Bible Study GO AND SIN NO MORE !!!

[Papa Zoom]

And so do you keep the Sabbath as described in Exo 20:10? But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

The basic premise of the OP is "how do we sin no more" of John 8:11. Were there consequences for not keeping the Sabbath Holy? Is the option of entering Jesus' rest a reality of Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. How do we do that? Thanks Sister Justicewolf.

Didn't he really just tell her to basically stop the sin she was engaging in in which he was presently addressing? As in this:"In saying, “Go and sin no more,” Jesus was not speaking of sinless perfection. He was warning against a return to sinful lifestyle choices. His words both extended mercy and demanded holiness. Jesus was always the perfect balance of “grace and truth” (John 1:14). With forgiveness comes the expectation that we will not continue in the same path of rebelliousness. Those who know God’s love will naturally want to obey Him (John 14:15)."
https://www.gotquestions.org/go-and-sin-no-more.html

Apart from the Spirit's work in our life, we cannot obey the Law of Christ. Galatians 5:22-23 New International Version (NIV)
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.

 

[Eugene]

Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who did not obey? 19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.
Hebrews 3:12-19

And you don't believe Moses was to go and die on mount Nebo because of unbelief? He was not allowed to enter that rest of Canaan, and fell in the wilderness as well as those that provoked God didn't he?

 

[JLB]

And you don't believe Moses was to go and die on mount Nebo because of unbelief? He was not allowed to enter that rest of Canaan, and fell in the wilderness as well as those that provoked God didn't he?

The scripture says he was faithful.

He was "disobedient" in the sense, that he struck the Rock instead of speaking to it, for water to come forth.

He "transgressed" the command in the incident of striking the "Rock" rather than speaking to it.

Water still came forth from the Rock.

What is your point?

I gave you the context of Hebrews 4 that shows it's a salvation issue.



JLB

 

[Eugene]

Didn't he really just tell her to basically stop the sin she was engaging in in which he was presently addressing? As in this:"In saying, “Go and sin no more,” Jesus was not speaking of sinless perfection.

Of course that would be speculation, at least in my opinion. Regardless the best efforts of the world there remains lack for there are none that do good; no not one. Rom 3:12.
I personally believe that there is sinless perfection in all Jesus has cleansed and that we are judged according to righteousness bestowed to us through His sacrifice. God sees us in the new man and the new nature we have in Christ. How else can scripture tell us as we read in 1Jn 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Was the woman told to sin no more saved (Jn 8:11), or did she as the young man who had followed all the law, and yet was told to follow Christ because he lacked one thing? Lk 18:22. (Follow Me?)

Joh 13:10 Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet (Our spiritual walk in Christ), but is clean every whit. Can we be more clean than every whit?
Thanks for your reply.

 

[Justicewolf]

I have Sunday off. So I refrain from work in that sense. I seek community with Christians when I enter forums on the net after church. And I fast the full day. I pray, take long walks and contemplate God and the scriptures. Sometimes I have my Bible with me. Being I'm not a Jew I don't follow the Jewish tradition of Sabbath, sundown Friday to sundown on Saturday. Many Christians I know recognize Sunday as the Sabbath day of rest even if they have to work. And there are also friends who celebrate the Jewish calendar sundown Sabbath.
I think God who indwells us knows we are as he said, the temple that carries his holy spirit. And so either way of taking time to glorify God would be righteous for those who are sincerely in Christ.

Thanks for asking Brother Eugene.

 

[Eugene]

He was "disobedient" in the sense, that he struck the Rock instead of speaking to it, for water to come forth.

Num 20:12 And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron, Because ye believed me not, to sanctify me in the eyes of the children of Israel, therefore ye shall not bring this congregation into the land which I have given them. And then Moses was told to go up and die on mount Nebo as the result of his actions of unbelief in striking the rock. Deut 32:50.

What is your point?

Long story short brother is that entering the rest of those that entered the land of Canaan was limited to belief. Moses had committed a sin unto death as it were and fell in the wilderness as all who provoked God, but he didn't lose his salvation as the result; Moses was still seen with Jesus later in Lk 9:30.

 

[Papa Zoom]

Of course that would be speculation, at least in my opinion. Regardless the best efforts of the world there remains lack for there are none that do good; no not one. Rom 3:12.
I personally believe that there is sinless perfection in all Jesus has cleansed and that we are judged according to righteousness bestowed to us through His sacrifice. God sees us in the new man and the new nature we have in Christ. How else can scripture tell us as we read in 1Jn 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Was the woman told to sin no more saved (Jn 8:11), or did she as the young man who had followed all the law, and yet was told to follow Christ because he lacked one thing? Lk 18:22. (Follow Me?)

