How do we respond to jews who believe messiah hasn't come?

[einstein]

nazarene

Oh, I get it. When Matthew mistranslates from a SINGLE prophet-that's a prophecy, but when he says "SPOKEN" by the PLURAL prophets (despite the fact that not one of them says this)- that's a "summation statement". And a neutral observer is supposed to believe and accept this? :roll:

 

[Guest]

So Matthew can use prophecies that can be figuratively speaking? What about Matthews geneology with the curse of Jeconiah in the middle? The tanach is clear that messiah will be a direct descandent of David and Solomon.
And when your days (David) are fulfilled, and you shall sleep with your fathers, I will set up your seed after you, who shall issue from your bowels, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build a house for my name, and I will make firm the throne of his kingdom forever..."
(2 Samuel 7:12 - 13)

Lukes geneology doesn't even count because it went through Nathan not Solomon. Matthew also claims to have 42 generations in all, count them, because it doesn't come to 42 no way no how.

The prophecy from
Matthew 2:15 out of egypt I called my son
Hosea 11:1 this verse speaks of the nation of Israel being called out by God after the Exodus, anything else is twisting scripture. If you can take verses out of context and apply them to NT writings then whats the difference when Mormons use Ezekiel 37 to say that this speaks of the book of mormon, when islam uses Moses verse of Duet 18:15 and says it speaks of Mohammed not Jesus. They use similarities between Mohammed and Moses that are similar than Jesus and Moses. They were both prophets, both had a mom and dad, both died and didn't raise from the dead, both married, both had children, and on and on it goes.

Matthew 2:23, once again now we can use figurative speaking in this prophecy, it can't go both ways, you cant use some verses figuratively and some literally, this is scripture twisting.

Matt 11:14 And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.(see also Mark 9:13)
John 1:21 And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not.

once again, was he or was he not?, but once again the claim is he was but not the Elijah that was taken to heaven. This speaks figuratively right?

The temptation of Jesus, why would Satan, if he knew Jesus was fully God ever tempt him. Satan of all people knows that God can not choose evil, this story just doesn't make sense Why would satan waste his time.

All the miracles, healings, feeding the thousands, raising the dead, and the other things Jesus did. Why is there not one single recorded writing about Jesus from anyone of the era, all that is found is writings of Josephus that many scholars agree arefraudulentt words added to bolster Jesus as the Christ. Josephus has writings about Herod, Pilate, John the baptist, the jewish war. Not one mention of Jesus, if jesus was as the new testament desrcibes him, wouldn't he be the talk of the century. This is a big void in chchristainitya guy who raised himself from the dead, but no recorded evidence. The NT wouldn't count, because it has a bbias plus all religions have thee own twist on what happened, look at Islam and Mormonism. Since the time of Christ, have there been any miracles like the ones done by jesus and some of the christians in acts? If these things hhappended wouldn't they be recorded, people being healed, raised from the dead even in the book of Acts, which was written maybe 60 A.D.

The Beatitudes, there are some incredible saying in this message, but I guess these count as figurative, not literal.

Thats all for now, I will post more, but I have a hard time when really examining the NT.

 

[Gary]

I was a born again christian since 1996, but are you hypocrite christians going to say that I was never truly born again? I was , once saved always saved is the biggest joke of the 20 and 21 century, all these pastors want is to sucker you in and depend on them and thee words for heaven and take your money, do you really think churches need to build million dollar buildings, or 30+ million dollar churches?

Then you look at the christian leaders for this day, dobson, robertson, these guys are the biggest judgemental fools around, if jesus does come back, he is the one that he would treat like the pharisees when he came in the 1 st century. They just want to tell everybody how to live there lives, what they and there family should watch, what they should buy, eat, and etc.... Last I checked god gave us free will, then why are these hyprocites judging the world and acting like they are so moral. They make me sick.

Oh I see... nothing judgmental in your comments above?

You ORIGINALLY said:

The purpose is not to disparage other religions, but rather to clarify the Jewish position.

Are your comments above not disparaging towards Christianity?

So DavidDavid, are you really a Jew?

..... or do you just plagiarize for fun from a Jewish site? (jewsforjudaism)
http://www.jewsforjudaism.org/web/handb ... uting.html

Gary I am a born again Christian, I have studied other religions and came across judaism, it is the only other religion that poses many objections to christainity that I cant just ignore, I am searching for what is true, but the jewish faith is the foundation of the christainity, so we must go the old testament and read about who God is, befoe we touch the new testament. The more I study judiasm, I dont see christainity at all, I see alot of so called prophecies taken out of context from a greek version of the hebrew bible to fulfill them in the NT. Matthew claims many of them. the book of matthew says that jews from the grave walked around after christs ressurection, but this is not mentioned aywhere in world recorded history, an event like this is amazing, why is it not recorded or talked about anywhere?

If you think Judaism is the truth, why have you not become a Jew? You quote/plagiarize their websites, you believe what they say.

Why not convert?

... and why did you lie? You originally claimed:

The purpose is not to disparage other religions, but rather to clarify the Jewish position.

Yeah right! We trust you on this one.....

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 837#196837

:-?

 

[Gary]

DavidDavid: All the miracles, healings, feeding the thousands, raising the dead, and the other things Jesus did. Why is there not one single recorded writing about Jesus from anyone of the era...

Gary: There is. It is called the New Testament.

DavidDavid: ....all that is found is writings of Josephus that many scholars agree are fraudulentt(sic) words added to bolster Jesus as the Christ. Josephus has writings about Herod, Pilate, John the baptist, the jewish war. Not one mention of Jesus....

Gary: Wrong again.

Jesus (A18:63) – AD33
At this time there was a wise man called Jesus, and his conduct was good, and he was known to be virtuous. Many people among the Jews and the other nations became his disciples. Pilate condemned him to be crucified and to die. But those who had become his disciples did not abandon his discipleship. They reported that he had appeared to them three days after his crucifixion and that he was alive. Accordingly, he was perhaps the Messiah, concerning whom the prophets have reported wonders. And the tribe of the Christians, so named after him, has not disappeared to this day.

Jesus’ Brother James (A20:197-200 W2:272) – AD64
Having such a character, Ananus thought that with Festus dead and Albinus still on the way he would have the proper opportunity. Convening the judges of the Sanhedrin, he brought before them the brother of Jesus who was called the Christ, whose name was James, and certain others. He accused them of having transgressed the law and delivered them up to be stoned. But those of the city residents who were deemed the most fair-minded and who were strict in observing the law were offended at this. Accordingly, they secretly contacted the king [Agrippa II], urging him to order Ananus to desist from any more such actions, for he had not been justified in what he had already done. Some of them even went to meet Albinus, who was on his way from Alexandria, and informed him that Ananus had no authority to convene the Sanhedrin without his consent. Convinced by these words, Albinus wrote in anger to Ananus, threatening him with punishment. And King Agrippa, because of this, deposed him from the high priesthood, in which he had ruled for three months, and replaced him with Jesus, the son of Damnaeus.

