The Two Natures That Co-Exist In A Spirit-Filled Christian

[JLB]

It can:

21Again Jesus said to them, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent Me, so also I am sending you.” 22When He had said this, He breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. John 20:21-22

2I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law, or by hearing with faith? Galatians 3:2

47“Can anyone withhold the water to baptize these people? They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have!” Acts 10:47

Don't try to box the Holy Spirit into a doctrine. He is like the wind. He comes and goes as he pleases and is not controlled by legalisms and rituals but by the faith he himself instills in a person through the hearing of the word.

My point exactly. Don’t try to box the baptism with the Holy Spirit into a denominational doctrine. The context should be evaluated.

Receiving the Holy Spirit in the scripture and context I quoted was how they referred to the Baptism with the Holy Spirit; being filled with the Holy Spirit.

Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. Acts 8:14-17

These folks had been born again, and then water baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. (baptized into Christ by the Spirit, and baptized in water)

They still needed to filled with the Holy Spirit; Baptized with the Holy Spirit

This is the point I was addressing.

The point is when we receive the word of salvation and are born again, it doesn’t mean we have been baptized with the Holy Spirit.


Again the same language is used by Paul -


And it happened, while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some disciples he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?”
So they said to him, “We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.”
And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?”
So they said, “Into John’s baptism.”
Then Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.”
When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. Acts 19:1-6

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Received the word of God refers to being saved; born again.


It does not refer to being filled with the Holy Spirit or receiving the Holy Spirit.

But I showed you the references where it does mean that.

 

[JLB]

But I showed you the references where it does mean that.

Receiving the Holy Spirit can mean several things based on the context.

Jesus breathed on them and said receive the Holy Spirit. Amen.

And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. John 20:22


He also said to His disciples…

And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Acts 1:4-5

He told them to wait for the baptism with the Holy Spirit.

The power to live their lives as witnesses.
The power to lay down their lives as witnesses.

Again, the context dictates what the meaning of receiving the Holy Spirit.

Acts 8:14-17
Acts 19:1-6

The baptism with the Spirit refers to being filled with the Holy Spirit.


When the Day of Pentecost had fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven, as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled the whole house where they were sitting. Then there appeared to them divided tongues, as of fire, and one sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Acts 2:1-4

The instances where people were baptized with the Holy Spirit there was evidence that could be seen and heard.

Therefore being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He poured out this which you now see and hear.
Acts 2:33


This is the main point I was addressing where the poster indicated that being born again, filled and sealed with the Holy Spirit is all one event…

everyone who accepted Jesus is born again, filled and sealed with the Holy Spirit and made alive spiritually.

Although if the Lord wants to do it all at once then that is up to Him.

Acts 10 would be one instance of that.

As long as we see the evidence we can be assured that it has occurred.

Again the point is receiving the word of salvation (being born gain) doesn’t mean that a person has been filled with the Holy Spirit, which is the seal; the signet stamp of authenticity.

Acts 8:14-17 makes that clear.

 

[Randy]

The sinful nature is considered the flesh. One who has the Spirit of Christ in them is not overcome by the desires of the flesh. Rather such a one would put down the misdeeds of the flesh by the Spirit.

Everyone who sins is a slave to sin unless the Son sets them free. If the Son sets them free, they are free indeed.

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

Most Christians have this wrong understanding and believed that God gave the Law for us to follow. Before the death and resurrection of Jesus, everyone is living in the flesh and dead spiritually. Therefore, there is only one nature which man lived by which is the flesh. Man not knowing that they are sinful and can never please God, tried to perform good works to earn God's favor. Therefore God gave the Law and said: "Anyone who desire earn my favor and enter heaven must obey the Law without breaking any of the commandments."

Romans 2:13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous.

Galatians 5:3 If anyone wants to be righteous through the law, they have to obey the entire law

James 2:10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

But God's true intention for giving the Law is to show man that they cannot keep his law because of their sinful nature. It is liken to God saying to a dead corpse "If you want to live, then show me that you can breathe." But it is impossible for a dead corpse to breathe.

After the death and resurrection of Jesus, everyone who accepted Jesus is born again, filled and sealed with the Holy Spirit and made alive spiritually. At this point, a Christian has two natures. The nature of the sinful flesh that is the old man and nature of the Holy Spirit that is God's nature. If you know the flesh, you will know that it is capable of performing good works and evil desires. In the non-Christian community, do we not see people who contributed much to the society and others? However, God compare all the rightouseness of sinful man as filthy rags.

Isaiah 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

The other nature of a Christian is the nature the Holy Spirit that is God's nature which cannot sin. These two different nature within a Christian is constantly at war. Therefore Paul wrote that he discipline his body and bring it into subjection.

1 Corinthians 9:27 But I discipline my body and bring it into subjection, lest, when I have preached to others, I myself should become disqualified.

How to know stop operating in the flesh?

Step 1: Stop focusing on the Law and do not be sin conscious. Remember that God did not gave the Law for anyone to follow but rather to make all sinners aware that of their sinful nature and cannot save themselves by their own human effort or good works. If you continue to focus on the Law, you will strengthen the flesh to perform and more sins will be committed.

