Law of God/Moses/Christ/the Spirit

[JLB]

Temporary by means of it being the source of salvation(righteousness)but not the course of salvation.(righteousness)

Jesus Christ was, is and forever will be our source of righteousness.

He was Abraham’s source of righteousness, just as He is ours.

His Spirit in us, leads us in the paths of righteousness and empowers us in the ways of righteousness.

 

[Corinth77777]

1 Corinthians 9:21
To them that are without law, as without law, [being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,]that I might gain them that are without law.

 

[Corinth77777]

I am going to disagree with this statement, although I know many see it your way; but Jesus did NOT teach his followers how to correctly obey the law of Moses, neither by word nor by example.

Hi, Can you share what He taught?

What he correctly taught was how the law condemns you. You in your own self-righteousness might say I have never committed adultery, I have ever only been with one women my whole life; But Jesus said if you look at a women with lust in your heart, then the law of Moses condemns you of adultery. Or, again the self righteous would say I have never killed another man, but Jesus say it doesn't matter, if you have hate in your heart for another, then the law of Moses condemns you of murder.

To be crucified with Christ, you must let the law condemn you in all things.

And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

Jesus and his disciples went about picking corn on the sabbath. That was not following the law, that was making an open show of the law and those who make themselves judges over the law, triumphing over them. What man of you having an ox...?

 

[Johann!@#]

Please take notice of a very important and much overlooked word in the verse you quoted, as well as the two other verses I will add.

“Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. Matthew 5:17-18


“The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it. Luke 16:16


What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. Galatians 3:19


The Question:

Does the word until denote that which is temporary or that which is permanent?


Out of the mouth of two or three witnesses let every truth be established.

One question--you said "the law" was nailed to the cross-right?


Colossians 2:14
"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross."

The "handwriting of ordinances" refers to the legal code of the Mosaic Law that condemned sinners. Through His crucifixion, Jesus canceled the debt that the Law held against humanity by fulfilling its demands.

2. Ephesians 2:15
"Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;"

Christ abolished the ceremonial and ritual laws that separated Jews and Gentiles. The dividing wall created by the Law was broken down through His sacrifice, allowing both groups to be reconciled to God.

3. Romans 7:4
"Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God."

Believers have been made dead to the Law through Christ’s body, meaning the legal obligations no longer bind them. They now belong to Christ, living under the new covenant of grace.

4. Galatians 3:13
"Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:"

Jesus took upon Himself the curse of the Law by being crucified, thereby redeeming believers from its penalties.

5. Romans 10:4
"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

The word "end" (τέλος, telos) means goal or completion. Jesus fulfilled the righteous requirements of the Law, making faith in Him the basis for righteousness rather than adherence to the Law.

6. Matthew 5:17
"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil."

Jesus did not abolish the Law but fulfilled its righteous demands and prophecies, bringing its requirements to completion through His perfect life and atoning death.


The Mosaic Law, particularly its legal and ceremonial aspects, was nailed to the cross because Jesus fulfilled its requirements and bore its curse. Believers are no longer under the Law’s jurisdiction but are justified by faith in Christ and live under the new covenant of grace.


Mat 11:13 For all the Neviim and the Torah prophesied until Yochanan.
Mat 11:14 And, if you are willing it to be mekabel (accept, receive), he is the “Eliyahu,” who is to come [MALACHI 3:23].
Mat 11:15 The one having ears, let him hear.

The term "Neviim" (נְבִיאִים) is the Hebrew word for "Prophets" and refers to one of the three major sections of the Tanakh (the Hebrew Bible), which consists of:

Torah (תּוֹרָה) - The Law or Instruction (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy)

Neviim (נְבִיאִים) - The Prophets

Ketuvim (כְּתוּבִים) - The Writings


The Neviim is divided into two parts:

1. Former Prophets (Neviim Rishonim):
These are historical books that narrate Israel's history from the conquest of Canaan to the Babylonian exile.

Joshua

Judges

Samuel (1 and 2 Samuel)

Kings (1 and 2 Kings)

2. Latter Prophets (Neviim Aharonim):
These are prophetic writings with messages from God through His prophets.

Major Prophets:

Isaiah

Jeremiah

Ezekiel

Minor Prophets (The Twelve):

Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah, Haggai, Zechariah, Malachi

Meaning in Matthew 11:13 (or similar passages):
The phrase "For all the Neviim and the Torah prophesied until Yochanan" (John the Baptist) indicates that the prophetic period, guided by the Law and the Prophets, culminated in John.

