Is Jesus Soon To Rapture The Church?

[Jacob62]

Try as you may, the pre-trib or nothing angle of saying we post-tribbers don't believe in the rapture is a disingenuous attempt to invalidate. Like we have said repeatedly, we believe in the Rapture, just not in your mistaken and desperate timing.

The only desperation will be with those remaining during Daniel's 70th. Week. Remember, that is not The Great Tribulation. It will start out with a peaceful World Government. I am sure you will be quite aware of it, I will be home with Jesus.

Blessings.

 

[daninthelionsden]

The only desperation will be with those remaining during Daniel's 70th. Week. Remember, that is not The Great Tribulation. It will start out with a peaceful World Government. I am sure you will be quite aware of it, I will be home with Jesus.

Blessings.

You mean when they realize their "Get out of Tribulation Free Card" was a fake? Yeah, I can only imagine pre-tribbers panic and feeling of betrayal as they are caught unawares.

 

[Jacob62]

You mean when they realize their "Get out of Tribulation Free Card" was a fake? Yeah, I can only imagine pre-tribbers panic and feeling of betrayal as they are caught unawares.

You stated you "can only imagine."

Imagining things about the future to supposedly to discern Scripture is unwise and unGodly. The Lord can change your habit of doing so. Submit to Him while you are able.

 

[JLB]

The Believing Church Bride will be raptured.

The believing Church bride will be resurrected first, then those who are alive and remain, on the last day, the Day of the Lord will be caught up together with them.


This occurs at the coming of the Lord.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15


You do understand that the coming of the Lord is the Second Coming of Christ?


Right?






JLB

 

[Jacob62]

The believing Church bride will be resurrected first, then those who are alive and remain, on the last day, the Day of the Lord will be caught up together with them.


This occurs at the coming of the Lord.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15


You do understand that the coming of the Lord is the Second Coming of Christ?


Right?






JLB

What exactly are you straining to say?

 

[Blade]

I have to say been offended here as in hurt. How some are treating their brother/sister in Christ. How can you knew about "caught up" yet not know how you just treated talked to your bother/sister ..to Christ He looks at it as if you said it to Him. Christ said to Paul why are you persecuting me? Paul never did Paul did hurt lock up kill Christians. Sheep and the Goats "if you have done it to the least of these my brethren you did it to me".

When you talk like this to prove your point you just failed. Ever search on PRE MID POST? If you have then you know one of those gets really beat up trashed made fun of and not by the world but by Christians. We just LOVE JESUS Huh.

So much of this is mute worthless why? If you truly know about searched on caught up and the tribulation they you know there is no POST verse no MID verse no PRE verse. What did Paul talk about in his first letter? Caught up and all He had was the OT Torah. Yeah that here really surprised me as no one talked about those verses (not talking about Daniel). So the more I read and how some are being treated it was clear not a debate. Your wrong I am right period.

I can see pre and mid and post in the word of God I just can't prove one over the other so I look at what GOD has promised me.. not tomorrow. Christ is coming in the clouds one time Angels are sent one time its just Him in the air no angels no saints the other He set foot on the earth. I know Paul had to have seen or known something yet for me if I KNEW Christ was coming at the end a day I would never see.. I would not mislead those I teach to say "WE" which remain. I would say they or them. Yet again its not proof. So hmmm I will live for Him now I will expect Him now to always watch what I say and do...always thinking of Him. This moment is all He gave me why live in a day I might never see.

My PERSONAL view belief is NOT the word of God..some treat it as so yet He does not go by your personal belief. That points to ME to YOU not Him. Respect what other say.. if you don't want to be made fun of even when they do that to you.. never do it back! Talk to them as you do Christ. Treat others as HE treats you. If I offended you forgive me... theres no joy here no love. Ever think those your talking to are weak in the faith and can't SEE what you see? HELP THEM.

Your pre trib? PRAISE GOD! I am post trib.. wanna talk?

 

[JLB]

What exactly are you straining to say?

