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if one doest accept the trinity then what was jesus?

shad said:
The word "Father" is used as Leading role, not as male or female. There is no genders in spritual beings. God and the angels are spirital beings.

Hi shad

Yes, God is Spirit, and angels are spirit beings. Yes there are genders in spirit beings !

Throughout the whole Word of God, a whore is a female gender. Be it in the physical realm or in the spiritual realm.

Here is an example in the spiritual realm - Revelation 17:1 and Rev. 17:16 - "---- these shall hate the whore , and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire"

God changed Jacob's name to Israel. The name Israel carries with it both genders. The man Israel. ---- And the nation Israel is the female. God gave Israel (the nation) a writ of divorcement. God also , when talking about the nation of Israel, told Israel that they went about whoring after other gods - Ref: Judges 8:33 and Leviticus 17:7
 
Mysteryman said:
Mohrb said:
A JW agreeing with a catholic:

I agree that God "Creating man and woman in his image" doesn't mean that God is physically either male or female. It's unlikely that we have the PHYSICAL form of God because there's no reason to believe that God has a specific finite physical form. However, unlike animals, we have freedom of choice rather than being simply drawn by instinct. We were created as a life form higher than animals. Our morality and spirituality is what makes us in God's (spiritual) image. That's what he meant in Psalms 82:6 (and referenced in John 10:34). Although humans are called Elohim (or theoi)... we're not literally deities. But, qualitatively we are "godlike" to the extent that we're in God's (spiritual) image... and as Jesus so vividly put in John 17... by serving God, we're in union with the Father JUST AS the Son is.

... it's not about physical characteristics. Yes, God is generally referred to with masculine pronouns. However God is no more "male" than "female." He's just not a sexual being. And "he" is only used for lack of a better term (considering "it" doesn't tend to be seen as "respectful" even though nonsexual terms would likely be more accurate). In the end... Jesus called him his "Father"... therefore we refer to "him" as "Him."

---------------

Hi Chris

God is also our Father, which is male gender. This has nothing to do with sex ! We are dealing with spirituality, not physicality.

Of course we are dealing with male and female when it pertains to God. We are speaking spiritually , and if you do not believe that the image of God, is as God has described throughout His Word, then you are missing the whole picture.

A father is of the male gender , both mankind as well as animal kind, as well as spiritual kind.

Father - he - him = male gender

mother - her - she = female gender

The Bible is using human analogy terms, not stating that "Father" is the male gender. Does the bible ever call God "male" or "man"? "He" is the pronoun we use because we associate God as Father first, and males are fathers. However, this is human useage, not spiritual useage. We don't have a neutral gender pronoun that can refer to a person ("it" won't do for a personal God).

WE image Him. WE, male and female. BOTH TOGETHER. God transcends gender talk. The role of the human male as Father is "LIKE" God the Father's role as a provider and protector in a partriachical society.

God is not male gender, He also is loving, caring and gentle, which are considered female charecteristics. Gender refers to the material world.
 
MM,

I bring up what Jesus says about it later because I have to go now.

Anyway, the more I get to know you the more you are losing me. You dont even acknowledge that Jesus sasy to "love your enemy", making it up as if complicated commandment.

I will stop responding to you after this. I won't deal with rabbit chasing discussion.
 
Mysteryman said:
Hi shad

Yes, God is Spirit, and angels are spirit beings. Yes there are genders in spirit beings !

No, there is not. We use human words to describe the spiritual, but they are not entirely accurate. We attempt to describe and explain something using materialistic ideas, but they fall short of reality. There is no gender in the spiritual world, no sex, no "male and female" angels.

Mysteryman said:
Throughout the whole Word of God, a whore is a female gender. Be it in the physical realm or in the spiritual realm.

Here is an example in the spiritual realm - Revelation 17:1 and Rev. 17:16 - "---- these shall hate the whore , and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire".

The "whore" is not in the spiritual realm, it is an analogy that refers to a material thing.

We use human pronouns to describe angels, for example, but that is because we don't have neutral gender pronouns that describe a personal creature, since all rational creatures in the material world are one of two genders. When describing spiritual creatures, we use "he", but it is not because spiritual beings are male gender.

