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Observing the Sabbath

J

Joe Domingo

Guest
Hello,

I would like to discuss the observance of the seventh day Sabbath. Are you for or against it and why? Also, in this discussion, please use scripture to support your position.

I'll start.

I believe in observing the Sabbath because it is part of the Ten Commandments.

Exodus 30:8, Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

I believe the Ten Commandments are Sound Doctrine. 2 Timothy 4:3.

I observe the Sabbath with the same fervor as not committing adultery, not stealing, not worshipping other gods, not murdering, not bearing false witness, not coveting, not using God's name in vain, not dishonoring my parents and not worshipping idols.

I do not see a separation between any of these Commandments. If I do one, I do them all, James 2:10,11,12.

Disclaimers: I do not observe the Sabbath to be saved. I do not observe the Sabbath to be perfect, I do not observe the Sabbath like a Pharisee, orthodox Jews or any one practicing Judaism outside of faith in Christ.

I observe the Sabbath like a person who believes in Christ, a fallen sinner in need of repentance and grace. I observe the Sabbath because I love Jesus and I believe in doing what he did. He is my Role Model for Life.

I observe the Sabbath because it is a part of the Ten Commandments and the Ten Commandments are my Moral Code.

Edit: I would also like to add that all Ten Commandments were the Moral Code that Jesus lived by as well. Does anyone challenge this?
 
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Ah come on 14 views no replies ...

It can't be that obvious, is it?

This is the subject that makes all Christians cringe - I wonder WHY?
 
yes we have discussed this on another thread, but I guess I will begin to defend the reason the Chruch worships on the first day of the week. Of course if we where under the law, we very well should keep the sabbath. And I agree with the OP that if one claims to be under the Ten Commandments, they very much should be under all of them. The OP also says that he "observes" the sabbath? Not sure what that means, because according to the law, this has very certain rules according to the written code. What I assume is that this is a day of rest and worship for him? Which is just as fine as frog hair. But for us who worship on the 1st day, we have clear biblical reasons.

Mr 16:2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
Mr 16:9 ¶ Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
Lu 24:1 ¶ Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.
Joh 20:1 ¶ The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
Joh 20:19 ¶ Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
Ac 20:7 ¶ And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.
1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come

Col 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 ¶ And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 ¶ Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath
 
yes we have discussed this on another thread, but I guess I will begin to defend the reason the Chruch worships on the first day of the week. Of course if we where under the law, we very well should keep the sabbath. And I agree with the OP that if one claims to be under the Ten Commandments, they very much should be under all of them. The OP also says that he "observes" the sabbath? Not sure what that means, because according to the law, this has very certain rules according to the written code. What I assume is that this is a day of rest and worship for him? Which is just as fine as frog hair. But for us who worship on the 1st day, we have clear biblical reasons.

Mr 16:2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
Mr 16:9 ¶ Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

He was already gone. He rose on Saturday afternoon at around sunset. There were no comma's in the original, they were added much later. This is the sense of verse 9...

Mar 16:9 Now when Jesus was risen, early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

Early on the first day of the week He appeared to Mary. This is not about when He rose, but when He appeared.

Lu 24:1 ¶ Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.

Luk 24:1 Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.
Luk 24:2 And they found the stone rolled away from the sepulchre.
Luk 24:3 And they entered in, and found not the body of the Lord Jesus.

He was already gone and had been for about 12 hours.

Joh 20:1 ¶ The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
Joh 20:19 ¶ Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

Hmmm, so Christ fulfulled this Feast Day...

Lev 23:10 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest unto the priest:
Lev 23:11 And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it.
Lev 23:12 And ye shall offer that day when ye wave the sheaf an he lamb without blemish of the first year for a burnt offering unto the LORD.

Remember He said...

Joh 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Then later that day He said...

Joh 20:27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.

One that Sunday, He ascended to the Father and presented Himself as the Wave Sheaf offering.

Ac 20:7 ¶ And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

The Diaglott has it...

Act 20:7 In and the first of the sabbaths, having been assembled of us to break bread, the Paul discoursed to them, being about to depart on the morrow; continued and the discourse till midnight.

