Tasted Death for every Man !

[JLB]

Why are you asking?

If a Christian does not forgive others, will God forgive his sins?


I’m asking you to see what you believe. Others are welcome to answer, as well.




JLB

 

[BrotherJames925]

For He has not put the world to come, of which we speak, in subjection to angels. But one testified in a certain place, saying:
“What is man that You are mindful of him,
Or the son of man that You take care of him?
You have made him a little lower than the angels;
You have crowned him with glory and honor,
And set him over the works of Your hands.
You have put all things in subjection under his feet.”
For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him. But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, that He, by the grace of God, might taste death for everyone. Hebrews 2:5-9


He tasted death for everyone, men and women.

He died for the sins of the world.


For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16





JLB

Hello "ALL" The Peace of Jesus, The Jewish "Christ" who is the Holy Spirit, The Eternal Father, Son of God and Son of man, God of Abraham and the Living God in His human nature be with you all....YOU SAY:<<
that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16>>>To Believe in Him is to believe that He is The Holy Spirit, Namely YHWH=Ha Shem (N0 jehovah, or yahweh, or yaveh or logos as the people of lucifer believes, and teaches)..a.k.a Eternal Father...Therefore!! The person should submit to Him at baptism in His Name, and start obeying His Holy "ETERNAL,MORAL" Law..And?!! Accepting His Singularity..Only The "REMNANT"=The New Spiritual Jews a.k.a Christians who are saved by "GRACE"= Romans 11:5 (Notice that your bible says ONLY A "REMNANT" will be saved? Are you in that REMNANT?!! I AM....Brother James.......

 

[BrotherJames925]

Huh ? This is a rabbit trail !

Hello brightfame52..The Peace of Jesus, The "Jewish" Christ, who is the Holy Spirit, The Eternal Father, Son of God and Son of man, The God of Abraham and the Living God in His human nature be with you...YOU SAY:

Huh ? This is a rabbit trail !<<

Is this what your bible says?! Brother James....

 

[BrotherJames925]

If a Christian does not forgive others, will God forgive his sins?


I’m asking you to see what you believe. Others are welcome to answer, as well.




JLB

Hello JBL..The Peace of Jesus The "Jewish" Christ who is the Holy Spirit, The Eternal Father, Son of God and Son of man. The God of Abraham and the Living God in His human nature, be with you....YOU SAY:<<
If a Christian does not forgive others, will God forgive his sins?


I’m asking you to see what you believe. Others are welcome to answer, as well.<<<< NO!!! Brother James....

 

[rogerg]

ou did say this back in Post #144 and several other times throughout this thread. Have you now changed your mind as you are contradicting yourself

Hi for_his_glory,

You're correct, I did say that which wasn't precise enough(and possibly my understanding is wrong). This is how I see the spiritual progression of a true believer: 1) elected from before the foundation of the world by God to salvation, then 2) saved at a time of God's choosing, then, 3) born again- indwelt by the Holy Spirit at which time they begin to exhibit the traits of a true believer. Not sure of the exact timing between 2 and 3 -- they might occur simultaneously or very closely together. So (and due to a lack of precision on my part,) I tend to use them somewhat interchangeably depending upon which spiritual context is in view, and not knowing exactly where they meet. Although, I think that if someone is at 3, 2 and 1 are still applicable to them. So, in a sense, I guess I think any of them can be used. But, I'll think about it to further refine my understanding of their boundaries for future referencing. Was there a particular issue this caused? Do you find a drastic functional difference between them, or do you believe they contradict each other somehow or was it just an observation?

 

[jaybo]

Misrepresentation, I never said humans became serpents. Also Jesus called men serpents here Matt 23:23

Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

But Im going to discontinue this conversation with you, I can see already you will misrepresent what is being said, later !

Thank you for dropping out of our conversation! FYI, here is Matthew 23:23, "“Woe to you, experts in the law and you Pharisees, hypocrites! You give a tenth of mint, dill, and cumin, yet you neglect what is more important in the law—justice, mercy, and faithfulness! You should have done these things without neglecting the others." No mention of serpents.

