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Homosexuality and Obesity?

In fact I would say if there was a target you "hit the bullseye". :D

I had a feeling I was onto something. :D

Here is some more scripture that applies.

Jeremiah 7:8-11 Behold, ye trust in lying words, that cannot profit. Will ye steal, murder, and commit adultery, and swear falsely, and burn incense unto Baal, and walk after other gods whom ye know not; And come and stand before me in this house, which is called by my name, and say, We are delivered to do all these abominations? Is this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your eyes? Behold, even I have seen it, saith the LORD.

Psalm 64:5 They encourage themselves in an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
 
Am I trying to justify the sin of homosexuality by pointing out another sin?

Well, most here even refuse to acknowledge that obesity is a sinful lifestyle that arises out of excessive indulgence and disrespecting the sanctity of the body. So, as far as I can see, I am taking the arguments used to show how one thing is a sin, and showing how something else is sinful.

When you consistently ignore the issue by saying "don't try to justify your own sin" and then consistently ignore the issue of obesity as a serious sin then you are demonstrating your own prejudice against homosexuality. Perhaps you are reluctant to condemn obesity as a sinful lifestyle that leads one on the path to hell....perhaps you think it will offend people...perhaps you have friends who are obese, or you your self are obese. Suddenly condmening obesity as such a serious sin, when we can see it everywhere, seems a little harsh...so you avoid it.

If this post was about homosexuality alone, all we would hear would be condemnations and quotes from scripture. Yet when we talk about obesity there is only one or two Christians who discuss it as a serious sin.

These are the facts: when discuss obesity as misuse of the purpose of the body and place it beside homosexuality as misuse of the purpose of the body....we get far more condemnation of homosexuality and most ignore obesity. It is beyond me how you can not see your own prejudices.
 
Well now that we know that over indulgence is a sin and homosexuality is a sin, let us discontinue these sinful practice and live according to the Word of God. Amen?
 
AHIMSA said:
These are the facts: when discuss obesity as misuse of the purpose of the body and place it beside homosexuality as misuse of the purpose of the body....we get far more condemnation of homosexuality and most ignore obesity. It is beyond me how you can not see your own prejudices.
AHIMSA is right (his being gay does not mean he cannot build a convincing case). We clearly prejudicially speak out against homosexuality as specifically contrasted with obesity. Whether speaking out is right is beside the point. The whole point of the thread, as I see it, was to show that arguments against homosexual practice can be used against obesity. Whether or not AHIMSA's goal is to justify his own behaviour is a matter of speculation for the rest of us. Only s/he and God know the truth about this.

solo said:
Well now that we know that over indulgence is a sin and homosexuality is a sin, let us discontinue these sinful practice and live according to the Word of God. Amen?
Amen
 
When you consistently ignore the issue by saying "don't try to justify your own sin" and then consistently ignore the issue of obesity as a serious sin then you are demonstrating your own prejudice against homosexuality.

It takes two to have a homosexual relationship. That right there makes it more serious than gluttony that results in obesity. Any time your sin involves leading another astray it becomes more serious. I don't know of anybody promoting obesity as natural, normal and healthy to children and society. Everyone knows obesity (from gluttony) is wrong and not good for you. But lets be more specific. A homosexual is always sinning, an obese person may have legitimate medical reasons for being obese. What is obese? Is it anything over 5% body fat? What about those who are obese because an injury has them temporarily bed ridden and they no longer exercise like they are used too. What about a pregnant mother, or a pregnant mother who just gave birth, is she sinning because she is overweight? The biggest difference is that obesity comes as a result of eating too much, but that does not make eating wrong. Homosexuality is wrong whether it is done in small doses (if that were possible), or whether it was done a lot.

Remember, sin is a matter of the heart. You can be overweight for a lot of reasons that are not sinful, but you cannot be slightly homosexual. There is no healthy dose of homosexuality that is needed to sustain life. It's always sinful, that's the difference. How do you remove the temptation of over eating? Can you stop eating? No, the temptation is always there and is very easy to fall into for many reasons. Eating the right amount of food or the right foods is an act of discipline, but you still need to eat food, with homosexuality you know before you even begin that it's wrong.
 
All of this silly 'back slapping' when it appears that an individual has scored a point with an 'appropriate' Bible text or 'reasoning' that condemns.

Do any of you folks realize that one's sexual orientation is NOT an issue that can be 'resolved' with the scriptures? Until you DO realize this, then you're beating a dead horse. Is there ANYONE out there who might care to acknowledge that one's sexual orientation just MAY not be of their own making?

AHIMSA ...do we have your particular profile on your specific sexual orientation? How far back did you feel 'different'? How did it affect your life? Would you care to share this with others on this thread who just MIGHT put their Bibles down long enough to listen?
 
