sola scriptura,

[Link1983]

sola scriptura, meaning the “Bible alone” if the Bible does not say it why post it? otherwise its a man made doctrine.

Amen!!!!!

 

[Link1983]

I totally agree.

Which is why we need to use scripture.

Also agree. But also not to misuse it I think..

 

[Link1983]

A Word for many: (and honour the thread starter)

When there are many words, transgression and offense are unavoidable, But he who controls his lips and keeps thoughtful silence is wise.
Proverbs 10:19

 

[Mungo]

The apostles taught what Jesus Christ taught them.

His Gospel
His Commandments
His Doctrine


But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth, to which He called you by our gospel, for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.
Now may our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and our God and Father, who has loved us and given us everlasting consolation and good hope by grace, comfort your hearts and establish you in every good word and work. 2 Thessalonians 2:13-17

• stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.

The teachings they were taught by them directly in person or by an epistle.




JLB

Exactly. That is what I have been saying.
The apostles taught what Jesus taught them, not deriving doctrine from a book.

Timothy was to hold fast to what he had been taught by Paul, not deriving doctrines from a book.

Timothy was to hold fast to what Paul had taught him orally [Tradition] or in writing [Scripture] not from Paul's writings alone.

Then Timothy entrusted (put into the care of) faithful men who in their turn taught others from what Timothy had passed on - in writing or orally.

It's not Scripture alone.

 

[Mungo]

sola scriptura, meaning the “Bible alone” if the Bible does not say it why post it? otherwise its a man made doctrine.

Untrue.

 

[Edward]

sola scriptura, meaning the “Bible alone” if the Bible does not say it why post it? otherwise its a man made doctrine.

Sounds good first time you read it. But it sort of falls apart if you think about it. Scripture talks quite a bit about revelations from God...it speaks of pouring out His Spirit upon all flesh in the last days...There's lots of testimonies of people being visited and taught or taken up in the Spirit and given messages and so forth...

So what do we do with all of that? Reject it? No, I think not.

 

[JLB]

Also agree. But also not to misuse it I think..

Of course. That would mean we are not using it.



JLB

 

[JLB]

Exactly. That is what I have been saying.
The apostles taught what Jesus taught them, not deriving doctrine from a book.

Amen.


Thats how the scribes and Pharisees came up with the religion of Judaism. They took the writings of the Talmud, and mixed it with the law of Moses.


God never gave the children of Israel Judaism.

He gave them the law of Moses.

Judaism is the teachings of man.




JLB

 

[JLB]

Timothy was to hold fast to what Paul had taught him orally [Tradition] or in writing [Scripture] not from Paul's writings alone.

What Paul taught in person is no different than what he wrote In his epistles.

The doctrine of Christ.


JLB

 

[JLB]

Then Timothy entrusted (put into the care of) faithful men who in their turn taught others from what Timothy had passed on - in writing or orally.

It's not Scripture alone.

The apostles taught what Christ taught them.


Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen. Matthew 28:19-20

• teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you;

JLB

 

[OzSpen]

So one's knowledge is only valid if read or learnt recently.

You have created a strawman and are attacking it.

Who said so?

 

[Mungo]

Amen.


Thats how the scribes and Pharisees came up with the religion of Judaism. They took the writings of the Talmud, and mixed it with the law of Moses.


God never gave the children of Israel Judaism.

He gave them the law of Moses.

Judaism is the teachings of man.




JLB

A false analogy. Why not show I was wrong in what I wrote rather than creating a straw man.

 

[Mungo]

What Paul taught in person is no different than what he wrote In his epistles.

The doctrine of Christ.


JLB

There is no way you can know that.

Paul clearly indicates he taught Timothy by oral teaching as well as by letter. There is no reason to think he duplicated all he taught Timothy (or anyone else) orally in his letters. He wrote very few letters compared to the number of people he taught and they seem to have been to settle particular disputes rather than a complete theology.