Mysteryman said:
God changed Jacob's name to Israel. The name Israel carries with it both genders. The man Israel. ---- And the nation Israel is the female. God gave Israel (the nation) a writ of divorcement. God also , when talking about the nation of Israel, told Israel that they went about whoring after other gods - Ref: Judges 8:33 and Leviticus 17:7

Israel describes two different things, but both refer to material things. Not spiritual things. Nations are ordinarily called "she", just as boats are called "she", even though they possess no gender charecteristics, per sec. Human analogy sees "nation" as our "mother", loving and caring for those who live within her. But it is all analogy, a nation is not specifically "female".
 
Quote francis : "Genesis 1 says God created man, which consists of two persons, male and female. How is man, MALE AND FEMALE, in God's image? "
----------

Hi Joe :

God created man < singular , because God is One !

God caused a deep sleep of this one man, and took a rib out of this one man, and God made woman.

God created this one man, in the image of God = One

Both this one man, and this one God, were both male and female in One .

Once God took the female out of man, and made woman, then God told them to become One again.

God did the same to himself. The female side of God is the Jerusalem that is above, who is free, and the mother of us all, yet barren. The New Jerusalem will come together in the marriage to the Lamb and become one again. In the spirit realm, spirits were not made to procreate. But they are male and female. In heaven, the spirits are only male. Those cast out of heaven are female in gender. God did not make them to mulitiply. So God did not make angels in His image, but he did create man in the image of God.

God had one seed, the promise seed, which became the promised Son of God.

Jesus was the son of man, through Mary, and the Son of God by way of his heavenly Father. Jesus was both, one of the terrestrial and the other of the celestial. Jesus came in the flesh, by way of his mother, Mary. The Holy Spirit overshadowed Mary, and Mary became pregnant. This shows that the Holy Spirit and the Father are actually the one and self same.
 
francisdesales said:
Mysteryman said:
Mohrb said:
A JW agreeing with a catholic:

I agree that God "Creating man and woman in his image" doesn't mean that God is physically either male or female. It's unlikely that we have the PHYSICAL form of God because there's no reason to believe that God has a specific finite physical form. However, unlike animals, we have freedom of choice rather than being simply drawn by instinct. We were created as a life form higher than animals. Our morality and spirituality is what makes us in God's (spiritual) image. That's what he meant in Psalms 82:6 (and referenced in John 10:34). Although humans are called Elohim (or theoi)... we're not literally deities. But, qualitatively we are "godlike" to the extent that we're in God's (spiritual) image... and as Jesus so vividly put in John 17... by serving God, we're in union with the Father JUST AS the Son is.

... it's not about physical characteristics. Yes, God is generally referred to with masculine pronouns. However God is no more "male" than "female." He's just not a sexual being. And "he" is only used for lack of a better term (considering "it" doesn't tend to be seen as "respectful" even though nonsexual terms would likely be more accurate). In the end... Jesus called him his "Father"... therefore we refer to "him" as "Him."

---------------

Hi Chris

God is also our Father, which is male gender. This has nothing to do with sex ! We are dealing with spirituality, not physicality.

Of course we are dealing with male and female when it pertains to God. We are speaking spiritually , and if you do not believe that the image of God, is as God has described throughout His Word, then you are missing the whole picture.

A father is of the male gender , both mankind as well as animal kind, as well as spiritual kind.

Father - he - him = male gender

mother - her - she = female gender

The Bible is using human analogy terms, not stating that "Father" is the male gender. Does the bible ever call God "male" or "man"? "He" is the pronoun we use because we associate God as Father first, and males are fathers. However, this is human useage, not spiritual useage. We don't have a neutral gender pronoun that can refer to a person ("it" won't do for a personal God).

WE image Him. WE, male and female. BOTH TOGETHER. God transcends gender talk. The role of the human male as Father is "LIKE" God the Father's role as a provider and protector in a partriachical society.

God is not male gender, He also is loving, caring and gentle, which are considered female charecteristics. Gender refers to the material world.

-------------

Hi Joe :

You may never understand this, but you couldn't be further from the truth ! Genders do not refer to the material world !

No, God is never refered to as man. But God is refered to as our dear heavenly Father. In order to be a Father, this means he took upon himself a male gender role, when refering to him as our Father.

In Ephesians 4:6 - "One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all"
 
shad said:
MM,

I bring up what Jesus says about it later because I have to go now.