 

[for_his_glory]

Hi for_his_glory,

You're correct, I did say that which wasn't precise enough(and possibly my understanding is wrong). This is how I see the spiritual progression of a true believer: 1) elected from before the foundation of the world by God to salvation, then 2) saved at a time of God's choosing, then, 3) born again- indwelt by the Holy Spirit at which time they begin to exhibit the traits of a true believer. Not sure of the exact timing between 2 and 3 -- they might occur simultaneously or very closely together. So (and due to a lack of precision on my part,) I tend to use them somewhat interchangeably depending upon which spiritual context is in view, and not knowing exactly where they meet. Although, I think that if someone is at 3, 2 and 1 are still applicable to them. So, in a sense, I guess I think any of them can be used. But, I'll think about it to further refine my understanding of their boundaries for future referencing. Was there a particular issue this caused? Do you find a drastic functional difference between them, or do you believe they contradict each other somehow or was it just an observation?

1 and 2, I disagree with giving the reason why further down. 3, yes we must be Spiritually born again from above and at that same moment we receive the baptism of Christ for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in whom we are sealed with unto the day of redemption, John 3:5-7; Ephesians 1:1-14. Ephesians 1:4-6 are key verses that teach us that from before the foundation of the world that the day we were created we were made in His image to be holy and without blame before God. This is what we still are to be unto the coming of Christ.

God did not predestine the man (which individuals would be saved & lost), He predestined the plan (how men would be saved) - read again Acts 10:34-35; Eph. 1:3-12; Rom. 8:28-30; 10:9-17.

The Bible reveals that regarding free-will and predestination it is not one or the other, but rather both. That is, the Bible teaches both the free-will of man and God's election or predestination. Unfortunately the teachings and creeds of men have misdefined these Biblical concepts so that the impression is left that one cannot have both, but only one or the other. We must accept the whole counsel of God on this subject instead of the wisdom of men (Gal. 1:6-10; 1 Cor. 1:18-21).

Many people teach that man either has no free-will (fatalism) or limited amounts of it. The Bible teaches that every person with a moral capacity has the freedom of will to decide whether or not to obey God. Simply put, the Bible teaches that God elected (predestined or set in place) to save every soul who fears (respects) God and works righteousness, (Acts 10:34-35). That is, before time eternal, God predestined that men would be saved "in Christ" (Eph. 1:3-4, 7-12). God predestined the "plan" of human redemption (cf. Eph. 3:10-11).

God also determined that man would have free-will, the ability and responsibility to choose to obey Him (cf. Gen. 3:1-6; Josh. 24:15; Matt. 11:28). God did not predestine the man (which individuals would be saved & lost), He predestined the plan (how men would be saved) - read again Acts 10:34-35; Eph. 1:3-12; Rom. 8:28-30; 10:9-17.

Some do not understand the above passages on predestination. They think that if a person is not of those predestinated, he is just out of luck, is eternally damned, and there is nothing he can do about it. However, it is a particular group or class of people that God chose before the foundation of the world and not individuals. It is up to us to be part of that class of those "in Him" if we want to be of the chosen.


​

 

[BrotherJames925]

Hi for_his_glory,

You're correct, I did say that which wasn't precise enough(and possibly my understanding is wrong). This is how I see the spiritual progression of a true believer: 1) elected from before the foundation of the world by God to salvation, then 2) saved at a time of God's choosing, then, 3) born again- indwelt by the Holy Spirit at which time they begin to exhibit the traits of a true believer. Not sure of the exact timing between 2 and 3 -- they might occur simultaneously or very closely together. So (and due to a lack of precision on my part,) I tend to use them somewhat interchangeably depending upon which spiritual context is in view, and not knowing exactly where they meet. Although, I think that if someone is at 3, 2 and 1 are still applicable to them. So, in a sense, I guess I think any of them can be used. But, I'll think about it to further refine my understanding of their boundaries for future referencing. Was there a particular issue this caused? Do you find a drastic functional difference between them, or do you believe they contradict each other somehow or was it just an observation?

