Only ONE TRUE GOD.

[Solo]

Unred,
Since you reject the Baptist's manner of teaching salvation, which "denomination" teaches the truth?

 

[unred typo]

Unred,
Since you reject the Baptist's manner of teaching salvation, which "denomination" teaches the truth?

You mean the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth? I have no clue. If I knew, I would belong. I guess the only true church is the spiritual body of Christ scattered everywhere all over the world throughout all generations and I will know them when I see them by their love. Some no doubt belong to the Baptists, Catholics, Methodists, and many other denominations but their affiliation with the particular brand of Christianity is not what makes them part of the body. They are joined by their love for God and fellow man, not their doctrines. You and I may even be part, but we hide it well. :wink:

 

[Solo]

You mean the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth? I have no clue. If I knew, I would belong. I guess the only true church is the spiritual body of Christ scattered everywhere all over the world throughout all generations and I will know them when I see them by their love. Some no doubt belong to the Baptists, Catholics, Methodists, and many other denominations but their affiliation with the particular brand of Christianity is not what makes them part of the body. They are joined by their love for God and fellow man, not their doctrines. You and I may even be part, but we hide it well. :wink:

Is the preaching of the Word of God important in the salvation of the lost?
If so, what is the Word that is preached that one might be saved? Where can we read about this in the Scriptures.

Is the organization of the eklesia in Acts still followed today with teachers, bishops, deacons, elders, preachers, etc?

 

[unred typo]

Is the preaching of the Word of God important in the salvation of the lost?
If so, what is the Word that is preached that one might be saved? Where can we read about this in the Scriptures.

Is the organization of the eklesia in Acts still followed today with teachers, bishops, deacons, elders, preachers, etc?

Have to run, but I see you skipped over my earlier post by a single slap down answer. I’ll give you a chance to catch up while I run some errands. :wink:
:smt039

 

[Solo]

Have to run, but I see you skipped over my earlier post by a single slap down answer. I’ll give you a chance to catch up while I run some errands. :wink:
:smt039

I am caught up and moved on, you are just running backwards and cannot see me. :wink:

 

[Oscar3]

Unread
Have you considred islam? You seem to be sampling the religion buffet, so I thought I would ask

 

[scorpia]

which "denomination" teaches the truth?

There is only One who teaches the TRUTH always - the Lord God Jesus Christ, the One True God who himself is the TRUTH and the only source and authority in all TRUTH. Him is the One whom we must all seek, call on and come to if we want ourselves to be included in God's family.

The denomination is not the source nor authority in all TRUTH hence same could not teach the truth. Further, denominations of today are the fulfillment of the white horseman of Apo. 6:2 and the people must refrain from getting into it.

 

[scorpia]

Is the preaching of the Word of God important in the salvation of the lost?

Hearing of the word of God from God himself, not from our fellow men pastors, is important in the salvation of the lost.

If so, what is the Word that is preached that one might be saved? Where can we read about this in the Scriptures.

Just tell your fellow men to call on and come to God and have God as his Good Pastor and Teacher in his life. You cannot find this in the scripture because God is just besides you any time.

Is the organization of the eklesia in Acts still followed today with teachers, bishops, deacons, elders, preachers, etc?

Indeed it is still being followed by many hence they have fulfilled Apo. 6:2 re:white horseman. If you want to be saved, seek God instead of the so called right denomination based on your own perception only.

 

[Vic C.]

There is only One who teaches the TRUTH always - the Lord God Jesus Christ, the One True God who himself is the TRUTH and the only source and authority in all TRUTH. Him is the One whom we must all seek, call on and come to if we want ourselves to be included in God's family.

The denomination is not the source nor authority in all TRUTH hence same could not teach the truth. Further, denominations of today are the fulfillment of the white horseman of Apo. 6:2 and the people must refrain from getting into it.

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.

 

[unred typo]

I am caught up and moved on, you are just running backwards and cannot see me. :wink:

Having a discussion with you is like playing chess with a guy who cheats. Just when you about have him in check, he drops something and when you’re picking it up, he moves his men out of danger. When you call him on it, he insists you are mistaken, and that he is really winning and you are a sore loser. No problem, Solo, it’s only a game of words with you. You don’t care to see that your doctrines are keeping you from knowing God and what he has given us to do to be saved.

