, maybe one more, in case that one was a stumper. Did anyone ever HEAR God or Jesus?

"Taste and see that the lord is good"
I wonder what the hot coals FELT like on lips?

We could both go through the book, and find all sorts of verses like that. God communicated through people's senses all the time.

Now, I don't doubt for a moment that you are unable to know God this way, (but you COULD be able to... if you didn't choose to fight it so), but that doesn't change the truth of it.
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Taste and see how the Lord is good............. is an expression.......... Honey, Hot coals........ Your mixing OT and being led by the senses with Holy Spirit filled beliers today. Satan operates in the realm of our senses......

We walk by faith, not by sight........ Not by touch.......... Not by smell....

We don't throw fleeces out anymore, we have a much higher way to be led.

Johnathan wants us to look at natural things, Power objects to walk with God and I just mentioned two, He mentioned a whole lot of other things we should steer clear of. There is a reason he has a teaching about Seperating "NEW AGE" from what He teaches. It's because He crossed the line and wants people to think what He believs is different from what New Agers believe............ You don't spiritually see what is going on with him, I get that. Believe what I am telling you.
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1.3 If a member disagrees with a Moderator's action, they are not to take their dispute public.
 
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Brother Mike said:
I went and downloaded his book School of Seers. I read it, it's only like 19 pages.
In the book is some things most believers would just freak out about. I am aware of the Anti-anointing believers preach (Antichrist) and aware of believers putting down people like Kenneth Copeland who is a awsome man of God.

So I read the book with wanting to find good.

He talked about seeing angels with swords............ Well, someone years back looked in my yard and saw angels standing guard around my door and house and they had swords. (I never saw them) Ok, check.

He talked about aura's around anointed folks. Just last week I was sharing a word with my wife and her friend and her friend just started to stare up at me. When I finshed she said, "I was not sure I was suppose to say this, but the Lord told me to tell you there was a green, yellow glow that flashed light around you as you spoke about certain things. Like something was around you.

I have heard that before in the past............ I suppose.

So I could relate to about everything in that book I read.

Now his other book He goes into deatail about amulets with power, and we should be able to read these aurar's. I could only find clipings of it.

Using crystal objects, smelling things in the spirit realm.......... He calls himself a rogue theologian. Who would call themselves that if they were right on scripture?

There is lots more, but I am not just going to dog on someone.

We are not to try to make gifts operate. Paul said desire spiritual gifts and they come as the Spirit wills.
According to Johnathan you have to flip the switch of faith to operate in these things, just turn the switch on.

I stay in belief 24/7 and we just don't flip a switch and expect God to do what we want. I don't pick how God is going to do something, but I know God will, without fail.

Johnathan tells us we need to operate in smelling things in the spirit and seeing these auror's. That is not what we are suppose to be doing. We don't choose to do that.

I am not putting the man down, He is just out there bad, and I believe he started off good, but youth and pride have clouded his judgement.
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I have that book, The School of Seers, it is actually 184 pgs long. A friend gave it to me several years ago. I went looking last night, because I was sure I had read something he had written, and found it. I don't remember how he worded things, I'll have to read it again.
But I'd like to know where you found the 19 pgs that you read online. I have looked and can't find the ones you read.
Please give me a link if you can.
 
Deborah13 said:
I have that book, The School of Seers, it is actually 184 pgs long. A friend gave it to me several years ago. I went looking last night, because I was sure I had read something he had written, and found it. I don't remember how he worded things, I'll have to read it again.
But I'd like to know where you found the 19 pgs that you read online. I have looked and can't find the ones you read.
Please give me a link if you can.
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Does this mean, Mike, we are to disregard what you say because you conjured up a number of pages for the book?

I also have that book, and I was going to let you slide on that "ERROR", but you are going way too overboard trying to besmirch this man of God.
 
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Brother Mike said:
Taste and see how the Lord is good............. is an expression.......... Honey, Hot coals........ Your mixing OT and being led by the senses with Holy Spirit filled beliers today. Satan operates in the realm of our senses......

We walk by faith, not by sight........ Not by touch.......... Not by smell....

We don't throw fleeces out anymore, we have a much higher way to be led.

Johnathan wants us to look at natural things, Power objects to walk with God and I just mentioned two, He mentioned a whole lot of other things we should steer clear of. There is a reason he has a teaching about Seperating "NEW AGE" from what He teaches. It's because He crossed the line and wants people to think what He believs is different from what New Agers believe............ You don't spiritually see what is going on with him, I get that. Believe what I am telling you.
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1.3 If a member disagrees with a Moderator's action, they are not to take their dispute public.
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Mike, I learned about 'putting out a fleece' from Kenneth Copeland.
 
Willie T said:
Does this mean we are to disregard what you say because you conjured up a number of pages for the book?

I also have that book, and I was going to let you slide on that "ERROR", but you are going way too overboard trying to besmirch this man of God.
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Whoa, Willie. I haven't said anything against Jonathan Welton. I think you meant that post for Mike, not me?
 
