Bible Study Rapture

[JLB]

Signs, signs, everywhere are signs. But signs of what? Wars and rumors of wars? Earthquakes in divers places? The gathering of armies? Signs of the coming of His mighty wrath? Or the signs of HIS MERCY that endures forever? The children of darkness see the works of sin in the world and then try to warn of the wrath of God, while they themselves hide beneath a covering and watch for the signs of the coming and wrath of God. But the children of light see the works of sin in the world and show forth the grace and compassion of the Lord, for they no longer hide themselves beneath the covering, but allow for the glory of the Lord to be revealed in them. But the children of darkness still seeks after a sign.

A wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, but no sign shall be given but that of Jonah the prophet. Many are simply taught that the sign of Jonah was about the resurrection of Jesus, but they are missing out on a great deal more of the sign of Jonah. For the sign of Jonah to the children of light is the resurrection of the body of Christ, that being the raising up of His Church, the bride. But the children of darkness want nothing to do with the light, so they hope the light is taken up to heaven where they will then await and watch for the signs of his coming in the mighty wrath and judgement of the Lord.

But so that the children of light are not caught completely unaware, there is another sign of Jonah that is hidden from the children of darkness, for they love the judgements of the Lord and their pride will not let them see, but the wrath the God they warn others of and watch for themselves shall fall upon their own heads, for they hath not considered the testimony of Jonah, nor the voice crying in the wilderness, nor the words of the bridegroom; but instead they turn their backs away from the light for a word of judgement instead.

Most know the story of Jonah, how he was swallowed up by a whale...... But Jonah was sent to deliver a message to Nineveh from the Lord that their days were numbered. But when the Lord repented of the evil that He was going to bring upon Nineveh, it displeased Jonah much like the elder brother in the parable of the prodigal son. Jonah grew angry and did not believe the word of the Lord, so Jonah built himself a booth to sit under while he waited and watched to see what their end would be. But the Lord took pity on Jonah and caused a vine to grow up over him and cover him, giving him shade. And Jonah was thankful for that gift as he kept watch until the numbered days be complete. But poor Jonah, as he kept watch upon the city, the Lord took from him the covering and then smote him such that he cried out and wanted to die.

The children of darkness speak of the wrath of God because the wrath of God rest's upon their heads, but they do not believe the word of the Lord, that He has repented of the evil he thought to do. They do not accept the word of the Lord and His promise of salvation and withholding his wrath under his covenant of peace that was confirmed in the blood of Christ. Instead the children of darkness take up the covering given to them to hide from the light whilst they keep watch for the signs of the coming destruction.

The children of darkness presume to know and understand the signs, telling you that everything thing they need to know and look for is given to them in the scriptures. They will speak of trumpets and warn of vials; they speak of what they have heard and read. But whilst they sit under their booth and under their covering keeping watch for the signs of destruction, the voice of the sound of the seven thunder's was kept from them; or in spite of all their professions, maybe they lack the faith or they just simply do not believe.

4 And Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many.
Matthew 24:4


and again



For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman.1 Thessalonians 5:3



JLB

 

[ezrider]

4 And Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many.
Matthew 24:4


and again



For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman.1 Thessalonians 5:3



JLB

So what is your point? Why even the devil himself can quote the scripture. But you have told us of the signs that you look for, as have others that have posted in this thread, because it becomes evident they seek to know the signs that lead to the "man of sin" being revealed. But if they stand watch for the man of sin, then how shall they see the Lord in His Glory?

Matthew 5:5
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

The Sand of the Sea should know and understand its position. For a grain of sand contends with the waves of the sea, it it battered and tossed about, bruising itself with the other grains of sand until it is worn down and polished. Then when the sun shineth upon it it does glimmer for a moment. But a grain of sand should not think of itself as one of the stars of heaven when it lays upon the beach watching for a beast to raise up out of the sea.

May the stars of heaven shine forth with the glory of the Lord in all humility and grace lest they find themselves cast down to the ground.

Matthew 5:8
Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

The promise to Abraham was that his children would be as the stars of heaven and as the sands of the sea. Such is it
in the resuurection of Christ, for some are given bodies terrestrial and other bodies celestial. Some are called forth to life everlasting, some are called forth to walk under judgement and shame. John 5:28-29, Daniel 12:2-3

1 Corinthians 15:40
There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

1 Corinthians 15:42
So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

John 14:19-20
Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

 

[JLB]

So what is your point? Why even the devil himself can quote the scripture. But you have told us of the signs that you look for, as have others that have posted in this thread, because it becomes evident they seek to know the signs that lead to the "man of sin" being revealed. But if they stand watch for the man of sin, then how shall they see the Lord in His Glory?