Context: Jesus is emphasizing that John the Baptist marks the end of the prophetic era that anticipated the coming of the Messiah.

Significance: The Neviim (Prophets), along with the Torah (Law), laid the groundwork for messianic expectations, and John’s appearance signals the transition to the Kingdom of God proclaimed by Jesus.

In short, the Neviim are the prophetic books of the Hebrew Bible, and they, along with the Torah, were seen as prophesying the coming of the Messiah up until John the Baptist.

Now please explain why you say the nomos/entole/ was nailed to that cross? And what exactly was nailed to that cross?
I have already explained, you reject my explanation--what more do you want brother?

Ever studied Paul's usage of law, the law, commandments, the commandments?

No? You should.

Shalom.

J.

 

[JLB]

Colossians 2:14
"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross."

And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. Colossians 2:14-14

“IT” refers to the law of Moses.

Paul is quoting Moses by saying having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us.
So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying: “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there as a witness against you;
Deuteronomy 31:24-26

• Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there as a witness against you;

The law of Moses was nailed to the cross.


You already said physical circumcision was not required for the New Covenant.

Physical Circumcision is absolutely positively required for the law of Moses.

 

[Johann!@#]

ke a breakdown of any specific word or phrase from th

And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. Colossians 2:14-14

“IT” refers to the law of Moses.

Paul is quoting Moses by saying having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us.
So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying: “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there as a witness against you;
Deuteronomy 31:24-26

• Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there as a witness against you;

The law of Moses was nailed to the cross.


You already said physical circumcision was not required for the New Covenant.

Physical Circumcision is absolutely positively required for the law of Moses.

This is going in circles-I’m afraid we’re getting nowhere. You’re quoting Scripture, but how is it that you’re not grasping what I’m saying?

Romans 8:3-4
"For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit."

Paul emphasizes that the Law was unable to bring righteousness due to human weakness.

Jesus’ sacrifice fulfilled the Law’s righteous demands, making it possible for believers to live righteously through the Spirit.

2. Romans 10:4
"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes."

The word "end" (τέλος) means the goal or fulfillment.

Paul teaches that Christ brings the Law’s purpose to completion, providing righteousness to those who believe.

3. Galatians 3:24-25
"Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor."

The Law acted as a guardian or tutor until Christ came.

Once faith in Christ is established, the Law’s guardianship ends, as Jesus fulfills its ultimate purpose.

4. Galatians 4:4-5
"But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law, to redeem those who were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as sons."

Jesus was born under the Law to fulfill its demands and redeem those under its curse.

Through His fulfillment, believers are adopted as God’s children.

5. Colossians 2:14
"Having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross."

The handwriting of requirements (ordinances or decrees) refers to the legal demands of the Law.

Through His death, Jesus canceled the record of debt that condemned us.

6. Ephesians 2:15
"Having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace."

Jesus abolished the enmity created by the Law’s ordinances, reconciling both Jews and Gentiles into one body through the cross.

This does not abolish moral principles but rather the legalistic demands and ceremonial aspects that separated Jews from Gentiles.

7. 2 Corinthians 5:21
"For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."

Jesus took on our sin, satisfying the Law’s demand for justice.

Through this, believers receive imputed righteousness that the Law could not provide.


Paul consistently teaches that Jesus fulfilled the Law’s requirements by:

Living a sinless life under the Law (Galatians 4:4-5).

Offering Himself as a sacrifice for sin, satisfying its righteous demands (Romans 8:3-4).

Abolishing the ceremonial and legalistic aspects that divided humanity (Ephesians 2:15).

Declaring believers righteous through faith, not by the Law’s works (Romans 10:4).

Canceling the legal debt that stood against us (Colossians 2:14).

Shalom.

J.

 

[onlysaved]

Hi, would you like to elaborate?

Humans are cleansed by the washing of water through the word.

The context of this is how a man should behave ragarding his wife.
I take this to mean a husband should make sure his wife is engaging with the word of God (the Gospel)and that metaphorical "water" " cleanses "her.



Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her
26 to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word,
27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless.

 

[Corinth77777]

Jesus Christ was, is and forever will be our source of righteousness.

He was Abraham’s source of righteousness, just as He is ours.

