Is the Ten Commandment Abolished?

[Theofilus]

one of those commands in the 613 contradict what the lord commands ie thou shalt kill the amalekete. didnt jesus say that we are to love thine enemy.

That depends on what you consider to be a commandment. Some things were only for certain groups (Levites, farmers, etc), some were for specific individuals (such as the miracles God commanded Moses to perform), some only apply within Israel and some only applied to a specific time (such as killing all the inhabitants of the land, which only applied while they were conquoring the Promised Land). I don't think anyone would say that the commandment to kill all Amalekites applies today.

 

[Elijah674]

Exactly. Well said Elijah.

The law of liberty. The law of Love. The law written on our hearts. Christs commandments. Thats all we need.

No need for written OT law. It's gone.


Cheers buddy. Your posts are certainly complex and cryptic but you get there in the end.


Peace :::::::::::::::::::::::: Doc.

You know, you are sounding like you are getting close to 'some real knowledge'. Just need to get inside of 'Gods WAY' (Psalms 77:13) of the Heavenly Sanctuary! You do remember that the seperating vail 'RENT' making only one MOST HOLY PLACE at Christ's death, right?? Reagardless that is N.T. (even see the furnishings in Rev. 1 & 2 on)

OK: Read Rev. 11:18-19 & see what you come up with? It is the time for the DEAD to be Judged, + what is seen in Gods Temple? And the TESTAMENT??? Do a side check on that! OH' yea, ARK is there to, huh?
Well, Strongs is not to good on testiment, so try Ark.. of His Testament! *2 Ch.5:10 + 1 Kings 8:9 + Deut. 10:8 for just starters.

--Elijah

 

[Nathan]

Mic 6:6-8 "With what shall I come before the LORD, and bow myself before God on high? Shall I come before him with burnt offerings, with calves a year old? Will the LORD be pleased with thousands of rams, with ten thousands of rivers of oil? Shall I give my firstborn for my transgression, the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul?" He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

We can try....and try...and try....and try some more. But the law was simply a tool in the hands of a Master to lead us to the one who fulfills all in all.

We have a law written on our hearts now. One that never fades away. If we could only come to the realization that a life of following Christ is a life of peace. When will we come and lay our burdens down and pick up His yoke? It is not impossible, and while time is short.....

2Peter 3:9 "The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance."

Know this....as long as we are here on the earth, and the Spirit of God is moving in the hearts of man, there is time!

 

[Elijah674]

Mic 6:6-8 "With what shall I come before the LORD, and bow myself before God on high? Shall I come before him with burnt offerings, with calves a year old? Will the LORD be pleased with thousands of rams, with ten thousands of rivers of oil? Shall I give my firstborn for my transgression, the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul?" He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

We can try....and try...and try....and try some more. But the law was simply a tool in the hands of a Master to lead us to the one who fulfills all in all.

We have a law written on our hearts now. One that never fades away. If we could only come to the realization that a life of following Christ is a life of peace. When will we come and lay our burdens down and pick up His yoke? It is not impossible, and while time is short.....

2Peter 3:9 "The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance."

Know this....as long as we are here on the earth, and the Spirit of God is moving in the hearts of man, there is time!

Sorry, but the [posting] is not to clear? Are you suggesting that the 2 Cor. 3:3's Epistle (letter) of Christ was an O.T. dead letter? I see it as the first [required] heart transplant with all of mankind from Adam after sin, on. The Christ required Rebirth! John 3:3 + Heb. 13:20's Eternal Covenant!

