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Stupid Question

this isnt the proper forum for debating calvinism. start a new thread on free will vs predestination please.
 
jasoncran said:
this isnt the proper forum for debating calvinism. start a new thread on free will vs predestination please.
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Jason, I understand your concern, but the OP was specifically asking about Free Will and Predestination, so I have no problem with the conversation.

I'll just ask everyone to check your posts for personal remarks before you hit "submit". Both sides can find their share of scripture to back up their understanding. This doesn't need to be something that divides believers. Just be careful that posts are in keeping with the spirit of the ToS. :thumb

Mike
 
Mysteryman said:
Your comments here brings God down to the level of man. Of course God knows his own thoughts , or else He would never be able to have foreknowledge, and then by shear logic, there would be no such thing as predestination in the first place !

God does not have new thoughts ! Nor does he change His thoughts ! This would make God a liar, if your comments were true. The Word states plainly, that God is a God that changes not ! God has told us that there is going to be a new heaven and a new earth, and that he is going to make all things new. What you are suggeting, is that God can change His mind , insomuch as God does not have to keep to that which has been prophesied through His Prophets.

Your comments here are counter productive. In fact, using a biblical reference. A double minded person is unstable in all their ways.
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Of course God knows His own thoughts, but He only knows His thoughts as He thinks them and formulates them at that time. If God knows the thoughts that He will have a million years down the road It means basically everything is laid out for Him and He has no choice in the matter.

Also to change your mind doesn’t mean what you thought of in the first place was wrong. Like when God repented of creating man, Gen. (6:6) (and please do not go, like HisSheep, and try to find a translation that changes the word repent or the meaning of this verse) does that mean that God did a bad thing of creating? None whatsoever, it that, like Jer. (32:35), God never thought that we humans would become so wretched that sorry He made us in the first place. Nevertheless, God did know that the possibility of our sinfulness would be great and therefore in His exceedingly immense great Love, He provided a way out for man, before the foundation of the world, in the Lamb that was slain.

If God cannot have a new thought, then He is not God. Are you able to formulate new thoughts? Yes? Then I guess you’re greater than God. Can you change your mind? Imagine, you can change your mind yet God can’t. Amazing.

It is true scriptures say that God changes not, but be careful how you interpret that. God does not change in His attributes. Prior to creation and angels, God was all alone, nothing but God for an eternity. The three in one, probably not even identified as The Father, Son and Holy Spirit. One of God’s primordial attributes is that He is Infinite, which affects all other attributes, i.e. infinite knowledge, infinite power, infinite love. Infinity means that there is nothing but God forever. It’s like a balloon being blown up infinitely, nonstop. The difference being the balloon had a beginning, God didn’t, and the balloon is ever expanding, while doesn’t expand He just is, infinite.

Having said that God in His infinite self had to make accommodation for the angels, the universe and humans He created. He had to make space within Himself to allow for that creation. THAT IS A MAJOR CHANGE. God does not inhabit the rocks nor does He exist in the chair at your kitchen table. Yet He is infinite. God is able to create things and at the same time disassociate Himself from them.

Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever. I believe that unequivocally. But what was Jesus prior to creation, a spirit? Yes, I agree with that. What is Jesus now? He lives forever as the 2nd person of the Trinity in spirit WITH the GLORIFIED body of the Human Jesus He portrayed. THAT IS A MAJOR CHANGE. Be careful how you interpret things!

BTW I am not suggesting that God changes His mind on things that he vows, promises or prophecies. So please do not put words in my mouth. But if God cannot change His mind then He Himself does not have free will.
 
teach thats a good reason we cant fathom all of god.

to quote adrian rogers" the bible isnt meant to be explained just believed"
 
jasoncran, I have no idea who adrian rogers is, but I don't think much of those words. As somebody who is very much interested in the sciences, philosophy and other subjects, I think that it is time well spent doing what we can to explain everything in life to the best of our abilities. In my experience, The Bible, our conception of God, the teachings of Jesus and many other parts of life are open to a certain amount of interpretation, and many of us find that to be a highly worthwhile activity.

The fact that, in all likelihood, we may never be able to fully explain everything doesn't diminish the joy of putting in the time to seek knowledge. It also doesn't, in any way, diminish my belief that God exists or my love of Jesus.
 
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