The Difference

[Free]

Wow, I guess there should be a place beside each verse that says "this is not for you" "this is for you"!!!

No need. This is precisely why there are rules for interpretation (hermeneutics) such as looking at context. It is all part of proper Bible study.

Two question, who taught those that preach the Gospel today

You would have to ask them for the names of their teachers.

do you believe Spiritual gifts are for today as they were when the disciples received them?

Obviously I do since I said that God gifted teachers.

 

[Free]

Discerning the heresy in Apologetic and Theology

What heresy? Who is saying that something is heresy, you?

 

[eddif]

No need. This is precisely why there are rules for interpretation (hermeneutics) such as looking at context. It is all part of proper Bible study.

So respectfully:

How do you take the context of oxen and seeds and arrive at preachers and men’s hearts?

And once you develop the concept of creation speaking of God, how do you use this concept to look at the moon?

Then how do you witness using these concepts?

Does apologetic discourse go there?

Mississippi redneck
eddif

 

[JLB]

What heresy? Who is saying that something is heresy, you?

How many believe that a born again Christian can reject Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, in which they depart from faith in Him, and turn to the antichrist, or Allah, or some other god, and confess him as Lord and Savior, and still be saved on the Day of Judgement, when Christ returns?


Edit by Stovebolts


What say you?

 

[Willie T]

How many believe that a born again Christian can reject Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, in which they depart from faith in Him, and turn to the antichrist, or Allah, or some other god, and confess him as Lord and Savior, and still be saved on the Day of Judgement, when Christ returns?


Freegrace teaches that the answer to this question is yes, a born again Christian can reject Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, in which they believe in the antichrist as lord and savior and still be saved.


What say you?

I believe that we, ourselves, create this scenario as a supposed "problem" by qualifying and quantifying the requisites that we believe have to be exhibited (or at least "exist) in a person before God accepts them as a bona fide "Christian." We do this almost every time we say the word, "Christian." We add the term a "true" or "real" Christian.........as though there is a "degree" we must work toward and earn before getting our genuine Christian Badge.

My bigger question would be: What criteria do we humans use to determine whether or not any particular person is a "true" or "real" Christian, in the first place?

But, in answer to the original question, "Yes", I believe the Bible constantly and consistently warns us against throwing it all away, even after we have labored so long "in Christ." The passage so many like to quote says we cannot be snatched out of his hand (by an evil force desiring to remove us), but it does NOT seem to ever say we can't JUMP SHIP of our own volition.

 

[JLB]

I believe that we, ourselves, create this scenario as a supposed "problem" by qualifying and quantifying the requisites that we believe have to be exhibited (or at least "exist) in a person before God accepts them as a bona fide "Christian." We do this almost every time we say the word, "Christian." We add the term a "true" or "real" Christian.........as though there is a "degree" we must work toward and earn before getting our genuine Christian Badge.

My bigger question would be: What criteria do we humans use to determine whether or not any particular person is a "true" or "real" Christian, in the first place?

But, in answer to the original question, "Yes", I believe the Bible constantly and consistently warns us against throwing it all away, even after we have labored so long "in Christ." The passage so many like to quote says we cannot be snatched out of his hand (by an evil force desiring to remove us), but it does NOT seem to ever say we can't JUMP SHIP of our own volition.

Yes sir.

 

[eddif]

Hi there,

I think there is s place for both apologetics and evangelism. Peter cut straight to the chase after Pentecost, Paul used reason, literature and "pre evangelism" at Mars hill...

And maybe:
Acts 18:25 kjv
This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

You may can operate apologetic discussions under the law in heart, but without law in mind.
However I have never been involved with a discussion that considers this concept.

The law in life identifies sin pretty good.

The law in mind that transcends the symbolism is a little hard to approach without moving up the baptism ladder.

Of course I get few responses to statements like this.

Redneck
eddif

 

[New Day Coming]

eddif

"The law in mind that transcends the symbolism is a little hard to approach without moving up the baptism ladder."

Not sure what a baptism ladder is? (Unless its the one down into a pool? ;-)

 

[Free]

And maybe:
Acts 18:25 kjv
This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

You may can operate apologetic discussions under the law in heart, but without law in mind.
However I have never been involved with a discussion that considers this concept.

The law in life identifies sin pretty good.

The law in mind that transcends the symbolism is a little hard to approach without moving up the baptism ladder.

Of course I get few responses to statements like this.

Redneck
eddif

It might be because people don’t understand what you’re saying with these statements. I know I sure don’t.

 

[eddif]

On the Willie T JLB conversation

The baptism of John the Baptist prepares the way to Christ, and provokes the belief in Christ Jesus.

