Peter not the rock nor the first Pope

[NewLifeInChrist]

This was directed to Carry_Your_Name in response to her post #128. I'm talking about Jesus literal flesh and blood that some believe turns into that literally when they take communion. 1John 5:11-12 is about how we have eternal life through Christ. They who have the Son has eternal life; and they who have not the Son of God has not eternal life.

I know it was. I was just having a little fun with the subject.

 

[for_his_glory]

Simple, become a member of his body, which is the church, receive the communion, thereby you partake his flesh and blood.

I'm speaking of eating His literal flesh and drinking His literal blood as some assume the bread and the wine actually turn into flesh and blood.

 

[for_his_glory]

Most assuredly I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him. (Jn. 6:53-56)

This comes from your post #126 where you said no one has a direct line to God, but I showed you in post #127 with scripture that we do have a direct line to God through Christ Jesus who lives within us, but you refute this. Take another look at these scriptures you gave here as it to says "and I in him".

I'm not going to get into the Trinity as that needs to be another topic.

 

[NewLifeInChrist]

Then why did Stephen see Jesus at the right hand of the Father? Was he lying? Hallucinating?

Then this shows you don't know the basics. Jesus himself prophecied: "you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of Power and coming with the clouds of heaven." (Mk. 14:62) He is in heaven, not on earth. What is on earth is the Holy Spirit, if He hadn't left, the Holy Spirit wouldn't have come to us. (Jn. 16:7)

This is the hill on which you're going to fall on your sword? Jesus can't live in our hearts because His location (sitting or standing at the right hand of the Father) is stated in Scripture? How do you make sense of the many dozens of Scriptures that say He does live in our hearts and that we do not belong to Him if He doesn't live in our hearts?

 

[Prycejosh1987]

Peter is not the first pope, that is Catholic jargon and catholic historical teaching. The Romans paganised Christianity. They are the ones who destroyed the temple after Jesus time and tried to get rid of the evidence of Jesus rise and death. Its true that technically the people close to Jesus are saints because they would of got saved. that is a saint. Its also true that Peter is the rock because that is what Cephas name means, Rock. He was the head of the church, and even Paul had to take under his authoirty in the start of the church, Paul westernised Christianity and said Jewish traditions did not need to be followed. But Peter set the record straight and agreed with Paul after arguments about it. This is what i found out from research.

 

[for_his_glory]

Peter is not the first pope, that is Catholic jargon and catholic historical teaching. The Romans paganised Christianity. They are the ones who destroyed the temple after Jesus time and tried to get rid of the evidence of Jesus rise and death. Its true that technically the people close to Jesus are saints because they would of got saved. that is a saint. Its also true that Peter is the rock because that is what Cephas name means, Rock. He was the head of the church, and even Paul had to take under his authoirty in the start of the church, Paul westernised Christianity and said Jewish traditions did not need to be followed. But Peter set the record straight and agreed with Paul after arguments about it. This is what i found out from research.

Peter's name might mean rock, but yet he was not the rock. My name means Bee, but yet I am not a Bee. With all the scriptures that have been given in this thread they all say that Jesus is the rock of our salvation and the gates of hell can not prevail against Him.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

I'm speaking of eating His literal flesh and drinking His literal blood as some assume the bread and the wine actually turn into flesh and blood.

Apparently that’s a figure of speech, similar to “born again”, “raise this temple in three days”, “living water”. His audience took it literally in every one of these occasions, I think we should know it better with retrospect.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

This is the hill on which you're going to fall on your sword? Jesus can't live in our hearts because His location (sitting or standing at the right hand of the Father) is stated in Scripture? How do you make sense of the many dozens of Scriptures that say He does live in our hearts and that we do not belong to Him if He doesn't live in our hearts?

Lord Jesus is Lord Jesus, Holy Spirit is Holy Spirit. Jesus has ascended into heaven, Holy Spirit lives in our heart, that’s what’s clearly stated in the Scripture.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

This comes from your post #126 where you said no one has a direct line to God, but I showed you in post #127 with scripture that we do have a direct line to God through Christ Jesus who lives within us, but you refute this. Take another look at these scriptures you gave here as it to says "and I in him".

I’ve never denied such a “direct line”, all I’m saying is that this direct line requires partaking in his body, according to the Lord’s own words. You gotta have skin in the game, being a player instead of a spectator. Jesus was speaking in the language of body politics, it doesn’t mean cannibalism - or so called “transubstantiation”, though.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Peter's name might mean rock, but yet he was not the rock. My name means Bee, but yet I am not a Bee. With all the scriptures that have been given in this thread they all say that Jesus is the rock of our salvation and the gates of hell can not prevail against Him.

The name Peter was given by Jesus, the thing is, petros means PEBBLE - a small, rounded stone usually found along river or lake as they are worn by water, that's the kind of stone which king David hit Goliath with; petra, the kind of rock Jesus built his church upon is a huge, thick rockbed, that's the kind of rock Jesus referred to in Matt. 7:24: "Therefore whoever hears these sayings of Mine, and does them, I will liken him to a wise man who built his house on the rock."

