Are you saying that you don't believe we will suffer the consequences for our sin? There is always a consequence for taking wrong action, at least for me there were always consequences.
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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
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Sin, Unconquerable or Conquerable?
- Thread starter Jesse
- Start date
No, I'm saying if I sin then I will have consequences from that sin, but when temptation comes the Holy Spirit is faithful to give me a verse to fight against it, hence, in using the verse I'm protecting myself.
Ok, got it. Thanks.
Thank you Ezra, that's a good rendition, Amazing Grace is one of my favorite hymns, ...I was saved in a holiness denomination, we sang Amazing Grace, but it wasn't until Father moved me nine hours out of my comfort zone to a tiny country church that I heard my first teaching on Grace coupled with the experiencing, first hand, of the love of Christ in His church, ...it blew my mind and changed how I thought, ...Jesus Christ is so much more than what I had been taught at first.
For me i know that as i draw closer to God, and focus more and more on His Word, i am renewing my mind to His ways. And as i daily decide to obey His Word, walking in His ways, and listening to the promptings of the Holy Spirit i sin less. And only by the Blood that Jesus shed on Calvary for me, will i ever be seen by the Father as completely sinless.
But we can overcome sin, there is sin we have that we may not know we have. I've heard people say that with the help of Jesus they can overcome sin but then they go onto say that they will always sin.....it's a contradictory statement.
It's the same with bringing our petitions to God but then say "if it's your will", to me this seems like a lack of faith. A person prays for something but then backs off. The Bible says a man who prays without faith is like one being tossed around.
Yes we can overcome sin, or rather the temptation sin presents, but yet we will stumble, there are many factors involved here. One is our time in country, how long have we been walking with the Lord, the longer we walk with with Him the more we understand His love, mercy and grace towards us, ...filthy rotten undeserving sinners, please don't take this the wrong way, but you are young, you haven't sinned as much as I have in our walk with our Lord, when I look back over my life with Him it's amazes me that He still puts up with me, but that's Agape love!
When we are born again the Holy Spirit washes us, cleanses us from what we think are gross immoral physical sins, we are constantly on the lookout for them and vow we won't do them any more, but that is just the physical side, there is still our spiritual lives and the more we learn of our Lord, the more we allow Him to conform us into His image the more we see how much we sin spiritually in our minds, ...our thoughts, will, desires.
Sin is empowered by the power of satan, that's why Paul calls him the prince of the power of the air, he is the most powerful of all of God's creation and we puny humans are so arrogant that we think we are some kind of a match for him, ...that is why it takes the Holy Spirit to overcome sin in our lives, both physical and spiritual, we say water will always seek it's own level, the sin nature in our mortal bodies is like water, always, 24/7 trying to seek it's level,to rule us, it's inescapable until we no longer live in this mortal body.
That's why I infer I know more personally about sin than you do, because I have sinned more than you even though I have said in my heart since day one I wouldn't. All of our sin, past, present and future (those that we will commit, today, tomorrow, next week etc.) were taken care of, paid for on the Cross and the lesson I would like to share with you is it's all GRACE, GRACE, GRACE, ...that is what my sin has taught me, like Paul said, where sin abounds Grace abounds more, that has freed me, set me at liberty to REST, REST in the finished work of the Cross and enjoy my walk with my Lord, I don't want to sin, I'm coming to abhor sin, but the truth is I do, but like Paul said, it's no longer me, but sin that lives in me, ...and that allows me to rest, leaning on the bosom of my Jesus.
Thanks, this does help and I'm glad I'm not the only one who doesn't want to sin and then ends up doing exactly that.
The thing is, we have a way out and then we don't take it (at least I don't all the time), then it's like we're back to square one. It's why I also mentioned faith and it's lacking when we do stumble. If we knew all the time that God's way is the best and let Him rule in our lives all the time, then we would avoid sin, but that's not what happens.Sometimes it's advancing, then other days, it's back peddling.
Fish Catcher Jim
Member
Well first of all there is a big difference in this...
Take the quote from John............Practicing sin.......that is the big clue here.........if you are a true born again spirit filled blood washed child of the Most High...well would you be practicing sin? Look at it this way.....practicing sin could be said as willfully sinning or another words not worried and do what you want...
A true born again Believer may fall or sin but they do not have the mind set fo sinning on purpose.
Now Paul is talking about walking out your salvation and learning to over come the flesh. This is also written to allow newer christians or babes in Christ that it is a normal thing to find this struggle or fight.
It will happen to every born again believer............It is all a part of learning to crucify the flesh and walk in the spirit.
KJ Galatians 5:16.... This I say then, Walk in the spirit, and ye shall not fulfil ther lust of the flesh.
