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Salvation by faith alone/only?

The true "formula" is "Grace+Faith+Nothing.

Nice for a bumper sticker, but found nowhere in Scriptures...

No one is saved without Grace. (which is a gift from God) Indisputeable.
No one is saved without faith in God (which is a gift from God). True.
But without works of love, you are worthless, nothing (the desire to DO the will of God comes from God, a gift). Without doubt.

The ultimate source of ALL THREE is God... Saying "grace + faith + nothing" is simply not the way to eternal salvation, for those who do not do the Will of the Father cannot enter the Kingdom of God.

Regards
 
Nice for a bumper sticker, but found nowhere in Scriptures...
Thanks for joining. I was beginning to feel quite outnumbered :lol.

In all seriousness, this is indeed an important issue, so I hope no one gets the impression that this is about "numbers on each side" of the issue.
 
Confession time. My ideas about the "final salvation by works" are based on the work of English theologian NT Wright. Here is something he wrote on this issue. I know its a little long, and Wright uses some complex language, but I beg your indulgence (I added bolding):

The third point is remarkably controversial, seeing how well founded it is at several points in Paul. Indeed, listening to yesterday’s papers, it seems that there has been a massive conspiracy of silence on something which was quite clear for Paul (as indeed for Jesus). Paul, in company with mainstream second-Temple Judaism, affirms that God’s final judgment will be in accordance with the entirety of a life led – in accordance, in other words, with works. He says this clearly and unambiguously in Romans 14.10–12 and 2 Corinthians 5.10. He affirms it in that terrifying passage about church-builders in 1 Corinthians 3. But the main passage in question is of course Romans 2.1–16.

This passage has often been read differently. We heard yesterday that Augustine had problems with it (perhaps the only thing in common between Augustine and E. P. Sanders). That is hardly surprising; here is the first statement about justification in Romans, and lo and behold it affirms justification according to works! The doers of the law, he says, will be justified (2.13). Shock, horror; Paul cannot (so many have thought) have really meant it. So the passage has been treated as a hypothetical position which Paul then undermines by showing that nobody can actually achieve it; or, by Sanders for instance, as a piece of unassimilated Jewish preaching which Paul allows to stand even though it conflicts with other things he says. But all such theories are undermined by exegesis itself, not least by observing the many small but significant threads that stitch Romans 2 into the fabric of the letter as a whole. Paul means what he says. Granted, he redefines what ‘doing the law’ really means; he does this in chapter 8, and again in chapter 10, with a codicil in chapter 13. But he makes the point most compactly in Philippians 1.6: he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion on the day of Christ Jesus. The ‘works’ in accordance with which the Christian will be vindicated on the last day are not the unaided works of the self-help moralist. Nor are they the performance of the ethnically distinctive Jewish boundary-markers (sabbath, food-laws and circumcision). They are the things which show, rather, that one is in Christ; the things which are produced in one’s life as a result of the Spirit’s indwelling and operation. In this way, Romans 8.1–17 provides the real answer to Romans 2.1–16. Why is there now ‘no condemnation’? Because, on the one hand, God has condemned sin in the flesh of Christ (let no-one say, as some have done, that this theme is absent in my work; it was and remains central in my thinking and my spirituality); and, on the other hand, because the Spirit is at work to do, within believers, what the Law could not do – ultimately, to give life, but a life that begins in the present with the putting to death of the deeds of the body and the obedient submission to the leading of the Spirit.

I am fascinated by the way in which some of those most conscious of their reformation heritage shy away from Paul’s clear statements about future judgment according to works. It is not often enough remarked upon, for instance, that in the Thessalonian letters, and in Philippians, he looks ahead to the coming day of judgment and sees God’s favourable verdict not on the basis of the merits and death of Christ, not because like Lord Hailsham he simply casts himself on the mercy of the judge, but on the basis of his apostolic work. ‘What is our hope and joy and crown of boasting before our Lord Jesus Christ at his royal appearing? Is it not you? For you are our glory and our joy.’ (1 Thess. 3.19f.; cp. Phil. 2.16f.) I suspect that if you or I were to say such a thing, we could expect a swift rebuke of ‘nothing in my hand I bring, simply to thy cross I cling’. The fact that Paul does not feel obliged at every point to say this shows, I think, that he is not as concerned as we are about the danger of speaking of the things he himself has done – though sometimes, to be sure, he adds a rider, which proves my point, that it is not his own energy but that which God gives and inspires within him (1 Cor. 15.10; Col. 1.29). But he is still clear that the things he does in the present, by moral and physical effort, will count to his credit on the last day, precisely because they are the effective signs that the Spirit of the living Christ has been at work in him. We are embarrassed about saying this kind of thing; Paul clearly is not. What on earth can have happened to a sola scriptura theology that it should find itself forced to screen out such emphatic, indeed celebratory, statements?

