I John 2:6 The Application.

[JLB]

JLB,

If you read the footnote of 1 John 5:8 (NIV) it states:

1. 1 John 5:8 Late manuscripts of the Vulgate testify in heaven: the Father, the Word and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one. 8 And there are three that testify on earth: the (not found in any Greek manuscript before the fourteenth century)

So 'there are three that testify" is not found in the earliest copies of the NT. I don't depend on that Scripture to build any doctrine as its authenticity is questioned.

Oz

The scripture I quoted was 1 John 5:7.

What does your footnote say about verse 7?

 

[OzSpen]

Do you believe the Father, the Word and the Spirit are Three Gods or one God?


JLB

JLB,

If this question has to do with 1 John 5:7-8, I don't believe it because it is not in the Bible.

I believe in the orthodox doctrine of the Trinity. See my exposition in:

• Is the Trinity taught in the Bible?
• How to understand three persons in the Trinity

Oz

 

[OzSpen]

Do you believe the Father, the Word and the Spirit are Three Gods or one God?

JLB

JLB,

In the NIV, 1 John 5:7-8 is the one sentence: '7 For there are three that testify: 8 the[a] Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement'. Verse 8 makes no sense without v. 7.

The Holman Christian Standard Bible agrees: 'For there are three that testify:[a] 8 the Spirit, the water, and the blood—and these three are in agreement'.

As does the New Revised Standard Version: '7 There are three that testify:[a] 8 the Spirit and the water and the blood, and these three agree'.

The NLT: '7 So we have these three witnesses[a]— 8 the Spirit, the water, and the blood—and all three agree'.

LEB: '7 For there are three that testify,[a] 8 the Spirit and the water and the blood, and the three are in agreement[b]'.

Oz

 

[OzSpen]

Please quote the scripture that says we will be horrifically persecuted for our faith if we walk in the truth.

JLB

JLB,

How about these Scriptures?

4 Jesus told them, “Don’t let anyone mislead you, 5 for many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah.’ They will deceive many. 6 And you will hear of wars and threats of wars, but don’t panic. Yes, these things must take place, but the end won’t follow immediately. 7 Nation will go to war against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in many parts of the world. 8 But all this is only the first of the birth pains, with more to come.​

​

9 “Then you will be arrested, persecuted, and killed. You will be hated all over the world because you are my followers.[b] 10 And many will turn away from me and betray and hate each other. 11 And many false prophets will appear and will deceive many people. 12 Sin will be rampant everywhere, and the love of many will grow cold. 13 But the one who endures to the end will be saved (Matt 24:4-13 NLT).​

Oz

​

 

[JLB]

In the NIV, 1 John 5:7-8 is the one sentence:

Verse 7 is One sentence.


For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one. 1 John 5:7


Verse 7 makes perfect sense on its own, and does not need verse 8 to help it make sense.


And there are three that bear witness on earth: the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.
1 John 5:8


Verse 8 is about the witness on earth.



JLB

 

[JLB]

JLB,

How about these Scriptures?

4 Jesus told them, “Don’t let anyone mislead you, 5 for many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah.’ They will deceive many. 6 And you will hear of wars and threats of wars, but don’t panic. Yes, these things must take place, but the end won’t follow immediately. 7 Nation will go to war against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in many parts of the world. 8 But all this is only the first of the birth pains, with more to come.​

​

9 “Then you will be arrested, persecuted, and killed. You will be hated all over the world because you are my followers.[b] 10 And many will turn away from me and betray and hate each other. 11 And many false prophets will appear and will deceive many people. 12 Sin will be rampant everywhere, and the love of many will grow cold. 13 But the one who endures to the end will be saved (Matt 24:4-13 NLT).​

Oz

​

This is during the great tribulation which has not taken place yet, and effects ONLY the people who are alive during that time.


Your statement involves all who walk in the truth.



JLB

 

[OzSpen]

Verse 7 is One sentence.

For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one. 1 John 5:7

Verse 7 makes perfect sense on its own, and does not need verse 8 to help it make sense.

And there are three that bear witness on earth: the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.
1 John 5:8

Verse 8 is about the witness on earth.

JLB

JLB,

1 John 5:7-8 (NIV) reads: '7 For there are three that testify: 8 the[a] Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement'.

It makes no sense to leave v. 7 without v. 8. Verse 7 states: 'For there are three that testify:' Who are the three? We need v. 8 to complete the sentence.



Oz

 

[JLB]

JLB,

1 John 5:7-8 (NIV) reads: '7 For there are three that testify: 8 the[a] Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement'.

It makes no sense to leave v. 7 without v. 8. Verse 7 states: 'For there are three that testify:' Who are the three? We need v. 8 to complete the sentence.



Oz

It stands on its own in the KJV or NKJV.


For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.
1 John 5:7


IT makes no sense in the NIV, which is why I reject it.



JLB

 

[OzSpen]

It stands on its own in the KJV or NKJV.

For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.
1 John 5:7

JLB

JLB,

Don't you understand that when there is a colon in a sentence there is more information to follow?

The colon is used to separate two independent clauses when the second explains or illustrates the first. In such usage, the colon functions in much the same way as the semicolon. ... When two or more sentences follow a colon, capitalize the first word following the colon (The Punctuation Guide).

Late manuscripts of the Vulgate testify in heaven: the Father, the Word and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one. 8 And there are three that testify on earth: the (not found in any Greek manuscript before the fourteenth century).​

​

Oz

 

[JLB]

Don't you understand that when there is a colon in a sentence there is more information to follow?

For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one. 1 John 5:7

Yes. The information after the colon is...

these three are one.


JLB

 

[JLB]

Late manuscripts of the Vulgate testify in heaven: the Father, the Word and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one. 8 And there are three that testify on earth: the (not found in any Greek manuscript before the fourteenth century).

I tend to lean toward KJV and NKJV.




JLB