Bible Study Should Christian women be able to teach Christian men?

[for_his_glory]

I never said they could not. I have said every time women cannot be Elders. A pastor or an evangelist are not Elders. And I have got a feeling in your comments here you have a thing against men. Not a good place to start from because that produces prejudice.

I have nothing against any man as I have no issue in who teaches me as long as what they teach lines up with scripture and not the other way around.

 

[for_his_glory]

On my computer and the fact that your asking this question tells me that you are not interested the validity of these scriptures. All you want is an argument to try and put down a man.

Why are you evading a simple request of giving me your understanding? I withdrawal my question.

 

[for_his_glory]

Do you attend a church run by a man with a title?

What does it matter. FYI I do not attend any church at this time.

 

[WIP]

Just because it does not mention Elder it is still the same as a Pastor. Go look it up. I will not debate this.

It depends. The Lutheran Brethren church uses the term elders where other Lutheran churches use the term deacons.

 

[jasonc]

I don’t understand.

You are bound to the same command whether you are married or not. It makes no difference.

This does not mean that the husband should be a dictator, or a tyrant. Rather, the final responsibility rests on his shoulders. He can take input from his wife, but the responsibility for the outcome of any decisions made, or any actions taken by anyone in the family, are his. Just like the Captain of a ship is responsible for the actions of his crew, even if he is not aware of them at the time.

being retired military ,the co gets a small chewing ,his senior enlisted a bit more and so on until,that guilty is reached who punished the most .

 

[for_his_glory]

It depends. The Lutheran Brethren church uses the term elders where other Lutheran churches use the term deacons.

I realize various denominations use the term elder, but we need to know how scripture explains what an elder, deacon and a Pastor is. This is not an issue with chauvinism or discrimination. It's about Biblical interpretation.

I've given my views, opinions and understanding. I'm not saying I am right as I know I could be wrong. It's just how I see it and how God called me into the ministry to teach men and women. To me church is where others are gathered together with Christ being the head of His church whether it be in a prison, an opened aired area or in a building with a name tagged to it.

 

[crossnote]

how God called me into the ministry to teach men and women.

Why would God contradict His Word?

1 Timothy 2:12 (NASB) But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet.

 

[WIP]

I realize various denominations use the term elder, but we need to know how scripture explains what an elder, deacon and a Pastor is. This is not an issue with chauvinism or discrimination. It's about Biblical interpretation.

I've given my views, opinions and understanding. I'm not saying I am right as I know I could be wrong. It's just how I see it and how God called me into the ministry to teach men and women. To me church is where others are gathered together with Christ being the head of His church whether it be in a prison, an opened aired area or in a building with a name tagged to it.

This is something that caught my attention in my daily reading last week. I noticed that Paul used many terms including apostle, disciple, priest, bishop, elder, deacon, preacher, teacher, evangelist, and so forth and it got me wondering how those titles differ. This is what I found so far. It's still confusing.

In the following verses Paul seems to differentiate between apostle, preacher, and teacher but the differences must be subtle. My research seems to indicate that an apostle is a teacher who is sent to preach the gospel - like a missionary.

For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus, who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time, for which I was appointed a preacher and an apostle—I am speaking the truth in Christ and not lying—a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and truth.
1 Timothy 2:5-7 NKJV

Therefore do not be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me His prisoner, but share with me in the sufferings for the gospel according to the power of God, who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began, but has now been revealed by the appearing of our Savior Jesus Christ, who has abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel, to which I was appointed a preacher, an apostle, and a teacher of the Gentiles.
2 Timothy 1:8-11 NKJV


In the following verse Paul seems to differentiate between apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers.

And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers,
Ephesians 4:11 NKJV


In the following verse Paul seems to differentiate between bishops and deacons.

Paul and Timothy, bondservants of Jesus Christ, To all the saints in Christ Jesus who are in Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:
Philippians 1:1 NKJV

Paul also references deacons in 1 Timothy 3:8-13 NKJV but it's not defined how their roles differ from others except for their qualifications.

Likewise deacons must be reverent, not double-tongued, not given to much wine, not greedy for money, holding the mystery of the faith with a pure conscience. But let these also first be tested; then let them serve as deacons, being found blameless. Likewise, their wives must be reverent, not slanderers, temperate, faithful in all things. Let deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well. For those who have served well as deacons obtain for themselves a good standing and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.


The title "elder" was used throughout the Old and New Testaments. In the NT they were most often associated along with priests and scribes so they would seem to be something different.