The future verdict, when it is positive, can be denoted by the verb ‘justify’. This carries its full forensic sense, rooted in the ancient Jewish belief that the God of Israel, being the creator of the world and also the God of justice, would finally put the world to rights, in other words, that he would conduct a final Assize. On that day there will be ‘glory, honour, immortality and the life of the age to come’ for all who do right (Romans 2.7); in other words (verse 13) they will be justified, declared to be in the right. This ought to have highlighted long ago something which I believe has played too little part in discussions of Paul: justification by faith, to which I shall come in a moment, is the anticipation in the present of the justification which will occur in the future, and gains its meaning from that anticipation. What Augustine lacked, what Luther and Calvin lacked, what Regensburg lacked as a way of putting together the two things it tried to hold on to, was Paul’s eschatological perspective, filled out by the biblical fusion of covenantal and forensic categories. But before we get there I want to address a question which Paul seldom touches explicitly but about which we can reconstruct his thought quite accurately. This is just as well because it has played an important role in protestant discussions of soteriology and lies, I think, at the heart of today’s controversies about justification.

By the way, I hope this makes it clear that, perhaps like many of you, I more or less adhere to the "good works are evidence of the work of the Spirit, showing that you are destined for final salvation" position.
 
Nice for a bumper sticker, but found nowhere in Scriptures...

No one is saved without Grace. (which is a gift from God) Indisputeable.
No one is saved without faith in God (which is a gift from God). True.
But without works of love, you are worthless, nothing (the desire to DO the will of God comes from God, a gift). Without doubt.

The ultimate source of ALL THREE is God... Saying "grace + faith + nothing" is simply not the way to eternal salvation, for those who do not do the Will of the Father cannot enter the Kingdom of God.

Regards

A person who believes (trusts) in the Lord HAS done the Will of the Father, Joe.
Those who looked upon the serpent on the pole LIVED.
There in the wilderness was the picture of salvation given.
 
Nice for a bumper sticker, but found nowhere in Scriptures...

No one is saved without Grace. (which is a gift from God) Indisputeable.
No one is saved without faith in God (which is a gift from God). True.
But without works of love, you are worthless, nothing (the desire to DO the will of God comes from God, a gift). Without doubt.

The ultimate source of ALL THREE is God... Saying "grace + faith + nothing" is simply not the way to eternal salvation, for those who do not do the Will of the Father cannot enter the Kingdom of God.

Regards

Fran says-----No one is saved without Grace. (which is a gift from God) Indisputeable.
No one is saved without faith in God (which is a gift from God). True.
But without works of love, you are worthless, nothing (the desire to DO the will of God comes from God, a gift). Without doubt.

Grubal-----It is true that no one is saved without God's Grace, this goes "undisputed." It is also true that, no one is saved without faith. Having said that, I must "take you to task" on the issue of, "faith being a gift." Faith in and of itself is something that, (God has built into all His beings) Allow me to expand. We ALL have been given the precious gift of "free-choice." We may "place" our faith anywhere we wish, whether it be in religion, philosophy, science, etc...God created man , with the "intent" of having a relationship with him.

Unfortunately, man choose to sin against Him. (Of his own volition I might add) In order to "reconcile" man to Himself, He sent His Son, as the "ultimate sacrifice for the sin problem." And thereby, made it possible to manifest His mercy and forgiveness to ALL of humanity. However, because He created man with a "free-will" to choose (in whom he would believe) it therefore, "behooves" man to place his (howbeit, weak faith) in Christ as Lord and Savior. The "order of things" would be, hearing the word of his salvation, next, the Holy Spirit using the word to convict his heart of sin, next, the acceptance or rejection of the offer. If the man or woman chooses to place his/her faith in Christ, then the Holy Spirit, indwells/seals that person, and they are, "born-again Spiritually." And placed into the body of Christ...

Fran says-----But without works of love, you are worthless, nothing (the desire to DO the will of God comes from God, a gift). Without doubt.

Grubal-----Mankind was "never" worthless, he was bought with a price!!! John 3:16, For God so "loved" the world (humanity) He gave His only Son, etc...Once the Spirit has, indwelt/sealed the man, he is now able to produce fruit/good works...