Anyway, the more I get to know you the more you are losing me. You dont even acknowledge that Jesus sasy to "love your enemy", making it up as if complicated commandment.

I will stop responding to you after this. I won't deal with rabbit chasing discussion.

Hi shad :

Well, that is totally up to you. Just remember, in spiritual growth, some , like yourself, are still growing spiritually. When your ready, just look me up and we will talk.

Take care
 
Mysteryman said:
francisdesales said:
: "Genesis 1 says God created man, which consists of two persons, male and female. How is man, MALE AND FEMALE, in God's image? "

Hi Joe :

God created man < singular , because God is One !

Male and female He created them. Man is singular, consisting of two persons, male and female.
God is also singular, consisting of three persons, Father, Son and Spirit. Man is in God's image because the singular Being, man, consists of multiple composite persons, just as God is a singular Being consisting of multiple composite persons.

Mysteryman said:
God caused a deep sleep of this one man, and took a rib out of this one man, and God made woman.

And Adam said, This [is] now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. Gen 2:23

You are refering to Genesis 2, which does not discuss the composite man being in the image of God. Nothing is said here about the image of God in man. The point of this description is not about how man is in God's image, but the relationship between male and female. Thus, the question at hand needs to remain within the context of Chapter one. Taking Genesis 1:26-27 and Gen 2:23 at face value is a contradiction. Thus, we must understand that the two citations are speaking analogously about two different things.

The pertinent section of Scriptures that describe how man is made in God's image is in Chapter 1, so we need to refer to chapter one.

So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Gen 1:27

Now, again, HOW is male and female in God's image? WHY is male and female a necessity to be in God's image?

Mysteryman said:
God created this one man, in the image of God = One

A oneness that consists of two persons, male and female, not a solitary person.

Mysteryman said:
Once God took the female out of man, and made woman, then God told them to become One again.

Again, you are mixing your analogies up. Chapter one deals with how man is in God's image.

Mysteryman said:
God did the same to himself.

Sorry, the bible presumes that God WAS ALREADY of a particular nature BEFORE He created man in HIS IMAGE. You have your order backwards. To be an image, something must ALREADY exist. Naturally, Jerusalem did not yet exist for God to make a reflection of Himself. God is not Jerusalem, nor the Church. Thus, these are not components of His nature that God would use to "image" Himself.

The analogy regarding the New Jerusalem and the Church is made AFTER THE FACT, where THEY are made in the image of a REGENERATED mankind, and only by analogy, not ontologically.
 
Mysteryman said:
You may never understand this, but you couldn't be further from the truth ! Genders do not refer to the material world !

No, God is never refered to as man. But God is refered to as our dear heavenly Father.

Only because we are using human terms from a patriarchical age to describe God, not the other way around.

If women were head of the house and provided all that the family needed to subsist financially, then this new FEMALE role would describe God. It is the human paradigm where WE define God's role.

NOT HIS GENDER in the spiritual world!
 
francisdesales said:
Mysteryman said:
You may never understand this, but you couldn't be further from the truth ! Genders do not refer to the material world !

No, God is never refered to as man. But God is refered to as our dear heavenly Father.

Only because we are using human terms from a patriarchical age to describe God, not the other way around.

If women were head of the house and provided all that the family needed to subsist financially, then this new FEMALE role would describe God. It is the human paradigm where WE define God's role.

NOT HIS GENDER in the spiritual world!

------------

Hi Joe:

All you are giving me is your philosophical point of view. This is a man made view, because you do not understand the spiritual implication.

Have a nice day
 
Mysteryman said:
God created man < singular , because God is One !

Ok, so your talking about Gen 1:27 right?... After all, you've stated that man was created in chapter 1, but he was formed in chapter 2. Thus, according to your own definitions, you're talking about chapter 1, verse 27. I can dig up where you have clearly defined these two terms and post if need be.

Mysteryman said:
God caused a deep sleep of this one man, and took a rib out of this one man, and God made woman.

This is chapter 2 correct?

Yet you say,

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=48396&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=8th+day&start=30
Mysteryman said:
So on the eighth day , God formed the man from the dust of the earth, after he caused it to rain. Man died in that day, during that 1000 years, and Adam died at 930 years of age.
According to you math on the other topic, this occured 8,000 years into creation.