Hello rogerg.. The Peace of Jesus, The "Jewish" Christ, who is the Holy Spirit, The Eternal Father, Son of God and Son of man and The God of Abraham and the Living God in His human nature be with you.....YOU SAY:<<saved at a time of God's choosing,<< The God of Abraham Choose His people since Ex. 6:7 + 31:12-16 + 2 Samuel 7 22-26 + 1 Chron. 17: 24-26...It is us the humans the ones who have to CHOOSE HIM NOW, If we do we go and get baptized in His Name, and Start Obeying His Holy "ETERNAL" Moral Law, Keep His Hoy Sabbath-Holy, and? Accept and Honor his Singularity...This goes for all gentiles a literal Jews, to become a New Man...A Spiritual Jew a.k.a a Christian...

YOu say:<<< So (and due to a lack of precision on my part,) I tend to use them somewhat interchangeably depending upon which spiritual context is in view, and not knowing exactly where they meet. Although, I think that if someone is at 3, 2 and 1 are still applicable to them. So, in a sense, I guess I think any of them can be used. But, I'll think about it to further refine my understanding of their boundaries for future referencing. Was there a particular issue this caused? Do you find a drastic functional difference between them, or do you believe they contradict each other somehow or was it just an observation?<<

If you do not do what I wrote....nothing will help....Brother James....

 

[BrotherJames925]

1 and 2, I disagree with giving the reason why further down. 3, yes we must be Spiritually born again from above and at that same moment we receive the baptism of Christ for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in whom we are sealed with unto the day of redemption, John 3:5-7; Ephesians 1:1-14. Ephesians 1:4-6 are key verses that teach us that from before the foundation of the world that the day we were created we were made in His image to be holy and without blame before God. This is what we still are to be unto the coming of Christ.

God did not predestine the man (which individuals would be saved & lost), He predestined the plan (how men would be saved) - read again Acts 10:34-35; Eph. 1:3-12; Rom. 8:28-30; 10:9-17.

The Bible reveals that regarding free-will and predestination it is not one or the other, but rather both. That is, the Bible teaches both the free-will of man and God's election or predestination. Unfortunately the teachings and creeds of men have misdefined these Biblical concepts so that the impression is left that one cannot have both, but only one or the other. We must accept the whole counsel of God on this subject instead of the wisdom of men (Gal. 1:6-10; 1 Cor. 1:18-21).

Many people teach that man either has no free-will (fatalism) or limited amounts of it. The Bible teaches that every person with a moral capacity has the freedom of will to decide whether or not to obey God. Simply put, the Bible teaches that God elected (predestined or set in place) to save every soul who fears (respects) God and works righteousness, (Acts 10:34-35). That is, before time eternal, God predestined that men would be saved "in Christ" (Eph. 1:3-4, 7-12). God predestined the "plan" of human redemption (cf. Eph. 3:10-11).

God also determined that man would have free-will, the ability and responsibility to choose to obey Him (cf. Gen. 3:1-6; Josh. 24:15; Matt. 11:28). God did not predestine the man (which individuals would be saved & lost), He predestined the plan (how men would be saved) - read again Acts 10:34-35; Eph. 1:3-12; Rom. 8:28-30; 10:9-17.

Some do not understand the above passages on predestination. They think that if a person is not of those predestinated, he is just out of luck, is eternally damned, and there is nothing he can do about it. However, it is a particular group or class of people that God chose before the foundation of the world and not individuals. It is up to us to be part of that class of those "in Him" if we want to be of the chosen.


​

Hello forhis -glory.. The peace of Jesus, The "Jewish" Christ, who is the Holy Spirit, The Eternal Father, Son of God and Son of man, The God of Abraham and the Living God on His human nature, be with you...You say:<<1 and 2, I disagree with giving the reason why further down. 3, yes we must be Spiritually born again from above and at that same moment we receive the baptism of Christ for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in whom we are sealed with unto the day of redemption, John 3:5-7; Ephesians 1:1-14. Ephesians 1:4-6 are key verses that teach us that from before the foundation of the world that the day we were created we were made in His image to be holy and without blame before God. This is what we still are to be unto the coming of Christ.<<< You are correct, but?!! ARE YOU HOLY? Do you live a Holy and Blameless Life as He wants?!! He says: 2 Timothy 1:9 He has "SAVED US"=(All humans) And Has called us to Live a Holy and Godly Life....Do you do that?!! 1 Thess. 4:7 For God didn't "CALLED US=Acts 2:39; To Be IMPURE, but to live a Holy and Blameless life...Do you that?!! Remember Rev. 21:27 NOTHING "IMPURE" Will enter the Kingdom of the God of Abraham....See! You need to be PURIFIED = Titus 2:13-17 + 3 5-7...Brother James...

