" I never knew you " --- Literal or Figurative

[Nathan]

No, you are right. In context He is speaking mainly to those who 'profess' to have faith, but have never really grasped what it is.

The deep theological discussion comes in when a person tries to get a grasp of them "casting out demons" and "prophesying"(which in context would seem to indicate that what they said came true) and the doing of "many wonderful works". Can these things be brought about by the will of man? Does God have to have a hand in it? Is it just pure satanic power?

So it could be said that these were also some that had come to "know" Him, but let the deceitfulness of sin enslave them once again.

2Pe 2:1-2 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed

2Pe 2:14-15 They have eyes full of adultery, insatiable for sin. They entice unsteady souls. They have hearts trained in greed. Accursed children! Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing,

What do we know of Balaam?

Num 22:7-9 "So the elders of Moab and the elders of Midian departed with the fees for divination in their hand. And they came to Balaam and gave him Balak's message. And he said to them, "Lodge here tonight, and I will bring back word to you, as the LORD speaks to me." So the princes of Moab stayed with Balaam. And God came to Balaam and said, "Who are these men with you?"

Well, we know that he thought 'highly' of God. And we know that God spoke to him.

What is interesting is that we never have an account of Balaam actually cursing Israel. In fact, on the contrary, we have him constantly blessing them. He said himself that he could speak none other than what the Lord would allow him too. He was 'foolishly' deceived that he was doing the right thing. How? Because in the beginning of the story of Balaam and Balak we see this scene.

Num 22:12 God said to Balaam, "You shall not go with them. You shall not curse the people, for they are blessed."

Then the next day he told them;

Num 22:13 So Balaam rose in the morning and said to the princes of Balak, "Go to your own land, for the LORD has refused to let me go with you."

So whats the problem? He was doing the will of God. He told them flat out he would not go. But what we do not see is his heart, not yet at least, but God did. And in the end we see it manifested through his 'lawlessness'/disobedience.

Num 22:18-19 "But Balaam answered and said to the servants of Balak, "Though Balak were to give me his house full of silver and gold, I could not go beyond the command of the LORD my God to do less or more. So you, too, please stay here tonight, that I may know what more the LORD will say to me."

Here is the deception of riches interning into his mind and heart. He really, really wanted the money. So instead of doing as the Lord had already told him to do, he went back with his OWN desire, asking God to let him do it. 'Come on, just this one time....'

Num 22:20 And God came to Balaam at night and said to him, "If the men have come to call you, rise, go with them; but only do what I tell you."

Huh? Did God go back on what He had previously said? Did He change His mind? No, it was a test. And we know it was because of the following verses.

Num 22:21-22 So Balaam rose in the morning and saddled his donkey and went with the princes of Moab. But God's anger was kindled because he went, and the angel of the LORD took his stand in the way as his adversary. Now he was riding on the donkey, and his two servants were with him.

Why was God's anger against him? Did He just not tell Balaam to go? Yes, but it was that He was allowing Balaam to choose. We know, and from this context of this story, that people can only do what God allows them to do. Balaam made this statement over and over. Yet in order to give Balaam the opportunity of obedience, He had to give Balaam "free will" to do what Balaam desired in his heart. And so Balaam, instead of doing what God told him before, went with the desire of his heart. This is where we see God giving someone the choice of obedience or disobedience. And yet again, He gives Balaam another chance to see the error of his way, to do righteousness instead of lawlessness.

Num 22:24-25 Then the angel of the LORD stood in a narrow path between the vineyards, with a wall on either side. And when the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she pushed against the wall and pressed Balaam's foot against the wall. So he struck her again.

God sends an Angel to stand in the way that Balaam is going, a 'messenger'.

Num 22:31-32 Then the LORD opened the eyes of Balaam, and he saw the angel of the LORD standing in the way, with his drawn sword in his hand. And he bowed down and fell on his face. And the angel of the LORD said to him, "Why have you struck your donkey these three times? Behold, I have come out to oppose you because your way is perverse before me.

Ok, so you would think that Balaam would get the hint that he was not doing the right thing. But greed had so filled his heart that he would not hear the call, and so God gave him over to fulfill the desires of his heart, but in the process God decided to use him to bless Israel and not curse them. And the whole time, Balaam thought he was 'doing the will of God'. Over, and over, and over he told Balak that he could not curse Israel. And yet over, and over, and over he would 'sacrifice' in hopes that at least one time God would allow him to in order that he could receive some money.