Joe said:
So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Gen 1:27

Now, again, HOW is male and female in God's image? WHY is male and female a necessity to be in God's image?
I would like to hear your explanation to Joe since according to what you have written in the other topic that I've linked, what occured in chapter two occured 8,000 years after what occured in Chapter 1, verse 27 since it is clear that what occured in 1:27 was on the 6th day, which in your terms, would have been 6,000 years into creation.

Now then, if it is as you've said,
Mysteryman said:
Once God took the female out of man, and made woman, then God told them to become One again.

Then clearly according to what you've posted elswhere, this occured 2 thousand years after man was created in the image of God (1:27). Thus, the command for 'them' to be fruitful and mulitply doesnt' occur for another 2,000 years?

So ya really need to help me out here Hervy cause I'm honestly confused with your theology. :shrug

Was this man in Genesis 1, who was created in the image of God, both male and female the same man who 2,000 years later is 'formed' from the dust of the earth, and through God's divine breath made a 'living soul' to which at that time, God takes the woman out of him, then puts them back together?

If he wasn't a 'living soul' until day 8, what was he the previous 2,000 years?

Also, wouldn't his total lifespan really be 2,930 years or don't the first 2,000 count because he wasn't really a "Living Soul" the first 2,000 years of his life?

According to what you have written on the board, this is the picutre you are painting.
 
Forum:
GOD IS A SPIRIT. Only ONE that we are told [IS] the HOLY GHOST or AND THE HOLY SPIRIT! Again GOD IS a Spirit!! John 4:24

Christ/God & Father/God HAVE AN IMAGE. (if one BELIEVES the WORD OF GOD with the Holy Spirits Inspiration?? Or the Word as penned as the God/Christ?? 2 Peter 1:20-21 & John 1:1-3)

OK: ONLY [[[GOD]] HAS IMMORTALITY! Not any creation on THEIRS! GOD/FATHER GOD/CHRIST GOD/HOLY SPIRIT & OR HOLY GHOST, and these Three have been ETERNALLY 3 Separate individuals. Heb. 13:8

1 John 5:7-8
'For there [ARE THREE] that bear RECORD IN HEAVEN, [THE FATHER], THE [WORD], and the [HOLY GHOST:] and [THESE THREE ARE ONE.] And there are [THREE THAT BEAR RECORD IN EARTH], the [SPIRIT], (if one is Born Again! other/wise His Gen. 6:3's STRIVING is only 'felt' but rejected!) and the water, and the blood: and [THESE THREE AGREE IN ONE].' (UNITY! UNITED FAMILY OF GOD, like we are supposed to be.)

'.. Who is blessed and only Potentate, the King of Kings, and Lord of Lords; [WHO ONLY HAS IMMORTALITY], dwelling in the LIGHT WHICH NO MAN CAN APPROACH unto..'

'Now unto the King [[ETERNAL]] [[IMMORTAL]], [[INVISIBLE, the [[ONLY WISE GOD]]..'

Again: TWO with an IMAGE as previously stated by this GOD/HOLY/SPIRIT INSPIRATION + the WORD/CHRIST GOD, and all in UNITY as ONE with God the Father as now understood.

And still one must remember that CHRIST IS THE CENTERPIECE of this Eternal/plan after Adam fell, and He came to be the second Adam, & EARTH which was lost by the first Adam was to be reclaimed by Christ/man (Perfect/man!) (compare Isa. 42:21)

--Elijah
 
Posted Today, 08:27 AM (on another site along the same subject)

Hi, Elijah here:
Of all the 12 Apostles + Paul, John was around the longest. Rev. 22 we see penned in AD 96. And surely the Holy Spirit would have corrected any faulty [INSPIRATION] given in all the Bible if it had been faulty? by his pen. Look at all of his books from John 1-3 of even the N.T.. Also, if 2 John 1:9 is as we BELIEVE?? 'Whosoever transgresseth, [and abideth not IN THE DOCTRINE OF CHRIST, HATH NOT GOD]..' So, there is NO doubt for me that the Bible leaves John believing in the 'True' Doctrine of Christ.

OK: Now for the Pro. 8 passages . Remember that Christ was not yet the Son of God! See Psalms 1:7 + Heb. 1:1-5. with verse 5 saying 'Shall Be' a Son. It is important with reading these verses of Proverbs [PROPHECY]. I will jump in between some verse here to just have us [THINK!] ;)



----, on 13 July 2010 - 01:36 AM, said:

Here is Scripture where Jesus is speaking.