 

[Fastfredy0]

Free Will = deism, the belief in the existence of a supreme being, specifically of a creator who does not intervene in the universe. For if God intervenes in any way as to determine our choices then one is NOT FREE to choose by definition.
To think that God is in control and you can still do what you want is a contradiction.

 

[for_his_glory]

Hello forhis -glory.. The peace of Jesus, The "Jewish" Christ, who is the Holy Spirit, The Eternal Father, Son of God and Son of man, The God of Abraham and the Living God on His human nature, be with you...You say:<<1 and 2, I disagree with giving the reason why further down. 3, yes we must be Spiritually born again from above and at that same moment we receive the baptism of Christ for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in whom we are sealed with unto the day of redemption, John 3:5-7; Ephesians 1:1-14. Ephesians 1:4-6 are key verses that teach us that from before the foundation of the world that the day we were created we were made in His image to be holy and without blame before God. This is what we still are to be unto the coming of Christ.<<< You are correct, but?!! ARE YOU HOLY? Do you live a Holy and Blameless Life as He wants?!! He says: 2 Timothy 1:9 He has "SAVED US"=(All humans) And Has called us to Live a Holy and Godly Life....Do you do that?!! 1 Thess. 4:7 For God didn't "CALLED US=Acts 2:39; To Be IMPURE, but to live a Holy and Blameless life...Do you that?!! Remember Rev. 21:27 NOTHING "IMPURE" Will enter the Kingdom of the God of Abraham....See! You need to be PURIFIED = Titus 2:13-17 + 3 5-7...Brother James...

Hello BrotherJames925
In our renewed Spiritual inner man where Christ dwells in us by that of the Spiritual rebirth from above we do live a life that is holy and blameless before the Lord, but in my flesh dwells no good thing and will cause me to fail Him at times. When this happens the Holy Spirit is quick to convict me of my transgression that I humbly repent of my action and seek God's forgiveness. Until that of 1 Corinthians 15:51-58 taking place there is no perfect person until we are completely given new glorified bodies. Do we make a practice of sinning? No, but sometimes we will mess up and thanks be to God for His mercy and grace. Grace pardons us and mercy continues to love us.

 

[for_his_glory]

Salvation 101 needs no explanation if we would only believe what Jesus has already said.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.


Acts 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Mat 6:12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
Mat 6:13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
Mat 6:14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
Mat 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

What is so hard that we can not understand the simple truth of God's salvation through Christ Jesus in His written word!

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

What are the good works some of you ask, or put it another way, what are the works of salvation (which is different than what some suppose to be the works towards salvation). Answer, it is walking in obedience to God's commands within the moral laws, being part of the 613 Levitical laws, but that these parts are yet to be followed.

What are the moral laws we are to continue in as faithful servants unto the Lord:

The existing moral laws (commandments) for all of us to still follow as in prayers and blessings, love and brotherhood. The poor and unfortunate, treatment of the Gentiles, Marriage, divorce and family. Forbidden sexual relations, business practices, employees and servants. Vows, oaths, swearing, Court and Judicial procedures. Injuries and damages, property and property rights, criminal laws. Prophecy, idolatry and all its practices as the moral laws (commandments) keep us in line with the will of God.

We need to present ourselves a vessel of honor that God delights in as we allow the light of Christ shine in us and through us. This is a testimony of Gods grace and mercy as it is not ourselves that do any good thing, but Gods Spirit working in us and through us as we surrender our will to that of Gods will to be done.

 

[rogerg]

1 and 2, I disagree with giving the reason why further down. 3, yes we must be Spiritually born again from above and at that same moment we receive the baptism of Christ for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in whom we are sealed with unto the day of redemption, John 3:5-7; Ephesians 1:1-14. Ephesians 1:4-6 are key verses that teach us that from before the foundation of the world that the day we were created we were made in His image to be holy and without blame before God. This is what we still are to be unto the coming of Christ.

Definitely agree with including John 3:5 - 7.