They had met on the first Sabbath (of seven Sabbaths Lev 23:15 - after the Wave Sheaf counting to Pentecost) and Paul had spoken quite a long time, even to midnight onwhat we would call Saturday night. The others in his party had went ahead by ship...

Act 20:13 And we went before to ship, and sailed unto Assos, there intending to take in Paul: for so had he appointed, minding himself to go afoot.

Paul then on that Sunday walked nineteen miles across the peninsula to Assos...

Act 20:14 And when he met with us at Assos, we took him in, and came to Mitylene.

He was not observing Sunday, he was walking nineteen miles to meet up with his party at Assos.


1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come

1Co 16:1 Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye.
1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

Why were they laying up in store?

Act 11:27 And in these days came prophets from Jerusalem unto Antioch.
Act 11:28 And there stood up one of them named Agabus, and signified by the Spirit that there should be great dearth throughout all the world: which came to pass in the days of Claudius Caesar.
Act 11:29 Then the disciples, every man according to his ability, determined to send relief unto the brethren which dwelt in Judaea:
Act 11:30 Which also they did, and sent it to the elders by the hands of Barnabas and Saul.

1Co 16:3 And when I come, whomsoever ye shall approve by your letters, them will I send to bring your liberality unto Jerusalem.

They were collecting foodstuffs and preserving them on the first day of the week. Working on the first day of the week. Why? Because they were resting on the Sabbath. Why did Paul Mention the churches of Galatia in 1 Cor 16:1?

2Co 9:1 For as touching the ministering to the saints, it is superfluous for me to write to you:
2Co 9:2 For I know the forwardness of your mind, for which I boast of you to them of Macedonia, that Achaia was ready a year ago; and your zeal hath provoked very many.
2Co 9:3 Yet have I sent the brethren, lest our boasting of you should be in vain in this behalf; that, as I said, ye may be ready:
2Co 9:4 Lest haply if they of Macedonia come with me, and find you unprepared, we (that we say not, ye) should be ashamed in this same confident boasting.
2Co 9:5 Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren, that they would go before unto you, and make up beforehand your bounty, whereof ye had notice before, that the same might be ready, as a matter of bounty, and not as of covetousness.

After boasting to the other churches of the liberality of Corinth in relieving the starving saints in Jerusalem and Judea, Paul wanted to make sure he would not be put to shame if Corinth's collections were not bountiful.

2Co 9:6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.
2Co 9:7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
2Co 9:8 And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work:
2Co 9:9 (As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever.
2Co 9:10 Now he that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread for your food, and multiply your seed sown, and increase the fruits of your righteousness;)

Here he is referencing giving for those poor saints.

2Co 9:11 Being enriched in every thing to all bountifulness, which causeth through us thanksgiving to God.
2Co 9:12 For the administration of this service not only supplieth the want of the saints, but is abundant also by many thanksgivings unto God;

Col 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 ¶ And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

What is handwriting of ordinances?

From an article by Dr. Robert Thiel...

What Does Colossians 2:14 Really Say?

It is of interest to note that the expression "the handwriting of requirements" is a Greek legal term that signifies the penalty which a lawbreaker had to pay--through Jesus the penalty was wiped out ("the handwriting of requirements"), not the law! "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the LORD: I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them" (Heb 10:16).

Even Protestant commentators realize this. Notice what Matthew Henry's Commentary on the Whole Bible states about Colossians 2:14:

Whatever was in force against us is taken out of the way. He has obtained for us a legal discharge from the hand-writing of ordinances, which was against us (v. 14), which may be understood,

1. Of that obligation to punishment in which consists the guilt of sin. The curse of the law is the hand-writing against us, like the hand-writing on Belshazzar's wall. Cursed is every one who continues not in every thing. This was a hand-writing which was against us, and contrary to us; for it threatened our eternal ruin. This was removed when he redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us, Gal 3:13. (from Matthew Henry's Commentary on the Whole Bible: New Modern Edition, Electronic Database. Copyright (c) 1991 by Hendrickson Publishers, Inc.).

Some will argue that you still cannot keep the ten commandments (for "all have sinned"), even if they are all mentioned as being in effect after the crucifixion. Does this mean one should not try?