Is the preaching of the Word of God important in the salvation of the lost?
If so, what is the Word that is preached that one might be saved? Where can we read about this in the Scriptures.

Although I have answered this many times before for you, I will answer it again, in case you have opened your ears now. The word of God is important because it gives us the instructions that Jesus taught about how to be saved and it teaches you what he has done for man in order that our sins may be forgiven when we repent of them, and it shows the proof that God gave that following what Jesus taught will allow you to be raised from the dead as he was. You can be saved by following the leading of the Holy Spirit in your heart though, but you may not realize that by doing what the Spirit says, you will be forgiven and raised from physical death to life eternal. So yes, it’s important to preach it.

The word that is preached by us is the good news that your sins will be forgiven when you repent of them. The word that the Spirit preaches is the same word that Jesus taught, which is love one another, (i.e. forgive as you have been forgiven, turn the other cheek, be humble, not proud, give to the poor, and other things that are spoken daily to those who will listen.) Whenever you mess up, if you repent, God will abundantly pardon and restore you to your position in Christ. God is alive and you have no need that any man teach you, for it is God that works in you to do his good pleasure, which is his voice telling you to have love for one another. If you don’t listen, he has ways of slapping you side the head and getting your attention. Pain and punishment are very effective. A good nightmare will put the fear of God into you as well. It’s better to set aside your activities, pride and pleasures and obey what he tells you to do. There does come a day when you have hardened your heart so that you can no longer hear.

Is the organization of the eklesia in Acts still followed today with teachers, bishops, deacons, elders, preachers, etc?

There are churches everywhere, but few are just like the ones in Acts. Most are like the reprimanded ones in Revelation. The “eklesia†is nothing but a group of people who are believers in what Christ taught who follow the leading of God and help each other with encouragement and share physical blessings when any have needs. Teachers are those who turn those who are deceived by some sin back to repentance. Bishops, deacons, elders are nothing but distribution servants who are wise enough to divide the material goods among the members so that all is fair and no one is left out. Preachers, I believe, are those who have a special message from God to admonish or encourage the rest of the group.

Most churches today in this country (the U.S.) are nothing but exclusive religion clubs where falsely fabricated doctrines are taught that please the members and encourage them to be comfortable in their sin and not to worry about that knocking on their hearts. Anyone who finds that God’s word contradicts what they teach is branded as a heretic and excluded from the mutual fellowship enjoyed by the compliant ones.

:angel: :angel: :angel: :angel: :-?

 

[Imagican]

Well, I can see you feel pasionately about the subject but asking for direct scripture showing God and Christ are one and the same has the same controversial answers as asking for direct scripture showing that Christ was created.

But for me I'll take these couple examples as evidence that all things made can't include Himself as being made, a creature, that which was created.
:smt102


John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

And again

Colossians 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Hey Guys,

Sorry for taking so long for a response. Been on a 'vacation' to the Carolinas for Christmas and the New Year.

I believe that the answer to Mutz's question can be interpreted from this response to you Pot.

While I accept the words of the Bible without fail, I ALSO believe that MUCH of what is offered in the Word is NOT as literal as many seem to believe that it is. Let me explain.

At one point in the Word, it states that at the time in Egypt when Moses had delivered the 'message' to 'let my people go', God caused many hardships to befall the Egyptians. One was locusts. In the Word, it states that when the locusts came, they covered the 'face of the earth'. Now, does this mean that the WHOLE face of the earth was covered with locusts? I don't think so. For it was NOT the whole earth that God was attempting to teach a lesson. The face of the earth so far as EGYPT was concerned. From the perspective of those that witnessed this, it may have 'seemed' to be that they covered the 'face of the earth', while in 'reality', they were simply on 'one spot' on the face of the earth.

This is but one example of MANY that I could offer to explain my point but I believe that this is enough.