Matthew 5:5
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

The Sand of the Sea should know and understand its position. For a grain of sand contends with the waves of the sea, it it battered and tossed about, bruising itself with the other grains of sand until it is worn down and polished. Then when the sun shineth upon it it does glimmer for a moment. But a grain of sand should not think of itself as one of the stars of heaven when it lays upon the beach watching for a beast to raise up out of the sea.

May the stars of heaven shine forth with the glory of the Lord in all humility and grace lest they find themselves cast down to the ground.

Matthew 5:8
Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

The promise to Abraham was that his children would be as the stars of heaven and as the sands of the sea. Such is it
in the resuurection of Christ, for some are given bodies terrestrial and other bodies celestial. Some are called forth to life everlasting, some are called forth to walk under judgement and shame. John 5:28-29, Daniel 12:2-3

1 Corinthians 15:40
There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

1 Corinthians 15:42
So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

John 14:19-20
Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

But he who endures to the end shall be saved. Matthew 24:13



JLB

 

[JLB]

I'm so sorry that you have not yet been saved. For all that you post of the scriptures I thought you were saved. I shall pray that you can endure until the end.

Only those who endure to the end will be saved.

• But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

11 Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. 12 And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. 13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come. Matthew 24:11-14




JLB

 

[Douglas Summers]

Only those who endure to the end will be saved.

• But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

11 Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. 12 And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. 13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come. Matthew 24:11-14




JLB

This reference is not to the salvation of the soul of the believer (already saved) but a promise to those who endure (go through persecution), to comfort those by His promise of their deliverance by the Lords return. (Rev. 6:9-11). The Olivet discourse is not a solid event, but are time dimensional events. This is to the tribulation saints (The fifth seal of the seven sealed scroll (Revelation chapter 6). The Church is already with Christ (Revelation's Chapters 4 and 5). That is when the Gospel of the Kingdom will be preached to Israel again as it was when Christ first began to in Matthew Chapter 4. For it was postponed to call out the Church and "until the Fulness of the Gentiles come into the Church" (Rom. 11:25). Then after the Church is complete, Christ will again return its attention to Israel (Acts 15:14-17) (Rev. 7:1-17)

 

[JLB]

This reference is not to the salvation of the soul of the believer (already saved) but a promise to those who endure (go through persecution), to comfort those by His promise of their deliverance by the Lords return. (Rev. 6:9-11). The Olivet discourse is not a solid event, but are time dimensional events. This is to the tribulation saints (The fifth seal of the seven sealed scroll (Revelation chapter 6). The Church is already with Christ (Revelation's Chapters 4 and 5). That is when the Gospel of the Kingdom will be preached to Israel again as it was when Christ first began to in Matthew Chapter 4. For it was postponed to call out the Church and "until the Fulness of the Gentiles come into the Church" (Rom. 11:25). Then after the Church is complete, Christ will again return its attention to Israel (Acts 15:14-17) (Rev. 7:1-17)

Those who endure to the end will be saved, refers to the salvation of our soul.

This was plainly taught by Jesus in the parable of the Sower.


20 But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21 yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles. Matthew 13:20-22

• but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles.

Endures refers to continue believing under persecution.


Luke says it this way -

13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.
Luke 8:13

• who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.

• believe for a while - Luke
• endures only for a while. - Matthew

JLB

 

[Douglas Summers]

Those who endure to the end will be saved, refers to the salvation of our soul.

This was plainly taught by Jesus in the parable of the Sower.


20 But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21 yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles. Matthew 13:20-22

Two different words: In (Matt. 13:21) The word is "dureth" It means to build upon; (to build upon the word or Gospel) Receiving the word with joy in your heart is not salvation, but it should draw you to Christ and put you upon the Rock...these people were in sinking sand. They were offended that the word of God interfered with their worldly ways.

In (Matt. 24:13), The word "Endure" is used: Meaning to have fortitude, to suffer, an inferior position, to stay, abide, remain, for God 's promise of Judgement upon the offender will come in due time. Don't lose heart or don't despair I'm coming. (Rev. 6:9-11). This is about the Tribulation saints. From all accounts of your belief or doctrine is that you can lose your Salvation and you must maintain it by works of self effort. That is why we never agree. I have a different promise from God. And I have personal proof of His promise. I'm not being facetious, I wish you knew God as He is...merciful and has "Through His Spirit" made us a vessel of Good Works (Eph. 2:1-10)

 

[ezrider]

I have a different promise from God.

I really like the way you worded that Douglas. And there is much truth in that statement. Some are drawn to glory in the Life in Christ, while other remain drawn to glory in his death.