• Source: Paul Maier
  http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/ch ... sephus.htm

• Plus you may want to consider this:
  
  Confirmation of Jesus in non-Christian Sources
  http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/je ... istian.htm
  
  Evidence for the Resurrection
  http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/je ... idence.htm
  
  Resurrection – Order of Events
  http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/je ... -order.htm
  
  The Reliability of the Secular References to Jesus
  http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/jesus/secular.htm

DavidDavid: ....if jesus was as the new testament desrcibes(sic) him, wouldn't he be the talk of the century. This is a big void in chchristainity(sic), a guy who raised himself from the dead, but no recorded evidence.

Gary: There is. It is called the New Testament. Plus the evidence of thousands and thousands of Christians ... 3000 of whom converted on the day on Pentecost. Christianity itself is the evidence. The first Christians were converted Jews! How else would you explain the rise of Christianity? I won't hold my breadth.

DavidDavid: The NT wouldn't count, because it has a bias....

Gary: So apart from the evidence... you want evidence!

DavidDavid: ...plus all religions have thee(sic) own twist on what happened....

Gary: Have you studied Islam? What other religions have a twist on the death and resurrection of Jesus?

:roll:

 

[Guest]

DavidDavid wrote:
The purpose is not to disparage other religions, but rather to clarify the Jewish position.

I never wrote that................this is a lie
DavidDavid: All the miracles, healings, feeding the thousands, raising the dead, and the other things Jesus did. Why is there not one single recorded writing about Jesus from anyone of the era...

Gary: There is. It is called the New Testament.

again this is a biased writing, again with all the miracles there has to be other writings agreeing with this. The mormons wrote garbage in thee book, is it true? the Muslims wrote garbage in there book, is it true
? You have to go to other sources to back it up, the NT was written by people who wanted this story out.
DavidDavid: ....all that is found is writings of Josephus that many scholars agree are fraudulentt(sic) words added to bolster Jesus as the Christ. Josephus has writings about Herod, Pilate, John the baptist, the jewish war. Not one mention of Jesus....

Gary: Wrong again.

Josephus wrote:
Jesus (A18:63) – AD33
At this time there was a wise man called Jesus, and his conduct was good, and he was known to be virtuous. Many people among the Jews and the other nations became his disciples. Pilate condemned him to be crucified and to die. But those who had become his disciples did not abandon his discipleship. They reported that he had appeared to them three days after his crucifixion and that he was alive. Accordingly, he was perhaps the Messiah, concerning whom the prophets have reported wonders. And the tribe of the Christians, so named after him, has not disappeared to this day.

Josephus wrote:
Jesus’ Brother James (A20:197-200 W2:272) – AD64
Having such a character, Ananus thought that with Festus dead and Albinus still on the way he would have the proper opportunity. Convening the judges of the Sanhedrin, he brought before them the brother of Jesus who was called the Christ, whose name was James, and certain others. He accused them of having transgressed the law and delivered them up to be stoned. But those of the city residents who were deemed the most fair-minded and who were strict in observing the law were offended at this. Accordingly, they secretly contacted the king [Agrippa II], urging him to order Ananus to desist from any more such actions, for he had not been justified in what he had already done. Some of them even went to meet Albinus, who was on his way from Alexandria, and informed him that Ananus had no authority to convene the Sanhedrin without his consent. Convinced by these words, Albinus wrote in anger to Ananus, threatening him with punishment. And King Agrippa, because of this, deposed him from the high priesthood, in which he had ruled for three months, and replaced him with Jesus, the son of Damnaeus.


Source: Paul Maier
http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/ch ... sephus.htm
Plus you may want to consider this:

Confirmation of Jesus in non-Christian Sources
http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/je ... istian.htm

here is a non biased website on tacitus letter about christ.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tacitus_on_Jesus
Evidence for the Resurrection
http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/je ... idence.htm

Resurrection – Order of Events
http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/je ... -order.htm

The Reliability of the Secular References to Jesus
http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/jesus/secular.htm

Here is a non biased website talking about the Josephes writings...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus_on_Jesus
DavidDavid: ....if jesus was as the new testament desrcibes him, wouldn't he be the talk of the century. This is a big void in chchristainity, a guy who raised himself from the dead, but no recorded evidence.

Gary: There is. It is called the New Testament. Plus the evidence of thousands and thousands of Christians ... 3000 of whom converted on the day on Pentecost. Christianity itself is the evidence. The first Christians were converted Jews! How else would you explain the rise of Christianity? I won't hold my breadth.

the new testament needs other writings to support it. They are copied manuscrpits of manuscripts for over a 200 year period. Do you really believe that are original and untouched, I know by faith you want to beleive, but you need more evidence if you are really going to search for the truth. If I told you something and all the proof I had was someone's biased writings that have been copied for 200 years without any other proof, would you believe in Mormonism? As far as the other writings mentioning christ, these were not contempories, they just wrote what story was being passed around.
DavidDavid: The NT wouldn't count, because it has a bias plus all religions have there own twist on what happened....

Gary: So apart from the evidence... you want evidence!

Is everything I wrote about christains a lie? read that again and point out whats wrong. Lets face it, many christains give the religion of christainity a bad name. Look at all the persecution that christains have done to Jews in the name of Jesus
http://www.religioustolerance.org/jud_pers1.htm
http://www.religioustolerance.org/jud_pers3.htm
http://www.religioustolerance.org/jud_pers2.htm
also answer the objections stated above in the part of the book of matthew alone. Dont turn this into trying to put me down or call me ajew or telling me to just become jewish. I have legitimate questions that cant be ignored.

 

[Gary]

DavidDavid wrote: The purpose is not to disparage other religions, but rather to clarify the Jewish position.

DavidDavid now claims: I never wrote that................this is a lie

Gary: OK, let us analyse it again. Please go to the FIRST post you made. Read it again. You said (or in your plagiarism you failed to notice that it claimed):

It is important to understand why Jews don't believe in Jesus. The purpose is not to disparage other religions, but rather to clarify the Jewish position. The more data that's available, the better-informed choices people can make about their spiritual path.

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 1fd#196587

:

 

[Gary]

DavidDavid: ....if jesus was as the new testament desrcibes(sic) him, wouldn't he be the talk of the century?

Gary: He was and He still is, 2000 years later. Even you cannot stop trying to disprove Jesus! Plus we have the evidence of thousands and thousands of Christians ... 3000 of whom converted on the day on Pentecost. Christianity itself is the evidence. The first Christians were converted Jews! How else would you explain the rise of Christianity? I won't hold my breadth.

The first Christians were all ex-Jews.

Read Acts 2:1-47. Who were the first 3000 people converted? They were Jews.

Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven. Acts 2:5

Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day. Acts 2:41

Every day they continued to meet together in the temple courts. They broke bread in their homes and ate together with glad and sincere hearts, praising God and enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved. Acts 2:46-47

DavidDavid: the new testament needs other writings to support it. They are copied manuscripts of manuscripts for over a 200 year period. Do you really believe that are original and untouched, I know by faith you want to belive, but you need more evidence if you are really going to search for the truth. If I told you something and all the proof I had was someone's biased writings that have been copied for 200 years without any other proof, would you believe in Mormonism? As far as the other writings mentioning christ, these were not contempories(sic), they just wrote what story was being passed around.

Gary: Read and learn....

The primary sources for the life of Christ are the four Gospels. However, there are considerable reports from non-Christian sources that supplement and confirm the Gospel accounts. These come largely from Greek, Roman, Jewish, and Samaritan sources of the first century.

