[_ Old Earth _] How well do you actually know The Theory of Evolution?

[Doulos Iesou]

Sounds like for most people there's a lot of opinions on both sides that seem to go along with whether you believe science or you believe God.

OF COURSE, the millions of Christians who accept evolution simply don't believe God..

This is the kind of tribalism that I was talking about in another thread, how people are so quickly to draw the line and consider others as the "them." I wouldn't dare talk about such divides in this forum as this is a non-essential issue. We all believe that God is the Creator, we just disagree on the means by which he did so, and also the interpretation of Genesis 1-3. It's possible to believe in the discoveries of modern science, and also believe in God. Crazy! I know..

Neither side has all the answers.

Of course not, science has learned a lot but it has it's limits, and scientists have no problem with saying, "we don't know."

There will always be some things we won't understand, but we all do our best to make sense of this universe using the reason we have. I myself have been extremely persuaded regarding the evidence for evolution.

I guess for me, God promised me eternal life if I believe in Him and his word where science promises me nothing. So I'll choose to believe in God's word, even if there's parts of it, like Genesis, where I don't understand how it was done and don't know for sure if it was meant to be a factual explanation of how it was done, or just a story to tell us that God did it and did it in a miraculously powerful way that is simply beyond our ability to comprehend and beyond our need to comprehend.

I suppose this is a big difference. On matters of science, I believe in what has the strongest evidence to support it. Not on how that belief can somehow benefit me. The truth is true, whether or not you believe it.

I'm not so anxious to call God a liar just because some scientists think they are smarter and know more than He does, which really IS the way a lot of them act!

There are arrogant scientists, and there are arrogant theologians. Human nature me thinks.

Also, no one is calling God a liar, where did you pull that one from?

I believe when we are in heaven and with God, we will be given all the information that we don't know now, IF we need to know it then and IF we even care. I'm perfectly happy to wait until then.

You'll find that most people will find that to be an unsatisfactory answer, especially younger people, as this is simply a tactic used to avoid a question. No one should ever be afraid of the truth, that's living in fear of the doubt that resides in so many, because their beliefs aren't founded on Christ, but on non-essential issues like Creationism.

 

[Gary]

Please don't misrepresent what I said, that's rude.

Never in a million years.

I said that Creationism leads to many people losing their faith. Just go to the exchristian forums and read their out of faith testimonies and you can see the sad truth for yourself.

Actually you didn't. That thought may have been running through your head but you failed to transfer those thoughts into your post.

This is what you actually said.

The church's opposition to evolution is one root cause in my opinion for why so many fall away.

This could be interpreted as falling away from evolution and that's just how I saw it.

There is no mention of falling away from God.

They realize that they were taught so many lies on this particular subject and they end up throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

Again, this can be viewed as giving up on evolution.

Young Earth Creationism can be lethal to a person's faith, if they end up actually looking into the science.

Same thing here.

 

[Obadiah]

OF COURSE, the millions of Christians who accept evolution simply don't believe God..

This is the kind of tribalism that I was talking about in another thread, how people are so quickly to draw the line and consider others as the "them." I wouldn't dare talk about such divides in this forum as this is a non-essential issue. We all believe that God is the Creator, we just disagree on the means by which he did so, and also the interpretation of Genesis 1-3. It's possible to believe in the discoveries of modern science, and also believe in God. Crazy! I know..


Of course not, science has learned a lot but it has it's limits, and scientists have no problem with saying, "we don't know."

There will always be some things we won't understand, but we all do our best to make sense of this universe using the reason we have. I myself have been extremely persuaded regarding the evidence for evolution.


I suppose this is a big difference. On matters of science, I believe in what has the strongest evidence to support it. Not on how that belief can somehow benefit me. The truth is true, whether or not you believe it.


There are arrogant scientists, and there are arrogant theologians. Human nature me thinks.

Also, no one is calling God a liar, where did you pull that one from?


You'll find that most people will find that to be an unsatisfactory answer, especially younger people, as this is simply a tactic used to avoid a question. No one should ever be afraid of the truth, that's living in fear of the doubt that resides in so many, because their beliefs aren't founded on Christ, but on non-essential issues like Creationism.

Thank you.

 

[Doulos Iesou]

Never in a million years.

Sure..

Actually you didn't. That thought may have been running through your head but you failed to transfer those thoughts into your post.

This is what you actually said.

Wow... of course you would read your own views into my words. How does one "fall away," from evolution. "Fall away," is a Biblical expression that is extremely common within our community to denote falling away from God. I didn't think this needed to be clarified on this forum, but I should be more careful of people hijacking my statements.