 

[JLB]

Two different words: In (Matt. 13:21) The word is "dureth" It means to build upon; (to build upon the word or Gospel) Receiving the word with joy in your heart is not salvation, but it should draw you to Christ and put you upon the Rock...these people were in sinking sand. They were offended that the word of God interfered with their worldly ways.

In (Matt. 24:13), The word "Endure" is used: Meaning to have fortitude, to suffer, an inferior position, to stay, abide, remain, for God 's promise of Judgement upon the offender will come in due time. Don't lose heart or don't despair I'm coming. (Rev. 6:9-11). This is about the Tribulation saints. From all accounts of your belief or doctrine is that you can lose your Salvation and you must maintain it by works of self effort. That is why we never agree. I have a different promise from God. And I have personal proof of His promise. I'm not being facetious, I wish you knew God as He is...merciful and has "Through His Spirit" made us a vessel of Good Works (Eph. 2:1-10)

The context is continuing to believe while being persecuted in order to be saved.

Remaining in Christ to the end and not turning away from Him.


Thank you for making my point.

Enduring to the end refers to salvation.


9 “Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. 10 And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. 11 Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. 12 And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. 13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.
Matthew 24:9-14

• But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

JLB

 

[JLB]

From all accounts of your belief or doctrine is that you can lose your Salvation and you must maintain it by works of self effort. That is why we never agree. I have a different promise from God. And I have personal proof of His promise. I'm not being facetious, I wish you knew God as He is...merciful and has "Through His Spirit" made us a vessel of Good Works (Eph. 2:1-10)

The Spirit empowered Christian life which involves:

Salvation
Love
Faith
Righteousness
Justicstion

As well as receiving the Holy Spirit are predicated on obedience.

Without obeying the Gospel no person is saved; born again.


22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23


again


And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.” Acts 5:32

• the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.

Those who obey Him are those who know Him.


3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:3-4




JLB

 

[JLB]

I wish you knew God as He is...merciful and has "Through His Spirit" made us a vessel of Good Works (

My wife and I are living examples of His great love and mercy.

I know Him who has saved me, and kept me for good works.


Those who claim this, but live in disobedience will be in for a shock on the Day of Judgement.


JLB

 

[Truth7t7]

I'm so sorry that you have not yet been saved. For all that you post of the scriptures I thought you were saved. I shall pray that you can endure until the end.

I believe your judgment of a personal eternal destination in non-salvation is a bit much, as I see through JLB a Christian posting.

Perhaps You Need To leave eternal judgment up to the one who will loose the seals and view the book of life.

 

[Truth7t7]

So what is your point? Why even the devil himself can quote the scripture. But you have told us of the signs that you look for, as have others that have posted in this thread, because it becomes evident they seek to know the signs that lead to the "man of sin" being revealed. But if they stand watch for the man of sin, then how shall they see the Lord in His Glory?

Matthew 5:5
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

The Sand of the Sea should know and understand its position. For a grain of sand contends with the waves of the sea, it it battered and tossed about, bruising itself with the other grains of sand until it is worn down and polished. Then when the sun shineth upon it it does glimmer for a moment. But a grain of sand should not think of itself as one of the stars of heaven when it lays upon the beach watching for a beast to raise up out of the sea.

May the stars of heaven shine forth with the glory of the Lord in all humility and grace lest they find themselves cast down to the ground.

Matthew 5:8
Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

The promise to Abraham was that his children would be as the stars of heaven and as the sands of the sea. Such is it
in the resuurection of Christ, for some are given bodies terrestrial and other bodies celestial. Some are called forth to life everlasting, some are called forth to walk under judgement and shame. John 5:28-29, Daniel 12:2-3

1 Corinthians 15:40
There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

1 Corinthians 15:42
So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

John 14:19-20
Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

God has instructed the Christian not to be deceived by man, and gave signs before his second advent, that will be the "Apostasy" of the once professing Church, and the "Man Of Sin, Anrichrist" being revealed.

2 Thessalonians 2:1-4KJV
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

 

[Douglas Summers]

My wife and I are living examples of His great love and mercy.

I know Him who has saved me, and kept me for good works.


Those who claim this, but live in disobedience will be in for a shock on the Day of Judgement.

I can not say one way or another about your walk with God. It is not for me to Judge how you serve God. The most fallible and weak believer to the most illustrious saint, all have the same standing before Christ. I just do not know the things you interpret as Scriptural doctrine. The Lord has stirred me away from doctrines like yours. I use to believe the way you do....God is not religious.

 

[JLB]

I just do not know the things you interpret as Scriptural doctrine.