Dave... said:
I don't know of anybody promoting obesity as natural, normal and healthy to children and society. Everyone knows obesity (from gluttony) is wrong and not good for you.
Very true! And it is no doubt an obvious cause of the *obsession* with the sin of homosexuality. Now, I use the word *obsession* because many go to extremes when dealing with homosexuality.

Dave... said:
Eating the right amount of food or the right foods is an act of discipline, but you still need to eat food, with homosexuality you know before you even begin that it's wrong.
True, however; with both if one relies on Jesus Christ they can overcome both sins.

SputnikBoy said:
Do any of you folks realize that one's sexual orientation is NOT an issue that can be 'resolved' with the scriptures?
Scripture can lead on to the truth but Only God can deal with the issue. God must be allowed to work in a person to conquer a particular sin.

SputnikBoy said:
Is there ANYONE out there who might care to acknowledge that one's sexual orientation just MAY not be of their own making?
If you are insinuated that one is born (genetically predisposed) with the homosexual orientation then I would have to say two things to that:
1) No acknowledgement can be made since there is no conclusive scientific evidence to support the theory that one is born a homosexual.
2) Even if one were born a homosexual that would only provide more proof that the original sin of Adam effects all future generations.

Whither case 1 or 2 is the reality only God can deal with sin. If one trusts in God to deal with a particular sin they can overcome that sin no matter the original cause of it (be it genetic predisposition or choice).
 
SputnikBoy said:
Do any of you folks realize that one's sexual orientation is NOT an issue that can be 'resolved' with the scriptures? Until you DO realize this, then you're beating a dead horse. Is there ANYONE out there who might care to acknowledge that one's sexual orientation just MAY not be of their own making?

One's sexual orientation can be resolved by our Lord Jesus Christ (NOT Scripture).

My understanding is that there is no undisputed scientific evidence to support the premise that homosexuality is genetic. It is most likely a learned behavior.

Even if there was an inherited tendency towards homosexuality, that would not justify the homosexual act. I may have inherited a tendency towards alcohol abuse. It does not mean that I can justify my alcoholism because of that.

The Bible is very clear. We all inherit a tendency to sin (Psalm 51:4 Ephesians 2:3) but we are responsible for sinning.

Ideas from "Christian Ethics" - Norman Geisler

:)
 
"Obesity is one and being wealthy is another."

That is silly. God would like to see us wealthy, so as we do not let it corrupt us. Do you not know there were many wealthy characters of the bible who walked before the Lord and God did bless them to be wealthy. As far as obesity, I disagree and I believe God would not condemn anybody for over eating or being obese. Obesity is just the same as a man who works hard physically and if I put a lot of stress on my body each day working and destroys it in the long term, do you think God will condemn me for that? I think not. If physical labor is in my line of work, should I just quit my job? Last time I checked in the bible, if I did that I would be just as worse as an infidel. I am sure the bible refers to other ways of destroying the body, but over eating or being obese?

How can you even compare homosexuality with obesity? For one is a sin, the other is not.
 
well Im a solid 350 lbs but that doesnt stop me from living.

Obesitty can be genetic and I blieve this holds true in my case.

I am going to diet starting Jan 1
 
Most men are capable of having relationships with multiple partners.

A case could be made by an adulterer that "God made him that way" and being promiscuous is "his orientation" and he can't help himself.

I don't buy that nor the excuse homo's use either.

Having sex outside of marriage is a sin. Men with other men is a gross and unnatural sin.

Eating is not a sin. Overeating to an extreme is gluttony and it is a sin. Being overweight is not a sin.


I know lots of skinny people who eat way too much.

We all eat food and all of us it more than is necessary to survive.


There is no amount of homosexual perversion that is acceptable.

It is condemned by God and there is no excuse for defending the practice.

That is the way it is from a biblical perspective.

I am not going to apologise for telling it like it is.

Hebrews 13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.

And no, marriage is not between two men or two women.

Mark 10:7 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;

Jesus did not say for this cause shall a man leave his two parents and cleave to his boy friend.

And by the way... it is against the TOS to promote homosexual behaviour in this Christian forum and the subject is not up for debate.

Rule 15: No promoting any sinful behavior (Homosexual behavior, Lying, stealing, murder....etc.) Galatians 5:19-21

This is a Christian forum, and we go by what the bible says. The Bible clearly states sexual relations between people of the same gender are an abomination unto God.

Leviticus 20:13, Romans 1:26-27and Jude 1:7-8

If you have a problem with that you need to take it up with God.
While on this site show respect for God and our savior Jesus Christ.
 
bibleberean said:
And by the way... it is against the TOS to promote homosexual behaviour in this Christian forum and the subject is not up for debate. [....] If you have a problem with that you need to take it up with God.
While on this site show respect for God and our savior Jesus Christ.
True. At this point, however; I don't see anyone flat-out promoting homosexuality. One thing is for certain, some interesting points are being brought up and all of us Christians should take a step back and consider what has been discussed thus far and then pray about it.