The baptism in Christ assures eternal life ( the one name under which salvation occurres)

The baptism in the Holy Spirit is for power to witness. Probably much more need of spiritual gifts to compel folks to enter.

The baptism of fire is sure not discussed much. Church discipline is not very politically correct in the eyes of some.

eddif

 

[eddif]

It might be because people don’t understand what you’re saying with these statements. I know I sure don’t.

What about oniy the baptism of John is not understood?

eddif

 

[Free]

What about oniy the baptism of John is not understood?

eddif

This is all off topic.

 

[for_his_glory]

No need. This is precisely why there are rules for interpretation (hermeneutics) such as looking at context. It is all part of proper Bible study.


You would have to ask them for the names of their teachers.


Obviously I do since I said that God gifted teachers.

My Bible did not come with a set of instructions for rules of interpretation, but does say study to show yourself approved unto God. It's also written that I need no man to teach me apart from the Holy Spirit teaching them first even then it is up to me alone through the Holy Spirit to discern what I am being taught is truth or error. Many defend error without realizing the error they speak is not truth, but that of what they believe to be truth by another that teaches them.

You said in post #97 that John 14:26 was only for the Disciples and I can agree in part as they had to be called first and then anointed by God indwelling them with the Holy Spirit to begin their God given ministries as they went about witnessing and testifying of Christ. It's that same calling, anointing and indwelling of the Holy Spirit that we continue in the witness and testifying of Christ as we have to be called of God to bring His Gospel to the world as the Disciples did by those Spiritual gifts given to those who God has called into His ministry.

Jesus taught the disciples in the beginning when He called the twelve, but it wasn't until they received the indwelling of the Holy Spirit after Jesus was taken up to heaven that their Spiritual eyes and ears were opened to fully understand what Jesus taught them. It's been written and what has been written is what is taken out into the world in all simplicity that Jesus has already taught us.

So no, I do not need anyone apart from the Holy Spirit to teach me.

Jesus warned us in Matthew 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

 

[for_his_glory]

What heresy? Who is saying that something is heresy, you?

Yes, me and many others as you know darn well there is much heresy when it comes to false doctrines being taught and defended in Apologetics and Theology.

 

[eddif]

This is all off topic.

IMHO it is not off topic.

The difference in apologetics and witnessing can be an issue of calling and empowerment.

An evangelist has to understand sin and salvation to the highest order.

A person in apologetic ministry of pointing out sin alone might not have all the same needs.

We make up the body of Christ. Weak, strong, male, female, Jew, Gentile, etc.

The instructions to elders - deacons are different. The OP is what are differences in apologetics and witnessing. I am just looking in the area of a persons qualifications and position.

eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

Acts 18:25 kjv
This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

Best example given as what we are to speak and teach others as "It is written"

 

[for_his_glory]

Acts 18:25 kjv
This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

Best example given as what we are to speak and teach others as "It is written"

 

[eddif]

eddif

"The law in mind that transcends the symbolism is a little hard to approach without moving up the baptism ladder."

Not sure what a baptism ladder is? (Unless its the one down into a pool? ;-)

I was sinking deep in sin.

The life guard says grab the ladder at your right hand. He also may dive in to rescue you.

The first step up clears your head
The second step gives you hope
The third step gets you ready to help others

You have been been saved from chlorine. You now know how to tell others how to climb out of sin and see better eternal days.

I mixed the physical with the spiritual. I can probably do direct comparison from step to step if needed ( yet not me but the quickening spirit in me).

eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

And maybe:
Acts 18:25 kjv
This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

You may can operate apologetic discussions under the law in heart, but without law in mind.
However I have never been involved with a discussion that considers this concept.

The law in life identifies sin pretty good.

The law in mind that transcends the symbolism is a little hard to approach without moving up the baptism ladder.

Of course I get few responses to statements like this.

Redneck
eddif

Apollos had two good teachers who taught the things of the Lord as "it is written". This is how we all need to be taught as being fervent in the Spirit and not in man teaching us.

 

[eddif]

Apollos had two good teachers who taught the things of the Lord as "it is written". This is how we all need to be taught as being fervent in the Spirit and not in man teaching us.

Ok now I become the enemy LOL

Acts 18:26 kjv
And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:

IMHO Being fervent in the spirit does not mean he was baptized in the Holy Spirit. It just means he was passionate about his approach to teaching.

The (more perfectly) would mean they told him he needed to believe in the one he was
Teaching about. The baptism of John is not salvation , but repentance.

In this case you have apologetics (showing error) and evangelizing in moving him along to baptism in Jesus Christ.

Verse 28 I hate to mention, because Free will say “see I told you how important Apologetics is). LOL. Look at context though.

Redneck
eddif