Do you think the rest of the NT (apart from Paul's letters} add nothing to what Paul wrote in his letters?

 

[Mungo]

The apostles taught what Christ taught them.


Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen. Matthew 28:19-20

• teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you;

JLB

Exactly. But where does it say that everything that Jesus taught the apostles is written down in scripture?

After his resurrection Jesus spent another 40 days teaching them. How much of that do we have recorded in scripture?

Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book (John 20:30)
What book were they written in?

But there are also many other things which Jesus did; were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. (John 21:25)

 

[JLB]

A false analogy. Why not show I was wrong in what I wrote rather than creating a straw man.

Its nothing new. Satan has been deceiving man for thousands of years in this matter.

Thats how the scribes and Pharisees came up with the religion of Judaism. They took the writings of the Talmud, and mixed it with the law of Moses.

They made the word of God of no effect by mixing the teachings of man with the word of God.


He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition?
Matthew 15:3


So if God commands us to not make idols and bow down to them and serve them, and Catholicism in facts encourages its followers to make images of Mary and saints and Jesus and bow down or knell before them, then that is a clear example of violating the commandment of God in favor of the teachings of a man made religion.


JLB

 

[JLB]

There is no way you can know that.

You err not knowing the scriptures.


I have told you before, and foretell as if I were present the second time, and now being absent I write to those who have sinned before, and to all the rest, that if I come again I will not spare— since you seek a proof of Christ speaking in me, who is not weak toward you, but mighty in you. 2 Corinthians 12:2-3




JLB

 

[JLB]

But where does it say that everything that Jesus taught the apostles is written down in scripture?

After his resurrection Jesus spent another 40 days teaching them. How much of that do we have recorded in scripture?

We have enough to establish us in the truth, and the Holy Spirit to teach us in truth.


Any person or religion who teaches God’s people to bow down to idols and pray to the dead is not from God.

That’s idolatry.


But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death. Revelation 21:8



JLB

 

[Mungo]

Its nothing new. Satan has been deceiving man for thousands of years in this matter.

Thats how the scribes and Pharisees came up with the religion of Judaism. They took the writings of the Talmud, and mixed it with the law of Moses.

They made the word of God of no effect by mixing the teachings of man with the word of God.


He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition?
Matthew 15:3


So if God commands us to not make idols and bow down to them and serve them, and Catholicism in facts encourages its followers to make images of Mary and saints and Jesus and bow down or knell before them, then that is a clear example of violating the commandment of God in favor of the teachings of a man made religion.


JLB

Maybe that Satan has been deceiving people. Have you thought that Satan deceived the "reformers"?

Your comparison with Judaism is false. Sacred Tradition is the word of God not man made.

Catholics do not make or bow down to idols. Stattues are not idols. We do not worship them. However that is really an attempted diversion to avoid proper answers to my posts.

 

[Mungo]

You err not knowing the scriptures.


I have told you before, and foretell as if I were present the second time, and now being absent I write to those who have sinned before, and to all the rest, that if I come again I will not spare— since you seek a proof of Christ speaking in me, who is not weak toward you, but mighty in you. 2 Corinthians 12:2-3




JLB

Another false claim. I never said that Christ did not speak through Paul..

You said "What Paul taught in person is no different than what he wrote In his epistles."
I said "There is no way you can know that." And there isn't and you have not provided any evidence to back up your claim.

 

[Mungo]

We have enough to establish us in the truth, and the Holy Spirit to teach us in truth.

A claim that requires some evidence.

Any person or religion who teaches God’s people to bow down to idols and pray to the dead is not from God.

That’s idolatry.


But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death. Revelation 21:8



JLB

The Catholic Church does not teach people to bow down to idols and Catholics do not do that.

Try reading Ex 20:16 before you start throwing quotes like that around.

JLB, the way to have an honest discussion is to take up the points made not start hurling false claims around.