This could be interpreted as falling away from evolution and that's just how I saw it.

There is no mention of falling away from God.

The expression means to "lose one's faith," hence it would be referring to God. You see, I don't think evolution is a "faith" issue, and I have always been clear on that notion, hence there shouldn't have been any reason for me to all the sudden start expressing your views.

Perhaps in the future, rather than inserting your own views onto my words, you can ask for clarification.

Again, this can be viewed as giving up on evolution.

When said by me... an evolutionist? Please forgive me if I don't buy what you're shoveling.

Same thing here.

You have lost all respect from me.

Have a nice life.

 

[Gary]

I would like your take on this information.

 

[Gary]

In fact! There is not ONE single peer-reviewed article in any scientific publication criticizing evolution, none...ever... lol

Actually scientists are quite vocal regarding evolutions nonexistent evidence. So your comment there is a bit off the mark. Watch the video and see for yourself.

 

[lordkalvan]

Actually scientists are quite vocal regarding evolutions nonexistent evidence. So your comment there is a bit off the mark. Watch the video and see for yourself.

Actually, none of the video you link to cites any scientist stating that the evidence supporting evolution is 'nonexistent'.

 

[Gary]

Actually, none of the video you link to cites any scientist stating that the evidence supporting evolution is 'nonexistent'.

Watch the video again.

 

[Barbarian]

Your egg video is embarrassingly wrong. It boils down to: "Wow, it's so complicated, God couldn't be smart enough to create a world that would let an egg evolve."

Except that there's this. The amniote egg (found in reptiles and their descendants like birds and mammals) evolved from the simpler amphibian egg, but with some modifications of the earlier egg to survive being on land.

Here's where you can learn a bit about why God is a lot smarter than your egg man thinks He is.

 

[Gary]

Except that there's this. The amniote egg (found in reptiles and their descendants like birds and mammals) evolved from the simpler amphibian egg, but with some modifications of the earlier egg to survive being on land.

All those modifications would have to be in place before any eggs were laid on dry ground. If those modifications were in place prior to moving to dry ground, how did they survive in the water?

 

[lordkalvan]

Watch the video again.

Maybe you can just cite the relevant statement?

 

[Barbarian]

All those modifications would have to be in place before any eggs were laid on dry ground.

Since the amniotic egg evolved during a warm and wet period on the Earth, and first in wet environments, the transition from losing the thick jelly coat of amphibian eggs, and the elaboration of the amnion didn't need to happen at once; it merely increased the likelihood of survival. Some amphibians lay eggs on land; certain frogs do this, with the young bypassing tadpole stage, and emerging as small frogs. If conditions aren't very dry, it works.

If those modifications were in place prior to moving to dry ground, how did they survive in the water?

The evidence and histological data indicates amphibians laying eggs on land, with the amnion evolving as a way of improving survival. All of this, I'm sure would be news to the fellow in your video. It's a hazard of talking about things one does not understand.

 

[Gary]

It's a hazard of talking about things one does not understand.

My sentiments exactly.

 

[lordkalvan]

My sentiments exactly.

And yet you seem unable to support your claim that the linked video quotes scientists saying that the evidence for evolution is 'nonexistent'.

 

[Gary]

And yet you seem unable to support your claim that the linked video quotes scientists saying that the evidence for evolution is 'nonexistent'.

Do some research, it's not that difficult. I provided the video, all you have to do is watch it. It's only 5 minutes long.

 

[lordkalvan]

Do some research, it's not that difficult. I provided the video, all you have to do is watch it. It's only 5 minutes long.

I've watched it twice. If you can't support your claims, you should just say so rather than expect others to do it for you.

 

[Gary]

I've watched it twice. If you can't support your claims, you should just say so rather than expect others to do it for you.

Forward the video to the times indicated below.

1:30.....2:25.....3:55

 

[lordkalvan]

Forward the video to the times indicated below.

1:30.....2:25.....3:55

None of your indicated points in the video support your claim concerning 'vocal' scientists stating that the evidence for evolution is 'nonexistent'. Which is the point I made in the first place.

 

[Gary]

None of your indicated points in the video support your claim concerning 'vocal' scientists stating that the evidence for evolution is 'nonexistent'. Which is the point I made in the first place.

Well then, you have a decision to make.

 

[lordkalvan]

Well then, you have a decision to make.

How do you arrive at that conclusion? You made an assertion, I pointed out that the linked video did not support that assertion and so far you have failed to show that it does.