Pro 8:22 Jehovah (The Father) possessed me (Jesus) in the beginning of his way, Before his works of old.

---
OK: This above also says that God had a [BEGINNING] That is not true either! The correct understanding as 'i' understand it, (Matt. 4:4 + 2 Tim. 3:16's requirement of Doctrine.. OF CHRIST) is that the GODHEAD of the Immortal three in Unity had Eternally had a future [PLAN] called the Rev. 14:6 ETERNAL GOSPEL, when it was known that it would be needed!
---


Pro 8:23 I (Jesus) was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, Before the earth was.
Pro 8:24 When there were no depths, I (Jesus) was brought forth (From the Father), When there were no fountains abounding with water.
Pro 8:25 Before the mountains were settled, Before the hills was I (Jesus)brought forth; (from the Father)

---
Set up?? From eternity! [IMMORTAL in all directions]. So once again, we see here, two that mankind was created in the [IMAGE] of, at least. But the [PLAN] was only [Eternally Know] & not yet needed! Got that??
---


Pro 8:26 While as yet he (The Father) had not made the earth, nor the fields, Nor the beginning of the dust of the world.
Pro 8:27 When he (The Father) established the heavens, I (Jesus) was there: When he (The Father) set a circle upon the face of the deep,
Pro 8:28 When he made firm the skies above, When the fountains of the deep became strong,
Pro 8:29 When he gave to the sea its bound, That the waters should not transgress his commandment, When he marked out the foundations of the earth;

Pro 8:30 Then I (Jesus) was by him (The Father), as a master workman; And I (Jesus) was daily his (The Father's) delight, Rejoicing always before him,(The Father)
Pro 8:31 Rejoicing in his habitable earth; And my delight was with the sons of men.

---
OK: Pay 'close' attention! The above has told about Christ the Son in the [Prophesied] future plan! The forknowledge of the Godhead were all delighted in foreseeing the future plan unfold even before Christ BECAME THE SON/OF/GOD! In Rom. 4:17's last part of the verse we see Truth that might help one see how God this truth? ''.. even God, who quickeneth the dead, [AND CALLETH THOSE THINGS WHICH ARE NOT (yet!) AS THOUGH THEY WERE].' Such as 'Rejoicing in His habitable earth; An My [DELIGHT WAS WITH THE SON'S OF MEN].' (and when did this take place?? )

You can rest ASSURED that Christ before His birth on earth was one of the Godhead! (just not the Son yet. Acts 7:38)
We are told that God is a Spirit. Two with an Image, and the third God calling Himself Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit. When Adam forfeited his domain of earth by sin to satan, this is where the Plan was put into motion with Christ even leaving his Godly power of being omnipresent behind until He went back to heaven faithful as the second Adam, and then the Holy Spirit was again seen in full power representing Christ omnipresent to the world.
---
 
StoveBolts said:
So ya really need to help me out here Hervy cause I'm honestly confused with your theology. :shrug

Join the club. I've been waiting for clarification of the following for a while now.

God is Spirit ! True, Jesus Christ was not created, I agree. He was born of the virgin Mary, and the Holy Spirit overshadowed Mary. Jesus the Christ, is both, the son of man and the Son of God. Thus, his flesh is of man, which was taken from the earth. However, his seed is spiritual, which comes from his Father. Jesus the Christ is the seed Son of God - speaking spiritually.
 
francisdesales said:
Mysteryman said:
francisdesales said:
: "Genesis 1 says God created man, which consists of two persons, male and female. How is man, MALE AND FEMALE, in God's image? "

Hi Joe :

God created man < singular , because God is One !

Male and female He created them. Man is singular, consisting of two persons, male and female.
God is also singular, consisting of three persons, Father, Son and Spirit. Man is in God's image because the singular Being, man, consists of multiple composite persons, just as God is a singular Being consisting of multiple composite persons.

Mysteryman said:
God caused a deep sleep of this one man, and took a rib out of this one man, and God made woman.

