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Sin Was In The World Before Adam & Eve!!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Anna1334
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Anna1334

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I was thinking of Phoenix, "he is an atheist,"
when Yeshua gave me this message for him to understand how our faith has become
so real to us, that we are willing to die for the faith, and for the cause of
Christ. This is the way I see things. Phoenix is a very intelligent man because he is an excellent listener, once you tell him something he analyzes everything you say and that is very good. So I will
start from the beginning. God in his infinite wisdom knew before you were born
how we will turn out to be, He knew who would be His sons and daughters and who
would reject Him. I believe He chose the Jews because the Jews are the most
stubborn people in the world and they are stiff neck to show His love. If a Jew
is good he will be extremely good if he is bad the apposite will be true. Before
this Earth we live in, there was another earth and Satan ruled it as God’s most
favorite Cherubim, he was beautiful and perfect, surrounded with all precious
stones but when he turn against the Almighty Yahweh wanted to be higher
than God Himself, he said he will sit where Yahweh sits. Michael the arch Angel fought with
Lucifer, and that war has destroy that old earth from before Genesis 1:1 God
created a new earth because the other one was in darkness and void of God, and
so out of order. Meanwhile Lucifer was thrown out of heaven and we do know were
he went; he came to the new earth, which is the second earth. Now most of the
books that were rejected were of pagan origin but the book of Enoch was mention
in the pages of the Bible, so I would consider it a bit reliable. Enoch was the
seven dawn from Adam and he did not die the Bible tells us God took him. Bible
tells us that some will not sleep, the only two I know of not ever to die was
Enoch and Elijah.{{ Hebrews 11:5-6 By faith Enoch was taken so that he did not
experience death; and "he was not found, because God had taken him."
For it was attested before he was taken away that "he had pleased
God." And without faith it is impossible to please God, for whoever would
approach him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who diligently
seek him.}}Also the Bible tells us that Enoch prophesied. Jude 14 It was also
about these that Enoch, in the seventh generation from Adam, prophesied,
saying, "See, the Lord is coming with ten thousands of his holy ones,
Remember with God there is no time line that is why you can see Jesus speaking
to the Father and the Father answering Him, the closes I encounter was a eco of
my own voice. God can intersect time when ever He wants to. He can go back or
forward anytime he so desires He is God. We have also seen that in the Bible
Hezekiah pleaded for his life by reminding God how good he use to be. {{Isaiah
38:7-8 and here is my guarantee: I will send the sun backwards ten degrees as
measured on Ahaz' sundial!’ So the sun retraced ten degrees that it had gone
down!}} We can also see the time stop for Joshua 10:12-13 As the men of Israel
were pursuing and harassing the foe, Joshua prayed aloud, ``Let the sun stand
still over Gibeon, and let the moon stand in its place over the valley of
Aijalon!'' And the sun and the moon didn't move until the Israeli army had
finished the destruction of its enemies! This is described in greater detail in
The Book of Jashar. So the sun stopped in the heavens and stayed there for
almost twenty-four hours! Enoch prophesied from Genesis, all the way to Jude,
he saw what was to happen in the end because God show him time travel. John the
revelator 2000 years ago has also seen what is happening now, and what is to
come. We see prophecy right before our very own eyes being revealed as I write
to you this letter. Adam and Eve lived in a perfectly fine tune Paradise were there was no sickness or death, but remember one thing they had a free will. Yahweh will never take that from us, or even the angels, I guess that is why I love freedom of speech or freedom of religion. Yahweh will not want you in heaven against
your own will. This is our time line dating back to )(Adam--------)( Till the
coming of Jesus Christ.The Bible scarcely tells us before Adam, but it does tell us
some things. There was no death before Adam sin, but there was Spiritual death
in the old earth before Adam sin, spiritual death means being cut off from God.
In the book of Genesis God said to Adam the day you eat of this tree you will
die meaning Spiritual death not physical, because they went on living long
lives. When Jesus came He has quicken meaning make to life who were dead in