Sad, sad situation.

 

[Elvispelvis]

I am so glad that everyone can see that they are christians being rejected.
Let us take a closer look at why they are being rejected.

Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers.

They are arguing with Jesus demanding entry so they must be the leaders of the christians to be bold enough
to tell Jesus they deserve entry.
They claim to be the leaders when they say' did we not prophesy in your name' Jesus.

Since He was never called Jesus, He knows immediately these people did not take the time to find out what His real name is .
Anyone refering to Him with this name shows lack of understanding of His name.
The angels know
what religion you are as soon as you call him Jesus. Since no demons could be driven out with this false name
He knows they are lying again. Since no miracles could possibly be performed using the name of Jesus He knows they are lying again.
How important is it to know the name?
Your life depends on it. Give the wrong name to the collecting angel and your a dead man.
Acts 2
21 And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’
Get it use the wrong name, and the collecting angel can tell what religion you are, immediately.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Interesting. Jesus "never knew you" but "of course He knew their actions".

That's funny... God knows about someone's actions, but doesn't know them...

Jesus is not lying, you aren't getting it, that's all.

It should be quite obvious that Jesus is not refering to a 'literal' knowledge, since as God, He is quite AWARE of EVERYONE... I do recall you saying you believe Jesus is God. So what sort of God doesn't know someone HE CREATED??? He knows them ALL, even down to the hair on their head. The verse, within context, speaks for itself. It is the attempt to wrench it out of context that makes it confusing to others. It is ALL about ACTION and doing the Will of the Father.

Regards

Jesus said depart from me, ye workers of iniquity, speaking to very religious people who had done works in his name, I never knew you. How can Christ had died for people He never knew ?

He knew His Sheep that He specifically said He layed down His life for.

Jn 10:

14I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

15As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.

So, those He never knew, He never layed down His life for.

 

[savedbygrace57]

elvis:

I am so glad that everyone can see that they are christians being rejected.

No, they thought themselves Christians, Sheep, but Christ never knew them.

 

[smaller]

I am so glad that everyone can see that they are christians being rejected.
Let us take a closer look at why they are being rejected.

Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers.

They are arguing with Jesus demanding entry so they must be the leaders of the christians to be bold enough
to tell Jesus they deserve entry.
They claim to be the leaders when they say' did we not prophesy in your name' Jesus.

Since He was never called Jesus, He knows immediately these people did not take the time to find out what His real name is .
Anyone refering to Him with this name shows lack of understanding of His name.
The angels know
what religion you are as soon as you call him Jesus. Since no demons could be driven out with this false name
He knows they are lying again. Since no miracles could possibly be performed using the name of Jesus He knows they are lying again.
How important is it to know the name?
Your life depends on it. Give the wrong name to the collecting angel and your a dead man.
Acts 2
21 And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’
Get it use the wrong name, and the collecting angel can tell what religion you are, immediately.

Yeah, there are many who pitch the salvation via proper name spelling / pronounciation routine, with about a like amount of variants.

In all cases of such promotions there is ONE commonality...it must be EXACTLY as the 'teachers' claim or yer cooked.

?!

s

 

[Sparkey]

"I never knew you..."

This relates to the parable of the 10 virgins.
Those without oil shared a similar fate.

All were invited. Love believes all things, hopes all things, does not count a wrong suffered. Jesus loved those who were called and during the time that they were alive there was no difference between them (me) and you.

From all evidence I am the one to whom this will be spoken, I am broken. Yet there is time and yet will my savior come to my call. I have called and will continue, nothing can separate me from the Love of God - but does this mean that I can not continue in my stubborn unwillingness?

Why should I pretend? All things will be revealed. Christ Jesus, His compassion, His Love, His mercy is my only hope. Looking at the things seen causes me to identify with the adulterous idolater. When we actually meet, He will say one of two things:

• 
  [*]Enter, thou good and faithful servant.
  [*]Depart, I have never known you.

Personally? Being betrothed in faithfulness is what I want. Then may I say, "I have only done what was given to me to do," as my crown(s) are cast at His feet. None will brag. All will bow. Every knee will bend.

Let our knees bend now --->allow Him to heal us well.
"If you love me? Obey me."

Clearly we shall know that we are rightly following Him if our love for each other continues to grow and our compassion begins to be heralded by the unsaved. This is yet to come, my friend. I've looked and my praises are not sung by the unsaved, not yet, that is. Let God's purpose be found in our experience.