--Elijah

 

[Strangelove]

You know, you are sounding like you are getting close to 'some real knowledge'. Just need to get inside of 'Gods WAY' (Psalms 77:13) of the Heavenly Sanctuary! You do remember that the seperating vail 'RENT' making only one MOST HOLY PLACE at Christ's death, right?? Reagardless that is N.T. (even see the furnishings in Rev. 1 & 2 on)

OK: Read Rev. 11:18-19 & see what you come up with? It is the time for the DEAD to be Judged, + what is seen in Gods Temple? And the TESTAMENT??? Do a side check on that! OH' yea, ARK is there to, huh?
Well, Strongs is not to good on testiment, so try Ark.. of His Testament! *2 Ch.5:10 + 1 Kings 8:9 + Deut. 10:8 for just starters.

--Elijah

Ok...[Elijah]...but I cant understand :::: What you are??? trying to tell me when you. OH! wrap your posts in Cyptic [message] that are really impossible to [decipher]. Maybe if you just talk to me like a human being and not like an alien you can help me attain "some real knowledge" [psalms 94:10] like you apparently pocess.

:::: Doc.

 

[Strangelove]

Sorry, but the [posting] is not to clear?--Elijah

LOLZ!

 

[Elijah674]

Ten Commandments?
The T.V. guy sounds like catholic priest's in almost daily world news. Morals?? Are the 10 commandments not for the professed clergy of Rev. 17:1-5.

Even some posters on here remind me with their gooblygook (new word!) clear postings such as perhaps the minister of today being asked by one of his flook if the the ten commandments are still really Heb. 13:20 Eternal? And what do we hear?

Some might hear Eccl. 3:15 of Gods Word with the Rev. 17:1-5 ones telling the universe in the record books (Eccl. 12:13-14) that some of his flock say that these laws are Eternal, and most of his flock could care less, but what do you say, the member of his church asks?? Well.. I go along with my flock he replies.2

--Elijah

 

[stovebolts]

Ok...[Elijah]...but I cant understand :::: What you are??? trying to tell me when you. OH! wrap your posts in Cyptic [message] that are really impossible to [decipher]. Maybe if you just talk to me like a human being and not like an alien you can help me attain "some real knowledge" [psalms 94:10] like you apparently pocess.

:::: Doc.

The thing is Strangelove, is that Elijah makes you read scripture, and not only read, but grasp the gist of what's being conveyed within the scriptures he posts. While one may not always agree with the gist, he does stir you to understand scripture, not simply parrot it back.

So, if you can't follow Elijah, and I admit it can be tough at times, then start with the verses that he posts and ask him for clarity on his understanding on said passage. It's really that simple :nod

 

[Nathan]

Ok...[Elijah]...but I cant understand :::: What you are??? trying to tell me when you. OH! wrap your posts in Cyptic [message] that are really impossible to [decipher]. Maybe if you just talk to me like a human being and not like an alien you can help me attain "some real knowledge" [psalms 94:10] like you apparently pocess.

:::: Doc.

:toofunny

 

[Nathan]

No offense Elijah.

 

[Nathan]

Sorry, but the [posting] is not to clear? Are you suggesting that the 2 Cor. 3:3's Epistle (letter) of Christ was an O.T. dead letter? I see it as the first [required] heart transplant with all of mankind from Adam after sin, on. The Christ required Rebirth! John 3:3 + Heb. 13:20's Eternal Covenant!

--Elijah

No sir. I am not exactly sure where I might have suggested that. I am making the point that while we are still here, and the Spirit of God is drawing men, there is time.

The Epistle(letter) talked about in 2Corinthians 3:3 is a 'sign' of the work that God does in the heart of man by placing the new heart in with His eternal law written on it. It was Paul and the others "physical examples" to others around that they may see the Power of God at work in the lives of man. The outward expression of the inward change that took place in the lives of the Corinthians was a "letter", just as if God had written down words on paper and given them to someone. A statement of sorts, a manifestation of the Spirit.

Yes, I believe as you do it is the New Birth. Also spoken about in 1Peter 1:3.

 

[Nathan]

The thing is Strangelove, is that Elijah makes you read scripture, and not only read, but grasp the gist of what's being conveyed within the scriptures he posts. While one may not always agree with the gist, he does stir you to understand scripture, not simply parrot it back.

