is hell real? and if so is it eternal?

[shad]

Perishing means to perish. To die.

Absolutely!

We will have second death if we are not faithful to Jesus until the end. It is death. Death does not mean we will live in hell fire.

 

[ORwarriOR]

things can perish very slooooooowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwllllllllllllllllllllllllly. ie some foods take a while to good bad.

shoot last year i had wild bananas that i cut from the tree and it took two months for them to ripen!

Exactly but eventually it still perishes. God gave us the choice between life or death. Not between life and life in eternal punishment. If you are conscious in hell is it not still life? If a soul dies can it still be brought back, or would that be eternal as well? The parable of Lazarus and the rich man indicates that no it can't, it indicates that yes he's still going to suffer. But every other evidence in the bible still points to the fact that he will die.

Again do you think Ghandi suffer the exact same fate as hitler? Or do you think God will want to make hitler pay more for his sins...


@WM Tipton; that is suffering to those who will worship the beast during his end time revival. That was taken out of context.

Obviously, this takes place at Christ's second coming.

Those who have a part in this system of "Babylon," and who receive this frightful punishment from Almighty God, have "no rest day or night" as long as they remain in that land falling under God's wrath. They will either have to flee that area and seek God's mercy or be tormented by fire and sulfurous fumes until they perish.

Notice that verse 11 says, "The smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever," not that these individuals will be tormented forever in an ever-burning hell. God is not a sadist who wishes to torment His enemies perpetually. He clearly says in Romans 6:23 that "that wages of sin is death," and that is what is being described here: a death of well-deserved but short-lived agony.

Read more: http://www.cgg.org/index.cfm/fuseaction ... z0s7BpTdeX

Also death is death, you can't redifine the word to fit your own disgustingly sadistic doctrine. Unless you want to redefine perish too :/

 

[jasoncran]

yes, does god make a disticntion in sin, if one dies from the only one sin, despite the a trillion good works doesn that make God evil to you.

sin must be punished, no matter how big or small.

 

[ORwarriOR]

2 Peter 2:12
But these men blaspheme in matters they do not understand. They are like brute beasts, creatures of instinct, born only to be caught and destroyed, and like beasts they too will perish.

The verse you have just read shows that the wicked will be destroyed/perish like beasts. Now if that somehow means that the wicked suffer eternal torment, then we can only conclude given that argument that animals will also suffer eternal torment. Doesn't sound right to me, I would suggest that both are destroyed ie: they no longer exist.
http://www.heaven.net.nz/answers/answer26.htm

So you guys believe God is going to torture all his beautiful animals for all of eternity too?

 

[Guest]

Perishing means to perish. To die.

Absolutely!

We will have second death if we are not faithful to Jesus until the end. It is death. Death does not mean we will live in hell fire.

Oh boy...here we go....I shoulda figured.

Sorry but your simply wrong...yet again.
Scripture shows quite conclusively, as already proven, that many WILL be perpetually tormented in this 'lake of fire'
And, again...sorry, handwaving away the evidence wont change the facts.

 

[Guest]

So you guys believe God is going to torture all his beautiful animals for all of eternity too?

Hmmmm....Red Herring or a Strawman...which one is it ?

Sorry but the animals arent included in the plan of salvation....MAN sinned and MAN is the one needing redemption. What God does with His animal Kingdom is His own choice....but it is not relevant to the discussion about human beings and our eternal destiny.

 

[ORwarriOR]

If what you believe is true, how could you enjoy heaven knowing millions upon millions of people are suffering? It doesn't matter if animals are included in salvation or not. Christ came to save us from death. Not eternal torture. That verse clearly says they will perish LIKE animals. It doesn't say "They too will perish but suffer eternity of torment"

 

[Guest]

yes, does god make a disticntion in sin, if one dies from the only one sin, despite the a trillion good works doesn that make God evil to you.

sin must be punished, no matter how big or small.

Exactly.
Some dont seem to understand that mankind is already under a judgment of death because we sinned from the beginning.
We are condemned basically by default, the sentence having already been passed...ie 'the wages of sin is death (death as defined in scripture, not as we want to define it)"
The only way out of that default judgment is to have it atoned for by the blood of Christ.