 

[Sparkey]

No, you are right. In context He is speaking mainly to those who 'profess' to have faith, but have never really grasped what it is.

The deep theological discussion comes in when a person tries to get a grasp of them "casting out demons" and "prophesying"(which in context would seem to indicate that what they said came true) and the doing of "many wonderful works". Can these things be brought about by the will of man? Does God have to have a hand in it? Is it just pure satanic power?

So it could be said that these were also some that had come to "know" Him, but let the deceitfulness of sin enslave them once again.

2Pe 2:1-2 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed

2Pe 2:14-15 They have eyes full of adultery, insatiable for sin. They entice unsteady souls. They have hearts trained in greed. Accursed children! Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing,

What do we know of Balaam?

Num 22:7-9 "So the elders of Moab and the elders of Midian departed with the fees for divination in their hand. And they came to Balaam and gave him Balak's message. And he said to them, "Lodge here tonight, and I will bring back word to you, as the LORD speaks to me." So the princes of Moab stayed with Balaam. And God came to Balaam and said, "Who are these men with you?"

Well, we know that he thought 'highly' of God. And we know that God spoke to him.

What is interesting is that we never have an account of Balaam actually cursing Israel. In fact, on the contrary, we have him constantly blessing them. He said himself that he could speak none other than what the Lord would allow him too. He was 'foolishly' deceived that he was doing the right thing. How? Because in the beginning of the story of Balaam and Balak we see this scene.

Num 22:12 God said to Balaam, "You shall not go with them. You shall not curse the people, for they are blessed."

Then the next day he told them;

Num 22:13 So Balaam rose in the morning and said to the princes of Balak, "Go to your own land, for the LORD has refused to let me go with you."

So whats the problem? He was doing the will of God. He told them flat out he would not go. But what we do not see is his heart, not yet at least, but God did. And in the end we see it manifested through his 'lawlessness'/disobedience.

Num 22:18-19 "But Balaam answered and said to the servants of Balak, "Though Balak were to give me his house full of silver and gold, I could not go beyond the command of the LORD my God to do less or more. So you, too, please stay here tonight, that I may know what more the LORD will say to me."

Here is the deception of riches interning into his mind and heart. He really, really wanted the money. So instead of doing as the Lord had already told him to do, he went back with his OWN desire, asking God to let him do it. 'Come on, just this one time....'

Num 22:20 And God came to Balaam at night and said to him, "If the men have come to call you, rise, go with them; but only do what I tell you."

Huh? Did God go back on what He had previously said? Did He change His mind? No, it was a test. And we know it was because of the following verses.

Num 22:21-22 So Balaam rose in the morning and saddled his donkey and went with the princes of Moab. But God's anger was kindled because he went, and the angel of the LORD took his stand in the way as his adversary. Now he was riding on the donkey, and his two servants were with him.

Why was God's anger against him? Did He just not tell Balaam to go? Yes, but it was that He was allowing Balaam to choose. We know, and from this context of this story, that people can only do what God allows them to do. Balaam made this statement over and over. Yet in order to give Balaam the opportunity of obedience, He had to give Balaam "free will" to do what Balaam desired in his heart. And so Balaam, instead of doing what God told him before, went with the desire of his heart. This is where we see God giving someone the choice of obedience or disobedience. And yet again, He gives Balaam another chance to see the error of his way, to do righteousness instead of lawlessness.

Num 22:24-25 Then the angel of the LORD stood in a narrow path between the vineyards, with a wall on either side. And when the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she pushed against the wall and pressed Balaam's foot against the wall. So he struck her again.

God sends an Angel to stand in the way that Balaam is going, a 'messenger'.

Num 22:31-32 Then the LORD opened the eyes of Balaam, and he saw the angel of the LORD standing in the way, with his drawn sword in his hand. And he bowed down and fell on his face. And the angel of the LORD said to him, "Why have you struck your donkey these three times? Behold, I have come out to oppose you because your way is perverse before me.

Ok, so you would think that Balaam would get the hint that he was not doing the right thing. But greed had so filled his heart that he would not hear the call, and so God gave him over to fulfill the desires of his heart, but in the process God decided to use him to bless Israel and not curse them. And the whole time, Balaam thought he was 'doing the will of God'. Over, and over, and over he told Balak that he could not curse Israel. And yet over, and over, and over he would 'sacrifice' in hopes that at least one time God would allow him to in order that he could receive some money.

Sad, sad situation.

Man has not taught you this. It is the Lord, it is the Lord.