Im saying the rapture and resurrection occur at His coming.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15



The coming of the Lord refers to the Second Coming of Christ.




JLB

 

[Atonement]

When I think of the Rapture, the 2nd coming and the 1000 years of Christ reign. I always look to the Feasts. The Spring Feast were fulfilled precisely to the day by Christ 1st coming. The Fall Feast we are still waiting to be fulfilled. The next Feast is Rosh Hashana (Feast of Trumpets). And it happens on a New Moon when historically no man knew the day and hour. God uses the lunar cycle (unfortunately we use the solar). Rosh Hashana is the only Feast not on a Full Moon.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Or some select segment of Believers?

In addition to the standard model of Christ rapturing His Church Bride, various predictions of a phased or multiple catching away of God's People are offered through detailed inspection and exegesis of prophetic Scripture. This can be accomplished by the text of Scripture being now available for digital search for selected end of times phrases, such as given by John the Revelator, as they amazingly are spoken throughout the OT Prophets.

For instance, The Sixth Seal of Rev. ch. 6 is clearly given by Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Hosea, Micah, and elsewhere. This means more details of the event and of it's timing relationship to other prophesied events can be put together. A larger picture emerges.

At the other end of the eschatological doctrine spectrum is the camp which either analogizes or ignores the literal details of end times prophecy. These are the Reformists, Calvinists, and proponents of Covenant Theology, even as they are dedicated to worshipping the very text of Scripture within their exegetic workings.

As those redeemed in Christ, how significant are our gut feelings upon the Rapture? After all, "Belief" always comes down to a subjective decision. Will a personal belief in Rapture Doctrine, and confession of it, be required for attaining it?

"Eschatology" is just another term for "Rank Speculation".

 

[Atonement]

"Eschatology" is just another term for "Rank Speculation".

Its just the study of last things or the end times. "Rank Speculation" seems a bit speculative

 

[MoriahsSong]

But, if you don't, then how is the Second Coming of Christ any different than the Rapture as a supposed 'scare tactic'?

Jesus spoke of the Second Coming in strong language because he was also a prophet. Prophets always use strong language as they are intended to get peoples attention on a very serious matters at hand. Jesus had previously spoken about both salvation and the rejection of it as well. If Jesus had only spoken of the good things to come of what value of that be to those who may be headed for hell? So I don't see it as a "scare tactic" but as a "strong warning". How often does a parent say to their kids "If you keep being disrespectful you will get punished for it?" Is it not the same principle?

 

[DavidT]

For those who don't hold to the Rapture, do you know the exact time of the Second Coming of Christ? Could it occur at any time? If you do know it, let me know.

But, if you don't, then how is the Second Coming of Christ any different than the Rapture as a supposed 'scare tactic'?

Quantrill

The difference is simple, because it's only about comparison between what God's Word says as written vs. what men's doctrines say. How much effort does it really take to read God's Word with simplicity while comparing it to what man says?

Matthew 24:29-31 = Jesus showed His coming to gather His saints is 'after the tribulation'.
Mark 13:24-27 = same thing.

What is different between the two above passages by Christ? Exactly where saints are gathered 'from' is different in the two versions. With one it's about saints gathered from heaven. With the other it's about saints gathered from the earth. This is actually what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4 about the event of Christ gathering His Church.

Thusly, a reading of both Olivet discourse examples along with 1 Thessalonians 4 will give more detail about the 'when' of Christ's coming to gather His Church, and also 'how' they are gathered by Christ when He comes. But that's not all. The Zechariah 14 Scripture reveals exactly 'where'... Lord Jesus is to return at His coming, and where He will bring His Church.

So by those Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27, and 1 Thessalonians 4, and Zechariah 14 Scriptures, you have the 'when', 'how', and 'where' about Christ's coming and gathering of His Church.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

When I think of the Rapture, the 2nd coming and the 1000 years of Christ reign. I always look to the Feasts. The Spring Feast were fulfilled precisely to the day by Christ 1st coming. The Fall Feast we are still waiting to be fulfilled. The next Feast is Rosh Hashana (Feast of Trumpets). And it happens on a New Moon when historically no man knew the day and hour. God uses the lunar cycle (unfortunately we use the solar). Rosh Hashana is the only Feast not on a Full Moon.