Eph 1:1 - 14 is a different matter

1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus: ...

Paul is speaking to those who are already saved ("the faithful in Christ")

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Paul tells them they were specifically chosen by God "before the foundation of the world"
"holy and without blame" . As far as I can see, He was not talking about predestinated as a plan - the verse just will
not support that interpretation

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, ...
They (the individuals) were predestinated to adoption as children - as it was His pleasure to do so.

8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

God imparted Himself to them

9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: ...

He revealed to them His will, because, well , because He wanted to, and for no other reason

11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: ...

Since they have been "predestinated", (chosen) they have obtained an "inheritance": God Himself

13 In whom ye also [trusted], after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

They trusted after they heard the word of truth (Christ)-- "heard" meaning hearing physical, but much more importantly,
hearing spiritually.

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Their trust and belief were actually "earnest" money given by God, to demonstrate their inheritance had been
made sure

I think that verse 4 is the key to unlocking these verses and thereby God's intent; that is, that Paul spoke to them as people already selected by God to eternal life. Selected for no reason other than He wanted to, and told them as much. Please note these verses demonstrate they contributed nothing.

I can continue with your other references if you'd like, but thought I'd stop here so as not to exceed the
max reply size, which I have already done in a prior reply and would like to avoid. So, please let me know

 

[for_his_glory]

Definitely agree with including John 3:5 - 7.

Eph 1:1 - 14 is a different matter

1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus: ...

Paul is speaking to those who are already saved ("the faithful in Christ")

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Paul tells them they were specifically chosen by God "before the foundation of the world"
"holy and without blame" . As far as I can see, He was not talking about predestinated as a plan - the verse just will
not support that interpretation

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, ...
They (the individuals) were predestinated to adoption as children - as it was His pleasure to do so.

8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

God imparted Himself to them

9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: ...

He revealed to them His will, because, well , because He wanted to, and for no other reason

11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: ...

Since they have been "predestinated", (chosen) they have obtained an "inheritance": God Himself

13 In whom ye also [trusted], after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

They trusted after they heard the word of truth (Christ)-- "heard" meaning hearing physical, but much more importantly,
hearing spiritually.

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Their trust and belief were actually "earnest" money given by God, to demonstrate their inheritance had been
made sure

I think that verse 4 is the key to unlocking these verses and thereby God's intent; that is, that Paul spoke to them as people already selected by God to eternal life. Selected for no reason other than He wanted to, and told them as much. Please note these verses demonstrate they contributed nothing.

I can continue with your other references if you'd like, but thought I'd stop here so as not to exceed the
max reply size, which I have already done in a prior reply and would like to avoid. So, please let me know

I really do not see Eph 1:1-14 as being a different matter as it's all aboust us being faithful to Christ.

I agree Paul was speaking to the saints at Ephesus as that is very clear. But, I also see his message is also to the faithful in Christ Jesus as in my understanding being those who are faithful throughout all the generations as he was speaking to the saints that were present before him that day teaching the Spiritual blessings of Christ to the saints that were present at Ephesus that day. The message is still taught by Paul today as we read what he has already written.

Vs. 4 God has chosen all who will be holy and without blame even before His forst creation of man as this is what He wanted within all His creation as we are all made in His image, but sin found in us messed up that image. God must have known we would fail him as His plan of salvation through Christ Jesus was before the foundation of the world.

Vs. 5 God had predestined all of us that will receive Him by faith unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ.

Vs. 8 God imparts Himself to all who are of faith.

Vs. 9 The mystery of God's will is that of what He desires of His self that we would be holy and blameless before Him. This was His desire before He created man.

Vs. 11 We obtain the inheritance being the kingdom of God the moment of our Spiritual rebirth from above as we see the kingdom of God that is a Spiritual kingdom.

Vs. 13 We who came to Christ heard the Gospel preached and confessed Him as our Lord and Savior and then sealed with the Spirit of promise. This only comes by trusting in His salvation through Christ Jesus in whom we trust in.

Vs. 14 You will have to show me where earnest meant God giving them money as I never heard that before. The earnest of our inheritance is not money given by God, but that of the kingdom of God while we are still on earth. As it is in done in heaven so shall it be done on earth with Him as we are adopted as Sons and Daughters of God through that of Christ Jesus.