 

[Sparkey]

[Deuteronomy 28:56 KJV] - [56] The tender and delicate woman among you, which would not adventure to set the sole of her foot upon the ground for delicateness and tenderness, her eye shall be evil toward the husband of her bosom, and toward her son, and toward her daughter...

Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.

We of the evil eye shall not be saved. Because it appealed to us to believe the lie and to continue in deception, there was no love of the truth found in us. This then makes us unknowable. It does not reflect on the quality of the Love of God but only shows clearly that all men are given freedom of choice. Choose well, if you hear His voice, know that today is the day of salvation - and I don't care if you've told people 10 millions of times that you "are saved" - it does not matter. If you continue you shall be saved.

 

[Strangelove]

I am so glad that everyone can see that they are christians being rejected.
Let us take a closer look at why they are being rejected.

Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers.

They are arguing with Jesus demanding entry so they must be the leaders of the christians to be bold enough
to tell Jesus they deserve entry.
They claim to be the leaders when they say' did we not prophesy in your name' Jesus.

Since He was never called Jesus, He knows immediately these people did not take the time to find out what His real name is .
Anyone refering to Him with this name shows lack of understanding of His name.
The angels know
what religion you are as soon as you call him Jesus. Since no demons could be driven out with this false name
He knows they are lying again. Since no miracles could possibly be performed using the name of Jesus He knows they are lying again.
How important is it to know the name?
Your life depends on it. Give the wrong name to the collecting angel and your a dead man.
Acts 2
21 And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’
Get it use the wrong name, and the collecting angel can tell what religion you are, immediately.

So...Elvis....you use the name 'Yeshua' which is the talmudic spelling of His name. Talmud being the book of the Pharisees. Who Jesus describes as children of the devil...and the Synagogue of Satan. The talmud that describes Jesus as a sorceror using the power of beelzebub and says that when he went to hell he was boiling in a pot of boiling semen?

And thats gonna get you into Heaven?

You are so lost right now Elvis.

Read this link and then at your next Noahide meeting you can tell everyone the truth about why we call Him Jesus:

Yahshua, Yehoshua, Y'shua, Yeshua, Iesous, Iesus Or Jesus
The Sacred Name or True Name ​

Yahshua, Yehoshua, Y'shua, Yeshua, Iesous, Iesus, or Jesus The Sacred Name or True Name

​

 

[Strangelove]

No, you are right. In context He is speaking mainly to those who 'profess' to have faith, but have never really grasped what it is.

The deep theological discussion comes in when a person tries to get a grasp of them "casting out demons" and "prophesying"(which in context would seem to indicate that what they said came true) and the doing of "many wonderful works". Can these things be brought about by the will of man? Does God have to have a hand in it? Is it just pure satanic power?

You lost me when you said 'deep theological discussion'

 

[savedbygrace57]

Christ knew the people He died for.

Jn 10:

14I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

Those in Matt 7 23 were not of his Sheep that He knew ! They were religous and probably very sincere, but Matt 7:


23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

They could not have been His Sheep, unless He lied !

 

[Nathan]

You lost me when you said 'deep theological discussion'

Thats why I warned you :D

And yes, it is not something I was taught by man. It was not something that I had sought out till this morning. God is good, and is able to give abundantly to those who will ask from Him. I take no honor in the exposition of Scripture.

 

[Nathan]

Christ knew the people He died for.

Jn 10:

14I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

Those in Matt 7 23 were not of his Sheep that He knew ! They were religous and probably very sincere, but Matt 7:


23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

They could not have been His Sheep, unless He lied !

Jesus never lied.

Are all of His sheep's names found in the Lambs Book of Life?

 

[Elvispelvis]

17 ” ‘In the last days, God says,

I will pour out my Spirit on all people.

Your sons and daughters will prophesy,

your young men will see visions,

your old men will dream dreams.

18 Even on my servants, both men and women,

I will pour out my Spirit in those days,

and they will prophesy.

19 I will show wonders in the heaven above

and signs on the earth below,

blood and fire and billows of smoke.

20 The sun will be turned to darkness

and the moon to blood

before the coming of the great and glorious day of the Lord.

---------------------------21 And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’ -----------------------------

IF YOUR CHURCH TEACHES THAT THE PROPER NAME IS NOT IMPORTANT PLEASE RE -READ V 21

ps stranglove I am not a Noahide I am Christadelphian for the last time. I do not want to go to heaven.

 

[Nathan]

I do not want to go to heaven.

