What's new
By:
Filters
Christian Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Isreal Conflict

digging said:
This situation is not about two equal powers arguing. An entire nation of people have been displaced in a very short time from a place they had been living in for over two thousand years.

I find it very interesting how the word 'terrorist' is used so freely here and how this words seems to just make violent retaliation ok?

War has been fed to our minds for many generations. Perhaps you missed my earlier comment I see a very strong difference between local crime where the attacker is clearly known.

War is not about that. When nations attack other people with booms because of the action of a few within that is simply revenge not justice.

Why are we so willing to let go of our Christianity? How many faithful of old had to leave everything and live homeless, Jesus himself said he had no place to lay his head.

At what point in time will Christians of today turn away for such things? How far are we willing to go to support real peace? What did Jesus say about Lot's wife???
Click to expand...
yet you are enjoying the internet brought to you by military conquest, launched the sattelites that sends the signals for it and the gps system for your phone and also did so from a military base.

if we want real peace, don't work, don't eat, and don't have anything. its that simple. we don't need faster cars, phones, and anything that causes one to lust or to desire for more then another. the reason we went into space was out of jealousy over the ussr.
 
Last edited:
digging said:
Deborah different nations have just used different stories to the same end. How many or us have seen the photos of Priests blessing solders? I believe many soldier are said to be in heaven to.

There are far greater reasons this is happening, 100's of millions of people are living in desperate hopelessness when this happen it brings out a force within people that is oddly the equal opposite of the powerful weapons of war.....
Click to expand...

The point is the reasons a soldier fights in war. The typical soldier doesn't go in order to die or for some promised eternal bliss. Therefore, it is Very different than the suicide bomber which you compared the typical soldier to.
 
digging said:
This situation is not about two equal powers arguing. An entire nation of people have been displaced in a very short time from a place they had been living in for over two thousand years.

I find it very interesting how the word 'terrorist' is used so freely here and how this words seems to just make violent retaliation ok?

War has been fed to our minds for many generations. Perhaps you missed my earlier comment I see a very strong difference between local crime where the attacker is clearly known.

War is not about that. When nations attack other people with booms because of the action of a few within that is simply revenge not justice.

Why are we so willing to let go of our Christianity? How many faithful of old had to leave everything and live homeless, Jesus himself said he had no place to lay his head.

At what point in time will Christians of today turn away for such things? How far are we willing to go to support real peace? What did Jesus say about Lot's wife???
Click to expand...

There are a few things here that need correcting. First of all, being weaker doesn't make someone right. Hitler, Napoleon and Idi Amin, among others, were all weaker than those they sought to conquer. Did that make them right? Just because Israel has more advanced weapons doesn't mean that they are in the wrong.

As for the "entire nation of people" bit, that's not correct either. The "Palestinian people" didn't exist until after the 6 day war in 1967. The concept of a people who had lived there for ages that were now being displaced was fabricated for propaganda purposes. Most of the so-called "Palestinians" came from other countries such as Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Syria, Egypt and others. Very few were native to that area.

As for being displaced, the British Mandate of Palestine covered the area we today know as Gaza, Israel, the West Bank and Jordan. How have these people been displaced, since they are still living in Palestine? And why do they need a Palestinian state? What about Jordan? That's a Muslim, Arab Palestinian state that already exists. Why do they need another one? From 1948 to 1967 the West Bank was part of Jordan and Gaza was part of Egypt. Nobody mentioned the Palestinian people during those 19 years, nor did anyone talk about their need for their own home land or that they were being displaced or occupied.

The TOG​
 
TOG said:
There are a few things here that need correcting. First of all, being weaker doesn't make someone right. Hitler, Napoleon and Idi Amin, among others, were all weaker than those they sought to conquer. Did that make them right? Just because Israel has more advanced weapons doesn't mean that they are in the wrong.

As for the "entire nation of people" bit, that's not correct either. The "Palestinian people" didn't exist until after the 6 day war in 1967. The concept of a people who had lived there for ages that were now being displaced was fabricated for propaganda purposes. Most of the so-called "Palestinians" came from other countries such as Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Syria, Egypt and others. Very few were native to that area.