I have no problem discussing vs by vs with you as you seem to be a pleasant person to talk with. We might see things we never understood before. That's how I study is vs by vs.

 

[JLB]

To Believe in Him is to believe that He is The Holy Spirit,

1. God the Father is God the Father.
2. Jesus is the Son; the Word of God
3. The Holy Spirit is the Holy Spirit.

These are three, that are one; one in unity


For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.
1 John 5:7


Notice it say these three are one.

Your saying this one is three.





JLB

 

[rogerg]

Salvation 101 needs no explanation if we would only believe what Jesus has already said.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

The world in 3:16 is the world to come, not this current world. This world will be destroyed as the Bible informs per God's wrath - so how could GOD have "so loved" it? The only world that can exist eternally will be the world to come.
Had Christ's offering not been successful, then that new world would never be allowed by God to come into being, since it would then be under the law of sin and death - as this world currently is. But Christ was successful, so that new world will be created, having as its only law the law the spirit of life in Christ.

[2Pe 3:10-13 KJV]
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11 [Seeing] then [that] all these things shall be dissolved, what manner [of persons] ought ye to be in [all] holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Well, to "confess" is not just confessing verbally by the mouth, but for it to come from the heart first. For that to happen, God had to have first indwelt the person and changed the heart, which He does only to those who become born-again. As with most biblical statements of this type, the person in view had to first be saved by God, with any subsequent actions as an after affect, or of by-product of it.

Romans 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Same as 9 but telling us the heart has to change first which only God can do, which is what I said previously

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

No disagreement there - both have to happen

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

Don't understand, that's what I've been saying - we cannot make ourselves born again spiritually just as we
couldn't give ourselves life physically. Dead is dead.

Acts 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

No one can repent of themselves that it is the work of the Holy Spirit.

And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
Mat 6:13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
Mat 6:14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
Mat 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Think I already covered this subject in my reply replies(s) to Butch5

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Wait -- did you quote verses that say we're saved by grace? And through faith -
the faith of Christ? That we are His workmanship, created in Jesus Christ?
Those verses don't leave any wiggle room for anything on our part, right?

What are the good works some of you ask, or put it another way, what are the works of salvation (which is different than what some suppose to be the works towards salvation). Answer, it is walking in obedience to God's commands within the moral laws, being part of the 613 Levitical laws, but that these parts are yet to be followed.

What are the moral laws we are to continue in as faithful servants unto the Lord:

The existing moral laws (commandments) for all of us to still follow as in prayers and blessings, love and brotherhood. The poor and unfortunate, treatment of the Gentiles, Marriage, divorce and family. Forbidden sexual relations, business practices, employees and servants. Vows, oaths, swearing, Court and Judicial procedures. Injuries and damages, property and property rights, criminal laws. Prophecy, idolatry and all its practices as the moral laws (commandments) keep us in line with the will of God.

We need to present ourselves a vessel of honor that God delights in as we allow the light of Christ shine in us and through us. This is a testimony of Gods grace and mercy as it is not ourselves that do any good thing, but Gods Spirit working in us and through us as we surrender our will to that of Gods will to be done.

If I understand you correctly, if we actually were to follow what you posted, then we would be trying to achieve the law through our works, and thus, we would be putting ourselves back under law which is what Christ came to remove: Please observe:

[Gal 5:4-6 KJV]
4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

and

[Col 2:14 KJV]
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

[Rom 7:4 KJV]
4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, [even] to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Please notice that verse 4 is non-specific as to which laws are in view , it pertains to ANY law we may try to use to justify ourselves

 

[Fastfredy0]

The world in 3:16 is the world to come, not this current world.

That an interpretation that I've never heard before. Do you have a URL/source that supports this (not that that proves the statement true, but at least it has some support).
This is at least the 5th interpretation of the meaning of "WORLD" in John 3:16. So much doctrine based on John 3:16 and so much disagreement. Interesting

 

[rogerg]

Vs. 14 You will have to show me where earnest meant God giving them money as I never heard that before. The earnest of our inheritance is not money given by God, but that of the kingdom of God while we are still on earth. As it is in done in heaven so shall it be done on earth with Him as we are adopted as Sons and Daughters of God through that of Christ Jesus.