In brief they inform us that: (1) Jesus was from Nazareth; (2) he lived a wise and virtuous life; (3) he was crucified in Palestine under Pontius Pilate during the reign of Tiberius Caesar at Passover time, being considered the Jewish king; (4) he was believed by his disciples to have been raised from the dead three days later; (5) his enemies acknowledged that he performed unusual feats they called “sorceryâ€Â; (6) his small band of disciples multiplied rapidly, spreading even as far as Rome; (7) his disciples denied polytheism, lived moral lives, and worshiped Christ as Divine. This picture confirms the view of Christ presented in the New Testament Gospels.

http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/je ... istian.htm

 

[Solo]

It is beginning to become clearer and clearer to me why God will judge each of us to choose our own eternity. Those that believe God will live in one eternity, and those that do not believe God will live in yet another.

Praise God for his righteousness, love, grace, and justice.

31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true. 32 There is another that beareth witness of me; and I know that the witness which he witnesseth of me is true. 33 Ye sent unto John, and he bare witness unto the truth. 34 But I receive not testimony from man: but these things I say, that ye might be saved. 35 He was a burning and a shining light: and ye were willing for a season to rejoice in his light. 36 But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me. 37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. 38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not. 39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. 41 I receive not honour from men. 42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. 43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. 44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? 45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words? John 5:31-47

For those that are not blinded to the truth of God................