Purim falls on a full moon.

 

[Quantrill]

Jesus spoke of the Second Coming in strong language because he was also a prophet. Prophets always use strong language as they are intended to get peoples attention on a very serious matters at hand. Jesus had previously spoken about both salvation and the rejection of it as well. If Jesus had only spoken of the good things to come of what value of that be to those who may be headed for hell? So I don't see it as a "scare tactic" but as a "strong warning". How often does a parent say to their kids "If you keep being disrespectful you will get punished for it?" Is it not the same principle?

My reply was to one who was accusing those who hold to a pre-trib rapture of scare tactics.

My point was, what is the difference between the Rapture or Second Coming as far as a scare tactic.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

The difference is simple, because it's only about comparison between what God's Word says as written vs. what men's doctrines say. How much effort does it really take to read God's Word with simplicity while comparing it to what man says?

Matthew 24:29-31 = Jesus showed His coming to gather His saints is 'after the tribulation'.
Mark 13:24-27 = same thing.

What is different between the two above passages by Christ? Exactly where saints are gathered 'from' is different in the two versions. With one it's about saints gathered from heaven. With the other it's about saints gathered from the earth. This is actually what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4 about the event of Christ gathering His Church.

Thusly, a reading of both Olivet discourse examples along with 1 Thessalonians 4 will give more detail about the 'when' of Christ's coming to gather His Church, and also 'how' they are gathered by Christ when He comes. But that's not all. The Zechariah 14 Scripture reveals exactly 'where'... Lord Jesus is to return at His coming, and where He will bring His Church.

So by those Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27, and 1 Thessalonians 4, and Zechariah 14 Scriptures, you have the 'when', 'how', and 'where' about Christ's coming and gathering of His Church.

If it is so simple, why did you miss it?

In other words, the verses used for the pre-trib Rapture were claimed in a derogatory way to be a scare tactic.

So, to my point, those who beleive these verses refer to the Second Coming and not the Rapture, still must acknowledge that they too are scare tactics.

Quantrill

 

[JLB]

So, to my point, those who beleive these verses refer to the Second Coming and not the Rapture, still must acknowledge that they too are scare tactics.

I don’t know anything about scare tactics, what I do know is the rapture and resurrection occur at the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15



You do understand that the coming of the Lord refers to the Second Coming of Christ, right?






JLB

 

[Quantrill]

I don’t know anything about scare tactics, what I do know is the rapture and resurrection occur at the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15



You do understand that the coming of the Lord refers to the Second Coming of Christ, right?






JLB

Well, the accusation of 'scare tactics' was what was given in post #(2). That was what I was addressing.

So, apply accordingly.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

Why can't people believe what is already written instead of false theories that began around 1830 by one false teacher misunderstanding something he was told, but that it was not true. Scripture is very straight forward on what Jesus said.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Mat 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Mat 24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Mat 24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
Mat 24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Let's not forget also what is written in 1 Corinthians 15:51-58; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and Rev 19:11-21.

 

[JLB]

Well, the accusation of 'scare tactics' was what was given in post #(2). That was what I was addressing.

So, apply accordingly.

Quantrill

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15



You do understand that the coming of the Lord refers to the Second Coming of Christ, right?

 

[Quantrill]

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15



You do understand that the coming of the Lord refers to the Second Coming of Christ, right?

Again, pay attention. The accusation of 'scare tactics' was given in post #(2). I was addressing that accusation in post #(4).

Therefore, in post # (4) (114) (115), if you beleive the Pre-Trib Rapture is just a 'scare tactic', then the 2nd Coming of Christ must also be a scare tactic. Correct?

In other words: the accusation is empty.

Quantrill