Deborah13 said:
Whoa, Willie. I haven't said anything against Jonathan Welton. I think you meant that post for Mike, not me?
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Of course I did. That's why the first sentence reads the way it does..... I was merely tacking onto your post as reference. Sorry. I just didn't think simply typing that without your post, would associate to the false number he claimed he saw.
 
so if it appears that its in bible. don't check just believe it?

okaaaaaaaaaaaay. that is a first. I was taught to fleece to see if the lord said not just from Copeland has he has said that too, I used to listen to him once in a while. I have heard it my church. we at that church did have healings and likely that church still does. I haven't been there in a while. my own home church is a teacher of the healing promises. im sure pastor would teach that.
 
Deborah13 said:
Mike, I learned about 'putting out a fleece' from Kenneth Copeland.
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Good, then you have right instructions not to ever, ever, ever do that. Both Keith Moore and Brother Copeland warn about being natural led.

IN fact, Brother Moore just had done a series about it this week.

Deborah13 said:
I have that book, The School of Seers, it is actually 184 pgs long. A friend gave it to me several years ago. I went looking last night, because I was sure I had read something he had written, and found it. I don't remember how he worded things, I'll have to read it again.
But I'd like to know where you found the 19 pgs that you read online. I have looked and can't find the ones you read.
Please give me a link if you can.
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https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...8QFjAA&usg=AFQjCNHxF8t5tg5N3I5VmvCSfF6UPbZtyw

On tablet. Not sure that is the whole book What downloaded for me was about 19 pages. As I said, though the book I read was far out, I could relate to the same experiences and did not find anything worth a negetive comment. If that Link don't do, then Google school of Seers Pdf. Tablet has limitations.

Willie T said:
Does this mean, Mike, we are to disregard what you say because you conjured up a number of pages for the book?

I also have that book, and I was going to let you slide on that "ERROR", but you are going way too overboard trying to besmirch this man of God.
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I am not putting the man down. I am telling you very clearly he has gotten into things that are in error.

As an example you said "Taste and see that the Lord is good." That would be trying the Lord out as you would taste a good treat or something, that does not litterally mean go to the throne room and give God a good licking with Ketchup.

You misused a scripture without thought, to prove a point. Johnthan is telling folks to actually taste..........physically. Through visons, you might "Taste" something. Some taken to Hell tell about the real strong smell of sulfer. We are not suppose to seek after these things at all.

Your misuse of a scripture (Unless we are to visit the throne room and take a chunk out of God with some salt and pepper) shows you have already accepted corrupting scripture to prove a point. I am very mindful and Spirit led to use all scripture in a thoughtful and careing way. Does not mean I am always right, but it sure don't mean God needs a bite taken out of him either.

I am warning you to watch what you Hear.

There is a difference in speaking the Word only with signs following, and following signs, senses, to get the Word performed. The cart does not come before the horse.
 
Willie T said:
Of course I did. That's why the first sentence reads the way it does..... I was merely tacking onto your post as reference. Sorry. I just didn't think simply typing that without your post, would associate to the false number he claimed he saw.
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Oh, I don't think he was being false about it. Online there are portions of the books that are pdf files that are only a few pages long. I just can't find the one he is referring to, none of the ones I have found say these things. The ones I have found are just the foreword, preface, (both written by other people) and his introduction. He doesn't mention these things in the intro. He talks about Elijah, Elisha, and the servant that no name is mentioned and how they saw into the spiritual realm.
I just need to read the book again. Crystals? I don't remember anything about crystals and such. :shrug
 
Deborah13 said:
Back in the 70's and 80's that was not what he was saying.
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I gave you one from 1983...................... Now if you have evidence of this, then please share.

Since 1983 He has gotten it right. My hope is all ministers grown and get better and stronger in the things they believe, changing what needs changed. That is my hope.

Still, Brother Copeland learned for Oral Roberts and Kenneth Hagin. Both men against putting out fleeces, so I think you just heard him wrong.

Under your theory though, we should put down all ministers for things they said about God as kids to prove them wrong.............. 1983 is pretty far back.
 
Deborah13 said:
Oh, I don't think he was being false about it. Online there are portions of the books that are pdf files that are only a few pages long. I just can't find the one he is referring to, none of the ones I have found say these things. The ones I have found are just the foreword, preface, (both written by other people) and his introduction. He doesn't mention these things in the intro. He talks about Elijah, Elisha, and the servant that no name is mentioned and how they saw into the spiritual realm.
I just need to read the book again. Crystals? I don't remember anything about crystals and such. :shrug
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I'm sorry, but I cannot be that generous. The very site he posted shows 261 pages in the table of contents, and barely gets past the preface in the 30 pages it displays.

This is more than enough to see that he must not have even done much more than glanced at his download for a few words to slam the man with. and, to me, that kind of stinks. (Just to use one of my senses)
 
Willie T said:
I'm sorry, but I cannot be that generous. The very site he posted shows 261 pages in the table of contents, and barely gets past the preface in the 30 pages it displays.

This is more than enough to see that he must not have even done much more than glanced at his download for a few words to slam the man with. and, to me, that kind of stinks. (Just to use one of my senses)
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You can't be kind, because you can't pay attention to what I said. The one I downloaded School of Seers was cut short, or only 19 pages. I read through it and found nothing wrong doctrinally. It's his quotes from his other book.

Pay attention.............. I am worried about you.
 
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