Fran says-----The ultimate source of ALL THREE is God... Saying "grace + faith + nothing" is simply not the way to eternal salvation, for those who do not do the Will of the Father cannot enter the Kingdom of God.

Grubal-----The will of the Father is that ALL come to Christ as Lord and Savior. After one is "born-again Spiritually" the fruit/good works and doing the will of God will follow...Works are the "after effect" of being saved, not the reverse...
 
A person who believes (trusts) in the Lord HAS done the Will of the Father, Joe.
Those who looked upon the serpent on the pole LIVED.
There in the wilderness was the picture of salvation given.

I think we are speaking of different "salvations", glorydaz. Clearly, those who looked upon the snake were not "permanently" granted life - or even entered into the Land God promised. Those who looked upon the snake - some were later subsequently "not saved"...

I am speaking of entering the Kingdom of heaven. It appears that you are speaking of being redeemed from sin. The two are not necessarily the same thing. The former requires more than just "looking upon the serpent on the pole". Doing the will of the Father is more than just believing that the Father sent Jesus.

Regards
 
Grubal-----It is true that no one is saved without God's Grace, this goes "undisputed." It is also true that, no one is saved without faith. Having said that, I must "take you to task" on the issue of, "faith being a gift." Faith in and of itself is something that, (God has built into all His beings) Allow me to expand. We ALL have been given the precious gift of "free-choice."

Making faith a gift, as per Ephesians 2:8-9... Faith is not something we generate internally without God's grace - otherwise, 'faith' WOULD be something that we could boast of, something I COULD go to God and say "see, I deserve payment, because I brought faith into existence"

We may "place" our faith anywhere we wish, whether it be in religion, philosophy, science, etc...God created man , with the "intent" of having a relationship with him.

I think it is clear that I am speaking of religious faith in God. That desire to seek out God is a sense that is placed within us by God Himself. The seeking of God is not of our doing alone, since we are DRAWN to the Father, we don't seek Him out WITHOUT being drawn to Him first.

Unfortunately, man choose to sin against Him. (Of his own volition I might add) In order to "reconcile" man to Himself, He sent His Son, as the "ultimate sacrifice for the sin problem." And thereby, made it possible to manifest His mercy and forgiveness to ALL of humanity. However, because He created man with a "free-will" to choose (in whom he would believe) it therefore, "behooves" man to place his (howbeit, weak faith) in Christ as Lord and Savior.

There can be no faith, albeit weak, without God FIRST calling us. Thus, faith is a gift given. Whether that faith first given sprouts and bears fruit is another subject, since that depends upon the synergy of God and man. But even man's response, in part, is guided and moved by God. Thus, everything that we do when speaking of salvation or sanctification, must include God. Whether it is faith or works of love, God is involved. Man is not, by himself, "placing his weak faith in Christ..."

The "order of things" would be, hearing the word of his salvation, next, the Holy Spirit using the word to convict his heart of sin, next, the acceptance or rejection of the offer. If the man or woman chooses to place his/her faith in Christ, then the Holy Spirit, indwells/seals that person, and they are, "born-again Spiritually." And placed into the body of Christ...

As you say, the Holy Spirit is doing something. It is entirely a gift. Man is not convicting himself. Man is not accepting the offer himself. Man is not choosing to place his faith in Jesus without God's Holy Spirit!

Fran says-----But without works of love, you are worthless, nothing (the desire to DO the will of God comes from God, a gift). Without doubt.

Grubal-----Mankind was "never" worthless,

I am quoting Paul's First Letter to the Corinthians, 13th chapter. He, nor I, imply that mankind is worthless - but that the idea of faith WITHOUT LOVE is worthless.

Thus, your formula fails the test of Paul.

Fran says-----The ultimate source of ALL THREE is God... Saying "grace + faith + nothing" is simply not the way to eternal salvation, for those who do not do the Will of the Father cannot enter the Kingdom of God.

Grubal-----The will of the Father is that ALL come to Christ as Lord and Savior. After one is "born-again Spiritually" the fruit/good works and doing the will of God will follow...Works are the "after effect" of being saved, not the reverse...

It doesn't matter "WHEN" they were done or what order, for your formula to be incorrect. Good fruits/works do NOT "naturally" pop up from your faith, like some automatic conveyor belt! If it were so, there would be no need for Paul to constantly exhort Christians to perseverance in good works! Nor would James 2 be necessary.