I have no problem discussing vs by vs with you as you seem to be a pleasant person to talk with. We might see things we never understood before. That's how I study is vs by vs.

No problem - earnest money is a concept of showing one's sincerity in a transaction between to entities. I didn't mean to imply that literal money was involved, but that is the way the phrase is typically used. It is God's way of showing us that He was serious regarding salvation
As the prior verse I supplied informs, the faith we are given upon becoming born again is referred to as the "earnest". Please see the following:

earnest money.​

• Money paid as partial payment of a purchase price in order to establish a binding contract of sale.
• n.
  Money paid as earnest to bind a bargain or ratify and confirm a sale. Also called hand-money.
• n.
  Money paid as a deposit to show intent to buy or to reserve an item to be purchased; especially, money accompanying an offer to buy real estate

[Eph 1:14 KJV] 14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Possibly we can simplify our dialogue with this question (if you don't mind answering that is): Do you believe Jesus Christ is the Saviour?​

[2Pe 3:18 KJV]
18 But grow in grace, and [in] the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him [be] glory both now and for ever. Amen.

 

[rogerg]

That an interpretation that I've never heard before. Do you have a URL/source that supports this (not that that proves the statement true, but at least it has some support).
This is at least the 5th interpretation of the meaning of "WORLD" in John 3:16. So much doctrine based on John 3:16 and so much disagreement. Interesting

I only use the Bible to provide validation of biblical interpretation. Not sure what kind of validation you'd accept but to start with:
If Jesus's offering had not been successful, theoretically speaking , the new heavens and earth could not be brought into existence because there would be no law of the spirit of life in Christ to govern them and thus, able to set its inhabitance (the saved) free. Should they be created without the law of Christ ( were that even possible), then the new heaven and earth would also be under the same law as is the current heaven and earth are: the law of sin and death, which is what caused God's wrath and judgment against them in the first place. Those who remain on this earth (those who were not written into the Lambs book of life) at the coming of Christ will be destroyed (so to speak), because they were not under the law of life

[Rev 21:1-3 KJV]
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God.

[Rev 21:27 KJV] 27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither [whatsoever] worketh abomination, or [maketh] a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Above 21:27 --the law of life in Christ provides that, without the law of sin and death, which the law of life does not permit to enter

[Rom 8:2 KJV]
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

That world, the new world, is the one God loves and did not want to condemn. This current world is AREADY condemned by Him

[2Pe 3:10, 12 KJV]
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. ...
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

[Isa 65:17 KJV] 17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
[Isa 66:22 KJV] 22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
[2Pe 3:13 KJV] 13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

added one I had forgotten about:
[Rev 20:15 KJV] 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[Fastfredy0]

I only use the Bible to provide validation of biblical interpretation. If Jesus's offering had not been successful, theoretically speaking , the new heavens and earth could not be brought into existence because there would be no law of the spirit of life in Christ to govern them and thus, able to set its inhabitance (the saved) free. Should they be created without the law of Christ ( were that even possible), then the new heaven and earth would also be under the same law as is the current heaven and earth are: the law of sin and death, which is what caused God's wrath and judgment against them in the first place. Those who remain on this earth (those who were not written into the Lambs book of life) at the coming of Christ will be destroyed (so to speak), because they were not under the law of life

[Rev 21:1-3 KJV]
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God.

[Rev 21:27 KJV] 27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither [whatsoever] worketh abomination, or [maketh] a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Above 21:27 --the law of life in Christ provides that, without the law of sin and death, which the law of life does not permit to enter

[Rom 8:2 KJV]
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

That world, the new world, is the one God loves and did not want to condemn. This current world is AREADY condemned by Him Not sure what kind of validation you'd accept but to start with:

[2Pe 3:10, 12 KJV]
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. ...
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

[Isa 65:17 KJV] 17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
[Isa 66:22 KJV] 22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
[2Pe 3:13 KJV] 13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

So, to be brief. Are you saying:

1. God loves the NEW EARTH (the physical planet) or
2. are you saying God loves the elect selected from the OLD EARTH as represented by the NEW EARTH?
3. or something/someone else