So far I have come to the following conclusion:
Homosexuality is a sin that must be dealt with in a loving uplifting manner. Obesity is not really a sin so to speak but over eating is most certainly one. In any event, be it homosexuality or over eating both sins must and should (according to scripture) be dealt with in a loving and uplifting manner.
 
"Obesity is not really a sin so to speak but over eating is most certainly one."

We all agree on homosexuality a sin, but why is over eating(gluttony) a sin? Please explain? Over eating certainly does not mean you are destroying the body, what is the sinful part about it than?
 
No where have I claimed that the homosexual lifestyle and the obese lifestyle are the same. However, certain elements that determine homosexuality as a sinful lifestyle can be applied to obesity, so that it can be determined that obesity is indeed a serious sin, though perhaps not as serious as homosexuality…that is if one is in the business of determining one sin to be more serious than another.

Dave, I’m going to analyze where your argument fails:

Are people promoting obesity as natural? Not in the same sense as homosexuality, but whether or not people promote has no bearing on whether or not it is sinful. Secondly, there is general acceptance of obesity, while we may think in our minds “that person would benefit from losing weightâ€Â, we generally don’t point out that a person is “fatâ€Â, laws prevent one from discriminating against a person who is obese, for example, in the workplace, we don’t have people protesting their funerals, telling them they’re going to hell ect. In general, obesity is not seen as a sinful lifestyle…just unfortunate.

an obese person may have legitimate medical reasons for being obese

While this is true, it is very rare. Secondly, how often have I heard “If homosexuality is genetic, it does not change anything, sin is a sin†?

In addition, the sin of obesity does not so much lie in the state of being obese, but in the actions that lead one to that state, which are generally over eating, eating the wrong foods, lack of exercise, lack of caring for one’s body.

What is obese? Is it anything over 5% body fat? What about those who are obese because an injury has them temporarily bed ridden and they no longer exercise like they are used too. What about a pregnant mother, or a pregnant mother who just gave birth, is she sinning because she is overweight?

This is from the American Obesity Association: Some researchers refer to the 95th percentile as overweight and other as obesity. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), which provides national statistical data for weight status of American youth, avoids using the word "obesity," and identifies every child and adolescent above the 85th percentile as "overweight."

Christians are called to respect their bodies and treat them as vessels of the holy spirit. Obesity demonstrates an unbalance in one’s life, and is a generally unhealthy state. For a mother to gain weight while pregnant is perfectly natural and does not demonstrate an unbalance., in fact it is healthy for the child and the pregnancy. A little bit indulgence is certainly permitted by God, however, it is when we over-indulge that we are sinning. And obesity is certainly over indulging.

Obesity is described as an ‘epidemic’ in North America because of its numerous health affects. Again, I do not see how you can say this is not wrong. Most people are obese as a result of their choices, their choices lead them to an unhealthy and damaging state. Obesity leads to:

Asthma
o Prevalence of overweight is reported to be significantly higher in children and adolescents with moderate to severe asthma compared to a peer group.
Diabetes (Type 2)
o Type 2 diabetes in children and adolescents has increased dramatically in a short period. The parallel increase of obesity in children and adolescents is reported to be the most significant factor for the rise in diabetes.
o Type 2 diabetes accounted for 2 to 4 percent of all childhood diabetes before 1992, but skyrocketed to 16 percent by 1994.
o Obese children and adolescents are reported to be 12.6 times more likely than non-obese to have high fasting blood insulin levels, a risk factor for type 2 diabetes.
o Type 2 diabetes is predominant among African American and Hispanic youngsters, with a particularly high rate among those of Mexican descent.
Hypertension
o Persistently elevated blood pressure levels have been found to occur about 9 times more frequently among obese children and adolescents (ages 5 to 18) than in non-obese.
o Obese children and adolescents are reported to be 2.4 times more likely to have high diastolic blood pressure and 4.5 times more likely to have high systolic blood pressure than their non-obese peers.
Orthopedic Complications
o Among growing youth, bone and cartilage in the process of development are not strong enough to bear excess weight. As a result, a variety of orthopedic complications occur in children and adolescents with obesity. In young children, excess weight can lead to bowing and overgrowth of leg bones.
o Increased weight on the growth plate of the hip can cause pain and limit range of motion. Between 30 to 50 percent of children with this condition are overweight.
Psychosocial Effects & Stigma
o Overweight children are often taller than the non-overweight.
o White girls, who develop a negative body image, are at a greater risk for the subsequent development of eating disorders.
o Adolescent females who are overweight have reported experiences with stigmatization such as direct and intentional weight-related teasing, jokes and derogatory name calling, as well as less intentional, potentially hurtful comments by peers, family members, employers and strangers.
o Overweight children and adolescents report negative assumptions made about them by others, including being inactive or lazy, being strong and tougher than others, not having feelings, and being unclean.
Sleep Apnea
o Sleep apnea, the absence of breathing during sleep, occurs in about 7 percent of children with obesity. Deficits in logical thinking are common in children with obesity and sleep apnea.