 

[eddif]

We absolutely have our own direct line to God as we walk with Him and talk to Him, especially in prayer as each one of us came before Him in various situations in our life and humbled our self before before His throne of grace surrendering our will to be in God's will beginning that personal relationship with Christ Jesus when we repented and confessed Christ as our personal Lord and Savior, Romans 10:9-10.

1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
1Ti 2:6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Psalms 55:16 As for me, I will call upon God; and the LORD shall save me.
Psalms 55:17 Evening, and morning, and at noon, will I pray, and cry aloud: and he shall hear my voice.

Psalms 62:1 To the chief Musician, to Jeduthun, A Psalm of David. Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation.
Psalms 62:2 He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved.

Has nothing to do with any denomination/non-denomination. but only through our own personal relationship with Christ Jesus.

I really agree with the JLB response of AMEN.

We are each sometimes unique. The Father supplies the Diversity of Gifts

The Son is the Administration of the Gifts.

The Holy Spirit distributes the Gifts.

Peter was unique. Paul was unique. The Holy Spirit empowered them Differently.
But
Both are members of the body of Christ Jesus.
Both were Apostles. We should not chose just one to follow. The body of Christ has different functions, but are of the same body.
A hand is not an eye. God does not think like we do.

The building has a cornerstone, and that is Christ Jesus.

We have an Intercessor seated on the right hand of the Father.
If we open the door we have a life giving spirit in us.

This is all much more complicated than we can comprehend. Well, right now we see through a glass darkly, but at the last trump change comes.

Mississippi redneck
eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

The name Peter was given by Jesus, the thing is, petros means PEBBLE - a small, rounded stone usually found along river or lake as they are worn by water, that's the kind of stone which king David hit Goliath with; petra, the kind of rock Jesus built his church upon is a huge, thick rockbed, that's the kind of rock Jesus referred to in Matt. 7:24: "Therefore whoever hears these sayings of Mine, and does them, I will liken him to a wise man who built his house on the rock."

No one is refuting this.

 

[for_his_glory]

I’ve never denied such a “direct line”, all I’m saying is that this direct line requires partaking in his body, according to the Lord’s own words. You gotta have skin in the game, being a player instead of a spectator. Jesus was speaking in the language of body politics, it doesn’t mean cannibalism - or so called “transubstantiation”, though.

Not sure what you mean by body politics

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Not sure what you mean by body politics

Illustrating an institution or a system as a human body. Christ himself being the supreme head of his church, which is his body, that's language of body politics. Likewise, eating his flesh and drinking his blood means partaking in the church body.

 

[for_his_glory]

Illustrating an institution or a system as a human body. Christ himself being the supreme head of his church, which is his body, that's language of body politics. Likewise, eating his flesh and drinking his blood means partaking in the church body.

Thank you.

 

[NewLifeInChrist]

Lord Jesus is Lord Jesus, Holy Spirit is Holy Spirit. Jesus has ascended into heaven, Holy Spirit lives in our heart, that’s what’s clearly stated in the Scripture.

What does this mean: "Now the Lord is the Spirit" (2 Co 3:17)?
What does this mean: "But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him" (1 Co 6:17)?
What does this mean: "God is Spirit" (Jn 4:24)?

What does this mean: "We will come to him and make Our home with him" (Jn 14:23)?

What does this mean: "Christ in you" (Col 1:27)?
What does this mean: "And if Christ is in you" (Ro 8:10)?
What does this mean: "Christ may dwell in your hearts" (Eph 3:17)?
What does this mean: "Jesus Christ is in you" (2 Cor 13:5)?
What does this mean: "I will come to you" (Jn 14:18)?
What does this mean: "I in them" (Jn 17:23, 26)?
What does this mean: "Christ lives in me" (Gal 2:20)"?
What does this mean: "He who has the Son" (1 Jn 5:12)?
What does this mean: "I in you" (Jn 14:20)?

Christianity without "Christ in you, the hope of glory" (Col 1:27)? I can't imagine such a thing.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

What does this mean: "Now the Lord is the Spirit" (2 Co 3:17)?
What does this mean: "But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him" (1 Co 6:17)?
What does this mean: "God is Spirit" (Jn 4:24)?

What does this mean: "We will come to him and make Our home with him" (Jn 14:23)?

What does this mean: "Christ in you" (Col 1:27)?
What does this mean: "And if Christ is in you" (Ro 8:10)?
What does this mean: "Christ may dwell in your hearts" (Eph 3:17)?
What does this mean: "Jesus Christ is in you" (2 Cor 13:5)?
What does this mean: "I will come to you" (Jn 14:18)?
What does this mean: "I in them" (Jn 17:23, 26)?
What does this mean: "Christ lives in me" (Gal 2:20)"?
What does this mean: "He who has the Son" (1 Jn 5:12)?
What does this mean: "I in you" (Jn 14:20)?