Furthermore, let's look at another translation:

14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross (Colossians 2:14, NASB)

The handwriting of requirements (often also called the hand-writing of ordinances) or certificate of debt was wiped away and nailed to the cross.

Which requirements were wiped out?

Please understand that the expression "the handwriting of requirements" (cheirógrafon toís dógmasin) is a Greek legal expression that signifies the penalty which a lawbreaker had to pay--it does not signify the laws that are to be obeyed--only the penalty. It is only through the acceptance of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ that the penalty was wiped out ("the handwriting of requirements"). But only the penalty, not the law!

15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 ¶ Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath

So the instruction here is don't let anyone judge you for keeping the Sabbath and the Holydays. How does this abrogate the Sabbath? It does not condemn the Sabbath, it says do net let anyone judge you for keeping it.
 
Disclaimers: I do not observe the Sabbath to be saved. I do not observe the Sabbath to be perfect.

Why don't you obey Sabbath to be saved or to be perfect ?

Because no one can be saved by works. That's why I don't observe or a better word to use is acknowledge the Shabbat to be saved. Now let me ask you s question? Would you willfully commit adultery?
 
Disclaimers: I do not observe the Sabbath to be saved. I do not observe the Sabbath to be perfect.

Why don't you obey Sabbath to be saved or to be perfect ?

Not answering for Joe, answering for myself. Because 100 liftetimes of 100 years each of perfect obedience to the Law will not EARN eternal life. It is the gift of God...

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Now breaking the Commandments does not earn eternal life either, in fact, breaking the Commandments can disqualify one from eternal life...

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
 
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Now breaking the Commandments does not earn eternal life either, in fact,
breaking the Commandments can disqualify one from eternal life...

This is WHY I DONT gamble with the Commandments.

I want to make sure my salvation is sure.
 
I would also like to add that all Ten Commandments were the Moral Code that Jesus lived by as well. Does anyone challenge this?

Yes I challenge this. It is not the truth nor is it found in scripture.

Jesus lived by every word that proceeded out of the mouth of God, not just the 10 commandments.

Jesus is the word of God and represented God by speaking on behalf of God and therefore His words gave life because every word that proceeded out of His mouth were the words of God.


17 But Jesus answered them, "My Father has been working until now, and I have been working." 18 Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God. John 5:17-18


24 "Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. John 5:24


30 I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me. John 5:30

Man shall not live by bread alone, but every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.

Again, Jesus lived by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God, not just the 10 commandments.


JLB
 
I would also like to add that all Ten Commandments were the Moral Code that Jesus lived by as well. Does anyone challenge this?

Yes I challenge this. It is not the truth nor is it found in scripture.

Jesus lived by every word that proceeded out of the mouth of God, not just the 10 commandments.

Jesus is the word of God and represented God by speaking on behalf of God and therefore His words gave life because every word that proceeded out of His mouth were the words of God.


17 But Jesus answered them, "My Father has been working until now, and I have been working." 18 Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God. John 5:17-18


24 "Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. John 5:24


30 I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me. John 5:30

Man shall not live by bread alone, but every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.

Again, Jesus lived by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God, not just the 10 commandments.


JLB

He healed a man on the Sabbath. Show me where this is defined as breaking the Sabbath. The Jews accused Him of breaking their Sabbath rules. One could not carry more than the weight of a fig. Show me that in the Bible. If your house catches fire on the Sabbath, you cannot carry your clothes out but if you can put ten changes of clothing on, you can wear them out. He was speaking to this...

Mar 7:3 For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash their hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders.
Mar 7:4 And when they come from the market, except they wash, they eat not. And many other things there be, which they have received to hold, as the washing of cups, and pots, brasen vessels, and of tables.
Mar 7:5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands?
Mar 7:6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
Mar 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Mar 7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
 
Jesus lived by every word that proceeded out of the mouth of God, not just the 10 commandments.

Jesus is the word of God and represented God by speaking on behalf of God and therefore His words gave life because every word that proceeded out of His mouth were the words of God.




Man shall not live by bread alone, but every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.

Again, Jesus lived by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God, not just the 10 commandments.


JLB

Mat 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
Luk 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

Hmmm, how can you quote that and then not do this?

Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Exo 31:14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
Exo 31:15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
Exo 31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
Exo 31:17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.
Exo 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

Exo 34:21 Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest: in earing time and in harvest thou shalt rest.

Exo 35:2 Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death.

Lev 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

And we have seen the correct translation of this before, but here it is again...

from the Diaglott...

Heb 4:9 Therefore remains a keeping of a sabbath for the people of the God.

The keeping of the Sabbath remains, at least that is what Paul says.
 
The keeping of the Sabbath remains, at least that is what Paul says.

But Jesus answered them, "My Father has been working until now, and I have been working."

I hope this is clear. It doesn't need any explanation.

The Sabbath is not what you think. Keeping the Sabbath, as it seems right to you, profits you nothing!

as it is written -

5 One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. Romans 14:5-6

There goes the Sabbath rule.

What matters is faith working by love.


JLB
 
And we have seen the correct translation of this before, but here it is again...

from the Diaglott...

Heb 4:9 Therefore remains a keeping of a sabbath for the people of the God.

The keeping of the Sabbath remains, at least that is what Paul says.

Selective translations to suit doctrinal slants are progressively common.

Any reader should be able to read that the Sabbath is a shadow of 'the good things to come.'

The good things to come...not that have yet arrived.

Remembrance is a matter held in 'mind' in any case of measures, not some external rigidity.

Memory. Re-memory.

Remembrance.

One does not become 'holy' by showing up in the pew on Saturday. That is just another fairytale nonsense avenue of religion.

s
 
In order to 'enforce' this supposed dictate every observing sect also carries a club that they use to destroy other believers over the matter.

Without 'enforcement' in the form of one or more 'penalties' the religious authorities who 'set up' their constructs would be largely ineffective to force their measures upon others, so, in the case of the SDA's version for example, anyone who does not observe the Saturday Sabbath is sinning and stands to potentially be eternally killed by God.

One may as well concoct a system to toss a virgin into a volcano or cut the heart of of human sacrifices at the top of large edifices to pacify such a 'God/god.'

Our religious systems have not come too far out of the jungle with idolatry in hand in overall patterns. They just got an upgrade is all.

Does that mean the Law and the Sabbath are without meanings? Of course not.

It certainly shows how the 'human mind' reacts when encountering such Words doesn't it?

The Words reveal the intent to KILL within the human heart.

Direct hit.

s
 
The keeping of the Sabbath remains, at least that is what Paul says.

But Jesus answered them, "My Father has been working until now, and I have been working."

I hope this is clear. It doesn't need any explanation.

The Sabbath is not what you think. Keeping the Sabbath, as it seems right to you, profits you nothing!

as it is written -

5 One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. Romans 14:5-6

There goes the Sabbath rule.

What matters is faith working by love.


JLB

Certain "work" on the Sabbath is recognized as OK. The Priests...

Mat 12:5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?

This admonishment followed this...

Mat 12:1 At that time Jesus went on the sabbath day through the corn; and his disciples were an hungred, and began to pluck the ears of corn, and to eat.
Mat 12:2 But when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto him, Behold, thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do upon the sabbath day.

The Pharisees were accusing the disciples of winnowing grain...

From Barclay's...

Here in this chapter we see the first definite steps, the end of which could be nothing other than the Cross. The characters are painted clear before us. On the one hand there are the Scribes and the Pharisees, the representatives of orthodox religion. We can see four stages in their increasing attitude of malignant hostility to Jesus.

(i) In Matt 12:1-8, the story of how the disciples plucked the ears of corn on the Sabbath day, we see growing suspicion. The Scribes and Pharisees regarded with growing suspicion a teacher who was prepared to allow his followers to disregard the minutia of the Sabbath Law. This was the kind of thing which could not be allowed to spread unchecked.

From Adam Clarke...

Matthew 12:2

Thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do - The Jews were so superstitious, concerning the observance of the Sabbath, that in their wars with Antiochus Epiphanes, and the Romans, they thought it a crime even to attempt to defend themselves on the Sabbath: when their enemies observed this, they deterred their operations to that day. It was through this, that Pompey was enabled to take Jerusalem. Dion. Cass. lib. xxxvi.
Those who know not the spirit and design of the divine law are often superstitious to inhumanity, and indulgent to impiety. An intolerant and censorious spirit in religion is one of the greatest curses a man can well fall under.