So, if you can't follow Elijah, and I admit it can be tough at times, then start with the verses that he posts and ask him for clarity on his understanding on said passage. It's really that simple :nod

I agree. He certainly makes you look up Scriptures. But he does not always make clear and conclusive statements. I do not believe that he is intentionally doing it as some do. I think its a language barrier, or the thought crossed my mind that he may be in a persecuted country and all the added symbols and color changes really breaks up the message when you look at in in script format. So that people intercepting the message cannot completely grasp what he is saying.

Who knows for sure why he writes like he does, but its fun to read...sometimes.

 

[Strangelove]

The thing is Strangelove, is that Elijah makes you read scripture, and not only read, but grasp the gist of what's being conveyed within the scriptures he posts. While one may not always agree with the gist, he does stir you to understand scripture, not simply parrot it back.

So, if you can't follow Elijah, and I admit it can be tough at times, then start with the verses that he posts and ask him for clarity on his understanding on said passage. It's really that simple :nod

Ok Stove. Point taken. I'll try a bit harder.

Dude. Why is this thread not showing up in my subscribed list anymore? Any ideas?

 

[Elijah674]

OK: Who here knows what this lawyer dude is talking about? And
I suggest that some are far worst than this lawyer who tempted Christ? But how did he 'tempt' Christ? Matt. 22 (and the thread question??)

[35] Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, [tempting him], and saying,
[36] Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
(but from here on it does not sound like any one of them had been Abolished see Isa. 42:21!)
[37] Jesus said unto him, [Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.]
[38] This is [the first and great] commandment.
[39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
[40] On these [two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.]


OK: The Law of God that He alone penned, and put into a Born Again heart + MIND, or was it to be ABOLISHED like the thread question asks, or as many others teach for truth? I personally find in these following scriptures a [God that DOES NOT CHANGE]. As He documents in Mal. 3:6 + with it even being stated that it was Christ in Heb. 13:8 that [IS THE SAME FOREVER]!

OK: Lets see Peter with his THREE TIME VISION mind you, and still he would not accept it as it sounded! Why?? And how did he put God FIRST as above, and that was mandatory?? Read it & see if you can see why Peter did not believe that it meant what most of the Rev. 17:1-5 ones even teach & believe today about the 'common or unclean' beasts & creeping things. Sure Peter [saw these prohibited things in the vision], (and you can only read of them in Lev. 11) But why was he not going to eat them?? I suggest that if one can get the bottom/line truth here, he just might understand more truth?

Acts 10:9 (in part)

'... Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
[10] And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
[11] And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:

[12] Wherein were [all manner] of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.
[13] And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.
[14] But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for [I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean].

[15] And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
[16] This was [done thrice:] and the vessel was received up again into heaven.
(OK: was Peter putting God First in Commandment of Obedience?? Your answer will tell just about where you are at in Scriptual Knowledge! Dan. 12:4)

[17] Now while Peter doubted in himself what this vision which he had seen should mean, ..'

But you all know, huh? And by the way, do you complain to God for not making this more clear??

--Elijah

 

[Strangelove]

But you all know, huh? And by the way, do you complain to God for not making this more clear??

--Elijah

No. God is quite clear in His Word. That were not bound by OT law.

Only to live our lives in obediance to Christ and His commandments of love. It's simple. So simple a child can understand it.

But I can certainly complain to you for not making your position more clear.

Elijah....can you imagine for a second that new Christians are reading your posts and thinking....what the.....? :

It is pure confusion.

Can you just answer this simple question please. Its Yes or No.

Do you think Christians should be studying and then obeying Old Testamnet written law? I'd appreciate just a simple yes or no just so I can figure out your position.


Doc.

 

[Elijah674]

No. God is quite clear in His Word. That were not bound by OT law.

Only to live our lives in obediance to Christ and His commandments of love. It's simple. So simple a child can understand it.