His Spirit in us, leads us in the paths of righteousness and empowers us in the ways of righteousness.

However the Jews were given the law.
And it taught them and us somethings; The weakness of man brought about by being born in sin and shaped in iniquity. So in their mind I am not sure they knew Christ was the source of righteousness. Because it may have been hidden from them, for then it would not have been explained in Romans.

So the law lead them to Christ. It is through faith in Christ that they would receive imputed righteousness.

SO ONE IS SAVED BY HIS DEATH IN ORDER TO BE SAVED BY HIS LIFE.

DEATH FREED THEM FROM THE PENALTY OF SIN AND NOW IN THIS LIFE THROUGH YEILDING TO THE holy Spirit we can be saved from the power of sin.

We uphold the law through faith.
Meaning if you are walking by the Spirit you are no longer under the curse of the law - seperation from God
Which means life with the Father.
This is continuous a journey. For Abraham was Justified more than once. And I believe that is where Galatians 2:16 comes into play.

​

Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified."

The New governing system under King Jesus's Rule.

The expression of the Law naturally takes place as our hearts are transformed. Rather it be the moral law or what have you, the law was meant to serve people, not the other way around.

Correct me if I'm wrong...tks

 

[Soyeong]

The Mosaic Covenant was added to the Abrahamic Covenant, until the Messiah came.

The Messiah didn't come with the message that we should stop repenting and that we are now free to become doers of what God's law reveals to be wickedness because it has ended now that has come, but rather he came with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was in accordance within him being sent in fulfillment of the promise to turn us from our wickedness (Matthew 4:15-23, Acts 3:25-26).

The Abrahamic Covenant was made between the LORD Jesus Christ (before He became flesh) and Abraham.

The character and nature of God are formed within from the new Divine nature, not by external commandments written in stone.

The Lord Himself dwells within us and teaches us all things by His Spirit, something the law of Moses could never do.

Abraham learned directly from the Lord, like the Lord intended Adam and Eve to learn… from the tree of life.


And I will make your descendants multiply as the stars of heaven; I will give to your descendants all these lands; and in your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed; because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.”
Genesis 26:4-5


The New Covenant laws and commandments are written on our heart and mind and are also taught to us directly from the Spirit of truth, from within.

But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26


But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him. 1 John 2:27

It would be overwhelming to us for God to teach us how to be a doer of the divine nature in every possible situation, so the point is to teach those principles by teaching a limited set of instructions that all have them in common. For example, God might give one person a set of instructions for how to be a doer of righteousness in various situations and he might give a another person a different set of instructions for how to be a doer of righteousness in a different set of situations, but all of those instructions are going to have the same principle in common, they are all going to be eternally valid for anyone who has the goal of knowing God and Jesus by partaking in the divine nature, and partaking in the divine nature does not involve doing anything that is not in accordance with those instructions.

Moses was also taught directly by God (Deuteronomy 5:31-33). Changing the medium upon which God's instructions are written from stone to our hearts does not change the content of what it instructs us to do. For example, the command to honor our parents written on stone has the same content as the command to honor our parents written on our hearts. The Spirit leading us to honor our parents does not involve doing anything other than obeying the command to honor our parents as it was written on stone. God has not commanded anything that is not in accordance with walking in the Spirit, which is why Paul contrasted those who walk in the Spirit with those who have minds set on the flesh who are enemies of God who refuse to submit to the Law of God (Romans 8:4-7).

 

[ezrider]

So, in essence--
It would be more accurate to say that Jesus taught His followers how to correctly understand and fulfill the Law of Moses, emphasizing its true spiritual intent rather than mere outward conformity.

I could go point for point and respond, but to what end? I already said what Jesus taught correctly was the depths to how the law condemns you. There is only one way to fulfill the law, and that is by death.

 

[Johann!@#]

I could go point for point and respond, but to what end? I already said what Jesus taught correctly was the depths to how the law condemns you. There is only one way to fulfill the law, and that is by death.

Matthew 5:17:

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

Jesus clearly stated that He came to fulfill the Law, not abolish it.

Romans 10:4:

"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes."

Through His death, Christ brought the Law to its intended purpose, offering righteousness to believers.

Galatians 3:13:

"Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us..."

In His sacrificial death, Jesus took upon Himself the curse that the Law pronounced on sinners.

Colossians 2:14:

"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us... nailing it to his cross."

