Bible Study SO YOU THINK YOU ARE SAVED.

[JLB]

Don't, don't, don't, don't..........

It seems to me that with all of those don'ts you spend and awful lot of time giving place to the devil. If your eyes are focused on Christ there is no room to give place to the devil.
.

Exactly, if you are focused on Christ, to walk with Him, and be led by His Spirit, then you don't need to be reminded of these things.


However, for those who need to ask such questions, then they need to learn the basic necessities of the faith.

Paul said things like this -


What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not!
And do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. Romans 6:15-16


5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Romans 8:5-6


12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors—not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13 For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. Romans 8:12-13


19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery,fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. Galatians 5:19-21


People that are bent on indulging the lustful desires of the flesh, need rules to follow, and warnings - 911 warnings!

Here is such from 1 Timothy 1 9-11

knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, 11 according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust. 1 Timothy 1:9-11


JLB

 

[ezrider]

I would say that this person is focused on Jesus the Son of God because He doesn't want His children in places where sin abounds.

If this person were focused on Jesus the Son of God then they wouldn't spend so much time attributing things, or giving place to the devil. It is like always trying to find some "antichrist person" in the scripture so they will know him when they see him. Is that what we are called for?
If someone is looking for antichrist, then are they really following after Christ?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Jethro, do you think that those who make a profession of faith in Jesus for Salvation, but lack the faith to believe that their sins are forgiven is a real activity?

I believe there are people who start out in faith, professing Christ from a real faith, but who then later don't have that faith. If that's what you mean. Hyper-grace doctrine says that person is still saved.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

People that are bent on indulging the lustful desires of the flesh, need rules to follow, and warnings - 911 warnings!

Actually, any believer growing up into the stature of Christ needs rules to follow. As an example, James used the law to instruct the church how to love. So the law is also for those who aren't bent on indulging the flesh but simply don't know better and are still in the process of learning how to serve God through love for him and others.

Chopper, can you imagine, you being a shepherd of the flock, not being allowed to use what the law says to guide and instruct believers into the way of righteousness for fear that would be considered a damnable works gospel that can't save?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

What was the CROSS ALL ABOUT ???????????

So we don't have to get water baptized anymore?

 

[smaller]

"He who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous." (1 John 3:7 NIV)

When things are not right on the outside it shows that things are not right on the inside. The doctrine that teaches that the 'contrariness' between what you are on the inside and what you are on the outside is okay because that's just the way things are by God's design ignores what Jesus said about the matter:

"First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean." (Matthew 23:26 NIV)

IOW, it's impossible to rationalize a dirty cup as being clean on the inside. But that is what the hyper-grace doctrine does. What you are on the outside is a direct reflection of what you are on the inside. No amount of grace changes that truth. You're only as good on the outside as you are on the inside.

Believers who are in truth won't be led to justify their own contrary to against the Spirit flesh under any circumstances. Gal. 5:17.

Paul knew that evil was present with him when he did good. Romans 7:21. He didn't soft soap his own flesh on these matters under the guise of "good acting." Do you know the meaning of hypocrite is ACTOR?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Believers who are in truth won't be led to justify their own contrary to against the Spirit flesh under any circumstances. Gal. 5:17.

Paul knew that evil was present with him when he did good. Romans 7:21. He didn't soft soap his own flesh on these matters under the guise of "good acting." Do you know the meaning of hypocrite is ACTOR?

Your doctrine never seems to get to God's answer in Romans 8. It always leaves us in the despair of Romans 7.

 

[smaller]

We know that whoever is born of God does not sin; but he who has been born of God keeps himself, and the wicked one does not touch him. 1 John 5:18

Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. James 4:7

So much for your "theory".

JLB

The scriptures serve to prove the point. The devil doesn't win the game in the end and CAN NOT cause a believer to lose salvation. That is why John says "the wicked one touches him not."

Nevertheless, sin indwells the flesh and the lusts therein are in fact demonic regardless of how good an act is put up on the outside.

Galatians 5:16
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

Both conditions are and remain true. Walking in the Spirit will not lie and say there are no lusts in the flesh. Such are merely walking a lie in denial.

 

[smaller]

Your doctrine never seems to get to God's answer in Romans 8. You always leave us in the despair of Romans 7.

Why would I dangle any good things of God in Christ to that which is contrary to and against the Spirit? What good can possibly come of that? It's against the Spirit of Christ to do such things.

I understand the flesh wants to feel good about itself too, but too bad so sad.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Why would I dangle any good things of God in Christ to that which is contrary to and against the Spirit? What good can possibly come of that? It's against the Spirit of Christ to do such things.

I understand the flesh wants to feel good about itself too, but too bad so sad.

It's interesting that your doctrine considers anyone who is attaining to the victory spoken about in Romans 8 an arrogant liar and hypocrite.

 

[smaller]

Who is trying to justify the flesh, but only those who have not Gods Spirit dwelling in them. People love to blame Satan

That's exactly the point. Sin is demonic and sin indwells our flesh. That's WHY we don't justify the flesh, which is contrary to and against the Spirit. The flesh is and remains "under the influences" of our adversary and there isn't any doubt about it. We all have sin. We all sinned. And sin is in fact 'of the devil.' So yeah, I WILL point the finger here in the obvious direction and the influencer, the tempter in the flesh will scream and whine and buckle under this disclosure every single time. Every blinded by that which is contrary to and against the Spirit will DENY to their dying breath that their own sin is in fact 'of the devil.' A person in truth will see it, expose it, speak this fact. A blinded person will deny it, just like clockwork.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Why would I dangle any good things of God in Christ to that which is contrary to and against the Spirit? What good can possibly come of that?