Lastly you said homosexuality is a sin, but
eating the right amount of food is an act of discipline
You don’t think that God asks us to be disciplined? You don’t think that, to the homosexual, refraining from sex is an act of discipline? Does God ask us to be disciplined and respect the body that he gave us?

Look at this: Disability programs assist individuals who cannot engage in their usual employment because of their health.

Social Security Disability
If you are obese, you may be entitled to disability payments from the Social Security Administration (SSA). According to the SSA, $77 million are paid monthly to approximately 137,000 persons who met obesity requirements for disability under criteria used prior to May 15, 2000, when a new policy was issued. Most of the people who qualified for benefits under the old policy claimed to have muscle or skeletal complications.

Considering that obesity is a lifestyle choice for the majority, how is this justified?
http://www.obesity.org/subs/fastfacts/o ... outh.shtml
 
What a crock of undescribable matter too filthy to discuss on this forum. Homosexuality is very, very sick, and to want to continue in such a lifestyle of bondage shows the degenerate position of those that continue practicing it. What a crying shame that those that are practicing homosexuality are more intent on pleasure than they are concerned at pleasing God.
I'm not trying to start a "fight", but i'd like to just point some things out:

-You say it (Homosexuality) is "very, very sick",
but as a sin, can it be any more "sicker" than any other sin?

-Many people believe that because homosexual acts do not result in procreation (which obviously is correct)
and so you come to the result that homosexuals are people who only commit these acts out of pure lust -
Does a homosexual who doesn't practice homosexual acts (sodomy etc..)
still practice out of pleasure though?

Edited: clearing up possible promotion of homosexuality
 
Homosexual behaviour is an abomination in God's sight.

It is not the only vile sin in the world but it is a very sick sin.

There is nothing good about it.

I have come to this conclusion.

There are two ways to approach any sin.

We can look at sins we commit or other's commit and repent and help others to repent or we can make excuses.

Jesus gave us this sign to watch for before His coming.

Luke 17:26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.

Luke 17:27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.

Luke 17:28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;

Luke 17:29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

Luke 17:30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

No amount of diversion and excuse making is going to diminish the fact that homosexual behaviour is evil in the sight of God.

Here is an "uplifiting" word.

Whatever sin we are commiting needs to be repented of whether it is drunkeness, idolatry or fornication.

Repent!


Ephesians 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
 
J6o7h8n3 said:
"Obesity is one and being wealthy is another."

That is silly. God would like to see us wealthy, so as we do not let it corrupt us.
Perhaps you will consider reading the following thread:

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=15592

and evaluating arguments for and against whether wealth is sinful.

J6o7h8n3 said:
Obesity is just the same as a man who works hard physically and if I put a lot of stress on my body each day working and destroys it in the long term, do you think God will condemn me for that?
I just do not see this argument - work for God's Kingdom that wears out the body is legitimate self-sacrifice. Over-indulging in the lust for food that produces obesity (in the vast majority of cases, I would assert) is completely different.

J6o7h8n3 said:
How can you even compare homosexuality with obesity? For one is a sin, the other is not.
The reason why obesity is not considered a sin has everything to do with the unsophisticated thinking that underlies much of North American fundamentalism. If there is no one verse that says obesity is a sin, we think its OK. I think it just takes a little thinking, just a little really, to come to the conclusion that obesity is indeed sinful. But we do not want to do that thinking- we look for "one-liners".
 
I think Drew has hit the nail on the head in regards to the mentality of fundamentalism. What is sought in fundamentalism is essentially an easy way out. We look for those "one-liners" to circumvent any serious reflection and contemplation. Scripture becomes a handbook for judgement.

What I also think underscores this mentality, as can be clearly seen in this forum, is a need to be divisive. Many fundamentalists don't know any gay people, or do not take the time to get to know them. It's an "us" v.s "them" scenario, so its easy to condmen, to judge and to elevate homosexuality as the most terrible sin of them all. Yet when it comes to obesity these divisive lines are not so clearly drawn. Perhaps you have obese people at your church, in your bible group, perhaps its you. Suddenly its not so clear as us" v.s "them" because its become personal, it hits home.
 
Homosexuality needs to be repented of and so does gross over-eating.

Being over weight is not necessarily a sin but could be the result of sin.

Practicing sexual perversion with the same sex is always a sin and that cannot ever be said enough.

Everyone eats more than enough to survive...

Any homosexual perversion it too much...

Hebrews 13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.

Yep, that is the way it is...
 
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