In 1 Peter 5:1 Peter identifies himself as an elder even though we also know he was an apostle. Also in 2 John 1 and again in 3 John 1, John identifies himself as an elder and we also know he was an apostle.

I was unable to find a specific definition of what an elder is. Logically it seems to indicate an older person in the church or community but how is it defined? By age? By experience? By learning?

 

[stovebolts]

Here is a link to our past Shabbat service. I am the guy sitting in the back playing bass.
You also have the rare occasion that I am actually giving the sermon. (rabbi was on vacation)

That was a good message. Very well articulated.

 

[D-D-W]

That was a good message. Very well articulated.

Thanks!

 

[JLB]

Why would God contradict His Word?

1 Timothy 2:12 (NASB) But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet.

That is what Paul taught in the Gentile Churches as a general rule. He taught that men should teach men in the Church setting.

Women were and are uniquely qualified to teach other women and to counsel them. Women have the role of teaching and raising children.


There were women who were disciples and in leadership roles in the Church, which included teaching.


At Joppa there was a certain disciple named Tabitha, which is translated Dorcas. This woman was full of good works and charitable deeds which she did. Acts 9:36


Disciples will eventually teach the things that Christ taught.


And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen. Matthew 28:18-20

• teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you;

2 John was written to a women who was in the role of leadership, most probably an apostle or pastor. She was teaching and training up people to walk in the truth and was instructed by John to emphasize teaching the doctrine of Christ.


To the elect lady and her children, whom I love in truth, and not only I, but also all those who have known the truth, because of the truth which abides in us and will be with us forever:
Grace, mercy, and peace will be with you from God the Father and from the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love.
I rejoiced greatly that I have found some of your children walking in truth, as we received commandment from the Father.
2 John 1-4


The disciples of Paul were referred to as his sons in the faith.





JLB

 

[andy pandy]

Just because it does not mention Elder it is still the same as a Pastor. Go look it up. I will not debate this.

I have looked it up and done a thorough study of leadership of the New Testament Church so I can safely say that being a pastor is NOT the same as being an Elder.

A pastor (shepherd in the original) is a person who takes care of the sheep.


An Elder is a man who is responsible with other Elders for the whole fellowship in the area of correction, teaching, direction and discipline.

 

[JLB]

I have looked it up and done a thorough study of leadership of the New Testament Church so I can safely say that being a pastor is NOT the same as being an Elder.

A pastor (shepherd in the original) is a pereson who takes care of the sheep.


An Elder is a man who is responsible with other Elders for the whole fellowship in the area of correction, teaching, direction and discipline.

Elders in the early Church certainly had a different meaning than elders in the local church today.




JLB

 

[WIP]

A question came to my mind. Does this mean we men should not accept sound teaching from women, especially in a church setting?

 

[andy pandy]

This superior attitude is a figment of your imagination. Every day I want increase my knowledge and one of the ways to do that is to dialogue with people that have all sorts of ideas what the scripture means.

As I can not find the ToS can you tell me what ToS 1.3 is.

 

[andy pandy]

A question came to my mind. Does this mean we men should not accept sound teaching from women, especially in a church setting?

If the church is following the teaching of scripture, women would not be giving sound teaching.

If yu look around you and see the wholesale breakup of the family, including christians, you can see the wisdom of the scriptures that says older women should teach younger women how to be good wives and mothers. That would be much more useful and fruitful than standing in a pulpit or going out to work.

 

[WIP]

If the church is following the teaching of scripture, women would not be giving sound teaching.

Are you saying it is not possible for women to give sound teaching?

 

[andy pandy]

Elders in the early Church certainly had a different meaning than elders in the local church today.




JLB

Yes, that is true, but as we are in an era where denominational dictates are more important than scripture, what the scipture says has little meaning.

If yu look around you and see the wholesale breakup of the family, including christians, you can see the wisdom of the scriptures that says older women should teach younger women how to be good wives and mothers. That would be much more useful and fruitful than standing in a pulpit or going out to work.

 

[Doug Brents]

Elders in the early Church certainly had a different meaning than elders in the local church today.
JLB

Not so. The Biblical meaning has not changed.

The Perception in most congregations that call themselves part of the Church has changed, but God’s intent has not changed. Nor has the proper implementation of that command.

 

[andy pandy]

Not so. The Biblical meaning has not changed.

The Perception in most congregations that call themselves part of the Church has changed, but God’s intent has not changed. Nor has the proper implementation of that command.

No one has said the biblbical meaning has changed. What has been said is that the meaning today has been changed. Having does a study of leadership in the New Testament Church, consulting with many who have written books on the subject that knew more than I did, the meaning today has definitely been changed.