As for being displaced, the British Mandate of Palestine covered the area we today know as Gaza, Israel, the West Bank and Jordan. How have these people been displaced, since they are still living in Palestine? And why do they need a Palestinian state? What about Jordan? That's a Muslim, Arab Palestinian state that already exists. Why do they need another one? From 1948 to 1967 the West Bank was part of Jordan and Gaza was part of Egypt. Nobody mentioned the Palestinian people during those 19 years, nor did anyone talk about their need for their own home land or that they were being displaced or occupied.

The TOG​
Click to expand...

In all fairness I think we need to look back and realize that there where many more people of Arab descent living in what become the State of Israel. Many fled when Israel became a state and their homes were given to Jews immigrating back to Israel.
This is what I understand happened but I'm listening to correction of this history.
The British Mandatory Palestine was not renewed by Britain in May 1948 leaving the land rather like it was up for grabs. Basically they washed their hands of the problems that existed. Israel fought and won declaring the State of Israel would exist. Those in power in the rest of the world conceded to this. The Zionists had been fighting for this for many years.
When all this happened there where many Jews living in places like Syria that were happy where they were. They lived along side Muslims, they were free to practice their religion in their synagogues, owned their own businesses and did business with their Muslim neighbors. Not that they were looked on as equals they were not. When all this happened their lives were totally disrupted, their synagogues burned, their businesses harassed, and even their lives put in danger. They had to secretly slip out of these countries. Many of them never returned to Israel they came to the US and South America.
 
Deborah13 said:
In all fairness I think we need to look back and realize that there where many more people of Arab descent living in what become the State of Israel. Many fled when Israel became a state and their homes were given to Jews immigrating back to Israel.
This is what I understand happened but I'm listening to correction of this history.
The British Mandatory Palestine was not renewed by Britain in May 1948 leaving the land rather like it was up for grabs. Basically they washed their hands of the problems that existed. Israel fought and won declaring the State of Israel would exist. Those in power in the rest of the world conceded to this. The Zionists had been fighting for this for many years.
When all this happened there where many Jews living in places like Syria that were happy where they were. They lived along side Muslims, they were free to practice their religion in their synagogues, owned their own businesses and did business with their Muslim neighbors. Not that they were looked on as equals they were not. When all this happened their lives were totally disrupted, their synagogues burned, their businesses harassed, and even their lives put in danger. They had to secretly slip out of these countries. Many of them never returned to Israel they came to the US and South America.
Click to expand...
that isn't unknown. yes I have heard of that. what made the arabs change idk. prior to the formation of isreal the jews did live like that but the Zionists understandably after ww2 were afraid if they didn't have a state they would be run over and turned over another hitler. remember that during the shoah the arabs didn't want the jews in Europe to come there. so they were slaughtered.
 
jasonc said:
that isn't unknown. yes I have heard of that. what made the arabs change idk. prior to the formation of isreal the jews did live like that but the Zionists understandably after ww2 were afraid if they didn't have a state they would be run over and turned over another hitler. remember that during the shoah the arabs didn't want the jews in Europe to come there. so they were slaughtered.
Click to expand...

Yes, I can certainly understand their fear, who wouldn't be fearful after Hitler. Who wouldn't want a country of their own with their own ability to protect themselves. That is just why the US became a country of it's own.
What some Christians I think fail to see is that exact motivation. They think it is all related to taking back a land that God gave them.
Most Jews, from what I have read, do not tie their spirituality to a piece of land. God can love them and bless them just a easily in NYC as He can in Jerusalem.

Did the Zionist movement begin long before WW2?
 
I understand if non Christian people fight, but when the most powerful military nations in the world are supported by the hearts of Christians this concerns me.

Does no one have any other possible ideas for solving this fight some other way? Mankind has been trying the war thing for a long time and it's not really working.....

TOG the aboriginal people of north america were a 'nation' for 1000's of years before Europeans came.

The land was not empty of humans when Israel state was formed.

Let's ask ourselves how do we see the bible's promise of peace happening? How with the Lamb lay down with the Lion? If Christians believe in war now what do we think is going to happen to change that in the future?
 