By His death, Christ canceled the legal demands that condemned us under the Law.

In His death, Jesus fulfilled the righteous requirements of the Law and redeemed believers from its curse, making them righteous through faith.

RIGHTEOUSNESS NOT BY THE LAW
From these and other Scriptures we learn that there is no righteousness for the sinner by
law-keeping. No one can get into heaven by obeying the ten commandments. If righteousness
come by the law, Christ died in vain. (Galatians 2:21). If there had been a law given, which could
have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law. (Galatians 3:21). But Christ is
the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. (Romans 10:4). On the cross of
Calvary the sinless Christ, Who knew no sin, was made sin for us; that we might be made the
righteousness of God in Him. (II Corinthians 5:21). With the heart man believeth unto
righteousness. (Romans 10:9 and 10). To him that worketh not, but believeth on Him that
justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. (Romans 4:5).

From these and many other Scriptures we learn that righteousness, which is acceptable to
God, is not a human attainment; that no person can earn it or purchase it, or merit it by good
religious behaviour, or by ritual, ceremony or human endeavor. Righteousness is God’s free gift
to believing sinners. The only place in the universe of God where the sinner can find that
righteousness is in Christ Jesus on the cross of Calvary.

No person can become righteous by trying to obey the teachings of Jesus Christ the
Righteous, or by trying to follow Him, the great Example, or by trying to practice the ethics of
Christ, or by struggling with the Sermon on the Mount or by striving to obey the Golden Rule.
We must receive the nature of Christ at Calvary before we can practice the ethics of Christ.
In Galatians 3:14 and Romans 4:21 to 25 we learn that the blessing of Abraham is for
every sinner who will do what Abram did for his righteousness, believe God Who raised up
Jesus Christ from the dead, Who was delivered for our offences and raised up for our
justification.
Paul was a conscientious, zealous, sincere, law-keeping, religious man. He gave up all of
this, that he might win Christ and “be found - in Him, not having mine own righteousness, which
is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by
faith.” (Philippians 3:9).


Correct?

J.

 

[Corinth77777]

I could go point for point and respond, but to what end? I already said what Jesus taught correctly was the depths to how the law condemns you. There is only one way to fulfill the law, and that is by death.

Do you mean physical death..when the body is without breath and the heart stops? IF Not how do you justify this scripture:
Romans 8:4
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

 

[Soyeong]

Jesus came to provide us with a better way which is to have Him dwell within us and teach us personally from within our heart. Something the law of Moses was incapable of.

While the Spirit helps us to obey the Law of Moses, the Spirit does not lead us to do anything that is not in accordance with it.

The law of Moses was nailed to the cross, and therefore taken out of the way, because it was obsolete and no longer need.

In Matthew 27:37, they nailed a handwritten sign to Christ's cross that announced the charge that was against hi that he was the King of the Jews. This fits perfectly with the concept of a handwritten ordinance that listed the charges that were against us being nailed to Christ's cross and with him dying in our place to pay the penalty of our sins, but has nothing to do with nailing any laws to the cross. In Titus 2:14, it does not say that Jesus gave himself to free us from the Law of Moses, but in order to free us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so the way to believe in what Jesus spent his ministry teaching by word and by example and in what he accomplished through the cross is by repenting and becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to the Law of Moses (Acts 21:20).

Now we have His Commandments written on our heart and mind, within a new divine nature that is compatible with being filled with His Spirit, to lead us in the ways of righteousness from within.

The only way to do away with a set of instructions for how to act in accordance with the divine nature is by first doing away with the divine nature. It would be contradictory do to away with the Father's instructions for how to be a doer of righteousness and for the Spirit to lead us to be a doer righteousness instead.

The promise of the New Covenant is that the LORD Himself would teach each one of us, because we “know” Him, we are joined to Him and one spirit with Him, thus being one spirit with the Spirit of eternal life in Christ Jesus.

It is contradictory to want to know God instead of wanting to follow God's instructions for how to know Him.

Just because the law of Moses has been abolished in His flesh, having been nailed to the cross, doesn’t mean we are without law.

We are now under grace which means we are obligated to obey the Spirit of grace; which refers to the law of Christ.

