I don't think he is exaggerating a bit.
Christian Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
-
Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
Paul said there is "one baptism"
- Thread starter Charlie24
- Start date
Highway54
Member
Why are you working then sir?
Highway54
Member
Amen Hopeful!
Not because I have to but because I want to! The new man in Christ has new desires, he wants to please Christ.
No one has ever accomplished as much for Christ as did Paul. All of it was out of love from the heart of the new man!
Titus 2:14
“Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.”
The word "zealous" in the Greek is "zelotes."
Strong's Concordance
zélótés: zealous
Original Word: ζηλωτής, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: zélótés
Phonetic Spelling: (dzay-lo-tace')
Definition: zealous
Usage: one who is eagerly devoted to a person or a thing, a zealot.
HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 2207 zēlōtḗs – a person with zealous enthusiasm who (literally) "boils over with passion" ("someone burning with zeal," J. Thayer). See 2205 (zēlos).
2707 /kataphrontḗs ("a zealous person") is used of "one who is deeply committed to something and therefore zealous – 'enthusiast, zealous person' " (L & N, 1, 25.77).
This passion to do good works is given to us by the Holy Spirit through faith.
It's not something we must conjure up of ourselves.
Of course if you believe salvation takes place at water baptism, then that's what you will believe regardless.
Rom. 6:3-4
"Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life."
Notice that Paul said, "baptized into Christ" and then "baptized into his death."
This is immersion into Christ, the death of Christ spiritually, not in water! Water baptism is the symbol of this spiritual immersion into the death of Christ. Peter even tells us it is the symbol.
1 Peter 3;21
"The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:"
The "like figure" means a "symbol" it is the symbol of our spiritual baptism/immersion into the death of Christ.
I could go back to the OP and show you again in Col. 2 that this is an operation of God, the circumcision made without hands, but I doubt you want to hear it. Simply put, our salvation takes place spiritually in the heart through faith, not in the symbol of water baptism.
Careful there...
If water baptism is just a figure, so too is Noah's ark just a like figure.
Can just one be literal?
Peter was not referring to the 8 souls being saved from sin by the water, that would have been impossible. He was referring to their lives being saved, saved from drowning as the rest.
The thought is that as the water lifted the ark out of the water to their safety, saving them, so is water baptism the symbol of being saved in our spiritual salvation.
The "baptism that now saves us" is the circumcision made without hands in the New Covenant. It is what Jeremiah prophesied would happen in the New Covenant. Our immersion into Christ through the Holy Spirit.
The ark saved the eight from the fate of the vile, wicked world.
So too will "immersion" into Christ and into His death and burial save us from the same fate on the day of judgement.
It is the instrument of our actual, impending, salvation.
How is that body cast off?
By our immersion into Christ and His death.
His death and burial is our death and burial, and thankfully we are also raised with Him to walk in newness of life.
I like what Peter wrote in 1 Peter 4:1..."Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;"
Without being baptized into Christ's death, we can't "cease from sin".
So, is that "baptism that now saves us" a water baptism or a spiritual baptism? It should be very obvious which it is!
Co. 2:11-12
"In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead."
Can there be any doubt as to which baptism Paul and Peter are referring to?
No, there is no doubt.
Metaphysics
The physical and that greater than the physical.
Parable
The physical of creation and the greater hidden meaning. The seed is the Word of God. The Ground is men’s hearts.
Both exist. It is not choose one or the other, but can we understand the parallel meanings.
Both depend on the other.
Water Baptism is a physical action that has an implication beyond the physical.
Jesus used parables to conceal truth from some, but explained what was going on to the disciples.
Today there is more revelation of symbolism.
Then I am a redneck from Mississippi, and have I got it just right?
eddif
Highway54
Member
Then you have accepted what we teach on the subject. You believe with God's admonition through James that you show your faith through your works. Thumbs up to you Charlie.
What is the process
? How fo you get to be "in Christ"? The Ethiopian eunuch was baptized in WATER! read the account closely in Acts 8 and tell me (and Philip) that water baptism is not essential nor is it the one baptism of the bible. The baptism of John, which was the precursor to the baptism into Christ, was the exact same baptism as the one in Acts 2:38 except the later was in the name of Jesus Christ but still the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
That is all true! Christ commanded water baptism, the apostles demanded it. It was and is not an option!
Paul did not down play water baptism when he said, "I thank God that I baptized none of you..."
My point is that water baptism is not a baptism to itself. In other words, it is a shadow of the "one baptism," it recognizes the true baptism that saves us, which is being "baptized into Christ" spiritually.
Through water baptism we literally see ourselves baptized into the death of Christ (being lowered down into the water), and being raised a "new creation" in Christ (being raised up out of the water).
Water baptism is the symbol of what took place spiritually when we believed from the heart and were saved.
The difference between the JW's and myself is that my faith is totally in Christ for my salvation, not in my works.
My works are willful not a part of my salvation,
We are doing the same thing, but a much different mindset. The mindset makes all the difference to God!
If water baptism is the symbol of what took place [past tense] spiritually, then it is a) symbolic and b) accomplishes nothing by itself. Therefore, it is an option. It does indeed recognize the true baptism that saves us, which is being "baptized into Christ" spiritually, but it is not mandatory. Why would it be if one is already born of the Spirit? Can a person be born of water, born of the Spirit, and be born a third time of water?
The ark saved eight souls.
"Immersion" into Christ and into His death and burial will save countless souls.
Without the ark, nobody would have been saved.
Without water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins, nobody of the NT will be saved.
It's our confession of what Christ has done for us! That's why the Scripture refers to water baptism as "baptized in the name of the Lord/Christ."
Our salvation took place in the heart, no one could see it happen. When we are water baptized we have a ceremony in honor of what Christ has done for that person for everyone to see. This is what the apostles demanded, that you confess your salvation before God and man in the name of Christ.
Last edited:
This is why I say that water baptism is not a baptism of itself. It's a reflection of the "one true baptism" that Paul described to us.
Paul went into great detail to present the problems and doctrinal errors of his day, but there was no problem with the purpose of water baptism in his day, the reason we find very little information on water baptism.
After the apostles were gone and the full cannon of Scripture completed, came the error in water baptism. There are many such errors we will not find addressed in Scripture because there was no problem with it in that day.
It is my belief that God allowed it to be this way to separate His own from those who will follow the ways of man.