1 Corinthians 15:56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

Hebrews 10:2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for you are not under the law, but under grace.

Galatians 3:10 All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: ‘Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.

Galatians 5:4 You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.

Step 2: Live in freedom from the Law and act according to the prompting of the Holy Spirit. If you believe that God cannot sin, what made you think you will commit sin when you are flowing with the Holy Spirit?

Romans 8:5 Those who live according to the flesh have their minds set on what the flesh desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.

Anyone who is alive will naturally breathe without being told to do so. Therefore if a Christian flows with the spirit, they live out the nature of God which is free from the Law and Sin. Therefore, I believe this is the reason why God do not want Christians to be conscious of the Law and Sin. A born again Christian who is filled with the Holy Spirit will naturally obey the Law without effort or mindful of not breaking it.

alaric, how do you define the "law," just in the Old Testament or also in the New? There are many commands in the second parts of the letters that are binding on us, aren't there? For example, Paul tells the church in Thessalonica the following:

1Th 5:16 Rejoice always,
1Th 5:17 pray without ceasing,
1Th 5:18 give thanks in all circumstances; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you.

Aren't these commands the goals God wants us to strive for, not to be saved but to grow to become more godly?
Do you already fulfill these requirements perfectly? I don't, but God is enabling me to make progress.

 

[Beetow]

There are many commands in the second parts of the letters that are binding on us, aren't there?

Moses' people covenanted with God via the laws, rules, and regulations contained in
Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy; which was very dangerous because
it put them at risk of being slammed for non compliance by any number of the
curses listed at Lev 26:14-39, Deut 27:15-26, and Deut 28:15-68.

Folks unified with Christ are not covenanted with God that way. No; they're
covenanted with God via a different arrangement by which there are no curses for
non compliance, viz: whereas Moses' people were under a legal system; the folks
unified with Christ are under an honor system, which is a huge advantage.

● Matt 11:28-30 . . Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will
give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and
humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my
burden is light.
_

 

[Elijah7777]

Aren't these commands the goals God wants us to strive for, not to be saved but to grow to become more godly?

David and Paul both affirm that to be good is to our advantage—and to be right is to be united with God.

In the creation account, we first read of light and darkness, then waters above and waters below, followed by water and dry land. Each day introduces a new contrast—a new separation. These are not just physical divisions, but symbolic ones.

As the narrative unfolds, we move through a series of comparisons until we finally encounter the moral axis: good and evil.

We are not merely recounting creation—we are mapping a moral spiral:

• From light and dark → awareness
• To above and below → alignment
• To land and sea → foundation
• To good and evil → covenant

And in that spiral, to be good is to ascend—to spiral upward toward God’s government, where righteousness is not just a virtue, but a form of divine alignment.

​

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

No, the folks reborn of God's seed do not commit sin.
His seed cannot bring forth liars, adulterers, or thieves. (1 John 3:9)

I find teachings enabling a true servitude to God, liberating.

So true, but it only applies to those who still walk in and after the flesh, instead of in and after the Spirit.
Rebirth gives us a new nature.
One that reigns in those whose old self/nature was crucified with Christ.

Can you tell me if Spurgeon ever actually repented of sin?
Or did he die in his disobedience ?
He is speaking from the perspective of still being in the flesh.
A circumstance those in Christ have forsaken.

The narrative of his life prior to his conversion, (Rom 7:5), would surely include those words.

The narrative of Paul's pre-conversion life would surely include that message.
Thankfully, he wrote Romans 8:2, which magnifies the difference his pre-conversion life with where he was when he wrote Romans.
Rom 8:2..."For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death."
He had been freed from what you call..."his sinful nature/slave to the law of sin" by the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus".
You can be freed too.

Thankfully, rebirth from God's seed alleviates the slavery you write of.

Nobody in the OT.
But God has cleansed the heart of all that submit to Him; by the blood of Christ Jesus. (Acts 2:38)

OT writings that apply to those still living an OT lifestyle.
There are righteous men on earth since we have been enabled to walk "in Christ".
It is those outside of Christ that walk in the flesh and not in the Spirit.

I disagree.

Did they do that, or did they opt to die in their sins ?
I hope they obeyed a Godly exhortation.

Thank God for an apostle's admonissions and guidance !
If we walk in the Spirit, we won't be able to do do the things of the flesh !

Perfectly apt, as it addresses those who walk in darkness.
As do verses 6 and 10.
If we walk in the light, though, all or past sins can be washed away buy the blood of Christ. (1 John 1:7)
So those walking in the light/God, can say they have no sin !

Your rebirth is different from the one I believe in.

Chafer is right.
Thank God for making it possible to have but one "nature", after the old one was is destroyed and a new creature is raised with Christ to walk in newness of life ! (Rom 6:4,6)
Thank God !

Hopeful 2, someone has taught you only part of the gospel. You are right that you and I are ALREADY perfectly sinless in principle before our God who sees Jesus' perfection when he looks at us.

However, we are NOT YET perfect in practice because we still have to deal with the presence of sin in us because we still have it in our sinful natures.