Over 300 Messianic Prophecies


Gen. 3:15.....He will bruise Satan's head.....Heb. 2:14, 1 Jn. 3:18
Gen. 9:26,27...The God of Shem will be the Son of Shem...Lu. 3:36
Gen. 12:3...As Abraham's seed,will bless all nations...Acts. 3:25,26
Gen. 12:7...The Promise made to Abraham's Seed...Gal. 3:16
Gen. 14:18...A priest after Melchizedek...Heb. 6:20
Gen. 14:18........A King also........Heb. 7:2
Gen. 14:18...The Last Supper foreshadowed...Mt. 26:26-29
Gen. 17:19.......The Seed of Isaac.......Rom. 9:7
Gen. 22:8...The Lamb of God promised...Jn. 1:29
Gen. 22:18...As Isaac's seed, will bless all nations...Gal. 3:16
Gen.26:2-5..The Seed of Isaac promised as the Redeemer..Heb.11:18
Gen. 49:10...The time of His coming...Lu. 2:1-7; Gal. 4:4
Gen. 49:10.......The Seed of Judah.......Lu. 3:33
Gen. 49:10......Called Shiloh or One Sent......Jn. 17:3
Gen. 49:10...To come before Judah lost identity...Jn. 11:47-52
Gen. 49:10...To Him shall the obedience of the people be...Jn. 10:16
Ex. 3:13,14........The Great "I Am".......Jn. 4:26
Ex. 12:5...A Lamb without blemish...1 Pet. 1:19
Ex. 12:13...The blood of the Lamb saves from wrath...Rom. 5:8
Ex. 12:21-27...Christ is our Passover...1 Cor. 5;7
Ex. 12:46...Not a bone of the Lamb to be broken...Jn. 19:31-36
Ex. 15:2...His exaltation predicted as Yeshua...Acts 7:55,56
Ex. 15:11...His Character-Holiness...Luke 1:35; Acts 4:27
Ex. 17:6...The Spiritual Rock of Israel...1 Cor. 10;4
Ex. 33:19...His Character-Merciful...Lu. 1:72
Lev.14:11..The leper cleansed-Sign to priesthood..Lu.5:12-14; Acts 6:7
Lev.16:15-17...Prefigures Christ's once-for-all death...Heb. 9:7-14
Lev.16:27...Suffering outside the Camp...Mt. 27:33; Heb. 13:11, 12
Lev.17:11...The Blood-the life of the flesh...Mt. 26;28; Mk. 10:45
Lev.17:11...It is the blood that makes atonement...1 Jn. 3:14-18
Lev.23:36-37...The Drink-offering: "If any man thirst." ..Jn. 19:31-36
Num. 9:12...Not a bone of Him broken...John 19:31-36
Num. 21:9...The serpent on a pole-Christ lifted up...Jn. 3:14-18
Num. 24:17...Time: "I shall see him, but not now."...Gal. 4:4
Deut. 18:15..."This is of a truth that prophet."...Jn. 6:14
Deut. 18:15-16..."Had ye believed Moses, ye would believe me."...Jn. 5:45-47
Deut. 18:18...Sent by the Father to speak His word...Jn. 8:28, 29
Deut. 18:19...Whoever will not hear must bear his sin...Jn. 12:15,
Deut. 21:23...Cursed is he that hangs on a tree...Gal. 3:10-13
Ruth 4:4-9...Christ, our kinsman, has redeemed us...Eph. 1:3-7
1 Sam. 2:10...Shall be an anointed King to the Lord...Mt. 28:18; Jn. 12:15
2 Sam. 7:12...David's Seed...Mt. 1:1
2 Sam. 7:14a...The Son of God... Lu. 1:32
2 Sam. 7:16...David's house established forever...Lu. 3:31; Rev. 22:16
2 Ki. 2:11...The bodily ascension to heaven illustrated...Lu. 24:51
1 Chr. 17:11...David's Seed...Mt. 1:1; 9:27
1 Chr. 17:12, 13a...To reign on David's throne forever...Lu. 1:32, 33
1 Chr. 17:13a..."I will be His Father, He...my Son."...Heb. 1:5
Job 19:23-27...The Resurrection predicted...Jn. 5:24-29
Psa. 2:1-3...The enmity of kings foreordained...Acts 4:25-28
Psa. 2:2...To own the title, Anointed (Christ)...Acts 2:36
Ps. 2:6...His Character-Holiness...Jn. 8:46; Rev. 3:7
Ps. 2:6...To own the title King...Mt. 2:2
Ps. 2:7...Declared the Beloved Son...Mt. 3;17
Psa. 2:7, 8...The Crucifixion and Resurrection intimated...Acts 13:29-33
Psa. 2:12...Life comes through faith in Him...Jn. 20:31
Psa. 8:2...The mouths of babes perfect His praise...Mt. 21:16
Psa. 8:5, 6...His humiliation and exaltation...Lu. 24:50-53; 1 Cor. 15:27
Psa. 16:10...Was not to see corruption...Acts 2:31
Psa. 16:9-11...Was to arise from the dead...Jn. 20:9
Psa. 17;15...The resurrection predicted...Lu. 24:6
Psa. 22:1...Forsaken because of sins of others...2 Cor. 5:21
Psa. 22:1...Words spoken from Calvary, "My God..." Mk. 15:34
Psa. 22:2...Darkness upon Calvary...Mt. 27:45
Psa. 22:7...They shoot out the lip and shake the head...Mt. 27:39
Psa. 22:8.."He trusted in God, let Him deliver Him"...Mt. 27:43
Psa. 22:9......Born the Saviour......Lu. 2:7
Psa. 22:14...Died of a broken (ruptured)heart...Jn. 19:34
Psa. 22:14,15...Suffered agony on Calvary...Mk. 15:34-37
Psa. 22:15........He thirsted........Jn. 19:28
Psa. 22:16...They pierced His hands and His feet....Jn. 19:34,37;20:27
Psa. 22:17,18...Stripped Him before the stares of men...Lu. 23:34,35
Psa. 22:18.....They parted His garments.....Jn. 19:23,24
Psa. 22:20,21...He committed Himself to God...Lu.23:46
Psa. 22:20,21..Satanic power bruising the Redeemer's heel..Heb. 2:14
Psa. 22:22.....His Resurrection declared.....Jn. 20:17
Psa. 22:27...He shall be the governor of the nations...Col 1:16
Psa. 22:31......"It is finished"......Jn. 19:30
Psa. 23:1...."I am the Good Shephard"....Jn. 10:11
Psa. 24:3......His exaltation predicted......Acts 1:11; Phil. 2:9
Psa. 30:3......His resurrection predicted......Acts 2:32
Psa. 31:5..."Into thy hands I commit my spirit"...Lu. 23:46
Psa. 31:11...His acquaintances fled from Him...Mk. 14:50
Psa. 31:13...They took counsel to put Him to death...Jn. 11:53
Psa. 31:14,15..." He trusted in God, let Him deliver him"...Mt. 27:43
Psa. 34:20.....Not a bone of Him broken.....Jn 19:31-36
Psa. 35:11....False witnesses rose up against Him....Mt. 26:59
Psa. 35:19...He was hated without a cause...Jn. 15:25
Psa. 38:11.....His friends stood afar off.....Lu. 23:49
Psa. 40:2-5...The joy of His resurrection predicted...Jn. 20:20
Psa. 40:6-8....His delight-the will of the Father....Jn. 4:34
Psa. 40:9....He was to preach the Righteousness in Israel....Mt. 4:17
Psa. 40:14...Confronted by adversaries in the Garden...Jn. 18:4-6
Psa. 41:9.....Betrayed by a familiar friend.....Jn. 13:18
Psa. 45:2...Words of Grace come from His lips...Lu. 4:22
Psa. 45:6...To own the title, God or Elohim...Heb. 1:8
Psa. 45:7...A special anointing by the Holy Spirit...Mt.3:16; Heb.1:9
Psa. 45:7,8...Called the Christ (Messiah or Anointed)...Lu. 2:11
Psa. 55:12-14...Betrayed by a friend, not an enemy...Jn. 13:18
Psa. 55:15...Unrepentant death of the Betrayer...Mt. 27:3-5; Acts 1:16-19
Psa. 68:18...To give gifts to men...Eph. 4:7-16
Psa. 68:18...Ascended into Heaven...Lu. 24:51
Psa. 69:4...Hated without a cause...Jn. 15:25
Psa. 69:8...A stranger to own brethren...Lu. 8;20,21
Psa. 69:9...Zealous for the Lord's House...Jn. 2:17
Psa. 69:14-20...Messiah's anguish of soul before crucifixion...Mt. 26:36-45
Psa. 69:20..."My soul is exceeding sorrowful."...Mt. 26:38
Psa. 69:21...Given vinegar in thirst...Mt. 27:34
Psa. 69:26...The Saviour given and smitten by God...Jn. 17:4; 18:11
Psa. 72:10,11...Great persons were to visit Him...Mt. 2:1-11
Psa. 72:16...The corn of wheat to fall into the Ground...Jn. 12:24
Psa. 72:17...His name, Yinon, will produce offspring...Jn. 1:12,13
Psa. 72:17...All nations shall be blessed by Him...Acts 2:11,12,41
Psa. 78:1.2...He would teach in parables...Mt. 13:34-35
Psa. 78:2b...To speak the Wisdom of God with authority...Mt. 7:29
Psa. 88:8...They stood afar off and watched...Lu. 23:49
Psa. 89:27...Emmanuel to be higher than earthly kings...Lu. 1:32,33
Psa. 89:35-37...David's Seed, throne, kingdom endure forever...Lu. 1:32,33
Psa. 89:36-37...His character-Faithfulness...Rev. 1:5
Psa. 90:2...He is from everlasting (Micah 5:2)...Jn. 1:1
Psa. 91:11,12...Identified as Messianic; used to tempt Christ...Lu. 4;10,11
Psa. 97:9...His exaltation predicted...Acts 1:11;Eph. 1:20
Psa. 100:5...His character-Goodness...Mt. 19:16,17
Psa. 102:1-11...The Suffering and Reproach of Calvary...Jn. 21:16-30
Psa. 102:25-27...Messiah is the Preexistent Son...Heb. 1:10-12
Psa. 109:25...Ridiculed...Mt. 27:39
Psa. 110:1...Son of David...Mt. 22:43
Psa. 110:1...To ascend to the right-hand of the Father...Mk.16:19
Psa. 110:1...David's son called Lord...Mt. 22:44,45
Psa. 110:4...A priest after Melchizedek's order...Heb. 6:20
Psa. 112:4...His character-Compassionate, Gracious, et al... Mt. 9;36
Psa. 118:17,18...Messiah's Resurrection assured...Lu. 24:5-7;1 Cor. 15:20
Psa. 118:22,23...The rejected stone is Head of the corner...Mt. 21:42,43
Psa. 118:26a...The Blessed One presented to Israel...Mt. 21:9
Psa. 118:26b...To come while Temple standing...Mt. 21;12-15
Psa. 132:11...The Seed of David(the fruit of His Body)...Lu. 1:32
Psa. 138:1-6...The supremacy of David's Seed amazes kings... Mt. 2:2-6
Psa. 147:3,6...The earthly ministry of Christ described...Lu. 4:18
Psa. 1:23...He will send the Spirit of God... Jn. 16;7
Song. 5;16...The altogether lovely One...Jn. 1:17
Isa. 6:1...When Isaiah saw His glory... Jn. 12:40-41
Isa. 6:9-10...Parables fall on deaf ears...Mt. 13:13-15
Isa. 6:9-12...Blinded to Christ and deaf to His words...Acts. 28:23-29
Isa. 7:14...To be born of a virgin...Lu. 1:35
Isa. 7:14...To be Emmanuel-God with us... Mt. 1:18-23
Isa. 8:8...Called Emmanuel...Mt. 28:20
Isa. 8:14...A stone of stumbling, a Rock of offense... 1 Pet. 2:8
Isa. 9:1,2...His ministry to begin in Galilee...Mt. 4:12-17
Isa. 9:6...A child born-Humanity...Lu. 1:31
Isa. 9:6...A Son given-Deity...Lu. 1:32; Jn. 1;14; 1 Tim. 3:16
Isa. 9:6...Declared to be the Son of God with power... Rom. 1:3,4
Isa. 9:6...The Wonderful One, Peleh...Lu. 4:22
Isa. 9:6...The Counsellor, Yaatz...Mt. 13:54
Isa. 9:6...The Mighty God, El Gibor...Mt. 11:20