What good can possibly come of that? That someone might possibly put to death the misdeeds of the flesh? Is that really so absurd?

 

[smaller]

It's interesting that your doctrine considers anyone who is attaining to the victory spoken about in Romans 8 an arrogant liar and hypocrite.

First of all it's not my doctrine. I appreciate that which is against and contrary to the Spirit trying to spin it that way though. Just proves the point.

Yes, it is true. The flesh of every last one of us is contrary to and against the Spirit.

Now eat the humble pie and move on.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

That's exactly the point. Sin is demonic and sin indwells our flesh. That's WHY we don't justify the flesh, which is contrary to and against the Spirit. The flesh is and remains "under the influences" of our adversary and there isn't any doubt about it. We all have sin. We all sinned. And sin is in fact 'of the devil.' So yeah, I WILL point the finger here in the obvious direction and the influencer, the tempter in the flesh will scream and whine and buckle under this disclosure every single time. Every blinded by that which is contrary to and against the Spirit will DENY to their dying breath that their own sin is in fact 'of the devil.' A person in truth will see it, expose it, speak this fact. A blinded person will deny it, just like clockwork.

....and a Christian will overcome the sin in the flesh. That seems to be the point your doctrine leaves out.

 

[smaller]

What good can possibly come of that? That someone might possibly put to death the misdeeds of the flesh? Is that really so absurd?

Oh, so you think "good acting" made the flesh NOT contrary to and against the Spirit?

Again, nice try. There really is no getting around it. Gal. 5:17 is a hard line fact for all of us. The lusts of the flesh can be contained and reigned OVER, but we do NOT reign by lying about it.

 

[Chopper]

If this person were focused on Jesus the Son of God then they wouldn't spend so much time attributing things, or giving place to the devil. It is like always trying to find some "antichrist person" in the scripture so they will know him when they see him. Is that what we are called for?
If someone is looking for antichrist, then are they really following after Christ?

As I said before EZ, your focus is only on one side of an issue. There are two sides. You ask, "If someone is looking for antichrist, then are they really following after Christ?" My answer is yes. We are told to be watchful....
2John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
1:8 Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward.

 

[smaller]

....and a Christian will overcome the sin in the flesh. That seems to be the point your doctrine leaves out.

I'm not interested in having my flesh which is contrary to and against the Spirit turn me into a liar quite frankly. I'd rather it abide where it belongs. In condemnation and me, truthful about it.

Why does anyone try to justify our flesh which is contrary to and against the Spirit? Because their flesh is MAKING them justify the flesh and they are in fact "walking in the flesh" justifying that which is contrary to the Spirit.

It's a big game of dodge ball that the flesh plays with all believers.

Who in this thread has yet to step up and condemn their own contrary to against the Spirit flesh?

Let me be the first AGAIN to say, I condemn and hate my own flesh, because the evil present, sin indwelling it is in fact OF THE DEVIL.

Who wants to go there? Uh, no flesh man can go there.

 

[Chopper]

I believe there are people who start out in faith, professing Christ from a real faith, but who then later don't have that faith. If that's what you mean. Hyper-grace doctrine says that person is still saved.

Thanks, I understand. Hyper-grace is something that I'm not all that familiar with. Guess I'll have to do a little research.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

First of all it's not my doctrine. I appreciate that which is against and contrary to the Spirit trying to spin it that way though. Just proves the point.

Yes, it is true. The flesh of every last one of us is contrary to and against the Spirit.

Now eat the humble pie and move on.

I think the person who needs to eat the humble pie is the believer who thinks they can remain unchanged on the outside and think they have some quality of faith on the inside that's going to save them on the Day of Wrath. Thus the point of Chopper's 'So you think you are saved?'

The person who thinks they're clean on the inside, but who is not also getting clean on the outside, is actually the deceiver and the liar and arrogant one. They have a brisk cup of morning coffee waiting for them on the Day of Christ.

"7Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous; 8the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil " (1 John 3:7 NASB)

All I hear in your doctrine is that there is no such person as the one "who practices righteousness", whom John speaks of in the verse above. And if anyone even remotely suggests they're attaining to that then they are a liar and a hypocrite and they are actually the one who is of the devil, not the one who practices the unrighteousness. Interesting doctrine, but, as we can easily see, is quite contrary to what the scriptures actually say.

 

[smaller]

I think the person who needs to eat the humble pie is the believer who thinks they can remain unchanged on the outside and think they have some quality of faith on the inside that's going to save them on the Day of Wrath. Thus the point of Chopper's 'So you think you are saved?'

That which is contrary to and against the Spirit ain't gonna be saved.

No, our flesh isn't going to make it past the Pearly Gates. We all bear our respective crosses precisely because our own flesh is VILE.

That cross results in eventual death of our own flesh. We account it to be that way in the meantime. Not justifying our contrary to and against the Spirit flesh for any reason and certainly not lying about it, because in that we fail.

Why lie? That just proves slaveship to the flesh.