So in essence it doesnt matter if we sin once or a billion times, the judgment stands against us.
And since only Christ was sinless, none of us are exempted without His blood atoning for our sin.

 

[jasoncran]

http://www.cgg.org/index.cfm/fuseaction ... LETS/k/451
this site takes the genesis account and supports that idea of evolution with it.
man are being contininually made in the image of god?really.
that was done with the first couple adam and eve, and perverted when they fell from grace.
we arent being perfected in the natural but rather are drawing closer and closer to the return(spiritually speaking)
on evo that is for the science forum and debate.

orwarrior, you should check these sites beliefs before you post them as examples.

 

[Guest]

If what you believe is true, how could you enjoy heaven knowing millions upon millions of people are suffering?

As it always happens, now the emotional plea's begin.

Im really sorry about all the souls that will go there. I dont like the idea of ET, but I cant just change what God has SAID so that I can feel better about it all.

What I DO know is that I am a fallible, finite human being with a very limited understanding of it all.
GOD, however is infinite, infallible and perfect...so if HE says something is to be, my lack of understanding is irrelevant in the end. I simply need to believe and accept what He has said and understand that He knows what He's doing...even if it doesnt make any sense to me personally....it doesnt have to.

It doesn't matter if animals are included in salvation or not.

That is correct. but they arent.

Christ came to save us from death. Not eternal torture.

According to Gods WORD, this 'death' is eternity in perpetual flame.
Im sorry but it simply is fact and no amount of dismissing it is going to change it.

That verse clearly says they will perish LIKE animals. It doesn't say "They too will perish but suffer eternity of torment"

Im sorry but I supplied quite a bit so far that says VERY plainly that souls WILL suffer in eternal torment.

Hopefully we dont have to keep REposting that evidence over and again.

 

[jasoncran]

where in the bible does it say that christ came to redeem my dog, cat, and all other animals.

if he did that then why did the dinosaurs go extinct?

 

[ORwarriOR]

http://www.cgg.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Library.sr/CT/CGGBOOKLETS/k/451
this site takes the genesis account and supports that idea of evolution with it.
man are being contininually made in the image of god?really.
that was done with the first couple adam and eve, and perverted when they fell from grace.
we arent being perfected in the natural but rather are drawing closer and closer to the return(spiritually speaking)
on evo that is for the science forum and debate.

orwarrior, you should check these sites beliefs before you post them as examples.

What does it matter of their beliefs if they make a strong logical case against it?


Wm;
It's not an emotional plea it's loving human nature, the nature that Christ puts in us. The way he programs us to act. And I have to been programmed to feel mercy and compassion to those that are suffering. There is NO WAY I could enjoy heaven if I knew people like Ghandi were suffering for an eternity. And yet you're still dismissing certain facts to DISPROVE the word of God, in some sort of weird attempt to keep a disgusting doctrine alive.

2 Peter 2:12
But these men blaspheme in matters they do not understand. They are like brute beasts, creatures of instinct, born only to be caught and destroyed, and like beasts they too will perish.

Again it says like beasts they too will perish. Everyone will perish in earthly form so I think we can assume that they weren't singling out the wicked in this lifetime. But like the souls of beasts they will perish as well. Why would they specifically compare them to beasts unless according to your doctrine it meant all animals were going to suffer an eternity as well. Are you calling the apostles liars? Christ came to save us from death and having to feel the flames of Gehenna. Why are you arguing with scripture based on man-made doctrines which are in turn based on pagan beliefs? Hell was created from pagan beliefs at the time. And in turn the church has hardwashed it so far into your minds in some sort of attempt to zealously convert that it's gotten to the point where it's only staining the name of our merciful God.

 

[jasoncran]

2 Peter 2:12
But these men blaspheme in matters they do not understand. They are like brute beasts, creatures of instinct, born only to be caught and destroyed, and like beasts they too will perish.