Now, with this in mind, I believe that what Potluck has offered is but another example of such a 'possible' misinterpretation. See, The Word was given 'to US'. We are NOT given anything other than that which pertains to US. So, when the Word offers that NOTHING was created that was NOT created by Christ, I believe, that this is pertaining to things concerning US. We don't know that Christ created the angels, or heaven etc....... It even states that 'the things' that are IN heaven, NOT that Christ Himself created HEAVEN. What we are told is that there is NOTHING pertaining to US that He did not create. And that, my friends, would include Himself.

I have NOT stated that Christ WAS created. What I stated is that I don't know if He was or NOT. But, to be a little more specific, I CERTAINLY believe that He may very well have been created and this is NOT something we have been specifically given information concerning. ONLY from a 'trinitarian' perspective would one be 'forced' to believe that; since God and Christ are ONE, (the same), would it become impossible for Christ to have been created.

Since He IS the Son of God, that in itself is enough evidence to certainly INDICATE that He MUST have been created. Otherwise, the term Son has NO MEANING in our present acceptance of it's definition.

MEC

 

[Oscar3]

I have NOT stated that Christ WAS created. What I stated is that I don't know if He was or NOT. But, to be a little more specific, I CERTAINLY believe that He may very well have been created and this is NOT something we have been specifically given information concerning. ONLY from a 'trinitarian' perspective would one be 'forced' to believe that; since God and Christ are ONE, (the same), would it become impossible for Christ to have been created.

Since He IS the Son of God, that in itself is enough evidence to certainly INDICATE that He MUST have been created. Otherwise, the term Son has NO MEANING in our present acceptance of it's definition.

MEC

Mr Mec]
With all due respect you have indeed said many times that Jesus was created. The biggest problem that I see you have is that you seem to believe that you are as smart as God.

You are under this illusion that God has revealed everything to us.

I am sure also do not believe God parted the red sea as well, right?

 

[Oscar3]

Oscar, did you get the secret decoder ring with that labeler? :roll:

Yes. its called the Holy Spirit who gives decerment. Something that you do not have. When You are born again then you will indeed have the HS and you will see.

 

[Solo]

Hey Guys,

Sorry for taking so long for a response. Been on a 'vacation' to the Carolinas for Christmas and the New Year.

I believe that the answer to Mutz's question can be interpreted from this response to you Pot.

While I accept the words of the Bible without fail, I ALSO believe that MUCH of what is offered in the Word is NOT as literal as many seem to believe that it is. Let me explain.

At one point in the Word, it states that at the time in Egypt when Moses had delivered the 'message' to 'let my people go', God caused many hardships to befall the Egyptians. One was locusts. In the Word, it states that when the locusts came, they covered the 'face of the earth'. Now, does this mean that the WHOLE face of the earth was covered with locusts? I don't think so. For it was NOT the whole earth that God was attempting to teach a lesson. The face of the earth so far as EGYPT was concerned. From the perspective of those that witnessed this, it may have 'seemed' to be that they covered the 'face of the earth', while in 'reality', they were simply on 'one spot' on the face of the earth.

This is but one example of MANY that I could offer to explain my point but I believe that this is enough.

Now, with this in mind, I believe that what Potluck has offered is but another example of such a 'possible' misinterpretation. See, The Word was given 'to US'. We are NOT given anything other than that which pertains to US. So, when the Word offers that NOTHING was created that was NOT created by Christ, I believe, that this is pertaining to things concerning US. We don't know that Christ created the angels, or heaven etc....... It even states that 'the things' that are IN heaven, NOT that Christ Himself created HEAVEN. What we are told is that there is NOTHING pertaining to US that He did not create. And that, my friends, would include Himself.

I have NOT stated that Christ WAS created. What I stated is that I don't know if He was or NOT. But, to be a little more specific, I CERTAINLY believe that He may very well have been created and this is NOT something we have been specifically given information concerning. ONLY from a 'trinitarian' perspective would one be 'forced' to believe that; since God and Christ are ONE, (the same), would it become impossible for Christ to have been created.

Since He IS the Son of God, that in itself is enough evidence to certainly INDICATE that He MUST have been created. Otherwise, the term Son has NO MEANING in our present acceptance of it's definition.