Ok. You really got me curious on this one....

 

[Elvispelvis]

Exd 3:15 And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this [is] my name for ever, and this [is] my memorial unto all generations.

What is the memorial name forever YHWH

Exd 9:16 And in very deed for this [cause] have I raised thee up, for to shew [in] thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth.

Exd 23:21 Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions:---------------------------- for my name [is] in him---------------------------------

Get it my name is in Him. The name Yahweh is in the name of Yahshua.

In Matt 7 they say we have done it in the name of Jesus and we know they are rejected.

As soon as the angel hears them say the wrong name they condemn themselves.

Look what happens to those who get the name wrong;

Deu 18:20 But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.

Lev 19:12 And ye shall not swear by my name falsely, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I [am] the LORD.
Acts 2 21 he whos calls on the name shall be saved.

1Ki 9:3 And the LORD said unto him, I have heard thy prayer and thy supplication, that thou hast made before me: I have hallowed this house, which thou hast built,--------------------- to put my name there for ever;--------------------- and mine eyes and mine heart shall be there perpetually.

Psa 22:22 I will declare------------------ thy name unto my brethren: -----------------------in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.

Psa 23:3 He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness------------------ for his name's sake.

Psa 86:11 Teach me thy way, O LORD; I will walk in thy truth:-------------------- unite my heart to fear thy name.

YHWH is jealous about His name.

In Matt 7 they claim to have done wonderful works in Jesus name.

 

[Strangelove]

ps stranglove I am not a Noahide I am Christadelphian for the last time. I do not want to go to heaven.

Your words not mine pal:

The present day Jew is blind in part so like all other religions there are radicals who do not speak for the whole.
Please do not try to say this Rabbi speaks for all Jews.
My friend Rabbi Green and the other Rabbi's welcome me with open arms as Noahide or the one who follows Noah's law. Yet they know I am a gentile. I am allowed to enter the sanctuary and touch the scrolls.

As i like to remind everyone Yeshua is Jew.

Also notice in the above post you say Yeshua

Get it my name is in Him. The name Yahweh is in the name of Yahshua.

And in this post you say Yahshua.

So for a guy who's trying to teach that Jesus is really fussy about calling Him the correct name your not doing to good are you? :shocked!

Fail.

 

[Elvispelvis]

nathaniel I will try to be logical about this. Where to begin? Genesis! Abraham is promised land on this earth. OK ?
King David is promised land on this earth Jerusalem in the future. OK ?
Yahshua is promised the throne of his father David on the earth in Jerusalem. OK ?
Yahshua is promised to bring peace on earth and good will toward men on earth. OK ?
The bible says the meek shall inherit the earth.
Rev 5 10 says we shall reign as kings and priests on earth.
The 1,000 year reign of Christ is on the earth.
The kingdom of God comes on the earth.

New Heavens and a New Earth

17 “Behold, I will create

new heavens and a new earth.

The former things will not be remembered,

nor will they come to mind.

18 But be glad and rejoice forever

in what I will create,

for I will create Jerusalem to be a delight

and its people a joy.

19 I will rejoice over Jerusalem

and take delight in my people;

the sound of weeping and of crying

will be heard in it no more.



20 “Never again will there be in it

an infant who lives but a few days,

or an old man who does not live out his years;

he who dies at a hundred

will be thought a mere youth;

he who fails to reach [fn1] a hundred

will be considered accursed.

21 They will build houses and dwell in them;

they will plant vineyards and eat their fruit.

22 No longer will they build houses and others live in them,

or plant and others eat.

For as the days of a tree,

so will be the days of my people;

my chosen ones will long enjoy

the works of their hands.

23 They will not toil in vain

or bear children doomed to misfortune;

for they will be a people blessed by the Lord,

they and their descendants with them.

24 Before they call I will answer;

while they are still speaking I will hear.

25 The wolf and the lamb will feed together,

and the lion will eat straw like the ox,

but dust will be the serpent's food.

They will neither harm nor destroy

on all my holy mountain,â€

We are promised paradise on earth not heaven.

 

[Strangelove]

We are promised paradise on earth not heaven.

Thats super picky Pelvis.

We're allowed to say Heaven dude.

Kingdom of Heaven is mentioned several times in scripture

Sheesh.

 

[Elvispelvis]

stranglove Look close at my words the Rabbi's except me as Noahide I did not say I am a Noahide going to Noahide meetings.
Thats a ridiculous inference !
Miffed !