And Adam said, This [is] now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. Gen 2:23

You are refering to Genesis 2, which does not discuss the composite man being in the image of God. Nothing is said here about the image of God in man. The point of this description is not about how man is in God's image, but the relationship between male and female. Thus, the question at hand needs to remain within the context of Chapter one. Taking Genesis 1:26-27 and Gen 2:23 at face value is a contradiction. Thus, we must understand that the two citations are speaking analogously about two different things.

The pertinent section of Scriptures that describe how man is made in God's image is in Chapter 1, so we need to refer to chapter one.

So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Gen 1:27

Now, again, HOW is male and female in God's image? WHY is male and female a necessity to be in God's image?

Mysteryman said:
God created this one man, in the image of God = One

A oneness that consists of two persons, male and female, not a solitary person.

Mysteryman said:
Once God took the female out of man, and made woman, then God told them to become One again.

Again, you are mixing your analogies up. Chapter one deals with how man is in God's image.

Mysteryman said:
God did the same to himself.

Sorry, the bible presumes that God WAS ALREADY of a particular nature BEFORE He created man in HIS IMAGE. You have your order backwards. To be an image, something must ALREADY exist. Naturally, Jerusalem did not yet exist for God to make a reflection of Himself. God is not Jerusalem, nor the Church. Thus, these are not components of His nature that God would use to "image" Himself.

The analogy regarding the New Jerusalem and the Church is made AFTER THE FACT, where THEY are made in the image of a REGENERATED mankind, and only by analogy, not ontologically.

Hi Joe :

There is not one scripture which states that the image of God is three persons ! Not one !

And to correct you one more time --- male and female can refer to mankind, animal kind, plants, and spiritual kind.
 
Quote StoveBolts (Jeff) : "I would like to hear your explanation to Joe since according to what you have written in the other topic that I've linked, what occured in chapter two occured 8,000 years after what occured in Chapter 1, verse 27 since it is clear that what occured in 1:27 was on the 6th day, which in your terms, would have been 6,000 years into creation.

Now then, if it is as you've said,
Mysteryman wrote:
Once God took the female out of man, and made woman, then God told them to become One again.

Then clearly according to what you've posted elswhere, this occured 2 thousand years after man was created in the image of God (1:27). Thus, the command for 'them' to be fruitful and mulitply doesnt' occur for another 2,000 years?

So ya really need to help me out here Hervy cause I'm honestly confused with your theology.
----------------------

Hi Jeff :

Yes, each day is a thousand years of man, but only one day with God. Hang onto that, because that is the key to the explanation.

In Gen.1:27 God created man - singular, both male and female in the one man Adam. This occured in day 6, on the seventh day, God rested, another thousand years of man. God formed man from the dust of the earth on day eight, which simply comes after day 7.

Now I will try and clarify something for you, or at least attempt to do so. When God created man in Gen. 1:27 , man was just created. This deals with the image of God being one. Also, this also deals with the "kind" = mankind. What you and others have to try and realize, is that man had not been formed yet, nor had anything begun to grow yet, because God had not caused it to rain as of yet - Gen. 2:5. What God was setting up was "seed" of its own kind. Gen. 1:11 and verse 24 and 25.

God rested on the seventh day from what God had made and created - Gen. 2:3

On day eight, God caused it to rain - Gen. 2:6

Also on day eight, God formed man from the (wet) dust of the earth. (mankind is approx 66 % water).

Also on day eight, God took this seed and planted it in the garden - Gen. 2:8 and 9, and God caused it to grow. And there he put the man.

Also on day eight, God formed every beast of the field and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to name them . Gen. 2:19

Notice that God formed man out of the dust (wet) of the ground, before the beasts and the fowl. Yet, in day six, God created man, and made the beast of the earth after its kind, and every creeping thing, and creature after its kind, and cattle after its kind. But God had not formed them as of yet. This occured on day eight, along with man, who was formed first.

God said it was not good for man to be alone. But at this point in time, man was alone. The one man , which was both male and female, was alone.

God caused a deep sleep upon the man Adam, and God took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh. And God made woman from this rib. Gen. 2:21 and 22. Then in verse 23 Adam speaks, and says - "This is now bone of my bone and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called woman. The woman , the female side of Adam, was taken from the one man Adam, and God made woman. This all occured during the early part of day eight.

Adam ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, and as God told Adam, that in that day that thou eatest thereof, thou shalt surely die. Adam was formed first, and in day eight, that day, 930 years later, the man Adam died -- "in that day".