Deborah13 said:
Yes, I can certainly understand their fear, who wouldn't be fearful after Hitler. Who wouldn't want a country of their own with their own ability to protect themselves. That is just why the US became a country of it's own.
What some Christians I think fail to see is that exact motivation.

Did the Zionist movement begin long before WW2?
Click to expand...
yes, mid to late 1800's and isn't that what I have been trying to tell the futurists
They think it is all related to taking back a land that God gave them.
Most Jews, from what I have read, do not tie their spirituality to a piece of land. God can love them and bless them just a easily in NYC as He can in Jerusalem.
Click to expand...
 
digging said:
I understand if non Christian people fight, but when the most powerful military nations in the world are supported by the hearts of Christians this concerns me.

Does no one have any other possible ideas for solving this fight some other way? Mankind has been trying the war thing for a long time and it's not really working.....

TOG the aboriginal people of north america were a 'nation' for 1000's of years before Europeans came.

The land was not empty of humans when Israel state was formed.

Let's ask ourselves how do we see the bible's promise of peace happening? How with the Lamb lay down with the Lion? If Christians believe in war now what do we think is going to happen to change that in the future?
Click to expand...
how would one establish peace? lets be real, its not going to happen, history has shown that whenever we try it, we get more of it.ie a war to end all wars. again digging the jews that never LEFT were the ones whom made the claim. it would be no different then if the Seminole tribe asked America for florida back,even though they weren't the owners of florida before, since other tribes were here first. in my county it was the aIs.
 
digging said:
TOG the aboriginal people of north america were a 'nation' for 1000's of years before Europeans came.
Click to expand...

Actually there were many "nations" in North America before the Europeans showed up. The Sioux, Navajo, Apache, Comanche and others each considered themselves to be a nation. They are even referred to as nations to this day.



digging said:
The land was not empty of humans when Israel state was formed.
Click to expand...

No, it was not empty. Most of the inhabitants living within the original borders of Israel in 1948 were Jews. A minority were Christians and Muslims. That is, in fact, how the borders were decided upon. The area where Jews were in the majority is where Israel was founded. But unlike the original inhabitants of North America, the non-Jewish inhabitants of what is now Israel did not see themselves as a nation. The area that is now Israel, Gaza and the West bank has been ruled by a series of empires, including the Greeks, Romans, the Byzantine Empire, the Ottoman Empire and the British Empire. The last independent nation in the area was Israel, and that was over 2000 years ago. During all those centuries, there has been no demand or claim of any kind for a Palestinian people or a Palestinian nation. Look as hard as you want, but you won't find any reference to a group of people identifying themselves as a Palestinian nation or Palestinian people until after the Six Day War.


digging said:
Let's ask ourselves how do we see the bible's promise of peace happening? How with the Lamb lay down with the Lion? If Christians believe in war now what do we think is going to happen to change that in the future?
Click to expand...

Believing in a countries right to defend itself against terrorist attacks is not the same as "believing in war". War is never the best solution to any problem, but sometimes it may be the only solution that works. You must keep in mind that Hamas has vowed to wipe Israel off the map and has declared that it will never recognize Israel's right to exist. Do you have a suggestion for how to deal with people like that? If you do, and your idea works, there's a Nobel Peace Prize waiting for you.

The TOG​
 
digging said:
I'm think more about true Christianity at work and the peace that can come through that.....
Click to expand...
jesus said FEW will be the way. statistically of those that are in the west how many actually practice it? I bet its less then 10%
 
jasonc said:
how would one establish peace? lets be real, its not going to happen, history has shown that whenever we try it, we get more of it.ie a war to end all wars. again digging the jews that never LEFT were the ones whom made the claim. it would be no different then if the Seminole tribe asked America for florida back,even though they weren't the owners of florida before, since other tribes were here first. in my county it was the aIs.
Click to expand...
The antichrist will be able to establish peace - throughout the entire world.
 
Sinthesis said:
How do you define 'peace'? As Islam defines 'peace'?
Click to expand...
Peace - As the "walls" of Israel will come down.
Peace - NO wars, NO conflicts, NO problems - until GOD puts it into the heads of a few leaders to break those peace treaties, thus beginning "The Day of the Lord" or, secularly speaking, World War III.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top