if one doest accept the trinity then what was jesus?

[shad]

Jason, we were getting off-topic so I am starting that topic here.

if one doest accept the trinity then what was jesus?

Jesus was the Lamb of God and Savior of the world, and He is many other things. Jesus does not say we have to accept Him as one of the trinity. Trinity is not used in the Bible. You are adding your own qualification for salvation. If it was so essential for salvation, why isn't even the word trinity in there?

But the Bible is very clear that Jesus has to be accepted as the Lamb of God and Savior of the world and that without Him no one will be saved, not that He should be accepted as one of the trinity.

 

[jasoncran]

Jason, we were getting off-topic so I am starting that topic here.

if one doest accept the trinity then what was jesus?

Jesus was the Lamb of God and Savior of the world, and He is many other things. Jesus does not say we have to accept Him as one of the trinity. Trinity is not used in the Bible. You are adding your own qualification for salvation. If it was so essential for salvation, why isn't even the word trinity in there?

But the Bible is very clear that Jesus has to be accepted as the Lamb of God and Savior of the world and that without Him no one will be saved, not that He should be accepted as one of the trinity.

the idea of it is in the bible, the word for the shumah is a plural one, not singular one. odd if gone is only one, and not having a truine nature.

two, was jesus only a man to you?

 

[Mike]

shad, this is something I guess I never picked up in topics we shared... Do you not believe that Jesus was God incarnate? Not very God of very God?

This might explain your extreme opposition to the Apostle's Creed in said topic.

 

[shad]

two, was jesus only a man to you?

Jesus had to be a man to be the Lamb of God. He accomplished what Adam could not. Jesus was a man yet He was sinless; that's what made our salvation real. His sacrifice itself worth a great deal which none of us could do.

 

[Mike]

two, was jesus only a man to you?

Jesus had to be a man to be the Lamb of God. He accomplished what Adam could not. Jesus was a man yet He was sinless; that's what made our salvation real. His sacrifice itself worth a great deal which none of us could do.

So, I take that as a "no" to my question, although not directed at me. And a "yes" that this is your issue with the Apostles Creed. No? :gah

 

[shad]

shad, this is something I guess I never picked up in topics we shared... Do you not believe that Jesus was God incarnate? Not very God of very God?

Jesus was sent by His and our Father, as a Lamb.

This might explain your extreme opposition to the Apostle's Creed in said topic.

I am oppose to the trinity doctrine because trinitarians use it to ostracize non-trinitarians as non-believers. I have nothing in particular against any creed.

 

[ORwarriOR]

I have a hard time believing that Jesus was God incarnate. I fully believe that Jesus was my savior, I'll never ever deny that. Jesus did say things like ["Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone. Luke 18:19], he always refferred to God as the father, and he even said "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.'" [Luke 4:8].

Iunno, when I go to church and they elevate Christ above God it almost makes something in the back of my head feel guilty. Like "hey this doesn't feel right" so a lot of the songs I don't even sing a long with. I figure even if Jesus is God, then I'm sure he won't mind if I don't acknowledge it based on my "I don't know for sure" logic, considering if I am worshiping God, and they are one in the same; what difference does it make?

 

[Mike]

I am oppose to the trinity doctrine because trinitarians use it to ostracize non-trinitarians as non-believers. I have nothing in particular against any creed.

hmmm?

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=47943&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15#p582636

So Jesus was NOT fully man and fully God?

 

[Mike]

Iunno, when I go to church and they elevate Christ above God it almost makes something in the back of my head feel guilty. Like "hey this doesn't feel right" so a lot of the songs I don't even sing a long with.

If you feel your church is elevating Jesus above God, the either you're wrong or you need to find a new church. Jesus is NOT elevated above God the Father in the Christian faith. They are One, yet they are three. Jesus referred to God the Father while He was in the flesh.

The scripture has been argued at length here on this board. Your topic is "do you have to believe in the Trinity, than what?" I would say, that's up to you to seek in prayer. I'm not in position to say "what". I'm in position to say what "is".

Now, we're getting into the area where this topic might need to be move to "Christianity & Other Religions". The entire New Testament is built on Jesus being God in the flesh.

 

[shad]

I am oppose to the trinity doctrine because trinitarians use it to ostracize non-trinitarians as non-believers. I have nothing in particular against any creed.

hmmm?

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=47943&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15#p582636

Ok, I chided in but it is no big deal to me. I can take it or leave it.