They, both faith and works, are moved by God. Not man alone. Without works of love, you aren't getting into heaven... For without them, you are showing that your faith is not salvific. "Even the devil believes...". Our works SHOW FORTH our faith, and so WITHOUT them, your faith is of no consquence for entering the Kingdom. Thus, if you do the math, faith without works of love = no heaven.

Your formula fails, since "grace + faith + nothing" leaves out a critical part of the requirement for God to judge one worthy of entering the Kingdom - LOVE.

Regards
 
I think we are speaking of different "salvations", glorydaz. Clearly, those who looked upon the snake were not "permanently" granted life - or even entered into the Land God promised. Those who looked upon the snake - some were later subsequently "not saved"...

I am speaking of entering the Kingdom of heaven. It appears that you are speaking of being redeemed from sin. The two are not necessarily the same thing. The former requires more than just "looking upon the serpent on the pole". Doing the will of the Father is more than just believing that the Father sent Jesus.

Regards

With all due respect, glorydaz is trying to convey the idea that, those who were bitten by the snake had to do something in order to be healed. Hence, they had to look upon the "bronze serpent." Much like, if a person desires to have God's forgiveness and mercy, he must first (do something) and that is, believe... It's symbolic you see ??
 
Confession time. My ideas about the "final salvation by works" are based on the work of English theologian NT Wright. Here is something he wrote on this issue. I know its a little long, and Wright uses some complex language, but I beg your indulgence (I added bolding):

By the way, I hope this makes it clear that, perhaps like many of you, I more or less adhere to the "good works are evidence of the work of the Spirit, showing that you are destined for final salvation" position.
Using the verses provided in the text, I see the judment seat of Christ, where the believers are given rewards is being confused with the Great White Throne judgment where the sheep are separated from the goats.

Here, Paul is talking to believers about the judgment seat of Christ. This is a matter of rewards...not eternal life.
Romans 14:10-12 - 10But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. 11For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. 12So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
Again the judgment seat of Christ....rewards (not eternal life).
2 Corinthians 5:10 - 10For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
Here is stated in the clearest of terms, for the unprofitable works will be burned up, but the man, himself, shall be saved.
1 Cor. 3 - 13Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
 
I think we are speaking of different "salvations", glorydaz. Clearly, those who looked upon the snake were not "permanently" granted life - or even entered into the Land God promised. Those who looked upon the snake - some were later subsequently "not saved"...

I am speaking of entering the Kingdom of heaven. It appears that you are speaking of being redeemed from sin. The two are not necessarily the same thing. The former requires more than just "looking upon the serpent on the pole". Doing the will of the Father is more than just believing that the Father sent Jesus.

Regards

I don't think so, Joe.

We know the water from the rock was symbolic of the LIVING WATER, and the manna, the BREAD OF LIFE. We know this is the same because Jesus, when speaking to Nicodemus about being born of the Spirit, said...
John 3: 14-15 said:
And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
A man must be born again to enter the kingdom of God...whosoever believeth in Him.
John 3:5 said:
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
 
Making faith a gift, as per Ephesians 2:8-9... Faith is not something we generate internally without God's grace - otherwise, 'faith' WOULD be something that we could boast of, something I COULD go to God and say "see, I deserve payment, because I brought faith into existence"



I think it is clear that I am speaking of religious faith in God. That desire to seek out God is a sense that is placed within us by God Himself. The seeking of God is not of our doing alone, since we are DRAWN to the Father, we don't seek Him out WITHOUT being drawn to Him first.



There can be no faith, albeit weak, without God FIRST calling us. Thus, faith is a gift given. Whether that faith first given sprouts and bears fruit is another subject, since that depends upon the synergy of God and man. But even man's response, in part, is guided and moved by God. Thus, everything that we do when speaking of salvation or sanctification, must include God. Whether it is faith or works of love, God is involved. Man is not, by himself, "placing his weak faith in Christ..."



As you say, the Holy Spirit is doing something. It is entirely a gift. Man is not convicting himself. Man is not accepting the offer himself. Man is not choosing to place his faith in Jesus without God's Holy Spirit!



I am quoting Paul's First Letter to the Corinthians, 13th chapter. He, nor I, imply that mankind is worthless - but that the idea of faith WITHOUT LOVE is worthless.

Thus, your formula fails the test of Paul.