Isa. 9:6...The Everlasting Father, Avi Adth...Jn. 8:58
Isa. 9:6...The Prince of Peace, Sar Shalom...Jn . 16:33
Isa. 9:7...To establish an everlasting kingdom...Lu. 1:32-33
Isa. 9:7...His Character-Just...Jn. 5:30
Isa. 9:7...No end to his Government, Throne, and Peace...Lu. 1:32-33
Isa. 11:1...Called a Nazarene-the Branch, Netzer...Mt. 2:23
Isa. 11:1...A rod out of Jesse-Son of Jesse...Lu. 3:23,32
Isa. 11:2...The anointed One by the Spirit...Mt. 3;16,17
Isa. 11:2...His Character-Wisdom, Understanding, et al....Jn. 4:4-26
Isa. 11:4...His Character-Truth...Jn. 14:6
Isa. 11:10...The Gentiles seek Him...Jn. 12:18-21
Isa. 12:2...Called Jesus-Yeshua...Mt. 1:21
Isa. 25:8...The Resurrection predicted...I Cor. 15:54
Isa. 26:19...His power of Resurrection predicted...Jn. 11:43,44
Isa. 28:16...The Messiah is the precious corner stone...Acts 4:11,12
Isa. 29:13...He indicated hypocritical obedience to His Word...Mt. 15:7-9
Isa. 29:14...The wise are confounded by the Word...I Cor. 1:18-31
Isa. 32:2...A Refuge-A man shall be a hiding place...Mt. 23:37
Isa. 35:4...He will come and save you...Mt. 1:21
Isa. 35:5...To have a ministry of miracles...Mt. 11:4-6
Isa. 40:3,4...Preceded by forerunner...Jn. 1:23
Isa. 40:9..."Behold your God."...Jn. 1:36;19:14
Isa. 40:11...A shepherd-compassionatelife-giver...Jn. 10:10-18
Isa. 42:1-4...The Servant-as a faithful, patient redeemer... Mt.12:18-21
Isa. 42:2...Meek and lowly... Mt. 11:28-30
Isa. 42:3...He brings hope for the hopeless... Jn. 4
Isa. 42:4...The nations shall wait on His teachings... Jn. 12:20-26
Isa. 42:6...The Light (salvation) of the Gentiles...Lu. 2:32
Isa. 42:1,6...His is a Worldwide compassion... Mt. 28:19,20
Isa. 42:7...Blind eyes opened... Jn. 9:25-38
Isa. 43:11...He is the only Saviour... Acts. 4:12
Isa. 44:3...He will send the Spirit of God... Jn. 16:7,13
Isa. 45:23...He will be the Judge... Jn. 5:22;Rom. 14:11
Isa. 48:12...The First and the Last...Jn. 1:30;Rev. 1:8,17
Isa. 48:17...He came as a Teacher...Jn. 3:2
Isa. 49:1...Called from the womb-His humanity...Mt. 1:18
Isa. 49:5...A Servant from the womb...Lu. 1:31;Phil. 2:7
Isa. 49:6...He is Salvation for Israel...Lu. 2:29-32
Isa. 49:6...He is the Light of the Gentiles...Acts 13:47
Isa. 49:6...He is Salvation unto the ends of the earth... Acts 15:7-18
Isa. 49:7...He is despised of the Nation... Jn. 8:48-49
Isa. 50:3...Heaven is clothed in black at His humiliation... Lu. 23:44,45
Isa. 50:4...He is a learned counsellor for the weary... Mt. 11:28,29
Isa. 50:5...The Servant bound willingly to obedience... Mt. 26:39
Isa. 50:6a..."I gave my back to the smiters."... Mt. 27:26
Isa. 50:6b...He was smitten on the cheeks... Mt. 26:67
Isa. 50:6c...He was spat upon... Mt. 27:30
Isa. 52:7...To publish good tidings of peace... Lu. 4:14,15
Isa. 52:13...The Servant exalted...Acts 1:8-11; Eph. 1:19-22
Isa. 52:13...Behold, My Servant... Mt. 17:5; Phil. 2:5-8
Isa. 52:14...The Servant shockingly abused... Lu. 18:31-34; Mt. 26:67,68
Isa. 52:15...Nations startled by message of the Servant... Rom. 15:18-21
Isa. 52:15...His blood shed to make atonement for all... Rev. 1:5
Isa. 53:1...His people would not believe Him... Jn. 12:37-38
Isa. 53:2a...He would grow up in a poor family.... Lu. 2:7
Isa. 53:2b...Appearance of an ordinary man... Phil. 2:7-8
Isa. 53:3a...Despised.... Lu. 4:28-29
Isa. 53:3b...Rejected... Mt. 27:21-23
Isa. 53:3c...Great sorrow and grief... Lu. 19:41-42
Isa. 53:3d...Men hide from being associated with Him... Mk. 14:50-52
Isa. 53:4a...He would have a healing ministry... Lu. 6:17-19
Isa. 53:4b...He would bear the sins of the world... 1 Pet. 2:24
Isa. 53:4c...Thought to be cursed by God... Mt. 27:41-43
Isa. 53:5a...Bears penalty for mankind's transgressions... Lu. 23:33
Isa. 53:5b...His sacrifice would provide peace between man and God... Col. 1:20
Isa. 53:5c...His back would be whipped... Mt. 27:26
Isa. 53:6a...He would be the sin-bearer for all mankind...Gal. 1:4
Isa. 53:6b...God's will that He bear sin for all mankind... 1 Jn. 4:10
Isa. 53:7a...Oppressed and afflicted... Mt. 27:27-31
Isa. 53:7b...Silent before his accusers... Mt. 27:12-14
Isa. 53:7c...Sacrificial lamb... Jn. 1:29
Isa. 53:8a...Confined and persecuted... Mt. 26:47-27:31
Isa. 53:8b...He would be judged... Jn. 18:13-22
Isa. 53:8c...Killed.... Mt. 27:35
Isa. 53:8d...Dies for the sins of the world... 1 Jn. 2:2
Isa. 53:9a...Buried in a rich man's grave... Mt. 27:57
Isa. 53:9b...Innocent and had done no violence... Mk. 15:3
Isa. 53:9c...No deceit in his mouth... Jn. 18:38
Isa. 53:10a...God's will that He die for mankind... Jn. 18:11
Isa. 53:10b...An offering for sin... Mt. 20:28
Isa. 53:10c...Resurrected and live forever.... Mk. 16:16
Isa. 53:10d...He would prosper... Jn. 17:1-5
Isa. 53:11a...God fully satisfied with His suffering... Jn. 12:27
Isa. 53:11b...God's servant... Rom. 5:18-19
Isa. 53:11c...He would justify man before God... Rom. 5:8-9
Isa. 53:11d...The sin-bearer for all mankind... Heb. 9:28
Isa. 53:12a...Exalted by God because of his sacrifice... Mt. 28:18
Isa. 53:12b...He would give up his life to save mankind... Lu. 23:46
Isa. 53:12c...Grouped with criminals... Lu. 23:32
Isa. 53:12d...Sin-bearer for all mankind... 2 Cor. 5:21
Isa. 53:12e...Intercede to God in behalf of mankind... Lu. 23:34
Isa. 55:3...Resurrected by God... Acts 13:34
Isa. 55:4...A witness... Jn. 18:37
Isa. 59:15-16a...He would come to provide salvation... Jn. 6:40
Isa. 59:15-16b...Intercessor between man and God... Mt. 10:32
Isa. 59:20...He would come to Zion as their Redeemer... Lu. 2:38
Isa. 61:1-2a...The Spirit of God upon him... Mt. 3:16-17
Isa. 61:1-2b...The Messiah would preach the good news... Lu. 4:17-21
Isa. 61:1-2c...Provide freedom from the bondage of sin and death... Jn. 8:31-32
Isa. 61:1-2...Proclaim a period of grace... Jn. 5:24
Jer.23:5-6a...Descendant of David...Lu. 3:23-31
Jer. 23:5-6b...The Messiah would be God... Jn. 13:13
Jer. 23:5-6c...The Messiah would be both God and Man... 1 Tim. 3:16
Jer. 31:22...Born of a virgin... Mt. 1:18-20
Jer. 31:31...The Messiah would be the new covenant... Mt. 26:28
Jer. 33:14-15...Descendant of David... Lu. 3:23-31
Eze.17:22-24...Descendant of David... Lk. 3:23-31
Eze.34:23-24...Descendant of David... Mt. 1:1
Dan. 7:13-14a...He would ascend into heaven... Acts 1:9-11
Dan. 7:13-14b...Highly exalted... Eph. 1:20-22
Dan. 7:13-14c...His dominion would be everlasting... Lu. 1:31-33
Dan. 9:24a...To make an end to sins... Gal. 1:3-5
Dan. 9:24b...He would be holy... Lu. 1:35
Dan. 9:25...Announced to his people 483 years, to the exact day, after the decree to rebuild the city of Jerusalem... Jn. 12:12-13
Dan. 9:26a...Killed... Mt. 27:35
Dan. 9:26b...Die for the sins of the world... Heb. 2:9
Dan. 9:26c...Killed before the destruction of the temple... Mt. 27:50-51
Dan. 10:5-6...Messiah in a glorified state... Rev. 1:13-16
Hos. 13:14...He would defeat death... 1 Cor. 15:55-57
Joel 2:32...Offer salvation to all mankind... Rom. 10:12-13
Mic. 5:2a...Born in Bethlehem... Mt. 2:1-2
Mic. 5:2b...God's servant... Jn. 15:10
Mic. 5:2c...From everlasting... Jn. 8:58
Hag. 2:6-9...He would visit the second Temple... Lu. 2:27-32
Hag. 2:23...Descendant of Zerubbabel... Lu. 3:23-27
Zech. 3:8...God's servant... Jn. 17:4
Zech. 6:12-13...Priest and King... Heb. 8:1
Zech. 9:9a...Greeted with rejoicing in Jerusalem... Mt. 21:8-10
Zech. 9:9b...Beheld as King... Jn. 12:12-13
Zech. 9:9c...The Messiah would be just... Jn. 5:30
Zech. 9:9d...The Messiah would bring salvation... Luke 19:10
Zech. 9:9e...The Messiah would be humble... Mt. 11:29
Zech. 9:9f...Presented to Jerusalem riding on a donkey... Mt. 21:6-9
Zech. 10:4...The cornerstone... Eph. 2:20
Zech. 11:4-6a...At His coming, Israel to have unfit leaders... Mt. 23:1-4
Zech. 11:4-6b...Rejection causes God to remove His protection.. Lu. 19:41-44
Zech. 11:4-6c...Rejected in favor of another king... Jn. 19:13-15
Zech. 11:7...Ministry to "poor," the believing remnant... Mt. 9:35-36
Zech. 11:8a...Unbelief forces Messiah to reject them... Mt. 23:33
Zech. 11:8b...Despised... Mt. 27:20
Zech. 11:9...Stops ministering to the those who rejected Him... Mt. 13:10-11
Zech. 11:10-11a...Rejection causes God to remove protection... Lu. 19:41-44
Zech. 11:10-11b...The Messiah would be God... Jn. 14:7
Zech. 11:12-13a...Betrayed for thirty pieces of silver... Mt. 26:14-15
Zech. 11:12-13b...Rejected... Mt. 26:14-15
Zech. 11:12-13c...Thirty pieces of silver thrown into the house of the Lord... Mt. 27:3-5
Zech. 11:12-13d...The Messiah would be God... Jn. 12:45
Zech. 12:10a...The Messiah's body would be pierced... Jn. 19:34-37
Zech. 12:10b...The Messiah would be both God and man... Jn. 10:30
Zech. 12:10c...The Messiah would be rejected... Jn. 1:11
Zech. 13:7a...God's will He die for mankind... Jn. 18:11
Zech. 13:7b...A violent death... Mt. 27:35
Zech. 13:7c...Both God and man.. Jn. 14:9
Zech. 13:7d...Israel scattered as a result of rejecting Him... Mt. 26:31-56
Mal. 3:1a...Messenger to prepare the way for Messiah... Mt. 11:10
Mal. 3:1b...Sudden appearance at the temple... Mk. 11:15-16
Mal. 3:1c...Messenger of the new covenant... Lu. 4:43
Mal. 4:5...Forerunner in the spirit of Elijah... Mt. 3:1-2
Mal. 4:6...Forerunner would turn many to righteousness... Lu. 1:16-17