trespasses and sin, to be born again means to be born from the spiritual death
from Adam’s time. Remember Yahweh walk in the garden with Adam and Eve in the
cool of the day, and he talked to them, after they disobey and fell from grace
they die spiritually, so they lost communication with God Spiritually as well
as physically. Jesus came to restore that which was lost in the Garden of Eden.{{
Ezekiel 28:12-14"Son of man, take up a lamentation over the king of Tire
and say to him, 'Thus says the Lord GOD, "You had the seal of perfection,
Full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.†You were in Eden, the garden of God; every precious stone was your covering: The ruby, the topaz and the diamond; the beryl, the onyx and the
jasper; the lapis lazuli, the turquoise and the emerald; and the gold, the
workmanship of your settings and sockets, Was in you. On the day that you were
created they were prepared. "You were the anointed cherub who covers, and
I placed you {there.} You were on the holy mountain of God; you walked in the midst of the stones of fire.}} In the beginning of the verse it refers to the prince of tyrus but it is talking about Lucifer just as Jesus rebukes Peter calling Peter Satan, referring to the Lucifer speaking for Peter,
the same who was behind the king of Tyrus. Same Satan in different people. As
you can see here out of Eden there was another garden but this one was not made
of vegetation, but of precious stones were Satan lived and it to was destroy.
Don’t be surprised Satan had all the glory of a leader like a god. The New
Jerusalem has all these stones also and streets made out of gold and in front
of His throne a sea of glass Rev.4:6. Now after Satan was kicked out of heaven
he can roam on earth just on time to tempt Eve. As I have said before Yahweh
gave them a free will to choose and she chose what seem to look good to her at
the time, “the lust of the flesh.†God gave Satan to rule spiritual beings so when Satan dies spiritually, death enter him and all who follow him. Death was already at work before Adam’s fall,
so evil was present at the time. The principle of good and evil existed before
Adam sin; there cannot be evil if there is no good. Yahweh was good than and He
is still good now; by telling us not to eat of the tree that kills your
spiritual walk with Him, but eat of the one who gives you back the fellowship,
Adam and Eve lost at Eden, the one they had with God from the beginning.
Matthew Yeshua came to give you life, He is the tree of life and He loves you
so very much that he took upon Himself your sins and mine, so that fellowship
He had with Adam can be restore back to life, by that I mean your spiritual
life, the one that goes on forever and ever. The Word of Yeshua tells us that
the natural man does not know or understand the things that belong to God. He
who is of the spirit of God will understand the things that come out of the
mouth of God, which is the Word of Yeshua. Also Yahweh killed an animal to
cover Adam and Eve’s sin; all because Yahweh is not willing that any should
perish, but that all will come to repentance. The theme of the Bible from cover
to cover is love, repentance, and restoration of a relationship; from a loving
Father to a son and daughter. For something to live it must die first, so all
through the Bible sacrifices were made to God to cover their sins but in all
this they were never taking away till Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the
sins of the world. Without the blood there is no remission for sins this is
Yahweh’s way not yours not mind. The Old Testament is so full of knowledge to
know the why of things. When Yahweh delivers the Jews from bondage from the
Egyptians, Yahweh wanted to restore back to Himself a lost relationship with
them but they all went back to sin. He sent to them prophets they kill all the
prophets they said we have one king Creaser we do not want him to be our king.
The same with and Barabbas they said release Barabbas who was a criminal, and
crucified Jesus who was good. How long do you think Jesus would last if He came
today as a lamb to heal, and to tell us not to live for ourselves but for God?
Also how long will he live by rebuking all the phony preachers, full of lust
for money and fame? Matt Evil was present before Adam was created and Adam was
warned by God of this present evil that was lurking outside this holy garden
that God gave to mankind. In the garden was a gate and when Adam opens that
gate all evil enter in. So God put Adam and Eve outside, and they never were
able to enter in again because God put an Angel to guard the entrance back to Eden. Evil came from Satan yes Yahweh created him but we have a free choice to fallow Yeshua or Satan as for me and my house we will serve the Lord, blessings to all. Anna
 