Who cares "WHEN" they were done or what order. They, both faith and works, are moved by God. Not man alone. Without works of love, you aren't getting into heaven... For without them, you are showing that your faith is not salvific. "Even the devil believes...". Our works SHOW FORTH our faith, and so WITHOUT them, your faith is of no consquence for entering the Kingdom. Thus, if you do the math, faith without works of love = no heaven.

Your formula fails, since "grace + faith + nothing" leaves out a critical part of the requirement for God to judge one worthy of entering the Kingdom - LOVE.

Regards

Fran says-----Making faith a gift, as per Ephesians 2:8-9... Faith is not something we generate internally without God's grace - otherwise, 'faith' WOULD be something that we could boast of, something I COULD go to God and say "see, I deserve payment, because I brought faith into existence"

Grubal-----In Ephesians 2:8-9 the "gift" is not faith but, grace in that particular Scripture. The ability to place our faith is according to "free-choice" (which was given to ALL men by God)

Fran says-----I think it is clear that I am speaking of religious faith in God. That desire to seek out God is a sense that is placed within us by God Himself. The seeking of God is not of our doing alone, since we are DRAWN to the Father, we don't seek Him out WITHOUT being drawn to Him first.

Grubal----ALL men are drawn, without exception...John 12:32, "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw "ALL"men unto me."

Fran says-----There can be no faith, albeit weak, without God FIRST calling us. Thus, faith is a gift given. Whether that faith first given sprouts and bears fruit is another subject, since that depends upon the synergy of God and man. But even man's response, in part, is guided and moved by God. Thus, everything that we do when speaking of salvation or sanctification, must include God. Whether it is faith or works of love, God is involved. Man is not, by himself, "placing his weak faith in Christ..."

Grubal-----God calls every man...Man indeed "must" place his faith in Christ or there is no salvation...Mark 9:24 talks about this kind of issue relating to the weakness of human faith,
"And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief."
Granted we can't get saved "without" the conviction and work of the Holy Spirit but, we must be willing to place what little faith we have, in Christ alone...

Fran says-----As you say, the Holy Spirit is doing something. It is entirely a gift. Man is not convicting himself. Man is not accepting the offer himself. Man is not choosing to place his faith in Jesus without God's Holy Spirit!

Grubal-----That's true. However, the choosing to place our faith, relies on our (God given) ability to choose what we believe freely, without being forced to believe in anything...

Fran says-----Thus, your formula fails the test of Paul.

Grubal---explain "how" it fails please ?
 
You are able to judge mens' hearts?

No,I'm not but, the post was speaking about, "losing" salvation after one has received it. And this cannot happen, due to the fact a true believer is indwelt and sealed by the Holy Spirit and cannot lose his salvation... You cannot lose what you never had to begin with, that's all I'm saying...
 
A person who believes (trusts) in the Lord HAS done the Will of the Father, Joe.
Those who looked upon the serpent on the pole LIVED.
There in the wilderness was the picture of salvation given.

As to doing the will of God, I should have added this...
John 6:40 said:
And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Everything follows after, including good works (fruit of the Spirit).
Sanctification which includes presenting our bodies a living sacrifice, and the renewing of our mind.
Romans 12:1-2 said:
1I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. 2And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
 
No,I'm not but, the post was speaking about, "losing" salvation after one has received it. And this cannot happen, due to the fact a true believer is indwelt and sealed by the Holy Spirit and cannot lose his salvation... You cannot lose what you never had to begin with, that's all I'm saying...

AMEN.
 
Using the verses provided in the text, I see the judment seat of Christ, where the believers are given rewards is being confused with the Great White Throne judgment where the sheep are separated from the goats.

Here, Paul is talking to believers about the judgment seat of Christ. This is a matter of rewards...not eternal life.
You are stating a position, but it needs to be actually supported Biblically. Clearly, we should agree that we cannot simply assume what is, and is not, at stake at any particular judgement.

Romans 2:6-13 tells us what is at stake in the context of least one judgement at which all humanity will appear:

6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”[a] 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11 For God does not show favoritism.
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous.

I will keep bringing 2:6-7 - no one has provided any kind of explanation as to why Paul would assert that it is those who, yes, persist in doing good that get, yes eternal life, if this is not, in fact, what he believes.

Not to mention verse 13!!!

How much clearer could Paul be? Who is it in verse 13 who get declared righteous?

Those who "have faith"?

This is simply not what Paul actually writes.

Instead, he writes that it is those who, yes, obey the law who will be declared righteous.

In all candor, it is hard to discuss these texts when you guys basically deny the plain meaning of the text.
 