So Jesus was NOT fully man and fully God?

I will not get into a debate. I am only concerned with what is essential, to accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior. And serve Him with all my might and strive to obey everything He commands. It seems that that is not good enough for trinitarians but I dont worry about it. It's my conviction and that's what I spread.

We know we don't agree, so why do you want to debate all over? It's been dabated tons of times already.

 

[Mike]

I am oppose to the trinity doctrine because trinitarians use it to ostracize non-trinitarians as non-believers. I have nothing in particular against any creed.

hmmm?

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=47943&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15#p582636

Ok, I chided in but it is no big deal to me. I can take it or leave it.

So Jesus was NOT fully man and fully God?

I will not get into a debate. I am only concerned with what is essential, to accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior. And serve Him with all my might and strive to obey everything He commands. It seems that that is not good enough for trinitarians but I dont worry about it. It's my conviction and that's what I spread.

We know we don't agree, so why do you want to debate all over? It's been dabated tons of times already.

OH MY GOSH!!

jesus' Divinity is essential to the Trinity. You made the issue the topic of conversation in your OP!

 

[shad]

OH MY GOSH!!

jesus' Divinity is essential to the Trinity. You made the issue the topic of conversation in your OP!

Here you go, the same kind of comment made by trinitarians. Are you saying that Jesus being the Son of God and Savior of the world and being sent by His Father as the Lamb is not essential?

BTW, you sound so hostil.

 

[jasoncran]

if the lord jesus is only a man, that how can the sins of the world be paid for?

 

[shad]

if the lord jesus is only a man, that how can the sins of the world be paid for?

He was only a man but He was sinless; that's what made our salvation possible.

 

[jasoncran]

if the lord jesus is only a man, that how can the sins of the world be paid for?

He was only a man but He was sinless; that's what made our salvation possible.

so, how does only a man, reciever worship? its a sin to worship anything but GOD. a man cant forgive sins.

 

[Tina]

He was only a man but He was sinless; that's what made our salvation possible.

So you have reduced Jesus to only a sinless man ...

How do you interprete this scripture --- John 10:30 - " I and My Father are ONE" ?

 

[ORwarriOR]

He was only a man but He was sinless; that's what made our salvation possible.

So you have reduced Jesus to only a sinless man ...

How do you interprete this scripture --- John 10:30 - " I and My Father are ONE" ?

I have a hard time accepting the gospel of John. I don't know why, and I pray to the lord to allow me to feel different about him. But it just seems so... off from the other three gospels. Even the chronological order is different, like when he went to the temple and flipped the tables. And it's the only one that elevates Christ with the "I am" statements, and almost takes away some of his humility that's present in the other books. I guess the part that bugs me the most about the gospel of John is he describes himself as "the beloved disciple" I just don't see the humility in that.

So who knows, I won't slander the man, and I'd hate to make any blasphemous statements, but I feel the three gospels were enough for me to understand who Christ was, and what his message was; and those are the ones I truly live my life by. Usually when something doesn't fit my beliefs of who God is, it relates back to the book of john, while everything else I believe in is in perfect sync with the rest of the bible. I dunno, it just gives me bad vibes.

Hrm I dunno I, I've been reading into some old testament prophesies, and some more proof from the first three books, and it does seem to line up with the trinity idea. I guess I'll just have to talk to my minister more about all this when I have my one on one with him.

 

[shad]

He was only a man but He was sinless; that's what made our salvation possible.

So you have reduced Jesus to only a sinless man ...

Only sinless? Is anyone man sinless?

How do you interprete this scripture --- John 10:30 - " I and My Father are ONE" ?

This is so simple yet you make it complicated. God and Jesus are one in their purposes. Jesus is one with His Father because He will do anything He is told to do. He is perfect example for us to imitate.

 

[jasoncran]

can anyone man survive and walk after the cat of nine tails?
most men never lived past the tenth lash

 

[shad]

if the lord jesus is only a man, that how can the sins of the world be paid for?

He was only a man but He was sinless; that's what made our salvation possible.

so, how does only a man, reciever worship? its a sin to worship anything but GOD. a man cant forgive sins.

I already told you Jesus is sinless. He is not just a man, but the most important thing about Him that makes Him so special is that He is sinless and able to be the Lamb of God. No man who has ever lived is sinless, not even one. That's why His Father tells us to listen to Jesus.

That doesn't mean He is God.