Adam was both male and female, and was created on the sixth day, and formed on the eighth day and died in the eighth day - 930 years of man's years, but in that eighth day, that day , that God said he would surely die. Each day being 1,000 years of man, Adam died, in that day.

The image of God, is that of One, both male and female. After God seperated the male from the female, and made woman. God made it clear, that the two become one again. One flesh, which is God's way of saying, be fruitful now and mulitiply. But before they came together as one flesh, Adam disobeyed God. All three were guilty . 1. The Man, Adam 2. The woman, Eve and 3. the serpent

God is also male and female, and God likewise seperated himself - spiritually.

The Jerusalem that is above, is free, and the mother of us all, yet barren.

Then there is one final marriage, and it is between the New Jerusalem and the Lamb (God). This is the female side of God , coming back together to become one again .

Now I fully understand, that the New Jerusalem is the Holy city. So we are dealing with a euphemism. Nonetheless, God is expressing to us the image of God, which is both male and female and the two becoming one again. Which is also the image of God in the marriage to Christ and the body of Christ. < Colossians 1:15 and 3:10

Jesus Christ was born, but the revealed Mystery , which deals with Christ as the head of the body of Christ, is a creation. Ephesians 2:10

I pray this helps in some way.
 
Question from Jeff : "Also, wouldn't his total lifespan really be 2,930 years or don't the first 2,000 count because he wasn't really a "Living Soul" the first 2,000 years of his life?"

----------------------

Hi Jeff :

I though I would handle this seperately.

Adam did not have life until God breathed into the nostriles of the man Adam, and Adam became a living soul. This is when the life of Adam started.

Bless
 
Mysteryman said:
Hi Joe:

All you are giving me is your philosophical point of view. This is a man made view, because you do not understand the spiritual implication.

Have a nice day

Ah, thanks, that was an easy way to get out of this crazy argument of yours...
 
StoveBolts said:
Mysteryman said:
God caused a deep sleep of this one man, and took a rib out of this one man, and God made woman.

This is chapter 2 correct?

Mysteryman said:
So on the eighth day , God formed the man from the dust of the earth, after he caused it to rain. Man died in that day, during that 1000 years, and Adam died at 930 years of age.
stovebolts said:
According to you math on the other topic, this occured 8,000 years into creation.

Holy pickled rat cajones, praise be that I didn't see THIS part of the "argument" that now is spiraling out of control into "never-never" land...

francisdesales said:
So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Gen 1:27

Now, again, HOW is male and female in God's image? WHY is male and female a necessity to be in God's image?

stovebolts said:
I would like to hear your explanation to Joe since according to what you have written in the other topic that I've linked, what occured in chapter two occured 8,000 years after what occured in Chapter 1, verse 27 since it is clear that what occured in 1:27 was on the 6th day, which in your terms, would have been 6,000 years into creation.

:biglol :confused :shrug

StoveBolts said:
So ya really need to help me out here Hervy cause I'm honestly confused with your theology. :shrug

:amen

I think it is being invented and reinvented as we speak...
 
Mysteryman said:
I pray this helps in some way.

It helps, alright...


Mysteryman said:
In Gen.1:27 God created man - singular, both male and female in the one man Adam. This occured in day 6, on the seventh day, God rested, another thousand years of man. God formed man from the dust of the earth on day eight, which simply comes after day 7.

...

Notice that God formed man out of the dust (wet) of the ground, before the beasts and the fowl. Yet, in day six, God created man, and made the beast of the earth after its kind, and every creeping thing, and creature after its kind, and cattle after its kind. But God had not formed them as of yet. This occured on day eight, along with man, who was formed first.

God said it was not good for man to be alone. But at this point in time, man was alone. The one man , which was both male and female, was alone.

God caused a deep sleep upon the man Adam, and God took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh. And God made woman from this rib.

Genesis 1:27 ALREADY has God creating man, Adam and Eve, on day 6! God didn't create on "Day 8"!!! HE saw ALL of creation and called it "very good". Man was already created - male and female. Man consisted of male and female on day 6.

Any attempt to make Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 flow together as ONE CONTINUOUS story is doomed to failure. They are two stories of two different emphasis on the same event, until the discussion moves to the Garden and the Tempter...
 
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