How Much different?

[Edward]

How many of the prophets drank?

I give up. How many?

 

[WIP]

I belief that place never promotes alcohol either. I believe it is talking about a controlled medicinal efficacy of alcohol. Alcohol is used for our medicine stuff. Other purposes are significantly out-of-the-question.

Aren't you splitting hairs here a little bit? You asked if Paul promoted alcohol and he clearly did. Did he promote getting drunk on alcohol? Absolutely not as I think he clearly spoke against it in 1 Corinthians 6:9.

 

[WIP]

I used to smoke for years. Sometimes I wonder how much money all those packs of cigs over all the years would add up to and what it could have been used for instead?

I agree with your point but I think we have to be careful when we start equating the expense this way. Those of us that live in the US or other more developed countries could say the same thing with regard to the food we consume.

One of the things I learned after being diagnosed with type II diabetes is how much less food I really need to not only just survive but to still be healthy. How many of us have never indulged in a nice juicy t-bone steak? A typical t-bone is approximately 20oz. of meat which is really about 4x what anyone really needs at any given meal. Imagine cooking up a 3# roast, cutting 1/3 of it and dropping on your plate or eating a 1# hamburger instead of a 1/4-pound. Is it any wonder why the average person in the US is overweight?

 

[WIP]

We are not told this. We are only told they drank of "the cup", which implies they drank whatever was in the cup, but we aren't told what it was. Wine is assumed by many because, like in much of Europe today for example, wine was a very common drink with dinner (supper) at the time.

True. Is there any record in the early church or later that indicates when wine replaced something else in Holy Communion or has this been done for as far back as Acts?

 

[Willie T]

↑
How many of the prophets drank?

I give up. How many?

If they had to deal with religious people...... I would imagine, every single one of them... several times a day.

 

[Classik]

True. Is there any record in the early church or later that indicates when wine replaced something else in Holy Communion or has this been done for as far back as Acts?

The kind of bread used can help us answer this question

 

[Gary]

The kind of bread used can help us answer this question

Explain.

 

[Classik]

Explain.

Yeast

 

[Gary]

Yeast

Nice thought but you have nothing to back that up. You're trying to make a connection that isn't there.

It's better to stay within the boundaries of the Word. Less confusion. Not all minds operate on the same plane.
.

 

[Classik]

The idea was to not use yeast for the bread.

Unleavened bread don't need yeast. Right?
You need yeast to produce alcohol. Right?

It couldn't be alcohol that was produced since yeast was not needed in the first case. You know what yeast signifies?
just a thought :wink

 

[Gary]

The idea was to not use yeast for the bread.

Unleavened bread don't need yeast. Right?
You need yeast to produce alcohol. Right?

It couldn't be alcohol that was produced since yeast was not needed in the first case. You know what yeast signifies?
just a thought :wink

Yes I know the whole unleavened bread thing. What I didn't know is that bread is one of the ingredients in wine.

Who knew?
.

 

[jasonc]

The idea was to not use yeast for the bread.

Unleavened bread don't need yeast. Right?
You need yeast to produce alcohol. Right?

It couldn't be alcohol that was produced since yeast was not needed in the first case. You know what yeast signifies?
just a thought :wink

yeast, ok yeast was only forbidden in Passover. sheesh please read up on why that is. its a memorial to the jewish nation of how quickly they were thrust out of Egypt. pauls idea of yeast was to show how that during peshac as the yeast couldn't be in the home was to connect how that meant death and also how sin does that. a little bit. yeast itself doesn't always mean its a sin to consume it.take a look at Leviticus 13

 

[Classik]

yeast, ok yeast was only forbidden in Passover. sheesh please read up on why that is. its a memorial to the jewish nation of how quickly they were thrust out of Egypt. pauls idea of yeast was to show how that during peshac as the yeast couldn't be in the home was to connect how that meant death and also how sin does that. a little bit. yeast itself doesn't always mean its a sin to consume it.take a look at Leviticus 13

I didn't condemn yeast as a sin

 

[jasonc]

I didn't condemn yeast as a sin

yeast in water by implication you did. I hate beer and that stuff but my wife uses whine and other things that have yeast to make taste. she has bought jack daniels and used it too make a recipe. I did taste that.

 

[Deborah13]

The idea was to not use yeast for the bread.

Unleavened bread don't need yeast. Right?
You need yeast to produce alcohol. Right?

It couldn't be alcohol that was produced since yeast was not needed in the first case. You know what yeast signifies?
just a thought :wink

No.
Yeast does not need to be added to ferment wine. The yeast is natural in the grape skins.

However, yeast must be added to ferment bread.

1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

Christ is our passover, nothing needs to be added.

 

[Edward]

...

Christ is our passover, nothing needs to be added.

Interesting! I like it, it fits.

 

[jasonc]

Interesting! I like it, it fits.

of course it does. peshac is the most direct holiday and earliest story of redemption. I will tie that in in matthew if I can. if not another gospel will do.
yeast symbolizes the idea that the Egyptians thrust them out of the land. in a similar manner we are thrusted out of the world .

 

[Classik]

yeast in water by implication you did. I hate beer and that stuff but my wife uses whine and other things that have yeast to make taste. she has bought jack daniels and used it too make a recipe. I did taste that.

Can you prove my intent?

 

[Obadiah]

True. Is there any record in the early church or later that indicates when wine replaced something else in Holy Communion or has this been done for as far back as Acts?

I don't think we have any record specifically stating that in acts wine was used in communion, it can only be inferred since, much like when Jesus served the first communion, wine was the common drink of the day with supper. I've never heard of wine replacing anything else in church history. The very early church always used wine for communion right up into the 1800's That's when a Methodist minister named Dr. Thomas Welch (yep, of Welch's grape juice fame) discovered he could use pasteurization to keep grape juice from fermenting. This was the first time grape juice could be used in place of wine and, really, was the first time it became practical to use grape juice for anything at all since it could now be stored without it fermenting.

Welch, being a Methodist minister and supporter of the American prohibition that was going on at the time was driven by his desire to use something non-alcoholic for communion in his church. So really, the relatively modern idea that grape juice was used by Jesus in the first communion actually was born out of the American prohibition of the 1800's, not out of anything in scripture itself.

 

[Kathi]

Our Church used grape juice because some people have problems with alcohol.I have had real wine at a couple of other Churches.