The verse you have just read shows that the wicked will be destroyed/perish like beasts. Now if that somehow means that the wicked suffer eternal torment, then we can only conclude given that argument that animals will also suffer eternal torment. Doesn't sound right to me, I would suggest that both are destroyed ie: they no longer exist.
http://www.heaven.net.nz/answers/answer26.htm

So you guys believe God is going to torture all his beautiful animals for all of eternity too?

another bad site, man. rick joyner has a prophecy on that site. please double check this for new agism.

btw the new agers dont like the idea of hell and will hide behind the idea that god doesnt condemn anyone.that is why i'm picky

on joyner. that name sounds familiar, so i googled him and at a quick glance i got this.

http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/joyner.html

 

[ORwarriOR]

Again who cares about his beliefs, look at the scripture yourself and make your own conclusions. If we all perish in this life do we not all perish like beasts? And if so what was the point of the apostles making that distinction unless of course our souls went on to live, and the wicked's were simply put out like an animals?

 

[jasoncran]

so would accept the knowledge on the bible from a unbeliever? hmm. especially if he didnt want to convert but to subvert the gospel.

that is why when it comes to some things in the bible i let men who live the life before me teach me so that i can see if they are real and actual christians.

on the net, we dont know who is a liar or faking it, so i use caution.

 

[ORwarriOR]

so would accept the knowledge on the bible from a unbeliever? hmm. especially if he didnt want to convert but to subvert the gospel.

that is why when it comes to some things in the bible i let men who live the life before me teach me so that i can see if they are real and actual christians.

on the net, we dont know who is a liar or faking it, so i use caution.

Look the scripture up in your own bible and think about it. It's certainly not a misquote. The view of non-eternal hell is shared by many believers. Who cares if he's not a true believer, it's a piece of scripture in our bible and his conclusions are solid.

 

[Free]

Why are you arguing with scripture based on man-made doctrines which are in turn based on pagan beliefs? Hell was created from pagan beliefs at the time. And in turn the church has hardwashed it so far into your minds in some sort of attempt to zealously convert that it's gotten to the point where it's only staining the name of our merciful God.

Before being so sure of what you believe, make sure you know all that Scripture says. When are unbelievers punished?

 

[jasoncran]

so would accept the knowledge on the bible from a unbeliever? hmm. especially if he didnt want to convert but to subvert the gospel.

that is why when it comes to some things in the bible i let men who live the life before me teach me so that i can see if they are real and actual christians.

on the net, we dont know who is a liar or faking it, so i use caution.

Look the scripture up in your own bible and think about it.

i have and it supports it,the ideal of eternal hell, wm tipton pointed those verses out already.

 

[Guest]

Wm;
It's not an emotional plea it's loving human nature, the nature that Christ puts in us.

Friend, JESUS DOESNT put a nature in you that REJECTS His truth...not in the least. Dont blame Christ for YOUR dismissal of what His word SAYS.

The way he programs us to act. And I have to been programmed to feel mercy and compassion to those that are suffering. There is NO WAY I could enjoy heaven if I knew people like Ghandi were suffering for an eternity.

Since we dont know how that all works, I think its a bit premature to say if we will know who is or isnt there.

And yet you're still dismissing certain facts to DISPROVE the word of God, in some sort of weird attempt to keep a disgusting doctrine alive.

Sorry chap, but you HAVENT actually SHOWN a single thing that SAYS that ET is false.
And your use of 'disgusting doctrine' isnt going to have the traumatic effect on me that youre hoping for, friend...I know youre wrong and thats all there is to it....and its because I study my bible and have for many MANY thousands of hours.

 

[Guest]

Again it says like beasts they too will perish.

Irrelevant. Animals will DIE physically just like MAN will.
But MAN, not animals, will be RESURRECTED to one of two ETERNAL destinies....life or punishment...just as scripure SAYS

Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth;
they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life;
and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
(Joh 5)



And these shall go away into eternal punishment,
but the righteous into eternal life.
(Mat 25:31-46 EMTV)

eternal
G166
???????
ai?nios
ahee-o'-nee-os
From G165; perpetual (also used of past time, or past and future as well): - eternal, for ever, everlasting, world (began).


G2851
???????
kolasis
kol'-as-is
From G2849; penal infliction: - punishment, torment.