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Salvation is by FAITH

  • Thread starter Thread starter Alabaster
  • Start date Start date
RadicalReformer said:
Alabaster said:
God desires us, and like a lover, he woos us. He does so by orchestrating our circumstances so that we come to hear the truth of Jesus Christ. At the hearing of truth, He drops a measure of faith in us so that we will be convinced, and hold onto that truth. That measure of faith will bring us to the realization that we are sinners in need of a Saviour and will drive us to repentance. In repenting, we acknowledge that Jesus Christ has borne our sins on the cross, shed His blood for our sin and our belief in Him causes the Holy Spirit to effect changes us--we become actual sons and daughters of the living God! We become new creations and citizens of Heaven. Determining to turn from sin and follow Jesus Christ and God's Word, our faith grows from that small seed to a mature, full-blown faith that can move mountains...and is contagious--we help God enlarge His kingdom by yielding spiritual fruit, including offspring.

I am curious to this "measure of faith" that He drops in us. What Scripture do you use for this assertion?


Romans 12:3
For by the grace (unmerited favor of God) given to me I warn everyone among you not to estimate and think of himself more highly than he ought [not to have an exaggerated opinion of his own importance], but to rate his ability with sober judgment, each according to the degree of faith apportioned by God to him.
 
Salvation is by FAITH

One simple Bible fact: There is only one - I repeat, ONLY ONE - place in the Bible where the words "faith alone" stand together, side by side:

James 2:24: "You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone."

That is a fact. No matter how you spin it, that is the only place where the words "faith alone" stand side by side, and the apostle James, inspired by the Holy Spirit, said that faith alone don't cut the mustard.
 
Romans 10:9 NLT
If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Romans 10:13 NLT
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.â€Â

Ephesians 2:8 NLT
God saved you by his grace when you believed. And you can’t take credit for this; it is a gift from God.

Acts 16:31 NLT
They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, along with everyone in your household.â€Â

Yes, faith is all GOD NEEDS from us.

 
Amen Alabaster!

We are saved by grace through faith:
Alabaster said:
God desires us, and like a lover, he woos us. He does so by orchestrating our circumstances so that we come to hear the truth of Jesus Christ. At the hearing of truth, He drops a measure of faith in us so that we will be convinced, and hold onto that truth. That measure of faith will bring us to the realization that we are sinners in need of a Saviour and will drive us to repentance. In repenting, we acknowledge that Jesus Christ has borne our sins on the cross, shed His blood for our sin and our belief in Him causes the Holy Spirit to effect changes us--we become actual sons and daughters of the living God! We become new creations and citizens of Heaven.
..... and this faith manifests itself in works:
Determining to turn from sin and follow Jesus Christ and God's Word, our faith grows from that small seed to a mature, full-blown faith that can move mountains...and is contagious--we help God enlarge His kingdom by yielding spiritual fruit, including offspring.

See.... James 2:24: "You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone." works just fine with your faith. Works is not a "bad word" of itself.... only when one looks to store up good works to "earn" heaven does it change meaning into evil.

In Christ,
S
 
Salvation is by FAITH

Of course Salvation is by faith in Jesus as Lamb of God and Savior of the world, without Him no one can be saved. I know many will abuse "for God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son so who ever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life." this is not permission to live sinful life.
 
Alabaster said:
Romans 10:9 NLT
If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Romans 10:13 NLT
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.â€Â

Ephesians 2:8 NLT
God saved you by his grace when you believed. And you can’t take credit for this; it is a gift from God.

Acts 16:31 NLT
They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, along with everyone in your household.â€Â

Yes, faith is all GOD NEEDS from us.


Is the word "alone" in there? I can't see it. Did I miss it?
 
Paul tells us: "For [God] will reward every man according to his works: to those who by perseverance in working good seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. There will be . . . glory and honor and peace for every one who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek. For God shows no partiality" (Rom. 2:6–11; cf. Gal. 6:6–10).

In the second century, the technical Latin term for "merit" was introduced as a synonym for the Greek word for "reward." Thus merit and reward are two sides of the same coin.

Protestants often misunderstand the Catholic teaching on merit, thinking that Catholics believe that one must do good works to come to God and be saved. This is exactly the opposite of what the Church teaches. The Council of Trent stressed: "[N]one of those things which precede justification, whether faith or works, merit the grace of justification; for if it is by grace, it is not now by works; otherwise, as the Apostle [Paul] says, grace is no more grace" (Decree on Justification 8, citing Rom. 11:6).

The Catholic Church teaches only Christ is capable of meriting in the strict senseâ€â€mere man cannot (Catechism of the Catholic Church 2007). The most merit humans can have is condignâ€â€when, under the impetus of God’s grace, they perform acts which please him and which he has promised to reward (Rom. 2:6–11, Gal. 6:6–10). Thus God’s grace and his promise form the foundation for all human merit (CCC 2008).

Virtually all of this is agreed to by Protestants, who recognize that, under the impetus of God’s grace, Christians do perform acts which are pleasing to God and which God has promised to reward, meaning that they fit the definition of merit. When faced with this, Protestants are forced to admit the truth of the Catholic positionâ€â€although, contrary to Paul’s command (2 Tim. 2:14), they may still dispute the terminology.

