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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Gods' Wrath
- Thread starter journeymanisnothing
- Start date
journeymanisnothing
Member
The Bible defines why people are cursed,
Cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them. And all the peopleshall say, Amen. Deu.27:26
Cursed in any true sense doesn't apply to our Savior. The only peoole who viewed Jesus as cursed were those who accused him and other ignorant passerbys,
The fact that Jesus was sinless according to the law, shows that people who count him among the lawless are false witnesses,
journeymanisnothing
Member
And what?
Yes, that means that all of us are cursed.
Except: Gal 3:13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”—
Once again, Jesus took on our sins (curse) voluntarily. This is how we are redeemed.
Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Rom 3:24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,
Rom 3:25 whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins.
Rom 3:26 It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
God cannot just wink away sin. It must be atoned for. Jesus paid the price for out redemption by taking on our sin and curse and paying for it.
I don't understand what is so hard to understand about this.
journeymanisnothing
Member
What's so hard is that the Bible says,
The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the childrenbe put to death for the fathers:every man shall be put to deathfor his own sin. Deu.24:16
The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him. Eze.18:20
Therefore, "bearing sin" as Christ did means he endured wrongdoing committed against him,
I gave my back to the smiters, and my cheeks to them that plucked off the hair: I hid not my face from shame and spitting. Isa.50:6
What's so hard is you don't seen to think spitting in our Savios face is sin. Or that Jesus bire this sin.
Modern people have their rights.
1 Corinthians 9:5 kjv
5. Have we not power to lead about a sister, a wife, as well as other apostles, and as the brethren of the Lord, and Cephas?
The right (power) to have a wife with them was there, but for the cause of the gospel they gave up their rights.
1 Corinthians 9:6 kjv
6. Or I only and Barnabas, have not we power to forbear working?
So we have rights that we can choose to not take advantage of.
Different levels of rights (context), but the same concept.
Jesus gave up throne, home, clothing, beard even his life for us.
eddif
journeymanisnothing
Member
The point is, our Lord as King excercised his right not to bring sinners to judgment. He chooses to reign in mercy.
I'm not denying that at all. You seem to be denying that Jesus bore my sins that I committed 2,000 years after He died.
Again, you totally misunderstand. I don't count Jesus as lawless. I count that the Father imputed our lawlessness to Him, the same way the Father imputes His righteousness to me.
journeymanisnothing
Member
Yes I know. Mine also. So don't you think it's time for the world to know how much our sins hurt him? Mind you, not "the wrath of God" falling on him, but the wrath of men. Men who hated God and wanted to get rid of Christ for that reason.
journeymanisnothing
Member
Lawlessness is imputed (regarded) as such toward the violators, not the innocent, provided the violators haven't repented of their sins against him.
That's the point. And having Christs' righteousness imputed (thought of that way) toward believers may very well result in persecution. That is when we really get schooled in the doctrine of Christs' suffering.
I don't think the world cares.
Consecrated Life
Member
Jesus spoke from His cross of His experiencing God's wrath in that moment :
"And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? "
For me there is no greater expression of God's wrath than to be forsaken by him.
And that is from the standpoint of me being a sinner .
What we are talking about here is He who knew no sin being forsaken of God .
Even when our consciousness and knowledge has been expanded beyond belief when we die and received into the realm of heaven I believe we still will never be able to fully comprehend the price that was paid in that moment by Jesus .
journeymanisnothing
Member
Some would. In fact, if it was their own kid hanging from a cross for a crime he didn't commit, they would see the injustice in it.
They would know their own son paid the price of suffering for trying to help people.
journeymanisnothing
Member
Our Lord didn't quote Psa.22:1 for the reason you think.Jesus spoke from His cross of His experiencing God's wrath in that moment :
Mat 27:46
"And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? "
For me there is no greater expression of God's wrath than to be forsaken by him.
And that is from the standpoint of me being a sinner .
What we are talking about here is He who knew no sin being forsaken of God .
Even when our consciousness and knowledge has been expanded beyond belief when we die and received into the realm of heaven I believe we still will never be able to fully comprehend the price that was paid in that moment by Jesus
When Jesus was in agony, some religious leaders and others mocked him. They thought God had forsaken him, so our Savior quoted that Psalm, which teaches that no matter how bad things get, God never forsakes the righteous.
Read Psa.22.
Consecrated Life
Member
For me the transaction that took place between God the Father and God the Son on Calvary was between the two of them.
No religious leader and no human eye at all was allowed to witness that moment that no human will ever be able to fully understand when God the Father turned His back on His beloved Son.
This is why complete darkness covered the earth and no human was allowed to view what took place at that moment :
"And it was about the sixth hour, and there was a darkness over all the earth until the ninth hour."
Jesus quoting the psalm only after the Father had turned away from our sin bearer in that terrible darkness. the transaction "finished" as He tasted the death that we will never, ever have too .
Thanks Be To God !
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journeymanisnothing
Member
At Calvery, what took place was between God ( Fathe/Son/Spirit) and mankind. God showing mercy toward sinners who wanted him dead. Mankind showing hatred toward God,
The kings of the earthset themselves, and the rulerstake counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, Psa.2:2, Act.4:25
Believers can and should want to know Christ in his sufferings,No religious leader and no human eye at all was allowed to witness that moment that no human will ever be able to fully understand when God the Father turned His back on His beloved Son.
This is why complete darkness covered the earth and no human was allowed to view what took place at that moment :
Luk 23:44
"And it was about the sixth hour, and there was a darkness over all the earth until the ninth hour."
That I may know him,and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings,being made conformable unto his death; Phl.3:10
Paul wanted to know how Jesus felt for loving others who wanted him dead. Peter says that when believers are persecuted for their faith in Christ,
ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; 1Pet.4:13
Scripture teaches this truth,
You will indeed drink from my cup Mt.20:23
In you our ancestors put their trust; they trusted and you delivered them. Psa.22:4
in you they trusted and were not put to shame. vs.5
will declare your name to my people; in the assembly I will praise you. vs.22
Jesus knew that whole Psalm, which predicts the suffering, caused by vss.6-18.
So again, this is all you see in Jesus' crucifixion?
You just simply do not get it.
Consecrated Life
Member
It was to pay a ransom for many , the many being us , that the transaction between the two principles on Calvary took place .
The ransom was not being paid to us , it was being paid for us and our sins .
Yes ? No?
The paying of the ransom, was between God the Father and Christ His Son.
This was the transaction that took place between the Father and the Son .
We are the beneficiaries of that transaction that took between the Father and the Son
"For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many"