The same law Abraham obeyed because he walked before Him and was blameless, 430 years before the law of Moses.

because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws. Genesis 26:5

JLB

Christ spent his ministry teaching his followers to obey the Law of Moses by word and by example, so I see no justification for thinking that the Law of Christ is something other than or contrary to anything that he taught. In Psalms 119:29-30, he wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey the Mosaic Law, and he chose the way of faith by setting it before him, so this has always been the one and only way of salvation by grace through faith. In Exodus 33:13, Moses wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him to walk in His way, so those under the Mosaic Covenant were under grace along with all of God's other covenants.

 

[Soyeong]

It does say the curse of lawlessness.

It says the curse of the law.

In Deuteronomy 28, it lists the blessing of the law for lawfulness and the curse of the law for lawlessness. The Bible repeatedly says that obedience to the law brings a blessing, so the law itself was not given as a curse, but as a blessing. In Titus 214, it doesn't say that Jesus gave himself to redeem us from the law, but to redeem us from all lawlessness.

And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord. And they said to him, “You see, brother, how many myriads of Jews there are who have believed, and they are all zealous for the law; but they have been informed about you that you teach all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs. Acts 21:20-21


Nothing here about obedience to the law of Moses.

Quite the opposite.

Those verses directly state that they are all zealous for the law, so I don't see how you can claim that there is nothing here about obedience to it. They then planned to take steps to disprove those false rumors and show that Paul continued to live in obedience to the Law of Moses.

Do you believe Christians are obligated to become circumcised?

It is important to recognize that the Bible can speak against obeying God for an incorrect reason without speaking against obeying God. If Paul had been speaking against circumcision for any reason, then according to Galatians 5:2, Paul caused Christ to be of no value to Timothy when he has him circumcised right after the Jerusalem Council and Christ is of no value to roughly 80% of the men in the US. In Acts 15:1, men from Judea were wanting to require Gentiles to become circumcised in order to become saved, however, that was never the reason for which God commanded circumcision, so the Jerusalem Council upheld the Mosaic Law by correctly ruling against requiring circumcision for an incorrect reason. In Exodus 12:48, Gentiles who want to eat of the Passover lamb were required to become circumcised, the the Jerusalem Council should not be interpreted as ruling against Gentiles correctly acting in accordance with what God has commanded as if they had the authority to countermand God.

 

[Soyeong]

I am going to disagree with this statement, although I know many see it your way; but Jesus did NOT teach his followers how to correctly obey the law of Moses, neither by word nor by example.

It is by the Law of Moses that we have knowledge of what sin is (Romans 3:20) and Jesus was sinless, which means that he set a perfect example for us to follow of how to walk in obedience to it and as his followers we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked. Jesus also spread the Gospel message calling for repentance from sin, which is in accordance with Acts 3:25-26 where Jesus was sent as the promised seed to bless us by turning us from our wickedness, so I don't see how you can deny that he taught how to follow the Law of Moses by word and by example. Moreover, the command against committing adultery and murder are part of the Law of Moses, so by granting that Jesus taught to obey those commands you are undermining your denial.

What he correctly taught was how the law condemns you. You in your own self-righteousness might say I have never committed adultery, I have ever only been with one women my whole life; But Jesus said if you look at a women with lust in your heart, then the law of Moses condemns you of adultery. Or, again the self righteous would say I have never killed another man, but Jesus say it doesn't matter, if you have hate in your heart for another, then the law of Moses condemns you of murder.

To be crucified with Christ, you must let the law condemn you in all things.

And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

If we correctly understand what is being commanded by the 7th and 10th Commandments against committing adultery and against coveting in our hearts, then we won't look at a married woman with lust in our heart. Likewise, in Leviticus 19:17, we are instructed not to hate our neighbor, so Jesus wasn't teach anything brand new. In Matthew 7:21-24, Jesus did not end the Sermon on the Mount by saying that he was just kidding, we can't actually do what he, and that it all just to condemn us, but rather he said that only those who do the will of the Father will enter the Kingdom of Heaven, that he would tell those who are workers of lawlessness to depart from him because he never knew them, and that everyone then who hears these words of his and does them will be like a wise man who built his house on the rock. God did not give His law as instructions for how to become self-righteous.

In Romans 10:5-8, Paul referred to Deuteronomy 30 as the word of faith that we proclaim in regard to proclaiming that God's law is not too difficult for us to obey and that obedience to it brings life and a blessing while disobedience brings death and a curse, so choose life! So it was not given to condemn us, but to teach us the way to eternal life. Our salvation is not just about being freed from condemnation, but also about being made to be like Christ by following his example of walking in God's way.

