Is it Wrong to Think About Hell All the Time?

[Kathi]

I don't think you're getting it. The Rich Man in Hades had a body, why else would he ask Lazarus to pour water on his tongue? You yourself said their bodies were currently in the grave.

Please explain how you reconcile this?

Jesus was teaching a lesson in Luke 16:19-31.Some question if it a true story,real life account or a Parable.Jesus was teaching a lesson that hell is a real literal place.Why was Jesus telling this story and Lazarus had his resurrected body?I don't know you would have to ask Jesus.Maybe we could not understand it unless He told it the way He did.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Satan definitely wants us to think that hell is a lie.

Kathi, hell is for children...
(signature late 70's rock sound)

 

[Kathi]

Kathi, hell is for children...
(signature late 70's rock sound)

No, in fact the opposite.

 

[Doulos Iesou]

Jesus was teaching a lesson in Luke 16:19-31.Some question if it a true story,real life account or a Parable.Jesus was teaching a lesson that hell is a real literal place.Why was Jesus telling this story and Lazarus had his resurrected body?I don't know you would have to ask Jesus.Maybe we could not understand it unless He told it the way He did.

So you have no answer to why Jesus would be teaching bad theology? If someone was in hell with a resurrected body, then their brothers would not still be living on earth, period.

This and many other reasons are why myself and others do not regard this as Jesus taking a moment to randomly teach a lesson about hell, when in fact he is mentioning Hades, which is distinct from Hell.

 

[jasonc]

Jesus was teaching a lesson in Luke 16:19-31.Some question if it a true story,real life account or a Parable.Jesus was teaching a lesson that hell is a real literal place.Why was Jesus telling this story and Lazarus had his resurrected body?I don't know you would have to ask Jesus.Maybe we could not understand it unless He told it the way He did.

The idea of sheol was taught in the temple and yeshiva. I can post stuff on that. I have done a right that preexisted Jesus time on the earth. its called the mourner's kaddish.

also consider this. its not that you know god but if you do and you fail to do what he says. its going to be bad for you in the judgement. its also hard on those that never knew god but the modern church doesn't teach much these days on doing the faith as much as that simple prayer of I believe. that's in that story. the Pharisees thought they knew the Heshem. their actions based on their hearts said otherwise!

jesus described what fate awaited them in sheol. they already knew what sheol was.

 

[Doulos Iesou]

Do you think this is where deceased unbelievers also await their punishment along with the angels?

No, I do not think the wicked are conscious after death until they are resurrected.

The Old Testament is especially clear in teaching that the dead know nothing, and that being in Hades means the end of all activity. Literally the only text that could be conveyed as the wicked being conscious prior to the second resurrection is the passage about Lazarus and the Rich man, which of course contradicts all other teachings on the matter previously presented in Scripture. It is far better understood as a Parable told in allegory.

 

[Kathi]

So you have no answer to why Jesus would be teaching bad theology? If someone was in hell with a resurrected body, then their brothers would not still be living on earth, period.

This and many other reasons are why myself and others do not regard this as Jesus taking a moment to randomly teach a lesson about hell, when in fact he is mentioning Hades, which is distinct from Hell.

That is not bad theology because Jesus was teaching a lesson.It is a Parable.You can believe what you want to believe life is full of choices.

 

[Doulos Iesou]

That is not bad theology because Jesus was teaching a lesson.It is a Parable.You can believe what you want to believe life is full of choices.

Indeed, I will believe in what is coherent and makes actual sense of what Jesus is saying, rather than it contradicting other theology.

 

[jasonc]

That is not bad theology because Jesus was teaching a lesson.It is a Parable.You can believe what you want to believe life is full of choices.

I know you aren't addressing me with that. im suggesting that it was about gehenna, but about sheol. there is no way it could have been after the judgement as the rich man said sent one back to the land of the living to warn my brothers.

 

[Kathi]

Luke 16:19-31
The Rich Man and Lazarus
19 “There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. 20 But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, 21 desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fellfrom the rich man’s table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. 22 So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

24 “Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ 25 But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. 26 And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’

27 “Then he said, ‘I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father’s house, 28 for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.’ 29 Abraham said to him, ‘They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’ 30 And he said, ‘No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ 31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’”

 

[jasonc]

ok. I do believe in abode for the dead as in judgement and prior to the cross with levels for the righteous and the wicked being separated and or gan eden separate from that place(paradise to a jew is gan eden not heaven as it has the garden of eden in the imagery) but that is another topic.

 

[Kathi]

I know you aren't addressing me with that. im suggesting that it was about gehenna, but about sheol. there is no way it could have been after the judgement as the rich man said sent one back to the land of the living to warn my brothers.

But as you see in post #30 Abraham said the Lazarus "if they do not hear Moses and the prophets,neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead"
Another words if people see miracles and are told about Jesus they still will not believe.

 

[jasonc]

But as you see in post #30 Abraham said the Lazarus "if they do not hear Moses and the prophets,neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead"
Another words if people see miracles and are told about Jesus they still will not believe.

sheol! not the judgement. sheol in jewish that time was a place that was a purgatory, not that is correct just what they started to teach.

what does one peter 3:18 mean to you? what were those spirits?

 

[Kathi]

sheol! not the judgement. sheol in jewish that time was a place that was a purgatory, not that is correct just what they started to teach.

what does one peter 3;18 mean to you? what were those spirits?

Many of the Catholics want to say that Sheol/Hades is purgatory but it isn't.

 

[jasonc]

Many of the Catholics want to say that Sheol/Hades is purgatory but it isn't.

why would jesus preach to demons? how can a demon be sometimes disobedient and die in a flood?

 

[Kathi]

why would jesus preach to demons? how can a demon be sometimes disobedient and die in a flood?

I don't know but I believe the Bible says he did after His resurrection and he went to sheol/hades to take the believers to paradise and he spoke to the lost.I will try and find scripture for you on that.

 

[jasonc]

I don't know but I believe the Bible says he did after His resurrection and he went to sheol/hades to take the believers to paradise and he spoke to the lost.I will try and find scripture for you on that.

he went to sheol to speak to the beleivers. and I posted that verse and you deny that. they died in the flood. nothing else is there. im not even using the other possible mention of that in matthew of the saints coming back to life.

 

[Kathi]

Ephesians 4:8-10 says that Jesus went to the blessed side of sheol/hades and took them to heaven.1 Peter 3:18-20 says that Jesus went to sheol/hades not hell.

 

[jasonc]

Ephesians 4:8-10 says that Jesus went to the blessed side of sheol/hades and took them to heaven.1 Peter 3:18-20 says that Jesus went to sheol/hades not hell.

if he went to sheol and you said sheol has isn't a purgatory then what exactly was those person who died in the flood? where they judged? yes and why was that?

For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: 19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; 20 Which sometime were disobedient, ...

the full context is that they sinned. if they were there and died in the flood.

one peter 3:20. start there.

 

[Kathi]

if he went to sheol and you said sheol has isn't a purgatory then what exactly was those person who died in the flood? where they judged? yes and why was that?

the full context is that they sinned. if they were there and died in the flood.

one peter 3:20. start there.

I guess if they died in the flood they went to sheol the unbelievers side.Would you please show me the Scripture that says the people who died in the flood went to purgatory?