Anna, you covered a lot of ground in your first post. Books written apart from the Bible, are foreign to me and at this point I do not count them as 'inspired'. But I will address the last sentence of your post.
Evil came from Satan yes Yahweh created him but we have a free choice to fallow Yeshua or Satan as for me and my house we will serve the Lord, blessings to all. Anna
In Joshua 24:15 Joshua makes the reference mentioned in this statement of yours. What your post does not mention is the rest of what Joshua said - directly related to free choice.

Joshua 24:19 And Joshua said unto the people, Ye cannot serve the LORD: for he is an holy God; he is a jealous God; he will not forgive your transgressions nor your sins. KJV

Joshua 24:22 And Joshua said unto the people, Ye are witnesses against yourselves that ye have chosen you the LORD, to serve him. And they said, We are witnesses. KJV


I believe, when I say 'as for me any my house we will serve the Lord'
that I am witnessing against myself!

Ret
 
I do not get what you are trying to say how is it wrong to serve the Lord or to say my house will serve the Lord. Has not Yeshua said to us to fallow Him, and that every tree that does not bear fruit that is good for nothing but to be cast into the fire. Blessings and thanks for your replied, in the name above all names Yeshua-Jesus. Anna
 
Jos 24:22 Then Joshua said, “You are witnesses against yourselves that you have chosen to serve the LORD.†“Yes, we are witnesses,†they replied.
Jos 24:23 “Now then,†said Joshua, “throw away the foreign gods that are among you and yield your hearts to the LORD, the God of Israel.â€Â

By this portion of Scripture, we see that the Children of Israel in the desert were still involved in idolatry. They were saying that they would serve the Lord and yet they still were involved in Idolatry. That is why Joshua said that they were witnessing against themselves. This is mirrored in 1Corinthians 10:21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons too; you cannot have a part in both the Lord’s table and the table of demons. :wink:
 
Dt 10:12 And now, O Israel, what does the LORD your God ask of you but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all his ways, to love him, to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul,

Ps 2:11 Serve the LORD with fear and rejoice with trembling.
Ps 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry and you be destroyed in your way, for his wrath can flare up in a moment. Blessed are all who take refuge in him.

Mt 22:36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?â€Â
Mt 22:37 Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
 
Anna1334 said:
I do not get what you are trying to say how is it wrong to serve the Lord or to say my house will serve the Lord. Has not Yeshua said to us to fallow Him, and that every tree that does not bear fruit that is good for nothing but to be cast into the fire. Blessings and thanks for your replied, in the name above all names Yeshua-Jesus. Anna
Joshua 24:15 When Joshua says 'as for me and my house we will serve the Lord', Joshua is 'witnessing against himself' and this understanding comes from Zechariah 3:3 where Joshua has on 'filthy garments' standing before the angel of the Lord.

So, is the 'filthy garment' a bad thing? In the eyes of a perfect, Holy, Almighty God, even our good righteous works are 'filthy rags' (Isa 64:6) and need to be covered in His garments. Zechariah 3:4 goes on to tell that the 'filthy' garments are 'taken away'.

In Matthew 25:31-46 is the story of the sheep and the goats. The goats take credit for their good works of feeding the hungry, the thirsty, visiting the stranger, clothing the naked, etc. God's sheep say we did nothing! Nothing, in the eyes of God, for which they could take credit.

Anna, your thought about 'fruit' is good. Only 'in Christ' do we bear 'good fruit' - but these fruit are not our work, but the work of God in and through us (1Cor 15:10).

Isaiah 2:17 ....and the LORD alone shall be exalted in that day.KJV
Isaiah 5:16 ....the LORD of hosts shall be exalted in judgment...KJV


Oh, to be covered in His garments, in the day of Judgment!
Ret
 
Lee, both your posts present good thoughts! True the Children of Israel in the desert were still involved in idolatry. Question is, did that condition change at/by the time of Jesus? Could they, with the help of God, accomplish any of these things that God requires of them?

Even the disciples said, we will go to prison and to death then at calvary they all fled! Jesus told the disciples, before calvary in the garden where they prayed, 'Matt 26:41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak. KJV The disciples felt they were strong enough in their flesh to resist evil. They found out the 'flesh is weak' to weak to resist 'the rulers of the darkness of this world'. Ephesians 6:12 KJV

2 Corinthians 12:9,10, paraphrased - The power of God, through Jesus Christ, is perfected in our weakness. We live with weaknesses, distresses, difficulties, etc. Thus, the glory of God, in Jesus Christ His Son, is made manifest in us.

In the grace of Jesus Christ,
Ret
 
Ret,

I'm hesitant about accepting this interpretation. First off, I don't connect any dots between Josh 24:15 and Zechariah 3:3. Secondly, Joshua's statement in Josh 24:15 counts as righteousness. Lastly, filthy garments before the Lord is not a bad thing.

1 Ki 21:27 And it came to pass, when Ahab heard those words, that he rent his clothes, and put sackcloth upon his flesh, and fasted, and lay in sackcloth, and went softly.
1 Ki 21:28 And the word of the LORD came to Elijah the Tishbite, saying,
1 Ki 21:29 Seest thou how Ahab humbleth himself before me? because he humbleth himself before me, I will not bring the evil in his days: but in his son's days will I bring the evil upon his house.

