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Are you taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Wearing the right shoes, and properly clothed spiritually?
Join Elected By Him for a devotional on Ephesians 6:14-15
https://christianforums.net/threads/devotional-selecting-the-proper-shoes.109094/
MATT 2:34 "This generation will not pass away" ... What did Jesus mean?
- Thread starter Divinyl
- Start date
Thats what I figured!
No scripture, but another book. Another Jesus! Another Gospel!
God's word for you.
But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed. Galatians 1:8-9
The Mormons have another book too.
JLB
Have things happened that are not recorded in Scripture? Do we have scriptural record of what went on when Rome sent Christians to the lions? Do we have scriptural accounts of WWI & WWII . No we dont. Did they happen yes....
We have historic records of the destruction of Jerusalem, that are not recorded in Scripture.
I believe the NT to have been written earlier, you believe later. Both sides of that issue have scholars in their corner. Because i believe not all of history is recorded in Scripture, there is history being recorded today, does then lead to another Jesus.
But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. Galatians 3:22
Notice it doesn't say, Historical records has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe historical records.
Doctrine is established by scripture, not historical records!
All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness ... 2 Timothy 3:16
I have been using scripture, not historical records to correct Stormcrows heretical teaching that is based on half historical records, which is not inspired by God and half scripture.
Mixing the two together to come up with a defiling heresy!
Scripture not historical records!
JLB
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felix
Guest
Even Jesus was persecuted and He had to escape for life at one instance. He also added no prophet is honored in his town.
up:I agree historical records are not Scripture.
Some folks will tell ya the Mighty Hand of God was part of the the Revolution 1776 time. Weather doing odd stuff etc.
If we use scripture as a prayer point. this is one of my favorites
2Ch 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. and God heals our land have we not mixed the history to come and scripture...
I really dont understand the connection you are trying to convey.... Yes i believe mankind are sinners i know that from reading the Scriptures ... i dont get it... care to try again?
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felix
Guest
We should not be taking historical accounts to fit prophecies. But, rather, we must take prophecies in Scripture to identify times and seasons. Both are different. Edited reba
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It is prophetic that the Lord will return. Some day His return will be history.
If He returned today that will be history of tomorrow...
Was Jerusalem destroyed? about 70 ad? What was prophesy in the OT was/is history also.
I guess the pyramids of Egypt are really not there. The wars 2000 BC that had no connection to the Hebrews never happened.... The persecution of Christians under Roman rule never happened.....??
History does not replace scripture not even close but there is history stuff really happened.... I personally believe God had/has His hand in the history of the human race both in Scripture and outside of Scripture...
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felix
Guest
You are not getting the message of what i said.
Read again:
We should not be taking historical accounts to fit prophecies. But, rather, we must take prophecies in Scripture to identify times and seasons. Both are different. The first will result in heresies but the latter will help us know the truth.
Most historical accounts are not mentioned in Scripture but does really happened. I never doubted it nor against it.
What I am saying is, if you happen to know a historical account and you have a few verses supporting it, you must not try to "fit" the other non supporting verses either by making symbolic representations or by spiritualizing, when the supporting verses are not done the same way.
e.g, Jesus did say about the destruction of the Temple. He did not say a spiritualized version of destruction or a symbolic destruction. He is precise to the point He was making. Jesus did say we will see the Him coming in a cloud with power and great glory. He didn't come after 2000yrs as He said and confirmed by the Angels in Acts 1. It simply means, it is a future event as the prophecies say. But many try to take historical accounts like 70 AD and other events to fit the prophecy by spiritualizing or symbolizing it when neither Scripture nor Christ mentioned that way rather than allowing the prophecy to identify or reveal it in its own time.
God's mighty hand definitely had alot to do with preserving the nation of Israel since 1948 through the wars and so forth!
Historical records can attest to that!
Amen!
Stormcrow
Member
Edited reba
Eusebius was an early church father. Here is what he said about Josephus:
It is wonderful to observe, likewise, in this singular event, the coincidence of the history given by Josephus, with that of the sacred Scriptures.