A number of posters appear to basically arguing "you cannot take Romans 2:6-7 literally since we know, for other reasons, that Paul does not believe that "good works" have a role in final salvation".

What an odd argument.

Imagine if Paul had written this: "The name of my pet dog is Mr. Noodles."

Now: Imagine that you become convinced that the name of Paul's dog was really "Rover". You cannot simply say "well, the broader content of Pauline writings show that the name of his dog was Rover".

You still need to explain why Paul would say, even once, that the name of his pet dog was Mr. Noodles.

Do you see the point? In Romans 2:6-7, Paul clearly connects "good works" to getting eternal life.

The only way to deal with this text, other than suggesting that there is a translation error or that Paul made a mistake, is to argue that Paul has clearly prefaced the statement "The name of my pet dog is Mr. Noodles" with some statement like "I am now about to tell you something untrue about the name of my dog, for reasons x, y, and z"

Does he do this?

No.
 
A number of posters appear to basically arguing "you cannot take Romans 2:6-7 literally since we know, for other reasons, that Paul does not believe that "good works" have a role in final salvation".

What an odd argument.

Imagine if Paul had written this: "The name of my pet dog is Mr. Noodles."

Now: Imagine that you become convinced that the name of Paul's dog was really "Rover". You cannot simply say "well, the broader content of Pauline writings show that the name of his dog was Rover".

You still need to explain why Paul would say, even once, that the name of his pet dog was Mr. Noodles.

Do you see the point? In Romans 2:6-7, Paul clearly connects "good works" to getting eternal life.

The only way to deal with this text, other than suggesting that there is a translation error or that Paul made a mistake, is to argue that Paul has clearly prefaced the statement "The name of my pet dog is Mr. Noodles" with some statement like "I am now about to tell you something untrue about the name of my dog, for reasons x, y, and z"

Does he do this?

No.

To look at this logically, we must assume that, an unsaved man cannot create enough works to inherit eternal life. It's only possible for a born-again believer to enter eternal life. And only those who are saved will enter eternal life. Hence, the indwelling Spirit keeps the believer doing good, seeking for, glory, honor, etc. Only true believers will enter eternal life...
 
To look at this logically, we must assume that, an unsaved man cannot create enough works to inherit eternal life.
I have clearly stated that I agree with this.

It's only possible for a born-again believer to enter eternal life.
I have clearly stated that I agee with this, too.

And only those who are saved will enter eternal life. Hence, the indwelling Spirit keeps the believer doing good, seeking for, glory, honor, etc. Only true believers will enter eternal life...
We agree!!!

Now, for the tricky part: Do you believe this statement:

6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.â€[a] 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

If you do believe this statement, you are agreeing that "thing God looks at" in awarding eternal life is "good works", even if we otherwise agree on the things above.

If you do not believe this statement, how are you trusting the inerrancy of scripture?
 
You are stating a position, but it needs to be actually supported Biblically. Clearly, we should agree that we cannot simply assume what is, and is not, at stake at any particular judgement.

Romans 2:6-13 tells us what is at stake in the context of least one judgement at which all humanity will appear:

6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.â€[a] 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11 For God does not show favoritism.
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous.

I will keep bringing 2:6-7 - no one has provided any kind of explanation as to why Paul would assert that it is those who, yes, persist in doing good that get, yes eternal life, if this is not, in fact, what he believes.

Not to mention verse 13!!!

How much clearer could Paul be? Who is it in verse 13 who get declared righteous?

Those who "have faith"?

This is simply not what Paul actually writes.

Instead, he writes that it is those who, yes, obey the law who will be declared righteous.

In all candor, it is hard to discuss these texts when you guys basically deny the plain meaning of the text.

I will repeat, I am NOT denying the plain meaning of the text. It's plain enough to me, but you seem to be trying to create a principle by taking the text out of it's context.

So how can we obey the law, for if we fail in one point, we fail in all? There is only one way, and that is through faith (which you consistantly want to leave out of the equation.)

Since Paul is speaking of faith throughout, he doesn't suddenly drop faith from the equation. Through faith we have the righteousness of Christ imputed to us. We can only "obey the law" when we put on the righteousness of Christ by believing in Him.

I did support what I claimed with scripture concerning the Judgment Seat of Christ. The very scripture presented in your article. I'm assuming nothing, just pointing you to the verses that speak of the Judgment Seat of Christ. If you want to discuss the Judgment, you'll have to let go of your one verse long enough to delve into the subject. :)
 
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