Jesus and his disciples went about picking corn on the sabbath. That was not following the law, that was making an open show of the law and those who make themselves judges over the law, triumphing over them. What man of you having an ox...?

A number of God's laws appear to conflict with each other, such as when God commanded to rest on the Sabbath while also commanding priests to make offerings on the Sabbath (Numbers 28:9-10), however, it was not the case that priests were forced to sin by disobeying one of the two commands no matter what they chose to do but that the lesser command was never intended to be understood as preventing the greater from being obeyed. This is why Jesus said in Matthew 12:5-7 that priests who did their duties on the Sabbath were held innocent, why David and his men were held innocent, and why Jesus defended his disciples as being innocent. This is also why it is lawful to circumcise a baby on the 8th day if it happens to fall on the Sabbath, why it is lawful to get an ox out of a ditch on the Sabbath, and so forth.

Some Pharisees had reason that it is unlawful to work on the Sabbath and that healing is work, therefore it is unlawful to heal on the Sabbath, however, we are also commanded to love our neighbors as ourselves, we would not being doing that if we refused to heal them, and no command was intended to be understood as preventing us from obeying the greatest two commandments, which is why it was lawful for Jesus to heal on the Sabbath. So it not about following the law or not, but about what has priority.

 

[Soyeong]

Please take notice of a very important and much overlooked word in the verse you quoted, as well as the two other verses I will add.

“Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. Matthew 5:17-18


“The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it. Luke 16:16


What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. Galatians 3:19


The Question:

Does the word until denote that which is temporary or that which is permanent?


Out of the mouth of two or three witnesses let every truth be established.

Was the law until Christ or until John? Neither of them went around saying that the law has been abolished now that they've come and we nee to stop repenting, but rather that came with the message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which is the Gospel of the Kingdom that Luke 16:16 says was preached since John, so he was not saying that it had ended with him. Moreover, in Luke 16:17, Jesus said that it would be easier for the heaven and earth to disappear than for the least part to disappear form the law, so he was speaking about something that he thought was permanent and not something that he thought had already been abolished. In addition, Jesus proceeded to continue to teach obedience to God's law in Luke 16:18.

 

[JLB]

This is going in circles-I’m afraid we’re getting nowhere. You’re quoting Scripture, but how is it that you’re not grasping what I’m saying?

Please just observe and consider the three scriptures that all contain the same word until, and refers to the law of Moses.

Please answer the question at the bottom.


Please take notice of a very important and much overlooked word in the verse you quoted, as well as the two other verses I will add.

“Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. Matthew 5:17-18


“The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it. Luke 16:16


What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. Galatians 3:19


The Question:

Does the word until denote that which is temporary or that which is permanent?

 

[JLB]

However the Jews were given the law.
And it taught them and us somethings;

Yes the law of Moses with its sacrifices all pointed to Christ and the many wonderful things His sacrifice would do for us.

Moses was a type of Christ being the prophet.

Aaron was a type of Christ being the high priest.

The ark of the covenant as well as its contents were types of Christ.

The Sabbath was a shadow of the rest to come when Christ returns.

All the law of Moses were shadows and types that pointed to (was a school teacher) that pointed to Christ which He fulfilled.


The law of Moses is no longer needed having fulfilled its purpose.

 

[JLB]

The Messiah didn't come with the message that we should stop repenting and that we are now free to become doers of what God's law reveals to be wickedness because it has ended now that has come, but rather he came with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was in accordance within him being sent in fulfillment of the promise to turn us from our wickedness (Matthew 4:15-23, Acts 3:25-26).

The law has fulfilled its purpose having pointed the way to the Messiah.

We now have the actual person that cast the shadow and He dwells within us to teach us personally from within by His Spirit who gives us wisdom and understanding as we read the scriptures.

This is the promise of the New Covenant; that each of us would know Him, and the He Himself would teach us.

• “Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.” Jeremiah 31:31-34

• I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts;

• No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they all shall know Me,

• But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26

• But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him. 1 John 2:27

 

[JLB]

While the Spirit helps us to obey the Law of Moses, the Spirit does not lead us to do anything that is not in accordance with it.

But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
Galatians 5:18

“You have heard that it was said, You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you,
Matthew 5:43-44