Joh 13:10 Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet (Our spiritual walk in Christ), but is clean every whit. Can we be more clean than every whit?
Thanks for your reply.

This is the problem I have with single Bible verses, they don't give a full picture of what's True. No one does good? What is good? Is it the action taken or is it the motivation behind the action? I suspect it has more to do with the heart. And as I look around, I see many people that do good things. Like the young lady from my town that left for Sudan shortly after HS and set up medical clinics and worked to get clean water wells installed throughout the region. Is this not a good thing? So I see people doing good quite a bit. This verse cannot mean good in the way I immediately think of it.

So I'm left to wonder at the deeper meaning of Romans 3:12.

John Gill has written: "There is none that can do good in a spiritual manner, without the grace of God, strength from Christ, and the assistance of the Spirit; and there is not even a spiritual man, that can do good perfectly, and without sin."

1 John 3:6 seems to have more to do with living a life of sin (a life inconsistent on being "in Christ) than sinless perfection.

There's a principle that I first heard on str.org: never read a Bible verse. So when anyone quotes a verse on a forum as a support for a particular principle, I'm not yet convinced because no single verse is adequate to explain fully and accurately the Principle of God for which we are to live. It will take a while to put all the pieces together to come away with an exact meaning.

More importantly, what how would the original audience have understood those words? What it said to them it says to us.

 

[Eugene]

I think God who indwells us knows we are

I really like this. I use the scripture in Rom 14:3. Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

 

[Eugene]

I see many people that do good things. Like the young lady from my town that left for Sudan shortly after HS and set up medical clinics and worked to get clean water wells installed throughout the region. Is this not a good thing? So I see people doing good quite a bit. This verse cannot mean good in the way I immediately think of it.

Hi Brother @PapaZoom, and I too am reluctant to put all my eggs in one basket as it were considering Rom 3:12 alone, but just as the young man saying that he had kept all the law from his youth up in Mt 19:20, and then ask what he lacked. He had to be a pretty good guy. Well there is other scripture such as Mt 19:21 saying that to inherit eternal life he must follow Jesus. Not only that Jesus says in Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

Mat 19:19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 19:20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
Mat 19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

For the moment we have the best in this advice by Jesus: Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (And this regardless of any work any ever do.)

 

[Papa Zoom]

Hi Brother @PapaZoom, and I too am reluctant to put all my eggs in one basket as it were considering Rom 3:12 alone, but just as the young man saying that he had kept all the law from his youth up in Mt 19:20, and then ask what he lacked. He had to be a pretty good guy. Well there is other scripture such as Mt 19:21 saying that to inherit eternal life he must follow Jesus. Not only that Jesus says in Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

Mat 19:19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 19:20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
Mat 19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

For the moment we have the best in this advice by Jesus: Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (And this regardless of any work any ever do.)

Good words brother. amen and amen

 

[for_his_glory]

Eugene in his OP said, "You who keep the law, is the Sabbath a part of it? (Oh but I don't kill anyone)"

Genesis 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Sanctified means to set a part as being something special. God said the sabbath is a day of rest. It's a day to just lay back and exhale from all your labor you did in the past six days. When God sanctifies something it is made holy and good for us. Jesus said in John 17:16, 17 We are separated unto God as Gods word is truth and good for us as we are no longer of this world. 2 Peter 3:18 tells us to grow in grace and in the knowledge of Christ as He is our Lord and Savior, but vs. 17 says to beware not to be led away with the error of the wicked as we need to stay steadfast in the knowledge of the Lord.

Acts 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

No one could be justified by the old covenant laws as for one thing they had no saving provisions within it that brought anyone to faith,but led them to condemnation. The old covenant brought condemnation with it as no one could seem to follow them all. This is why Gods grace brought us into a better new covenant of love through Christ who redeemed us from the curse of the law, Matthew 22:37-40; Galatians 3:10-15, as Christ came to fulfill that of the Temple rituals and sacrifices, Matthew 5:17, 18. We are still under the moral laws as we are commanded to walk in love within them.

 

[Eugene]

No one could be justified by the old covenant laws as for one thing they had no saving provisions within it that brought anyone to faith,but led them to condemnation. The old covenant brought condemnation with it as no one could seem to follow them all. This is why Gods grace brought us into a better new covenant of love through Christ who redeemed us from the curse of the law.