MEC

Here is the truth:

Jesus created all things as He is God Almighty.

19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be. Mark 13:19

The first verse of the writings of Moses in Genesis says that God created the heavens and the earth in the beginning.

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis 1:1

God created all that was created.

Who is this verse of Scripture speaking of?

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. Colossians 1:16-17

The answer is, Jesus Christ as we see in the following verses:

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence. 19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell; 20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven. Colossians 1:18-20

I will now replace the pronouns that point to the person of Jesus Christ with the proper name in the same Scripture verses.

16 For by JESUS CHRIST were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by JESUS CHRIST, and for JESUS CHRIST: 17 And JESUS CHRIST is before all things, and by JESUS CHRIST all things consist. 18 And JESUS CHRIST is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things JESUS CHRIST might have the preeminence. 19 For it pleased the Father that in JESUS CHRIST should all fulness dwell; 20 And, having made peace through the blood of JESUS CHRIST'S cross, by JESUS CHRIST to reconcile all things unto JESUS CHRIST; by JESUS CHRIST, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Colossians 1:18-20

Who created all things?

JESUS CHRIST.

What did the 24 elders in Heaven say about the one who created all things?

8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come. 9 And when those beasts give glory and honour and thanks to him that sat on the throne, who liveth for ever and ever, 10 The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying, 11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. Revelation 4:8-11

It is very plain that the Scriptures teach that Jesus is the Creator of all things, Jesus is Almighty God, Jesus sits on the throne that the 24 elders and four creatures worship, and it is Jesus's pleasure that all things were created.

 

[Oscar3]

The earliest followers of Jesus all seemed pretty convinced that Jesus was fully God in human form. Paul said, "He is the image of the invisible God...in him all the fulness of God was pleased to dwell." John said that Jesus created the world. Peter said, "every one who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name."

But what did Jesus say about himself? Did he ever identify himself as God? According to the Bible...absolutely! Below are some of his statements made while on earth, in their context.
Is Jesus God? How he implied he was God:

The Jews therefore said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?" Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself, and went out of the temple. (John 8:57-59)

"I and the Father are one." The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?" The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God." (John 10:30-33)

And Jesus cried out and said, "He who believes in Me does not believe in Me, but in Him who sent Me. And he who beholds Me beholds the One who sent Me. I have come as light into the world, that everyone who believes in Me may not remain in darkness." (John 12:44-46)

And so when He had washed their feet, and taken His garments, and reclined at the table again, He said to them, "Do you know what I have done to you? You call Me Teacher and Lord; and you are right, for I am. If I then, the Lord and the Teacher, washed your feet, you also ought to wash one another's feet." (John 13:12-14)

Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me. If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; from now on you know Him, and have seen Him." Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us." Jesus said to him, "Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how do you say, 'Show us the Father'?" (John 14:6-9)
Is Jesus God? How he described himself:

Jesus therefore said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, it is not Moses who has given you the bread out of heaven, but it is My Father who gives you the true bread out of heaven. For the bread of God is that which comes down out of heaven, and gives life to the world." They said therefore to Him, "Lord, evermore give us this bread." Jesus said to them, "I am the bread of life; he who comes to Me shall not hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst." (John 6:32-35)

Again therefore Jesus spoke to them, saying, "I am the light of the world; he who follows Me shall not walk in the darkness, but shall have the light of life." The Pharisees therefore said to Him, "You are bearing witness of Yourself; Your witness is not true." Jesus answered and said to them, "Even if I bear witness of Myself, My witness is true; for I know where I came from, and where I am going; but you do not know where I come from, or where I am going." (John 8:12-14)

Jesus therefore said to them again, "Truly, truly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep. All who came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them. I am the door; if anyone enters through Me, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. The thief comes only to steal, and kill, and destroy; I came that they might have life, and might have it abundantly. I am the good shepherd; the good shepherd lays down His life for the sheep." (John 10:7-11)