NLT Galations 5:16-18....So I advise you to live according to your new life in the Holy Spirit. Then you won't be doing what your sinful nature craves..
17...The old sinful nature loves to do evil, which is just opposite from what the Holy Spirit wants. And the Spirit gives us desires that are opposite from what the sinful nature desires. These two forces are constantly fighting each other, and your choices are never fre from this conflict (pressure)
18..But when you are directed by the Holy Spirit, you are no longer subject to the law.
So you see that this question of who is right here John or Paul can only be answered like this....
THEY BOTH ARE I hope this helps you to see
God Bless
Jim
Thanks, Jim, I appreciate the explanation.Well first of all there is a big difference in this...
Take the quote from John............Practicing sin.......that is the big clue here.........if you are a true born again spirit filled blood washed child of the Most High...well would you be practicing sin? Look at it this way.....practicing sin could be said as willfully sinning or another words not worried and do what you want...
A true born again Believer may fall or sin but they do not have the mind set fo sinning on purpose.
Now Paul is talking about walking out your salvation and learning to over come the flesh. This is also written to allow newer christians or babes in Christ that it is a normal thing to find this struggle or fight.
It will happen to every born again believer............It is all a part of learning to crucify the flesh and walk in the spirit.
KJ Galatians 5:16.... This I say then, Walk in the spirit, and ye shall not fulfil ther lust of the flesh.
NLT Galations 5:16-18....So I advise you to live according to your new life in the Holy Spirit. Then you won't be doing what your sinful nature craves..
17...The old sinful nature loves to do evil, which is just opposite from what the Holy Spirit wants. And the Spirit gives us desires that are opposite from what the sinful nature desires. These two forces are constantly fighting each other, and your choices are never fre from this conflict (pressure)
18..But when you are directed by the Holy Spirit, you are no longer subject to the law.
So you see that this question of who is right here John or Paul can only be answered like this....
I hope this helps you to see
God Bless
Jim
Because Christ is the overcomer and it is He living in me and not I, do you think a person could overcome sin in this lifetime completely?
th1b.taylor
Member
Amen Karl. I was saved on stage but my first Church was a very fundamental Missionary Association Baptist Church. On top of that, I was seated under Brother Richard Clarke from Mississippi, that man can preach grace.
Fish Catcher Jim
Member
Jesse Have you ever heard this..............Greater is He that is in ME then he that is in the world ? 1john4:4
I believe Jesse with GOD all things are possible.........Matthew 19:26
If you set your mind and heart to it I believe one could but let me tell you this brother....It would take a quality choice made to do this and much discipline and I do mean MUCH to achieve this. You would have to discipline your self big time and make a quality choice to seek His face and Get in the word day and night and apply the things of His word in your life and Renew your mind far beyond what most people ever do. Oh and if you missed it or had a bad day.........No big deal........Because we have Grace and in this grace we can repent and simply take up where we left off......
Jim
I think the key is "all things are possible with God". Enoch walked with God and it seems like if there was anyone (besides Jesus) who was close to perfectly mature it would be him, he didn't even have to face physical death which also helps us to be purified. Maybe there are others like him.
Those are all good things to do and we should do all those things, but it's ultimately He doing the work in us, we're not able to cause ourselves to be mature, only be opened to submitting to Him.
Fish Catcher Jim
Member
and yet we must our selves make the first move towards Him or towards renwing our minds or Growing in Him....We move He moves...We ignore getting to know Him and His ways well, let me put it like this....The amount of Time and Effort we put towards getting closer to God is the same effort and time He will give back unto us.....We can not be slothful about this....(Lazy)
Blake
Member
I used to believe that it was entirely unconquerable... my mind changed on it only just recently. I can only speak from my own experience but here goes.
I believe that you can get so sick of your sin that you cast it aside. You will develop a hatred for your sin and turn from it, it will disgust you, make you feel ill to entertain the thought of it. I believe it's through grace and sanctification that this happens -- the sins you hate won't be taken from you, God will be there to robe you in righteousness when you've cast it aside.
Some sins are taken in an instant, but others aren't. I know for sure that there are plenty of MUCH BETTER CHRISTIANS out there than I am or will ever likely be, but I think if most of us are honest, we can admit that there are the sins in our lives that we either haven't yet -- or didn't easily -- cast aside. It had a grip on us. We made excuses for it or ignored the promptings of the Spirit against it. Those sins are not for God to take from you, those are the sins He waits for you to cast at His feet.
A preacher recently said something that shook me spiritually and caused me to grow in understanding on the subject of sin, and, paraphrased, he said this: Job was steadfast. The devil believed that he could break Job, and finally God removed His hedge of protection from Job's life. But what the devil wasn't counting on was that Job had built his OWN hedge up. Glory to God.