But I can certainly complain to you for not making your position more clear.

Elijah....can you imagine for a second that new Christians are reading your posts and thinking....what the.....? :

It is pure confusion.

Can you just answer this simple question please. Its Yes or No.

Do you think Christians should be studying and then obeying Old Testamnet written law? I'd appreciate just a simple yes or no just so I can figure out your position.


Doc.

First off: O.T. law? You jump off a water 300 ft. up & you what? Is the law of O.T. gravity still there or not? You will become a big red blob!
And you ask the N.T. prayer over your 'koolaid' drink mixed with a little arsenic and all is well, huh. I am saved

OK: about you new ones still on milk. Christ COMMANDED me in Matt. 28:19-20..

Go ye therefore, [and t-e-a-c-h] all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father, and the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. [TEACHING THEM TO OBSERVE ALL THINGS WHATSOEVER I HAVE COMMANDED YOU:] and I am with [YOU] always, even to the [end of the world].'

(and that surely includes His Matt. 4:4 & 2 Tim. 3:16 DOCTRINES)

Friend: Never would I baptise one who would not accept the Lords Everlasting Gospel of Rev. 14:6 & His Eternal Covenant of Heb. 13:20. Psalms 19:7-10 finds the ones not ready as of yet when they flunk this test!

--Elijah

 

[Strangelove]

First off: O.T. law? You jump off a water 300 ft. up & you what? Is the law of O.T. gravity still there or not? You will become a big red blob!
And you ask the N.T. prayer over your 'koolaid' drink mixed with a little arsenic and all is well, huh. I am saved

OK: about you new ones still on milk. Christ COMMANDED me in Matt. 28:19-20..

Go ye therefore, [and t-e-a-c-h] all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father, and the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. [TEACHING THEM TO OBSERVE ALL THINGS WHATSOEVER I HAVE COMMANDED YOU:] and I am with [YOU] always, even to the [end of the world].'

(and that surely includes His Matt. 4:4 & 2 Tim. 3:16 DOCTRINES)

Friend: Never would I baptise one who would not accept the Lords Everlasting Gospel of Rev. 14:6 & His Eternal Covenant of Heb. 13:20. Psalms 19:7-10 finds the ones not ready as of yet when they flunk this test!

--Elijah

Do you think you are a Prophet?

Do you think Christians should be studying and then obeying Old Testamnet written law? I'd appreciate just a simple yes or no just so I can figure out your position.

 

[Nathan]

Do you think you are a Prophet?

Do you think Christians should be studying and then obeying Old Testamnet written law? I'd appreciate just a simple yes or no just so I can figure out your position.

Friend: Never would I baptise one who would not accept the Lords Everlasting Gospel of Rev. 14:6 & His Eternal Covenant of Heb. 13:20. Psalms 19:7-10 finds the ones not ready as of yet when they flunk this test!

I think that what he is saying is that the Gospel has been the same since the beginning of time. And the fact that the Law of Faith that is written on our hearts, in and of itself, fulfills the written law of the Old Testament.

Christ came not to abolish the law, but to fulfill it. God is love. The whole of the written law could be summed up into those two commandments that deal with love. The Law of Faith that is written on our hearts at new birth, contains the fulfillment of the written law of the Old Testament. Is this making sense?

So I think, but by all means let him be the final word, but I think that what he is saying is that when a person does not desire the things of God DEEP within them, there is something wrong.

We being a trinity in ourselves; our heart/soul, our mind/spirit, and our body/flesh. When we just see the drive to do things in our mind/spirit, that does not mean that the heart/soul has been changed. Many people can "be" one thing and "do" another.

God instantaneous changes our hearts/soul. Then the process begins in our minds/spirit through the Holy Spirit, and our body/flesh is gradually changed even though it will one day perish. What Elijah is saying, I think, is that a person can "profess" to believe and follow the commandments of God, but if their heart has not been changed they really have no desire for it, and therefore they will not follow it.