 

[einstein]

messianic prophecy

WOW! 300 different prophecies and they all are fulfilled in Jesus :angel:
Tell us, is there ANY passage in the Tanach that DOES NOT refer to Jesus ?
:roll:

This is messianic prophecy gone beserk!. To cite one example which I took at random, you say Isaiah 55:3 prophecies the resurrection of Jesus.

Isaiah 55:3 (judaica press tanach):"Incline your ear and come to Me, hearken and your soul shall live, and I will make for you an everlasting covenant, the dependable mercies of David."

If you read the preceding chapter and this chapter it is clear the prophet is giving the nation of Israel comfort and promising redemption from exile.The prophet continues to exhort Israel to hearken to God. The message of following in God's ways in order that the soul shall live is repeated innumerable times in the Hebrew bible, while the soul that sins is said to be admonished and /or die.

WHERE IN THIS PASSAGE IS JESUS? WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT GOD IS RESURRECTING JESUS? I guess I am blind :roll:

For support you quote Acts 13:34 which terminates with the same phrase about redemption because of the goodwill established through David's loyalty to God. The redemption is for Israel! If, as you claim Jesus is God, can God redeem himself?

BTW. Acts is the very same book which contradicts the Tanach by claiming that 75 of Joseph's relatives went down to Egypt (Acts 7:14) while the Tanach tells us the number was 70 in 3 separate places, and further goofs by stating that Abraham bought the future burial site of the patriarchs from Emmor (Acts 7:16) while the Tanach clearly states it was bought from Ephron the Hittite.(Gen 50:13).

 

[Solo]

Re: messianic prophecy

WOW! 300 different prophecies and they all are fulfilled in Jesus :angel:
Tell us, is there ANY passage in the Tanach that DOES NOT refer to Jesus ?
:roll:

This is messianic prophecy gone beserk!. To cite one example which I took at random, you say Isaiah 55:3 prophecies the resurrection of Jesus.

Isaiah 55:3 (judaica press tanach):"Incline your ear and come to Me, hearken and your soul shall live, and I will make for you an everlasting covenant, the dependable mercies of David."