Matthew Henry...

Matthew 12:1-13

The Jewish teachers had corrupted many of the commandments, by interpreting them more loosely than they were intended; a mistake which Christ discovered and rectified (ch. 5) in his sermon on the mount: but concerning the fourth commandment, they had erred in the other extreme, and interpreted it too strictly. Note, it is common for men of corrupt minds, by their zeal in rituals, and the external services of religion, to think to atone for the looseness of their morals. But they are cursed who add to, as well as they who take fRom. the words of this book, Rev_22:16, Rev_22:19; Pro_30:6.

Oviously they did not break the Sabbath, if Christ broke the Sabbath, He was not without sin and could not be the perfect sacrifice...

Heb 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Now, did He break the Sabbath?
 
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Greetings to the Sabbath YES/NO thread!

I'm looking toward Heb 6 for various reason but one thing that I notice - look with me, please? Is that it speaks of "Elementary" or "Foundational" teachings as if we are somehow able to go past them. Setting fear aside, I would challenge that statement. Sure, sure. It was made by Paul who wrote under the authority of Ruach HaKodesh (Spirit Holy) as the Lord Breathed upon him. I don't challenge that. But the thought that we are able or should by now be able to move beyond foundational or elementary things? That's not in evidence today. Well, that's not what I see anyway.


Turn and look ---then after looking, turn.

Sparrowhawke said:
Yes i see your point and agree with it.

The "Heb 6:1" Point that was made? I can't take credit for that. It comes from our heart of service to the Lord. I am glad that you see it because it almost sounds to me like Paul was saying that we have no need to set those foundations and 'elementary' stones and teachings again and that we would do well to go toward the "meat" of the Word.

Here's a little "thought experiment" that we may take together. Pick any six members. 6 who seem to be very close knit and who understand each other and don't tend to argue with each other. Pick six examples of "brothers and sisters in the Lord," here on ChristianForums.net, from our Membership.

Then spread the "Foundational Teaching" that is referenced (but not taught) in Hebrews, chapter 6:

Heb 6 (NIV) -Extracted said:
  • Repentance from acts that lead to death,a
  • and of faith in God,
  • instruction about cleansing rites,b
  • the laying on of hands,
  • the resurrection of the dead,
  • and eternal judgment.
Footnotes:
a Or from useless rituals
b Or about baptisms

Paul is talking like there is no need to lay these things again? He said, Heb 6:1(NKJV) "Let us move beyond..." But today? So much has happened. What do you think, can we pick 6 people from the forum, any six, and survey them... would they, all six, agree on the foundation of our faith, the "elementary parts", according to Scripture?

We need those who are studied and sure who may speak the truth in kindness and nourish by the milk of the word.

Walk there, my friend. There. If I was prone to the dramatic, I would add, "I implore you to walk there." In the building of our most holy faith, in Christ, in Love.

Heb 6:3, And God permitting, we will do so.

Clearly we may be assured that worshiping God is not part of those things that need to be repented of. We do no longer need to strive regarding this. One brother honors the Lord on one day according to what he/she knows God has said... another may do the same. Do not both do same? One honors and the other also. Is there any place in the Bible that tells us to repent of this? We know that those who Honor God do not say, "Today only." Nobody says this.

I am certain that we are to become Peacemakers who sow in peace and work in unity: each of us, building each other up, and looking toward a harvest of upright acts and righteousness that shall be harvested and which is His due.
 
And we have seen the correct translation of this before, but here it is again...

from the Diaglott...

Heb 4:9 Therefore remains a keeping of a sabbath for the people of the God.

The keeping of the Sabbath remains, at least that is what Paul says.

Selective translations to suit doctrinal slants are progressively common.

Any reader should be able to read that the Sabbath is a shadow of 'the good things to come.'

The good things to come...not that have yet arrived.

Remembrance is a matter held in 'mind' in any case of measures, not some external rigidity.

Memory. Re-memory.

Remembrance.

One does not become 'holy' by showing up in the pew on Saturday. That is just another fairytale nonsense avenue of religion.

s

You do know what the Diaglott is, don't you?
 
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