Thus the Lutheran Book of Concord admits: "We are not putting forward an empty quibble about the term ‘reward.’ . . . We grant that eternal life is a reward because it is something that is owedâ€â€not because of our merits [in the strict sense] but because of the promise [of God]. We have shown above that justification is strictly a gift of God; it is a thing promised. To this gift the promise of eternal life has been added" (p. 162).
SOURCE: http://www.catholic.com/library/Reward_and_Merit.asp
 
Catholic Crusader said:
Alabaster said:
Romans 10:9 NLT
If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Romans 10:13 NLT
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.â€Â

Ephesians 2:8 NLT
God saved you by his grace when you believed. And you can’t take credit for this; it is a gift from God.

Acts 16:31 NLT
They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, along with everyone in your household.â€Â

Yes, faith is all GOD NEEDS from us.


Is the word "alone" in there? I can't see it. Did I miss it?

What else to you think you need?
 
Alabaster said:
What else to you think you need?

A working faith.

Galatians 5:6: For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love.
 
Catholic Crusader said:
Alabaster said:
What else to you think you need?

A working faith.

Galatians 5:6: For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love.

I read this today as part of my morning prayers. It seems to apply to the question at hand...

"What good is it to profess faith without practicing it?" â€â€James 2:14

We are saved by grace through faith (Eph 2:8). Therefore, we must have faith and know what true faith is. Faith must be practiced (Jas 2:14, 17). It must be accompanied by works (Jas 2:18, 26). Faith underlies (Jas 2:18) and assists works (Jas 2:22). Faith is implemented by works (Jas 2:22). We are justified by both faith and works (Jas 2:24).


Pope John Paul II taught: "It is urgent to rediscover and to set forth once more the authentic reality of the Christian faith, which is not simply a set of propositions to be accepted with intellectual assent. Rather, faith is a lived knowledge of Christ, a living remembrance of His commandments, and a truth to be lived out. A word, in any event, is not truly received until it passes into action, until it is put into practice. Faith is a decision involving one's whole existence. It is an encounter, a dialogue, a communion of love and of life between the believer and Jesus Christ, the Way, and the Truth, and the Life (my underlining for emphasis) (cf Jn 14:6). It entails an act of trusting abandonment to Christ, which enables us to live as He lived (cf Gal 2:20), in profound love of God and of our brothers and sisters" (The Splendor of Truth, 88).

http://www.presentationministries.com/obob/obob.asp
 
Blind faith is an ironic gift to return to the creator of human intelligence
-anonymous
 
proponent said:
Blind faith is an ironic gift to return to the creator of human intelligence
-anonymous
I like that
 
gila said:
The Bible says that faith without deed is dead. Jesus also says to be faithful to Him until the end.

You are mistaken, the Bible nowhere says that.

You are confusing "works" with "deeds".

Regards
 
francisdesales said:
gila said:
The Bible says that faith without deed is dead. Jesus also says to be faithful to Him until the end.

You are mistaken, the Bible nowhere says that.
You are confusing "works" with "deeds".

You are mistaken.
James 2:17
"Even so, faith by itself without [ergon] is dead."
Ergon is the greek word. According to Strong's, it means "deed, doing, labor, work".

In the Greek, both English words "deed" and "work" mean the same thing. What are you complaining about??
 
James 2:24 - "You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone."
 
I think that many in the reformation tradition have made a key error in this whole area, that of believing that the content of our lives - how we actually live - is not connected to our ultimate justification / salvation. It leads them into exegetical distress in a number of areas, not least of which is Romans 2:6-13 which they invariably mangle beyond recognition in an effort to "keep the good deeds out salvation". Unfortunately, at least from their perspective, Paul is crystal clear in Romans 2 - all of humanity will stand in judgement before God and eternal life will be given to those who "persist in doing good".

So what is the mistake that I am claiming has been made. It is simply this: to fail to understand that when Paul refers to "works", he is almost always referring to the works of Torah in particular, not "good works" in general. He is saying that doing the works of Torah does not save / justify. He is not saying that doing "good works in general" does not justify. How could he be, given the clear teaching of Romans 2 as well as other statements from both him and Jesus?

I suspect that some people cannot even consider the possibility that they have bought into an error. But for those who are at least willing to entertain this possibility, try seeing how the overall Scriptural picture, and especially Paul, works if you consider that Paul is denying the salvific power of following Torah and is not denying the salvific power of good works (fuelled of course by the Spirit - do not try to paint me with a "you are earning your salvation" brush, such a strategy will not work). I think things make a lot more sense on such a view.

And, of course, we get to take Romans 2:6-13 as it stands. Which is nice.
 
Catholic Crusader said:
James 2:24 - "You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone."
... and which translation might this be? Inquiring minds want to know. 8-)
 
vic C. said:
[quote="Catholic Crusader":0f80f]James 2:24 - "You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone."
... and which translation might this be? Inquiring minds want to know. 8-)[/quote:0f80f]

The NAB, at BibleGateway.com

The KJV says "Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only"
 
gila said:
francisdesales said:
gila said:
The Bible says that faith without deed is dead. Jesus also says to be faithful to Him until the end.

You are mistaken, the Bible nowhere says that.
You are confusing "works" with "deeds".

You are mistaken.
James 2:17
"Even so, faith by itself without [ergon] is dead."
Ergon is the greek word. According to Strong's, it means "deed, doing, labor, work".

In the Greek, both English words "deed" and "work" mean the same thing. What are you complaining about??

The word "deed" and "work" do not always mean the same thing.

However, carry on to your point...

Regards
 
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