Solo inserts scripture:
32 And we ourselves proclaim to you the good news of the promise that was made to our forefathers. 33 God has fulfilled this to us their children by raising up Jesus, as it is written in the second Psalm: You are My Son; today I have become Your Father. 34 Since He raised Him from the dead, never to return to decay, He has spoken in this way, I will grant you the faithful covenant blessings made to David. 35 Therefore He also says in another passage, You will not allow Your Holy One to see decay. 36 For David, after serving his own generation in God's plan, fell asleep, was buried with his fathers, and decayed. 37 But the One whom God raised up did not decay. 38 Therefore, let it be known to you, brothers, that through this man forgiveness of sins is being proclaimed to you, 39 and everyone who believes in Him is justified from everything, which you could not be justified from through the law of Moses. 40 So beware that what is said in the prophets does not happen to you: 41 Look, you scoffers, marvel and vanish away, because I am doing a work in your days, a work that you will never believe, even if someone were to explain it to you. " Acts 13:32-41


If you read the preceding chapter and this chapter it is clear the prophet is giving the nation of Israel comfort and promising redemption from exile.The prophet continues to exhort Israel to hearken to God. The message of following in God's ways in order that the soul shall live is repeated innumerable times in the Hebrew bible, while the soul that sins is said to be admonished and /or die.

WHERE IN THIS PASSAGE IS JESUS? WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT GOD IS RESURRECTING JESUS? I guess I am blind :roll:

For support you quote Acts 13:34 which terminates with the same phrase about redemption because of the goodwill established through David's loyalty to God. The redemption is for Israel! If, as you claim Jesus is God, can God redeem himself?

Solo comments:
Read Acts 13 and understand that God raised Jesus without him decaying. David died and decayed in the grave. Know that the Messiah was raised and did not decay. The everlasting covenant is extended to all people who have faith in the true almighty God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob; to the Jew first and then to the Gentiles.

BTW. Acts is the very same book which contradicts the Tanach by claiming that 75 of Joseph's relatives went down to Egypt (Acts 7:14) while the Tanach tells us the number was 70 in 3 separate places, and further goofs by stating that Abraham bought the future burial site of the patriarchs from Emmor (Acts 7:16) while the Tanach clearly states it was bought from Ephron the Hittite.(Gen 50:13).

You would come across as more legitimate if you proclaimed who the prophesies were proclaiming, and when it was going to take place. I know that it is easy to keep your eyes closed to the truth, but millions of Jews have come to know their savior and redeemer, Jesus Christ. Perhaps your accusatory manner is inherited from the god of this age, and not the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Jesus was very clear on the unbelief of the Jewish leaders of his time. In fact he called them hypocrites and vipers. Why?

Now that you have answered one of the 300 prophecies pointing to the Messiah, perhaps you could be a saint and answer the other 299 so that we can all get the perspective of an unbelieving Jew.

BTW, don't worry about Acts; it was written to believers. The prophecies that I posted are from the scriptures of Moses and the Prophets, so give us a class on Messianic prophecies as related to the posted 300.

And Jesus is mentioned throughout the entire Old Testament. Check out Daniel

22 Therefore because the king's commandment was urgent, and the furnace exceeding hot, the flame of the fire slew those men that took up Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. 23 And these three men, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, fell down bound into the midst of the burning fiery furnace. 24 Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astonied, and rose up in haste, and spake, and said unto his counsellors, Did not we cast three men bound into the midst of the fire? They answered and said unto the king, True, O king. 25 He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God. Daniel 3:22-25

‎3:22 ‏כָּל־קֳבֵ֣ל דְּנָ֗ה מִן־דִּ֞י מִלַּ֤ת מַלְכָּא֙ מַחְצְפָ֔ה וְאַתּוּנָ֖א אֵזֵ֣ה יַתִּ֑ירָא גֻּבְרַיָּ֣א אִלֵּ֗ךְ דִּ֤י הַסִּ֙קוּ֙ לְשַׁדְרַ֤ךְ מֵישַׁךְ֙ וַעֲבֵ֣ד נְגֹ֔ו קַטִּ֣ל הִמֹּ֔ון שְׁבִיבָ֖א דִּ֥י נוּרָֽא׃

‎3:23 ‏וְגֻבְרַיָּ֤א אִלֵּךְ֙ תְּלָ֣תֵּהֹ֔ון שַׁדְרַ֥ךְ מֵישַׁ֖ךְ וַעֲבֵ֣ד נְגֹ֑ו נְפַ֛לוּ לְגֹֽוא־אַתּוּן־נוּרָ֥א יָֽקִדְתָּ֖א מְכַפְּתִֽין׃

‎3:24 ‏אֱדַ֙יִן֙ נְבוּכַדְנֶצַּ֣ר מַלְכָּ֔א תְּוַ֖הּ וְקָ֣ם בְּהִתְבְּהָלָ֑ה עָנֵ֨ה וְאָמַ֜ר לְהַדָּֽבְרֹ֗והִי הֲלָא֩ גֻבְרִ֨ין תְּלָתָ֜א רְמֵ֤ינָא לְגֹוא־נוּרָא֙ מְכַפְּתִ֔ין עָנַ֤יִן וְאָמְרִין֙ לְמַלְכָּ֔א יַצִּיבָ֖א מַלְכָּֽא׃

‎3:25 ‏עָנֵ֣ה וְאָמַ֗ר הָֽא־אֲנָ֨ה חָזֵ֜ה גֻּבְרִ֣ין אַרְבְּעָ֗ה שְׁרַ֙יִן֙ מַהְלְכִ֣ין בְּגֹֽוא־נוּרָ֔א וַחֲבָ֖ל לָא־אִיתַ֣י בְּהֹ֑ון וְרֵוֵהּ֙ דִּ֣י רְבִיעָיָא רְֽבִיעָאָ֔ה דָּמֵ֖ה לְבַר־אֱלָהִֽין׃

In the first book of Moses, God revealed that he is plural and he is one.

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Genesis 1:26-27

‎1:26 ‏וַיֹּ֣אמֶר אֱלֹהִ֔ים נַֽעֲשֶׂ֥ה אָדָ֛ם בְּצַלְמֵ֖נוּ כִּדְמוּתֵ֑נוּ וְיִרְדּוּ֩ בִדְגַ֨ת הַיָּ֜ם וּבְעֹ֣וף הַשָּׁמַ֗יִם וּבַבְּהֵמָה֙ וּבְכָל־הָאָ֔רֶץ וּבְכָל־הָרֶ֖מֶשׂ הָֽרֹמֵ֥שׂ עַל־הָאָֽרֶץ׃
‎1:27 ‏וַיִּבְרָ֨א אֱלֹהִ֤ים׀ אֶת־הָֽאָדָם֙ בְּצַלְמֹ֔ו בְּצֶ֥לֶם אֱלֹהִ֖ים בָּרָ֣א אֹתֹ֑ו זָכָ֥ר וּנְקֵבָ֖ה בָּרָ֥א אֹתָֽם׃



Who is your Messiah? Hopefully you don't accept the one that comes with signs and wonders who is the counterfeit Messiah. Hopefully you will be able to see the truth as have many millions of other of the chosen people.

 

[Guest]

My first post was a copy and paste from jew4judiasm, sos I didnt write, but did copy it, my mistake.