It is only by amazing grace that any of us are accounted sons or daughters of the Most High, but I think we sometimes mistakenly rely entirely too much on His hedge around us to build our own. God's creation even testifies that the worker ant toils in the summer to prepare for the winter. Fasting, praying, being in the Spirit and developing a hatred for sin prepares us for the onslaught of sin coming, whether by temptation or by sewing the seeds we've reaped in the past. That's the case of my own sins that I am learning to greatly despise -- they hooked me young, became ingrained in my flesh, and that flesh is a rebel. But praise GOD, He is working in me every day. I believe that I will come out refined in faith and steadfast against sin, both because God is mighty to save us in His grace, and because I am building up my own hedge and preparing for winter! The time is coming when the temptations arise and I laugh them in the face and tell them that I am unbreakable through the graces of God and my hatred of sin.
The too long to read version: Yes, I believe we can conquer sin.
I believe that you can get so sick of your sin that you cast it aside. You will develop a hatred for your sin and turn from it, it will disgust you, make you feel ill to entertain the thought of it. I believe it's through grace and sanctification that this happens -- the sins you hate won't be taken from you, God will be there to robe you in righteousness when you've cast it aside.
Some sins are taken in an instant, but others aren't. I know for sure that there are plenty of MUCH BETTER CHRISTIANS out there than I am or will ever likely be, but I think if most of us are honest, we can admit that there are the sins in our lives that we either haven't yet -- or didn't easily -- cast aside. It had a grip on us. We made excuses for it or ignored the promptings of the Spirit against it. Those sins are not for God to take from you, those are the sins He waits for you to cast at His feet.
A preacher recently said something that shook me spiritually and caused me to grow in understanding on the subject of sin, and, paraphrased, he said this: Job was steadfast. The devil believed that he could break Job, and finally God removed His hedge of protection from Job's life. But what the devil wasn't counting on was that Job had built his OWN hedge up. Glory to God.
It is only by amazing grace that any of us are accounted sons or daughters of the Most High, but I think we sometimes mistakenly rely entirely too much on His hedge around us to build our own. God's creation even testifies that the worker ant toils in the summer to prepare for the winter. Fasting, praying, being in the Spirit and developing a hatred for sin prepares us for the onslaught of sin coming, whether by temptation or by sewing the seeds we've reaped in the past. That's the case of my own sins that I am learning to greatly despise -- they hooked me young, became ingrained in my flesh, and that flesh is a rebel. But praise GOD, He is working in me every day. I believe that I will come out refined in faith and steadfast against sin, both because God is mighty to save us in His grace, and because I am building up my own hedge and preparing for winter! The time is coming when the temptations arise and I laugh them in the face and tell them that I am unbreakable through the graces of God and my hatred of sin.
The too long to read version: Yes, I believe we can conquer sin.
Blake
Member
I agree with this... I think God goes a little more than we do, but He honors our own efforts as well... the faithful in Christ will remember to fill their lamps with oil and keep their wicks trimmed.
The amount of Time and Effort we put towards getting closer to God is the same effort and time He will give back unto us.....We can not be slothful about this....(Lazy)
Hey I heard one time that we are as close to the Lord as we chose to be! You just confirmed it!
The amount of Time and Effort we put towards getting closer to God is the same effort and time He will give back unto us.....We can not be slothful about this....(Lazy)
If we're not willing to pursue the Lord (which is what He tells us to do - Seek His face), then what is that saying about us?
Amen Blake! You've written a lot to ponder!
The point you made about how we view sin will determine what we do with the sin. Not only that, but what we do with sin is largely based upon how we think God sees sin. We need to hate sin like God hates it! If we hate it, we're going to do everything we can to stop it and hand it over to God, if we are indifferent to sin, then it's likely going to remain and not be conquered. The fruit will show either way.
The sanctification process is the purging of our old and being filled with the new and I think you and Jim are both right, we do have responsibilities in this process. God's intention for us is to always be participating in the process.
Blake, you were talking about how Job built his own hedge and it seems you are spot on! Job's faith was tested and it is silly to believe that God doesn't test us today (people think this means tempted and those 2 terms are not the same), of course He tests us! It shows us (to ourselves) where we are, where we fail. Job didn't fail and his faith was steadfast. Abraham was tested, his faith proved to be steadfast. Is our faith steadfast in the same manner when we're tested? Preparing ourselves and being prepared by spending time with God and getting rid of sin is a sure fire way for preparation, right? It's a growing and maturing process and if we're active in that, then we're going to be maturing and growing at a steady rate! Amen!
With Christ all things are possible and yes, sin in us can be conquered!! Praise God!!
This is truer than you might recognize.