Christianity without "Christ in you, the hope of glory" (Col 1:27)? I can't imagine such a thing.

OK two can play this game. What does any of these below mean?

Matt. 26:64 It is as you said. Nevertheless, I say to you, hereafter you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Power, and coming on the clouds of heaven.
Jn. 7:33 I shall be with you a little while longer, and then I go to Him who sent Me.
Jn. 14:1 "I go to prepare a place for you."
Jn. 16:5-7 “But now I go away to Him who sent Me, and none of you asks Me, ‘Where are You going?’But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart. Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you
Jn. 16:16 A little while, and you will not see Me; and again a little while, and you will see Me, because I go to the Father.”
Acts 1:9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight.
Acts 7:56 “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!
Rev. 12:5 She bore a male Child who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron. And her Child was caught up to God and His throne.

Most importantly, Jesus Christ comes in the FLESH, not just in ethereal, abstract spirit, this is the only litmus test that tells the Holy Spirit from all false spirits. Your understanding seems to have failed this test.

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world. (1 Jn. 4:1-3)

 

[eddif]

What does this mean: "Now the Lord is the Spirit" (2 Co 3:17)?
What does this mean: "But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him" (1 Co 6:17)?
What does this mean: "God is Spirit" (Jn 4:24)?

What does this mean: "We will come to him and make Our home with him" (Jn 14:23)?

What does this mean: "Christ in you" (Col 1:27)?
What does this mean: "And if Christ is in you" (Ro 8:10)?
What does this mean: "Christ may dwell in your hearts" (Eph 3:17)?
What does this mean: "Jesus Christ is in you" (2 Cor 13:5)?
What does this mean: "I will come to you" (Jn 14:18)?
What does this mean: "I in them" (Jn 17:23, 26)?
What does this mean: "Christ lives in me" (Gal 2:20)"?
What does this mean: "He who has the Son" (1 Jn 5:12)?
What does this mean: "I in you" (Jn 14:20)?

Christianity without "Christ in you, the hope of glory" (Col 1:27)? I can't imagine such a thing.

Now that is a good question.

I if a seed is equal to the Word of God (and Jesus says it is)

Marriage is becoming joined in one flesh. We are made in the image off of God.
So
If we are born again of the Spirit; Jesus is the bridegroom and we are the bride.

This is imagery at work. Some can see the concept, but others do not.

Mississippi redneck
eddif

 

[NewLifeInChrist]

OK two can play this game.

It's not a game.

What does any of these below mean?

Matt. 26:64 It is as you said. Nevertheless, I say to you, hereafter you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Power, and coming on the clouds of heaven.
Jn. 7:33 I shall be with you a little while longer, and then I go to Him who sent Me.
Jn. 14:1 "I go to prepare a place for you."
Jn. 16:5-7 “But now I go away to Him who sent Me, and none of you asks Me, ‘Where are You going?’But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart. Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you
Jn. 16:16 A little while, and you will not see Me; and again a little while, and you will see Me, because I go to the Father.”
Acts 1:9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight.
Acts 7:56 “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!
Rev. 12:5 She bore a male Child who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron. And her Child was caught up to God and His throne.

You say the verses I quoted can't be true because the verses you quoted must be true. That is not a good argument. However, I would answer your question by saying that Jesus' departure from earth was necessary as He said, but was only temporary because, as He said, "I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you." (Jn 14:18).

Most importantly, Jesus Christ comes in the FLESH, not just in ethereal, abstract spirit, this is the only litmus test that tells the Holy Spirit from all false spirits. Your understanding seems to have failed this test.

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world. (1 Jn. 4:1-3)

I take this to mean that you believe the Catholic Church is standing in for Jesus' physical presence on earth and that anyone who rejects Catholicism is being led by the "spirit of the Antichrist". Is that what you're saying?

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

You say the verses I quoted can't be true because the verses you quoted must be true.

This is a common logical fallacy called false dilemma, and this is one of the biggest challenges in biblical study. Many statements may seem to be contradictory on face value unless you understand the proper context and references.

However, I would answer your question by saying that Jesus' departure from earth was necessary as He said, but was only temporary because, as He said, "I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you." (Jn 14:18).

What is temporary to Lord Jesus is like 2000 years plus to us - “one day with the Lord is like a thousand years and a thousand years one day.” Yes, of course He will come back to us, and I believe it’s near, as near as the 2030s, but that hasn’t happened, we’re not there yet. We’re not left orphans as we’ve received the Holy Spirit.

I take this to mean that you believe the Catholic Church is standing in for Jesus' physical presence on earth and that anyone who rejects Catholicism is being led by the "spirit of the Antichrist". Is that what you're saying?

Catholic Church doesn’t own Jesus, Christianity is not their intellectual property. Jesus’s physical presence extends to all nations on earth, not just Western Europe. The bottom line is, if you believe that the church is the body of Christ and the presence of his kingdom, then that’s his physical presence.