As Luke in the Acts, also introduces Gamaliel in the consultation respecting the apostles, saying, that at this time "arose Theudas, who gave out that he was some one, but who was destroyed, and all that obeyed him were dispersed," let us now, also, add the written testimony of Josephus respecting the same circumstance.
This account is given by Josephus in the second book of his history; and it is worth while to subjoin also to this account respecting the Egyptian, also that which is mentioned in the Acts of the Apostles. It was there said to Paul, by the centurion under Felix, when the multitude of the Jews raised a sedition against the apostle, "Art thou not indeed that selfsame Egyptian that excited and led away the thirty thousand assassins into the desert?" Such, however, were the events that happened under Felix.
But the number of calamities which then overwhelmed the whole nation; the extreme misery to which particularly the inhabitants of Judea were reduced, the vast numbers of men, with women and children that fell by the sword and famine, and innumerable other forms of death; the numerous and great cities of Judea that were besieged, as also the great and incredible distresses that those experienced who took refuge at Jerusalem, as to a place of perfect security; these facts, as well as the whole tenor of the war, and each particular of its progress, when finally, the abomination of desolation, according to the prophetic declaration, stood in the very temple of God, so celebrated of old, but which now was approaching its total down-fall and final destruction by fire; all this, I say, any one that wishes may see accurately stated in the history written by Josephus.
If Josephus was good enough for the early church fathers, he's good enough for me.
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Stormcrow
Member
At least half of all the scripture you claim to worship is historical in nature. What part of history should be thrown out of the Bible just for being "historical records"???
You have been using a doctrine that discards most of what Christ and the apostles taught and believed about His second coming. Were you actually using scripture as written without your own heretical spin on it, you would be able to present a doctrine that harmonizes perfectly with everything Christ said and the apostles wrote. You haven't because you can't. Your blind, slavish devotion to a "doctrine of demons" forces you to ignore what Christ and the apostles taught.
If there is anyone here worthy of wearing the heretic moniker, it would be you.
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Stormcrow
Member
But His disciples were not! Not until after He had ascended!
Again, you have purposely chosen to misrepresent Christ's words here. I trust others here can see that what you're doing is both dishonest and discredits the gospel of Christ.
People like you and JLB are why Christians are viewed as irrational by those of the world. What a witness you are!
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Stormcrow
Member
History is as much a part of scripture as is theology, poetry, metaphor, and prophecy. All truth is God's truth. Put another way, if something is true, God is behind it.
Paul encouraged the Philippians with these words:
Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things. Philippians 4:8 (NASB)
Truth is worth dwelling on wherever it may be found, even if it's in one of those history books JLB would like to see burned!
Never be ashamed of standing for truth wherever you find it.
And that is why you are a voice of reason.
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felix
Guest
But His disciples were not! Not until after He had ascended!
Again, you have purposely chosen to misrepresent Christ's words here. I trust others here can see that what you're doing is both dishonest and discredits the gospel of Christ.
People like you and JLB are why Christians are viewed as irrational by those of the world. What a witness you are!
Persecution neither means end times nor His coming. What makes you think that Chapter 10 refers to end times? He simply points out there will be persecution, prepares them for the ministry and sends them in Matthew chapter 10 and chapter 11:1 confirms it.
The end times is on chapter 24.
Tri Unity
Member
This discussion has been difficult to follow. It seems it has ventured into a dispute over Futurist verses Preterist teachings on prophecy.
I am personally influenced and persuaded by the Early Church Fathers on this topic; as scriptures can easily be construed into any theological perspective we can imagine. From what I have observed, the earliest church fathers ALL taught futurist eschatology. That does not mean that some scriptures on prophecy did not have a historical unfolding, for I believe they definitely did. A case in point is Daniel chapter 11, the King of North and the King of the South. The first real challenge to the futurist view came from the discussion on the Millennium, which the earliest fathers did teach the Preterist view on the Millennium (with minor exceptions) - but not on the return of Christ. The return of Christ has always been a futurist teaching. This, at least, has been my observation. I do not think either view is necessarily heretical. Probably a waste of time once discussions become antagonistic; yet cool heads have mostly prevailed. Well done for those of you endeavouring to preserve the bond of unity!
Tri
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