But...I might be wrong. He might be indicating that we have to follow the written law of the Old Testament. But I think that he is simply[in his cryptic way] trying to say that if there is no love for ALL of God's commands, old or new, then the change has not happened in the heart, and we should not try to convince a person who really has not had the change happen that the change has happened.

How many times, in how many churches, have we only given part of the Gospel, and then convince people that they have heard the full Gospel, and that although they might not understand it, a change has happened?

I am sorry, well no I am not sorry, but I am sickened that people think that a new heart can be put into someone and they not know it. If God does a work inside of you...you will know it. There is no way a Holy and Living God can REMOVE a heart of stone, and REPLACE it with a heart of flesh that has His Law of Faith written on it, and the person not know it. They might not understand what happened, I did not at first, but they will know it!

I would like to ask Elijah to list the differences between the gospel that is preached by "the Rev. 17:1-5 ones" and the Eternal Gospel of Rev. 14:6?

I would also like him to expound on;

Lets see Peter with his THREE TIME VISION mind you, and still he would not accept it as it sounded! Why?? And how did he put God FIRST as above, and that was mandatory?? Read it & see if you can see why Peter did not believe that it meant what most of the Rev. 17:1-5 ones even teach & believe today about the 'common or unclean' beasts & creeping things. Sure Peter [saw these prohibited things in the vision], (and you can only read of them in Lev. 11) But why was he not going to eat them??

 

[Strangelove]

I think that what he is saying is that the Gospel has been the same since the beginning of time. And the fact that the Law of Faith that is written on our hearts, in and of itself, fulfills the written law of the Old Testament.

Ok, this is the heart of this thread isn't it Brother Nathaniel? I mean.....it's so simple.

If we know our Gospels and we know our Jesus and we follow His two commandments then everything else falls into place, as long as you are sincere in your faith.

We dont need OT written law. You dont even need to read the OT.

I just dont understand why this guy is coming here and muddying the waters.

Think about new Christians and how they read this thread. It started off with a bunch of guys saying outright that we needed to study the OT to understand Jesus and His commandments and that the Old written law was still applicable to Christians today. Then a few good Christians came in and battled for the truth like Brother Drew and yourself and a coupla of the mods. And the noise from the OT fanboys all but dried up. They are gone.

But now this confusion from Elijah just keeps raining down. I dont know what he's trying to do but I just dont like it. Christianity is not cryptic. It's simple and easy and he's making it out to be some secret that we need to unlock and only he has the key.

Maybe it was the thread title....just worded wrongly that makes him keep comming back......dunno. What we've clearly been dabating is >> Are Christians under the written law.

It's a simple no. The ten commandments are effectively abolished because we dont need to go there and read up on the laws becasue we fulfill the law AUTOMATICALLY as a by product of Gods grace through faith in Christ. This is not rocket science. As long as we sincerely walk in true faith.

If your talking about people professing to be Christian but showing no fruit then thats something entirely different. Thats false salvation. Thats a different debate.


((sigh))


Doc.

 

[walter]

I was holding off on saying this but I see people still want to make something hard out of the simple truth.

The law had many purposes and one of them was to cause Israel as a people to survive through all their trials. We now know for example that eating pork can be very dangerous. We know now that certain sexual activities are extremely unhealthy. We now know that mercury poisoning is a real risk if you eat certain seafood. God gave them the law to allow them to be healthy as possible given their circumstances.
Also, they did not have the Messiah's atoning sacrifice which neccessitated the temple sacrifices so God gave them rituals to perform to cleans themselves from sin.
Jesus brought the actual ritual of the law to a conclusion. It fulfilled its purpose. Jesus told us what id required of us. It's that simple.

I mean this in all love and sincerity, and please don't think I know it all. Those of you arguing about this really don't grasp the simple truth that Jesus taught.