Thanks for your reply Sister for_his_glory. I couldn't agree more.

We are still under the moral laws as we are commanded to walk in love within them.

And if we don't is there consequence? Will we realize the rest we could have just by no longer committing adultery? And as per the OP of this thread, could the woman taken in adultery in Jn 8:3 have life if she just didn't sin any more as instructed by Jesus in Jn 8:11? In actuality was she being told to receive Jesus as her Savior?
Rom 4:8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not . . .

 

[ezra]

Didn't he really just tell her to basically stop the sin she was engaging in in which he was presently addressing? As in this:"In saying, “Go and sin no more,” Jesus was not speaking of sinless perfection. He was warning against a return to sinful lifestyle choices.

Bingo the same thing he says to us when we sin ... i wondered how long it would take to hit it straight on

 

[JLB]

Long story short brother is that entering the rest of those that entered the land of Canaan was limited to belief. Moses had committed a sin unto death as it were and fell in the wilderness as all who provoked God, but he didn't lose his salvation as the result; Moses was still seen with Jesus later in Lk 9:30.

Of course Moses was seen with Jesus, because he was faithful in all his house, and is an example to us, if we want to be with Jesus we also need to follow his example of faithfulness.

And Moses indeed was faithful in all His house as a servant, for a testimony of those things which would be spoken afterward, but Christ as a Son over His own house, whose house we are if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end. Hebrews 3:5-6

• whose house we are if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end.

And again


12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, 15 while it is said:

“Today, if you will hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion.”

16 For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses? 17 Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who did not obey? 19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief. Hebrews 3:12-19

• brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God;

I don’t see where Moses committed a sin unto death as you claim.

Are you trying to say, Moses fell into unbelief and departed from the Lord?

I simply don’t understand why you would try to count Moses with the rebellious children of Israel.

Moses had committed a sin unto death as it were and fell in the wilderness as all who provoked God

Please show me the scripture that says Moses committed a sin unto death and fell in the wilderness like the others whom God was angry with for forty years?


I find it alarming that you would lump Moses in with the rebellious who fell in the wilderness.

Are you trying to teach this forum that Moses was rebellious and God was angry with him for forty years?

For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses? Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? Hebrews 3:16-17

• Now with whom was He angry forty years?
• Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness?

This is not referring to Moses. This is a reference to the rebellious children of Israel, who constantly provoked the Lord for forty years, whom the Lord let die until only Joshua and Caleb were left and the next generation rose up to take the promised land.

Again, here is the testimony about Moses:

• And Moses indeed was faithful in all His house as a servant, for a testimony of those things which would be spoken afterward.
• consider the Apostle and High Priest of our confession, Christ Jesus, who was faithful to Him who appointed Him, as Moses also was faithful in all His house.

JLB

 

[Eugene]

I don’t see where Moses committed a sin unto death as you claim.

Dear Brother JLB, I love Moses as does God, but due to scripture he didn't have God's best and the rest from the wilderness He could have realized.
Num 20:12 And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron, Because ye believed me not, to sanctify me in the eyes of the children of Israel, therefore ye shall not bring this congregation into the land which I have given them.
Deu 32:50 And die in the mount whither thou goest up (A sin unto death? It sure was not the loss of his salvation.), and be gathered unto thy people; as Aaron thy brother died in mount Hor, and was gathered unto his people:
Deu 32:51 Because ye trespassed against me among the children of Israel at the waters of Meribah-Kadesh, in the wilderness of Zin; because ye sanctified me not in the midst of the children of Israel.
Deu 32:52 Yet thou shalt see the land before thee; but thou shalt not go thither unto the land which I give the children of Israel.

Are you trying to say, Moses fell into unbelief and departed from the Lord?

He didn't obey the Lord; what would you call it? As the result he wasn't allowed to enter Canaan after forty years.

I simply don’t understand why you would try to count Moses with the rebellious children of Israel.

He fell in the wilderness just as those in the provocation that should not enter God's rest as the remainder of Israel did. Why again? Because Moses did not believe God. Num 20:12. I don't know what else we can call it.

 

[JLB]

If I could live out Jesus world view and expectations, I would not need Jesus as saviour. Its thats simple.

Jesus words are truth but I cannot live up to them. Thats not the reason he come into the world.

I thought He came to save sinners; to save that which was lost.