Only after the Resurrection of the righteous will we be clothed in fine linen.

In the Zechariah 3 passage, we must consider that this is a vision to Zechariah is highly symbolic. Joshua appears to be representative of all of Israel (Israel and Judah) or at the very least, their remnant. Satan represents their Adversary. As we well know, Israel has been chastised over and over again for their sins.

The filthy garments is a reference to the sackcloths worn by the Israelites in times of calamity and times of repentance for the transgressions. The raiment to perfect garments should be familiar to New Covenant students and followers of Jesus.

The whole passage:

Zec 3:1 And he showed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the LORD, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.
Zec 3:2 And the LORD said unto Satan, The LORD rebuke thee, O Satan; even the LORD that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?
Zec 3:3 Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.
Zec 3:4 And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

Now a further reading of the verses that follow suggest some conditions preceding this "change of rainment".

As for Joshua the man, I believe he remains in God's grace because of his faith.

Now, what has any of this have to do with "Sin Was In The World Before Adam & Eve!!" :smt102
 
The filthy garments is a reference to the sackcloths worn by the Israelites in times of calamity and times of repentance for the transgressions. The raiment to perfect garments should be familiar to New Covenant students and followers of Jesus.
Thank you Vic C, I guess Ret was reading wrong into the scriptures. I like to elaborate further into this if you allow me to. I am a humble repented Christian in need of His mercy every day and if I say I have no sin I am fooling myself. Now with all this said, I must not continued in the same sins but must pray for my Lord Yeshua to take them away until the sin that separates me from Yahweh, is gone. "Notice dependence here " Yeshua said in John 15: 4. Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. Abide in me and I will abide in you, for without me you can do nothing. NOTHING TO ME MEANS NOTHING. I know that as long as I abide in Him He is well please with me, and having the Holy Spirit living in me makes me Holy, for without Holiness no one will see Yahweh. So there I am not holy but He is. He the Holy Spirit which will quicken my mortal body to be able to stand in His presence as Holy as I’ll ever be. Love you Ret by I disagree with your statement. Yahweh is well please with all who serve Him whole heartily. Again all the time I have free from work is for Him. I have three websites that my Husband Lee, and me are running, and still I post in two other sites so does he. “As for me and my house we will serve the Lord†So yes Yahweh has called me to preach an adulterated Gospel, as to leave sin and follow Him, Love you all. Anna
 
vic C. said:
I'm hesitant about accepting this interpretation. First off, I don't connect any dots between Josh 24:15 and Zechariah 3:3. Secondly, Joshua's statement in Josh 24:15 counts as righteousness. Lastly, filthy garments before the Lord is not a bad thing....Now, what has any of this have to do with "Sin Was In The World Before Adam & Eve!!"

RE: Sin was in the World Before Adam & Eve:

Romans 5:13(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. 14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
Romans 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.KJV

RE: Sin Was In The World Before Adam & Eve
In refrence to other creations apart from Adam and Eve, my conclusion is consistent with your end thought, though arriving at this otherwise!

Because other creations have no law, they have not transgressed. When there is no law, their sin is not imputed [in the judgment] against them. Therefore, they do not enter into judgment.

Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God,
so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
KJV


God bless the hearing of His word.....Ret

Edit note: I did go in and edit to wait till I can 'connect the dots', my apologies! .....Ret
 
Anna1334 said:
...I am a humble repented Christian in need of His mercy every day and if I say I have no sin I am fooling myself. Now with all this said, I must not continued in the same sins but must pray for my Lord Yeshua to take them away until the sin that separates me from Yahweh, is gone. "Notice dependence here " Yeshua said in John 15: 4. Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. Abide in me and I will abide in you, for without me you can do nothing. NOTHING TO ME MEANS NOTHING.
Amen! and Amen - "abide in me and I will abide in you". Wonderful blessing because what happens inside, will also work it's results outside!

May the love of God to keep us in His word!
In the fellowship of His love......Ret
 
Well I've evolved from scratching my head trying to wrap my brain around it scripturally/to connect the dots sorta speak like Vic, to sitting here rubbing my chin going ummmmm. I'll stay out of this one....confusing.

Kudos HIM,
Carol
 
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