Just compare Colossians 1 and 2 with chapters 3 and 4, and you will see the ALREADY (1 and 2) and the NOT YET (3 and 4) of the Good News.

The Apostle Paul says that he isn't perfect, so I won't either. The result is his and our race toward the goal of resurrection perfection at our death or Jesus' second coming as follows:

Php 3:8 Indeed, I count everything as loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord. For his sake I have suffered the loss of all things and count them as rubbish, in order that I may gain Christ
Php 3:9 and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which comes through faith in Christ, the righteousness from God that depends on faith—
Php 3:10 that I may know him and the power of his resurrection, and may share his sufferings, becoming like him in his death,
Php 3:11 that by any means possible I may attain the resurrection from the dead.
Php 3:12 Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own.
Php 3:13 Brothers, I do not consider that I have made it my own. But one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and straining forward to what lies ahead,
Php 3:14 I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.

 

[Elijah7777]

However, we are NOT YET perfect in practice because we still have to deal with the presence of sin in us because we still have it in our sinful natures.

David was far from perfect, yet he was called a man after God’s own heart. Why? Because David desired to be perfect before God. He longed for alignment, not just obedience. The question isn’t whether we are perfect—or even whether we can be. I’ll leave that debate to Wesley and the Holiness tradition. The deeper question is: Do we want to be perfect before God? Do we pray, repent, and seek Him—not to earn favor, but to be acceptable in His sight?

Paul’s cry in Romans 7:24—“Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death?”—reveals the same longing. His grief isn’t just over sin; it’s over the gap between his heart’s desire and his human condition. He yearns to be right with God. That yearning itself is a sign of life—a sign that the Spirit is at work, even in the struggle.

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

David and Paul both affirm that to be good is to our advantage—and to be right is to be united with God.

In the creation account, we first read of light and darkness, then waters above and waters below, followed by water and dry land. Each day introduces a new contrast—a new separation. These are not just physical divisions, but symbolic ones.

As the narrative unfolds, we move through a series of comparisons until we finally encounter the moral axis: good and evil.

We are not merely recounting creation—we are mapping a moral spiral:

• From light and dark → awareness
• To above and below → alignment
• To land and sea → foundation
• To good and evil → covenant

And in that spiral, to be good is to ascend—to spiral upward toward God’s government, where righteousness is not just a virtue, but a form of divine alignment.

​

You didn't answer my comment, Elijah7777. Don't we have to grow to be more obedient after we become Christians?

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

You didn't answer my comment, Elijah7777. Don't we have to grow to be more obedient after we become Christians?

Now, I read your #89 post. Amen, Elijah7777!

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

The only part of a "sin nature" that I retained after the destruction of the old man, (Rom 6:6), was the memory of it.

Correct, as it requires baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and its destruction of the old man, to accomplish it. (Rom 6:6, Gal 5:24))

I guess you will have to define "conversion".

Thank God that occurs at our "immersion" into Christ, and His death, burial, and resurrection. (Rom 6:3-7)

Paul's Rom. 7 laments were a narrative of his previous life whole still in the flesh, and unsuccessfully trying to please God by keeping the Law.
Rom 7:23's lament was answered in Rom 8.
Rom 7:24's lament was answered in Rom 6:6.
Because the laments were from his past.

Rom 7:23..."But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members."
Answered in...
Rom 8:2..."For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death."
Most of Rom 7. is the story of a Pharisee who was still walking in the "flesh".

Hopeful 2, I agree that all you say and quote has ALREADY happened in God's sight, but it has NOT YET happened completely in my daily life. If Paul thought that it had happened in his readers' daily lives, he wouldn't have commanded them in these ways:

1Th 5:14 And we urge you, brothers, admonish the idle, encourage the fainthearted, help the weak, be patient with them all.
1Th 5:15 See that no one repays anyone evil for evil, but always seek to do good to one another and to everyone.
1Th 5:16 Rejoice always,
1Th 5:17 pray without ceasing,
1Th 5:18 give thanks in all circumstances; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you.
1Th 5:19 Do not quench the Spirit.
1Th 5:20 Do not despise prophecies,
1Th 5:21 but test everything; hold fast what is good.
1Th 5:22 Abstain from every form of evil.

Do you obey his all of his commands perfectly? I don't, but God is helping me make progress.

If you think that you are perfectly sinless, you are disagreeing with Paul, who says that he is not perfect in Philippians 3:8-14. Because he admits that he isn't perfect (verses 12 and 13), Paul's goal is resurrection perfection toward which he runs a race; it's mine too:

Php 3:8 Indeed, I count everything as loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord. For his sake I have suffered the loss of all things and count them as rubbish, in order that I may gain Christ
Php 3:9 and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which comes through faith in Christ, the righteousness from God that depends on faith—
Php 3:10 that I may know him and the power of his resurrection, and may share his sufferings, becoming like him in his death,
Php 3:11 that by any means possible I may attain the resurrection from the dead.
Php 3:12 Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own.
Php 3:13 Brothers, I do not consider that I have made it my own. But one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and straining forward to what lies ahead,
Php 3:14 I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.