Ok, as a brother in Christ, please point out what you specifically disagree with in my post # 492 -


The Spirit empowered Christian life which involves:

Salvation
Love
Faith
Righteousness
Justicstion

As well as receiving the Holy Spirit, are predicated on obedience.

Without obeying the Gospel no person is saved; born again.


22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23


again


And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.”
Acts 5:32

• the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.

Those who obey Him are those who know Him.


3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:3-4

• we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.

JLB

 

[ezrider]

I believe your judgment of a personal eternal destination in non-salvation is a bit much, as I see through JLB a Christian posting.

Perhaps You Need To leave eternal judgment up to the one who will loose the seals and view the book of life.

Perhaps you should re-read what I actually said instead of assuming and implying something otherwise. Did I not say in that post that I thought JLB to be saved? Was it I, or was it JLB who said your not saved until the end? Did I condemn JLB to eternal judgement? Or did I pray for him?

 

[ezrider]

God has instructed the Christian not to be deceived by man, and gave signs before his second advent, that will be the "Apostasy" of the once professing Church, and the "Man Of Sin, Anrichrist" being revealed.

2 Thessalonians 2:1-4KJV
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

I see, you do not wish to be deceived. Therefore you look for knowledge about this "Man of Sin" so you won't be deceived. You search the volume of the book so you can know all about the Ant-Christ so you won't be caught worshiping him. I understand the temptation, I wouldn't want to be caught worshiping him either. That's why I look for the revelation of Jesus Christ. I figured if I knew him, then I didn't have to worry about being deceived by some anti-christ any more. After all, it was Jesus who said Lo, I come; In the VOLUME OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME. But some will still look for an anti-christ in the volume of the book as they feed their strong delusion.

 

[Truth7t7]

I see, you do not wish to be deceived. Therefore you look for knowledge about this "Man of Sin" so you won't be deceived. You search the volume of the book so you can know all about the Ant-Christ so you won't be caught worshiping him. I understand the temptation, I wouldn't want to be caught worshiping him either. That's why I look for the revelation of Jesus Christ. I figured if I knew him, then I didn't have to worry about being deceived by some anti-christ any more. After all, it was Jesus who said Lo, I come; In the VOLUME OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME. But some will still look for an anti-christ in the volume of the book as they feed their strong delusion.

That's correct I will look for the "Apostasy" of the church and "Man Of Sin" to be revealed, a literal human man, just as the Apostolic church fathers taught.

"Let No Man Deceive You By Any Means"

2 Thessalonians 2:3KJV
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

 

[ezrider]

That's correct I will look for the "Apostasy" of the church and "Man Of Sin" to be revealed, a literal human man, just as the Apostolic church fathers taught.

"Let No Man Deceive You By Any Means"

2 Thessalonians 2:3KJV
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Do you think a man who sits by himself upon a mountaintop without another soul in sight can not be deceived? A wise man once said we must take care that we do not deceive ourselves.

Why is it that you would seek to know about the anti-christ and man of sin rather than the knowledge of Christ? Is the anti-christ your first love? If your heart is set upon the "man of sin," then what is to be your treasure?

 

[Douglas Summers]

The Spirit empowered Christian life which involves:

Salvation
Love
Faith
Righteousness
Justicstion

As well as receiving the Holy Spirit are predicated on obedience.

Without obeying the Gospel no person is saved; born again.
The above are talking points, that are given every Sunday in the visible Church. While responding to God's calling gives you rebirth, it is not the flesh, but the Spirit of the born again believer that gives us the obedience (power / privilege / submission) to preach the Gospel (Rom. 1:1-5; 15-17) (Heb. 1:1-2) (Acts 5:42) I have not heard the Gospel preached until I read it in the Scriptures...Not in Church. We are to live a Godly life, but that comes from rebirth and fellowship with God and the brethren, and should be encouraged....not just by hearing it every Sunday, but by the nature of the new man. The Gospel includes Israel and the kingdom of God. (Acts 8:12; 9:20; 14:21-22; 15:13-18; 19:8; 20:24-25; 28:31)


22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23


again


And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.” Acts 5:32

• the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him. The obedience here is not on a day by day basis were God takes the Spirit away one day and gives it back another day, The obedience is to the same as in (Rom. 1:1-5). The obedience is to obey (believe / trust) God. The relationship with Christ / the Holy Spirit is a permanent possession (I will never leave you)

Those who obey Him are those who know Him. (Those that are known by Him are treated as Son's and are chastised as sons) Heb. 12:13-15.


3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:3-4 Of course, And a multitude stand every Sunday preaching that are liars, and especially the government who quote Scripture that has no barring on anything Holy, while they themselves give God a bad name.

We should be preaching the Gospel.....




JLB