Anyway, Im still waiting to hear answers from my objections on matthew

As far as the 300 prophecies here is a website that answers the many false claims, it has been said that a rooster can fulfill 70 prophecies from the OT by himself, these prophecies are vague and can be filled by anybody, on top of that they are just verses used out of context, not true messanic prophecies.
http://uk.geocities.com/hesedyahu/Tanakh/index.html

 

[Solo]

My first post was a copy and paste from jew4judiasm, sos I didnt write, but did copy it, my mistake.

Anyway, Im still waiting to hear answers from my objections on matthew

As far as the 300 prophecies here is a website that answers the many false claims, it has been said that a rooster can fulfill 70 prophecies from the OT by himself, these prophecies are vague and can be filled by anybody, on top of that they are just verses used out of context, not true messanic prophecies.
http://uk.geocities.com/hesedyahu/Tanakh/index.html

Then you will believe a rooster to be the messiah over Jesus Christ. Amazing but I believe you probably do accept a rooster over Jesus.

Since you brought it up, give me the 70 Messianic prophecies that a rooster can fulfill, if you are not lying to us.

 

[Guest]

again, side setting the main issue at hand, the 300= propecies are misused, taken out of context, not even propheies, and mistranslated by the christain bibles.

again im waiting to hear about the book of matthew problems

 

[bibleberean]

again, side setting the main issue at hand, the 300= propecies are misused, taken out of context, not even propheies, and mistranslated by the christain bibles.

again im waiting to hear about the book of matthew problems

You will be waiting along time...You have a problem with Matthew not us.

 

[Solo]

again, side setting the main issue at hand, the 300= propecies are misused, taken out of context, not even propheies, and mistranslated by the christain bibles.

again im waiting to hear about the book of matthew problems

Again, you are unable to answer questions about your unreliable generalizations (a polite word to use instead of lies). Your inability to understand God's Word should not be taken out on God by lying about his revelation to mankind. Keep it up and your nose will grow to the point of no return.

NOW with all kidding aside, show me the 70 messianic prophecies that a rooster could fulfill.

The book of Matthew doesn't have any problems; you have problems but Matthew is fine.

 

[BradtheImpaler]

The book of Matthew doesn't have any problems; you have problems but Matthew is fine.

It "doesn't have any problems" to those whose statement of faith requires them to believe it doesn't (or can't) have any problems. This is the same reason committed moslems believe the Koran doesn't have any problems.

"Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. Butter and honey HE (the son just mentioned in context) shall eat, that HE (the same son just mentioned in context) may know to refuse the evil, and choose the good. For before THE CHILD (same child just mentioned in context) shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land that thou abhorrest shall be forsaken of both her kings"

In order to believe that the son/child in the 2nd and 3rd verses of this passage is not the same child just mentioned in the first, or that the 2nd and 3rd verses refer to "any child", and not to the child in the first verse, and that the child in the first verse is someone who will born 700 years later than the situation at hand ("two kings") and therefore would have nothing to do with the situation being addressed in the passage - in order to prepose all this in order to justify one's religious viewpoint, that one would have to be dishonest or braindead. If any of you found a similar prophecy in another "Holy Book" such as the Koran, with an obviously mistaken claimed fulfillment such as the Matthew quote from Isaiah, you would be the first to point out that the supposed fulfillment was fraudulent. You would approach the situation logically and honestly, because it appeared in a book you disavow. But because it occurs in your NT, you cannot apply the same rules of logical, honest exegesis, because it would be self-incriminating to the Christian religion.

That's what this whole thing's about.

 

[DivineNames]

Re: messiah

For Gary: You wrote : "Only gene-carrying descendants are considered as descendants. This assumption is demonstrably false.

Not according to God's word in the Tanach:
1) 2 Sam 7:12-...then I will raise up your seed that shall issue from your body after you and I will establish his kingdom
2)Ps 132:11: The Lord has sworn in truth to David,from which He will not turn back, of the fruit of your body I shall seat upon the throne.

You then wrote:" Jesus got his genes from Mary and his legal standing from Joseph (thru the marriage of M+J)."...."PROBABLY through the law of levirate marriage" I want to make sure I understand your (or Glenn Miller's) position. Are you saying that if Heli had no sons, then Joseph, by marrying into Mary's family, preserves the inheritance of that line?

Gary, if you are still claiming that the Glenn Miller article is sound, are you going to clarify the position as requested?

Gary doesn't seem to want to respond. I will take that as a retraction of the Glenn Miller article.

 

[DivineNames]

For those that are not blinded to the truth of God... Over 300 Messianic Prophecies

What are the Messianic prophecies that Jews would accept as genuine? (and when I say 'Jews', I don't mean converts to Christianity...)

How many of these prophecies did Jesus fulfill?


There is 1 that he could have done- entering Jerusalem on a donkey. Of course, we don't know if he really did that. Even if he did, this one prophecy fulfillment by itself is meaningless.

So, are there any more?

 

[Guest]

I said it has been said that a rooster can fulfill 70 prophecies, but I dont know of any place that it says it exactly. The point is that many of the prophecies can be fulfilled by anyone.

here is a website to a christain bible that translates the hebrew word almah as young woman in isiaih 7:14
http://www.devotions.net/bible/00bible.htm

this is a big hit to christainity and its claim that the prophecy had to do with virgin. I have studied the bible to defend christainity for years, but have come acroiss many problems with the NT.

again I ask count how many generations are from abraham to christ in matthews geneeology. Matthew states 42, please post how many you count? I just started with matthew and only part of matthew to show the problems with the NT, please answer the objections and stop trying to change the subject and hide from the problems it contains. Comon guys stop hiding and answer the questions.

 

[Solo]

The book of Matthew doesn't have any problems; you have problems but Matthew is fine.

It "doesn't have any problems" to those whose statement of faith requires them to believe it doesn't (or can't) have any problems. This is the same reason committed moslems believe the Koran doesn't have any problems.

"Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. Butter and honey HE (the son just mentioned in context) shall eat, that HE (the same son just mentioned in context) may know to refuse the evil, and choose the good. For before THE CHILD (same child just mentioned in context) shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land that thou abhorrest shall be forsaken of both her kings"

In order to believe that the son/child in the 2nd and 3rd verses of this passage is not the same child just mentioned in the first, or that the 2nd and 3rd verses refer to "any child", and not to the child in the first verse, and that the child in the first verse is someone who will born 700 years later than the situation at hand ("two kings") and therefore would have nothing to do with the situation being addressed in the passage - in order to prepose all this in order to justify one's religious viewpoint, that one would have to be dishonest or braindead. If any of you found a similar prophecy in another "Holy Book" such as the Koran, with an obviously mistaken claimed fulfillment such as the Matthew quote from Isaiah, you would be the first to point out that the supposed fulfillment was fraudulent. You would approach the situation logically and honestly, because it appeared in a book you disavow. But because it occurs in your NT, you cannot apply the same rules of logical, honest exegesis, because it would be self-incriminating to the Christian religion.

That's what this whole thing's about.

When you repent and believe God will give you the indwelling of the Holy Spirit so that you too can understand the scriptures. Until then you will continue on your path of rebellion towards the creator God. You will take your lumps whatever they may be when he judges you. No amount of scripture will prove anything to you because you are an unbeliever. Keep walking the path that I was saved off of, and you can do as the ole boy in Luke 16 does.