Lost = Sinner. Unreconciled to God
Found = Saved. Reconciled to God


Now that we are joined to Him, and are one spirit with Him, we have His Spirit, to enable and empower us to live in domionion over sin, that we would no longer be a slave in bondage to sin.

Therefore, brethren, we are debtors—not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.
Romans 8:12-13

Learning to walk in victory over sin does take time and comes more and more as we grow in Christ.

I know the Lord has delivered me from many things over the years.

But we do come to the place where we learn to live according to His life within us, and avoid being in the wrong place, with the wrong people, doing the wrong thing.

It's a process.


JLB

 

[JLB]

He fell in the wilderness just as those in the provocation that should not enter God's rest as the remainder of Israel did. Why again? Because Moses did not believe God. Num 20:12. I don't know what else we can call it.

Not true. He died on the mountain after being faithful for forty years, dealing with a stiff neck and rebellious people whom God was angry with for forty years.

Moses made a mistake in striking the rock, and you have associated him with the rebellious whom God was angry with for forty years...as if the drunkard is counted with the sober.

and so it may not happen, when he hears the words of this curse, that he blesses himself in his heart, saying, ‘I shall have peace, even though I follow the dictates of my heart’—as though the drunkard could be included with the sober.
Deuteronomy 29:19


Again, the scripture makes a distinction between Moses who was faithful and the rebellious children of Israel whom God was angry with for forty years, yet you seem to make no such distinction. Why?

16 For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses? 17 Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? Hebrews 3:16-17

Those whose bodies fell in the wilderness were those who rebelled and God was angry with for forty years.

This was not said of Moses.


Michael himself cared for his body.

Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!” Jude 9


JLB

 

[Eugene]

Moses made a mistake in striking the rock, and you have associated him with the rebellious whom God was angry with for forty years...as if the drunkard is counted with the sober.

You say that Moses made a mistake? And because of that mistake God didn't allow Moses to enter Canaan, and told Moses to go up to mount Nebo and die? Even Peter denying Jesus three times wasn't treated like that.
Deu 32:48 And the LORD spake unto Moses that selfsame day, saying,
Deu 32:49 Get thee up into this mountain Abarim, unto mount Nebo, which is in the land of Moab, that is over against Jericho; and behold the land of Canaan, which I give unto the children of Israel for a possession:
Deu 32:50 And die in the mount whither thou goest up, and be gathered unto thy people; as Aaron thy brother died in mount Hor, and was gathered unto his people:
Deu 32:51 Because ye trespassed against me among the children of Israel at the waters of Meribah-Kadesh, in the wilderness of Zin; because ye sanctified me not in the midst of the children of Israel.
Deu 32:52 Yet thou shalt see the land before thee; but thou shalt not go thither unto the land which I give the children of Israel.

Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!” Jude 9

God is not going to accept a reviling accusation against us either brother for all the times we have failed; at least I have.

 

[JLB]

You say that Moses made a mistake?

Yes.

And what I also said was -

...you have associated him with the rebellious whom God was angry with for forty years...as if the drunkard is counted with the sober.

and so it may not happen, when he hears the words of this curse, that he blesses himself in his heart, saying, ‘I shall have peace, even though I follow the dictates of my heart’—as though the drunkard could be included with the sober.
Deuteronomy 29:19


Again, the scripture makes a distinction between Moses who was faithful and the rebellious children of Israel whom God was angry with for forty years, yet you seem to make no such distinction. Why?

16 For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses? 17 Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? Hebrews 3:16-17

Those whose bodies fell in the wilderness were those who rebelled and God was angry with for forty years.

This was not said of Moses.


Why are you associating Moses who was faithful, with those God was angry with for forty years, who the scripture said were rebellious.

• The scripture says of these children of Israel -

For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses? Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? Hebrews 3:16-17

• Now with whom was He angry forty years?
• Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness?

The scripture testifies of Moses this way -

And Moses indeed was faithful in all His house as a servant, for a testimony of those things which would be spoken afterward, but Christ as a Son over His own house, whose house we are if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end.
Hebrews 3:5-6


You on the other hand, see no difference between the rebellious children of Israel and Moses.


Why? When the scripture makes a clear distinction.



JLB

 

[JLB]

God is not going to accept a reviling accusation against us either brother for all the times we have failed; at least I have.

Brother the scripture says Michael was the one who did not bring a reviling accusation against the devil.


Why would Michael bring a reviling accusation against us?



JLB