Martha therefore said to Jesus, "Lord, if You had been here, my brother would not have died. Even now I know that whatever You ask of God, God will give You." Jesus said to her, "Your brother shall rise again." Martha said to Him, "I know that he will rise again in the resurrection on the last day." Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life; he who believes in Me shall live even if he dies, and everyone who lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?" She said to Him, "Yes, Lord; I have believed that You are the Christ, the Son of God, even He who comes into the world." (John 11:21-27)
Is Jesus God? What he said he was sent here to do:

But Jesus called them to Himself, and said, "You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their great men exercise authority over them. It is not so among you, but whoever wishes to become great among you shall be your servant, and whoever wishes to be first among you shall be your slave; just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many." (Matthew 20:25-28)

For He was teaching His disciples and telling them, "The Son of Man is to be delivered into the hands of men, and they will kill Him; and when He has been killed, He will rise three days later." But they did not understand this statement, and they were afraid to ask Him. (Mark 9:31-32)

"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world should be saved through Him. He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." (John 3:16-18)

"All that the Father gives Me shall come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him, may have eternal life; and I Myself will raise him up on the last day." (John 6:37-40)

 

[stranger]

MEC,

Chalcedonian definition. . .

We, then, following the holy Fathers, all with one consent, teach men to confess one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, the same perfect in Godhead and also perfect in manhood;truly God and truly man, of a reasonable [rational] soul and body;consubstantial [co-essential] with the Father according to the Godhead, and consubstantial with us according to the Manhood;in all things like unto us, without sin; begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead, and in these latter days, for us and for our salvation, born of the Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, according to the Manhood; one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, only begotten, to be acknowledged in two natures, inconfusedly, unchangeably, indivisibly, inseparably; the distinction of natures being by no means taken away by the union, but rather the property of each nature being preserved, and concurring in one Person and one Subsistence, not parted or divided into two persons, but one and the same Son, and only begotten, God the Word, the Lord Jesus Christ; as the prophets from the beginning [have declared] concerning Him, and the Lord Jesus Christ Himself has taught us, and the Creed of the holy Fathers has handed down to us.

Who can surpass this as definitive? It is exclusive and inclusive.

blessings: stranger

 

[scorpia]

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.

This is purely theoretical and there is no truth in these accounts of the bible. If this is true, then there should have been no denominations not only in the so called christian world but even in the RCC as we can see it today. There is only one HS but there are many christian denominational churches, where have they gone wrong? Indeed there is no HS teaching them because it is the Lord God Jesus Christ who is the Teacher of all. Hear them frrom the Lord himself and refrain from treating the bible as if it was God.

 

[Vic C.]

2 Pet 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
2 Pet 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
2 Pet 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
2 Pet 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2 Pet 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
2 Pet 2:3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.


Peter, who walked with the Lord, says no one is to privately interpret. I believe what you are doing is worse than private interpretation; you refure Scripture. You have no proof whatsoever that God did not, nor is incapable of preserving HIS word. Your say your problem is with man, but you deny Scripture; you never use it and you are in danger of denying the HS of His work in instructing us in the word of God.

You'd know absolutely nothing about Jesus if God didn't preserve HIS word for all to learn from and use to spread HIS word; not the word of someone's alleged revelations.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.
John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
John 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
John 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

 

[Solo]

Hey, Vic.
Is scorpia deceived and listening to a spirit not from God?

 

[unred typo]

Scorpia is telling us what Jesus and the disciples warned about. There will be tares sown in the wheat, and God will allow errors to mingle with his words because of the silly hearts of men who build with a mixture of truth and error and by pulling the errors, God would pull some of the wheat with them. If you didn’t even have a Bible, you would not have so many errors in your thinking because of how you have added false ideas to what was written and how it has been translated with these false ideas embedded in it. Even the wonderful KJV is not infallible. Only God is infallible.

The Pharisees could not boil the law and prophets down to the simple concept that we are to love and forgive one another, but made a monstrosity of impossible laws, rituals and regulations. Now you have taken the teaching of Christ which was simple love for God and mercy for one another and turned it into a complicated fabrication of definitions and doctrines.

Now when someone comes to you and tells you to only follow Christ, you don’t even recognize the Spirit by which they are preaching. Very sad. :

If you go to God, your creator and savior, and you ask for truth, will he give you lies?
:-?